11th Jul 2011

Time for Mr. Abbott to put up or shut up.

FONT SIZE: A+ A-
Kaye Fallick

In Australia, the carbon tax is one of the most hotly debated topics in recent political history, as it should be. This blog should be read for what it is – an opinion on whether the carbon tax is a good or bad thing for this country. Whether you agree or disagree, I hope you will take the time to share your thoughts – and to vote in our poll.
So without further ado, I would like to state that I think this is the single most important piece of legislation to be proposed in recent decades. I also think it is an extremely courageous piece of legislation for a government which is flagging in the opinion polls.
We hear a lot about the effect, on the economy, of a price on carbon. But I believe we have got it around the wrong way. For generations we have treated our planet with contempt and it has now caught up with us. A majority of the worlds’ scientists have agreed. Unless we reduce carbon emissions soon, there will be no economies left to worry about.
And to our great shame, the world's highest per-capita offender is Australia, with a whopping 27.3 metric tonnes per person. Not China (5.5), not one of the rapidly developing economies such as India (1.7) nor Brazil (5.4). Nearest other offenders are the USA (23.4) and Canada (22.9). So for me there is no question of whether we should have a tax on carbon emissions – it’s simply how soon it can be implemented without causing grief to those on low incomes.
We have also heard comment that Australia should wait for other countries to take the lead. Why? If we are the number one offender, surely it is appropriate that we step up and make the necessary changes to reduce our emissions as quickly as possible. We once led the world in the introduction of social reforms, including giving the vote to women and creating a pension for older citizens. What is wrong with leading the world now when it faces the greatest challenge of modern times? Are we afraid of being innovative? Of punching above our weight? For the sake of our children and grandchildren, I sincerely hope not.
The debate preceding yesterday's release by the Federal Government of the detail of the proposed carbon tax has been acrimonious, to say the least. From the get-go the Federal Opposition, led by Tony Abbott, has denounced the carbon tax as a bad tax which needs to be rejected and, if it became law, to be repealed. All this without any detail! This negative stance was reinforced by the decision of the Opposition to not participate in the proceedings of the cross-party Climate Change Committee – preferring instead to promote its own option of a Direct Action climate policy.

Yes, the carbon tax is very new territory for Australia. But it is not without precedent, a similar scheme having been happily working in Europe for the past six or more years, depending upon the individual nation. The UK emissions, per capita, are 10.7 per cent, less than 40% of ours.

Over the next few weeks and months two things are likely to happen.
With the support of the Greens and Independents, the Federal Government’s carbon tax legislation will pass both houses of parliament and become law.
And the Federal Opposition, led by Tony Abbott and Joe Hockey, will criss cross the country chanting “Great Big New Tax” and spruiking fear and catastrophe in the wake of this new legislation.
My suggestion for Mr. Abbott is that he should do one of two things.
We now have a detailed plan put forward by the elected government, costed by politically-neutral Treasury officials.
Mr. Abbott has been offered the opportunity to have his preferred scheme – Direct Action – costed by the same officials.
I believe he should accept this offer and present his fully costed alternative to a carbon tax rather than resorting to cheap stunts and one-liners with little substance.
In short, I think he should either put up or shut up.

What do you think?
Has Kaye got a point? Or is she being unnecessarily unfair to the Leader of the Opposition?





COMMENTS

To make a comment, please register or login
aquatrek
11th Jul 2011
4:23pm
Hi Kaye - U are no different to the other millions of people who have had the wool pulled over their ears and eyes. Plus, you have joined the scaremongering side of the debate with your 'Unless we reduce carbon emissions soon, there will be no economies left to worry about.' That is a lot of adulterated crap. If I ask you to tell me what the 'natural' climate change process is I very much doubt that you would have a clue. Yet the whole Carbon debate is based upon 'perceived but not proven' CO2 atmospheric affects. Do you really conclude that 200 years of human endeavours will 'destroy' the world - that would put you fairly and squarely in the Creationist cubicle. In other words a true wacko idiot.
grahami2006
11th Jul 2011
4:38pm
I agree with you Kaye however would like to see the Liberal Party alternative. One thing I would like to know is if business can buy these carbon credits overseas and if so is that going to impact on the government's revenue.
calmer
11th Jul 2011
4:39pm
Hooray for Kaye. Spot on. I know we've been waiting for too long for certainty about this issue, but I suppose it has been difficult to negotiate with so many differing interest groups. At last we are doing the right thing for our children, grandchildren and the world's environment. I'm so grateful for all those involved in this negotiation, and for a resolution at last. Thanks to all those involved.
bungate38
11th Jul 2011
4:40pm
Sorry, but I do not agree. The science is certainly not in like the PM would claim. The climate is always changing over the thousands of years but the current proven science in the last 10 yerars says that the world is not warming but in fact cooling.
Australia is not lagging behind the rest of the world as other countries are all different and in many cases their systems are failing, changing or are the subject of rorts and fraud.
If you do the real numbers on reducing our carbon dioxide emissions you'll see that the government's projected 160 million ton total savings in emissions under the government scheme is a drop in the sea compared to the world's emissions.

China this year in its growth is projected to add some 750 million tons to its emissions alone.

The Australian Carbon Dioxide Tax by this government and the spurious alarmist Greens party is a total con and fraud on our people.
No one will answer the vital question of what the giant carbon dioxide tax will do for our climate - the real answer is - absolutely nothing!
Mion
11th Jul 2011
4:44pm
Hi Kaye.
We are short of power so the coal burning will continue as the number of paper shufflers in Canberra grow unabated. This is purly a socialist agenda and just layers cost on cost on the Australian,s who have already seen Gillard and Co squander the nation's funds .I note no assistance at all for self funded retirees especially those below Age pension age who do not pay tax or have a Centrelink card.What about spending the money on nuclear power,solar will never provide base load power.
GeminiJune
11th Jul 2011
4:50pm
As a Mother and Grandmother this is misleading your statements are misleading the public. Your comments are so wrong as few other nations have taken up a carbon tax. Julia Gillard has misled the public and any support of her unconstitutional tax is naive. Taxes wont fix the environment, education and understanding with a collaborative plan will with bi-partisan commitment. It is simply a money grab to raise taxes on the people at a time when everyone is struggling under the weight of the GFC and natural disasters. Julia Gillard has no right to implement this hardship on the Australian people. We need to rise up and not accept this abuse of power.
GeminiJune
11th Jul 2011
4:51pm
As a Mother and Grandmother this is misleading your statements are misleading the public. Your comments are so wrong as few other nations have taken up a carbon tax. Julia Gillard has misled the public and any support of her unconstitutional tax is naive. Taxes wont fix the environment, education and understanding with a collaborative plan will with bi-partisan commitment. It is simply a money grab to raise taxes on the people at a time when everyone is struggling under the weight of the GFC and natural disasters. Julia Gillard has no right to implement this hardship on the Australian people. We need to rise up and not accept this abuse of power.
Big Al
11th Jul 2011
4:52pm
Hi Kaye, I think our Prime Minister is a "bloody idiot", how can anyone believe that a naturally occurring gas which constitutes only 0.038% of the atmosphere, can possibly cause the "Climate Change" the proponents of this tax claim (notice it used to be called "Global Warming"). Were you aware that of this 0.038% Australia contributes only 1%, that's 0.00038%.
Pull the other one it's got bells on!
allen61
11th Jul 2011
4:53pm
Kaye it is regretful that I cannot see your point of view it just is that at 75 years of age I have not seen any concern-able change in the weather we have the four seasons that is not completely accurate they are only a guide and what happens is up to mother nature, taxing businesses is no answer to the worlds pollution problems the politicians are not game to address the root cause which is over population and eventually when they are not able to feed the masses they will have to do something about it. At the moment the Socialist and communists alias the greens are on a roll and are full of themselves we have a minority government with no mandate to bring in this policy and therefore it is not binding and the voters will provide a government with an honest mandate at the next federal election
jennyya
11th Jul 2011
4:56pm
Hullo Kaye
Why should Tony Abbott put up or shut up? An election is two years away and he can do very little but inform us that this is a bad tax. Julia needs to fill up the coffers again after recklessly throwing our taxes away and this will do the trick. If she was really serious she would bring Australia to its knees and tax all fuel, get rid of all livestock and stop burn offs completely. She is a liar and a cheat and really not worth talking about. She will not survive as leader or in an election and that is why she will not have a referendum on the subject. We will wait for her demise and that of the independents. WE want an election NOW before Oz is a shadow of its former self
gordon336
11th Jul 2011
5:02pm
Hi Kaye, I cannot agree with your comments claiming Australia is the worst offender you base your statement on a per capita per annum basis of all the countries you mention Australia is the smallest aggregate offender with China being the greatest aggregate offender being approximately 12.3 times greater than Australia if your per capita figures are reasonably accurate, blind freddy can do the sumd based on population census. I feel we are again being led down the garden path with bs by this governemnt.
Nan 164
11th Jul 2011
5:02pm
Kaye, I agree something has got to be done to reduce the pollution and emissions from big industrial businesses..An emissions trading scheme would probably work better. ., As it is , time is against us on this, if pollution was to cease tomorrow, it would be too late to reverse the damage that has already been done. So I guess a little too late is better than none at all.
supa2
11th Jul 2011
5:05pm
Sorry Kaye I agree with aquatrek having so many disastrous predictions in the past as the loss of fossil fuels, the ozone layer and the millennium bug just to mention a few I remain skeptical of an unproven theory on the global warming/climate change need for a carbon tax. I really do believe we Aussies boo booed in the last elections in voting the Greens into power of the Senate and after all Ms Gillard is not our elected Prime Minister and Mr Swan
retained his seat on preferences. In on a lie and have bought our Broadband back to being controlled by a monopoly and will the low income earner benefit by it in any way ?
Another grab for our money but give some back to the Pensioners and low income earners and they will accept it with arms open and they will need it to cover the loss of living due to the costs rising. I fear we will lose our industry to overseas investment as we have allowed our dairy, fruit and food/meat producing properties to go.
lillian
11th Jul 2011
5:13pm
Kaye,I fully agree with you.Julia Gillard is going in the right direction,especially in regard to pensioner.Gee, I like that lady!
Tony Abbott is not to be trusted, and he should shut up!!!!
Subieagle
11th Jul 2011
5:18pm
WhMaureen

y should Mr Abbott put up or shut up ????Hes not the prime minister.I cant wait to go to the polls and get rid of the Greens like we did the democrats.Who on earth woulde believe that lying Julia Gillard I cant bear herand shes certainly not to be trusted.
SMMM
15th Jul 2011
5:10pm
Who Believed John Howard when he said, Never Ever to the GST. We have that now don't we. Are you saying he didn't lie.
peterac
11th Jul 2011
5:19pm
what a load of rubbish, check out how much carbon the volcano released last month
look outside the square at what carbon does, the more carbon in the atmosphere, the larger the trees and crops grow, check the research about orange trees, the simple test was 2 trees put into separate climate controlled tents one with normal air the other with extra carbon in, guess which one grew 20 % bigger with more fruit.
peter c.
PatrickRM
11th Jul 2011
5:21pm
I congratulate you Kaye on putting forward your point of view (and we are all entitled to our point of view). I agree entirely with what you write. We need to act now, why should we delay any longer, we are only putting off the inevitable and it will become far more expensive in the long term. Global warming aside and whether you believe in it or not, surely it would be a good thing to reduce our filthy pollution (even at just a local level); health aspects need to be considered too. We all nee to do our bit though, not just the 500 top polluters. I am not convinced by the scaremongering about loss of jobs. Sure, some jobs will go but many more will be created by the 'new energy industries'.
dallaswc
11th Jul 2011
5:31pm
Thank you for a comment that is an informed and a real opinion. I have been bitterly disappointed by the biased, and frankly hostile comments by Tony Abbott. Since the details of the scheme has been presented to the Australian Public several financial and political people have agreed and admired the details. I continually feel the attack on our Prime Minister is purely an opposition to any thing the Federal Government try to do. I for one would like him to tell us of his plans and not just listen to his continual verbalizing. Put up or Shut up........
Anthony Gale
11th Jul 2011
5:34pm
Kaye, I fully agree with you our childrens children need a safe world to live in even good old New Zealand is ahead of Australia as the Prime Minister Mr Kees told the House what they had done and he is the same party as Mr Tony Abbot I did not see him oppose what they are doing over or does he just like to see the world die off, He certainly has a way to stir up trouble but no policies of their just scare mongering, the big companies have been getting away with too much polluting for too long. As for nuclear power we do not want it look what is happening around what with Russia, Japan, lets use the waves in the oceans and winds of our fine land. Julia is going to help the low income earners and pensioners, and help the companies to enforce climate change so where are the jobs going to be lost. We already have a Problem here in WA with Barnets Party stirring up job losses here and putting apprentices out of chances to better training and trying to do away with union type scare mongering.
Brackets
11th Jul 2011
5:37pm
Well said Kaye - time for Mr Abbott to move away from spurious soundbites and engage in a substantial debate with the Government. The public will then be able to make an informed judgment. In doing so, we should not overlook the fact that John Howard refused to implement the advice of his own expert committee and expand the Mandatory Renewable Energy Scheme (a decison that sent Australian jobs to China from where we now import wind power technology that we used to make here) and rejected an emissions trading scheme designed by Treasury because it was brought to Cabinet by his nemesis, Peter Costello. The Opposition engages in puerile politics while the Government gets on with the job.
GeminiJune
11th Jul 2011
5:44pm
I am so strongly opposed to your outspoken knocking of Tony Abbott that I intend now to unsubscribe from your emails Kay. If you think taxing our industries is the right anser then that is naive. We need to work with industry because they create jobs for our kids and our future. The poor farmers have had to put up with the knee jerking that goes on at Federal Level with the cattle debacle when there are other abbatoirs that do the right thing. Look at the debacle of the squandering of money with the Education debacle and the Insulation disasters. Labor cannot implement anything properly and the Greens are a waste of space. We need to create a double dissolution and get rid of the lunatics running this country. Julia Gillard really would love to increase GST to 15% like New Zealand has done so when she gets this tax installed - watch out!
JJ
11th Jul 2011
5:55pm
I feel saddened by the comments of so many who don't support the carbon tax - it indicates the extent of resistance to the changes necessary to protect the planet if we are to survive with a reasonable standard of living. We have been taking everything we can get and not putting anything back for so long now; it seems that all we are interested in are our own wants and desires regardless of what that may cost. With our population growing as it is the rate at which resources are used up, and the growth of emissions of pollutants increases the problems will increase exponentially.
To those who say that climate change is not happening, I would ask why are the icecaps melting as they undoubtedly are? Why are we experiencing so many catastrophic natural events? What is the cause of the high levels of smog blanketing many major cities in the world with attending health problems for the inhabitants?
Okay, maybe a carbon tax is not the best way to go, but at least it's a start; and until some authority comes along with a better plan I am happy to go along with it. If it costs me, too bad - I can wear it. We have grown so accustomed to our modern way of life that we take it for granted that the resources we require are limitless. There are many brilliant scientists all over the world who could put their talents toward discovering better and cleaner ways of doing things and manufacturing goods and providing services which lessen our carbon emissions. They just need funding, and this is partly what the carbon tax will help to do.
As for Tony Abbott, once upon a time I respected him. But not now. He appears to have one chant, and that is all we ever hear. If he had anything constructive to add to the debate, or if he actually calmly discussed the issue instead of loudly arguing I would be happy to listen. Manufacturing industries of course are dead set against the carbon tax, as they would be against anything which looks like affecting their profit margins so they will bring out all the old arguments of job losses and business failures to scare us into voting against the government in the next election, or protesting in the streets about this terrible tax!
I wish Julia and her government well, but I am fearful of the backlash I expect to see at the next election. If Tony comes to power and pulls this whole plan apart, I will feel devastated.
johnso
11th Jul 2011
6:05pm
I agree with you, Kaye. It's taken far too long to reach this stage. The media in Australia is a disgrace! And the journalists have no principles at all. Let's go with it now without the biased opions we are receiving from the media.
Bunyip
11th Jul 2011
6:17pm
Hi Kaye, sorry, but unfortunately the 6.00oclock news, or listening to some of the most pathetic politicians bleating about Global Warming, sorry it is now Climate change, constitutes real research. It is amazing how little research is needed to become an expert, and promote this line of misinformation.

(Dec 09) CIA cooling report: "The western world's leadlng climatologists have confirmed reports of a detrimental global climatic change [cooling]. The stability of most nations is based upon a dependable source of food, but this stability will not be possible under the new cllmatic era. A forecast by the University of Wisconsin projects that the Earth's climate is returning to that of the neo·boreal era (1600-1850) - an era of drought, famine, and political unrest in the western world." (1974)

I am so disappointed with mankind, we need to respect and conserve the planet, the land, the birds fish and the trees, not this diatribe we are being force fed by dopey politicians of whatever persuasions.The old story, when can you tell when a politician is lying? you can see their lips move......holds very true today. THIS IS JUST ANOTHER TAX DRESSED UP SO THE GULLIBLE WILL SWALLOW IT.once in, it will get higher, and higher as the years go by. I agree with Big Al and the others who can recognise B/S.
Chevy Chase
11th Jul 2011
6:18pm
Hi Kaye, I'm sure you're a nice person, and LifeChoices is a great publication, but I'm afraid I feel in this instance you are dead wrong. The Carbon Tax and ETS's have largely been promoted by greedy individuals such as Malcolm Turnbull, Tim Flannery, and a number of governments, including Australia's Greens/Gillard alliance. None of these schemes will make one iota of difference in reducing temperatures from the CO2 emissions from our planet. Unfortunately, through well-meaning, but deceived people wanting to do the "environmentally right thing", Australia has fallen under the control of the crackpot minority group, the Greens. Over the next 3-6 years they now have the power to implement some of their screwball ideas, which will severely damage our country and the lives of future generations. Climate alarmists and the largely left biased Australian media have successfully stifled debate and alternative views to global warming. There are a few voices of reason, such as Terry McCrann and Andrew Bolt, but as with the Y2K Virus, Wonthagi Desal Plant, N-S Pipeline, Myki, Smart Meters, the Very Fast Train, etc. the majority of people will not realise the folly of such schemes until it is too late.
maris song
11th Jul 2011
6:21pm
Hi Kaye.... looks like you're another one of those who have been slowly and successfully brain-washed by this government with its constant bombarded of the so called climate change and can no longer think outside the square. However, I have to agree with you that per capita throughput we are probably one of the highest in the world, if you disregard the many small islands who use coal for their daily heating needs. But by going per capita is the most outrageous reason anyone can use because at the end of the day our throughput is still less than China by miles!!! So, the solution to your per capita comment is for Australians to simply multiply faster to reduce our per capita throughput emissions and become the lowest in the world... simple solution and making love is a lot of fun.... Come on Australia lets multiply faster and make Kaye happy by lowering our per capita emissions because tomorrow according to her is too late. Please look at the whole picture before you accept spins from this government. I guessed you liked her address to the nation last night whereby she was addressing us with a voice like she was reading a story from a fairy tale book. This cardon tax is exactly like that ...a fairy tale tax.
WATCHER
11th Jul 2011
6:41pm
Kaye, with all due respects, climate change, global warming/cooling has been a fact of life ever since this planet acquired a gaseous atmosphere. This planet has undergone successive and constant dry periods,wet periods hot & cold. In the last 650 million years Earth has been subjected to 5 great extinction periods, at least 3 extreme glaciation periods and at least as many warming periods. Continents have drifted all over the place. Oceans have risen and fallen. untold species have come and gone. Our atmosphere has changed in gaseous content many times - all without the help of human beings. Climatologists will tell us that our entire history of civilisation has been experienced at the tail end of the most recent ice age. Yes, carbon dioxide is a prime driver of heating and cooling of our planet together with a plethora of other gases. It is also quite possible, even a certainty that the activities of humankind are accelerating the current process. However, to imagine that putting a price on carbon - any price - will have any useful effect on humanities' looming troubles is really in the same category as attempting to irrigate the Sahara Desert by urinating from the top of the nearest sand dune. Our politicians would have us believe that their fooling around the edges of the situation, making speeches and "selling us" on their ideas will somehow reverse the current global trends. Pure arrogance! They are attempting to cover up their inability to confront the real challenges. The human population of this planet is much too large. Our demand for a better and better lifestyle, more technology, more labour saving devices, better, cheaper and more convenient personal transport by more and more of the world's inhabitants all requiring the expenditure of more & more energy is racing off the scale. Correct me if I have the numbers wrong but I am led to believe that we now need to produce, process and transport some 8 million tons of food Per DAY just to feed all the people. That results in human bodily wastes of some 5 million tons Per Day. All of which must be rendered down by whatever processes, but all resulting in huge quantities of greenhouse gases. The World demand for Steel, Aluminium,Copper etc are all increasing and all require vast amounts of energy to mine, process, transport and form into objects we consider essential. Even making and transporting fired clay bricks for our houses is energy intensive. We do not live in a unique atmospheric bubble over Australia. We share all the World's atmosphere with everybody else. What the rest of the world does renders anything we do in Australia virtually irrelevant by way of our small contribution. If we decided to shut down Australia totally:- no Aircraft, no trucks, buses, trains, cars, tractors or earthmoving machines; no factories, no shopping malls no animals of any kind and yes no people at all; the world annual Carbon Dioxide emissions would fall by just under 2%. That saving would be overtaken in around 6 months by the annual growth of emissions from China or India. A Carbon Tax? The only possible way that it can work is if, on a GLOBAL basis, our World's entire population is reduced to somewhere less than 1 billion souls; and all of those remaining revert to the lifestyle and living standards of the early nineteenth century. ( Of course we could not permit the use of wood for heating and cooking for at least a century after that to allow the forests to regenerate). Even then the planet may refuse to co-operate and just keep right on indulging in Climate Change. An Australian Carbon Tax to save the World? Pure self indulgent, self deluding rubbish! Just one more futile gesture by politicians who have neither the skill, the ability or the courage to come up with a real and workable long term process of adaptation to what will be an inevitable change to the climate in which we live. We are not clever enough or powerful enough to stop a process which has now reached, for us, a critical moment. If we do not adapt, humans will become just another extinction; another species who have outlived our ability to survive in our environment!
Dewey
11th Jul 2011
7:00pm
Well, you certainly set the cat among the pigeons didn't you. Can't understand people who get so upset when someone expresses their opinion, ie someone withdrawing their subscription merely because you expressed yours (we know which way that person's leanings are don't we). From my point of view, if Tony Abbott won the next election I would have to emigrate somewhere else. He is so negative about everything (and no I don't always vote Labour). Now on to climate change. So much misinformation is put out by the mainstream media and especially the shock jocks. Listening to Media Watch on the ABC is testament to that. We all have our own opinion on climate change but merely talking about it and taking no action seems to have been going on for a number of years. As well as a carbon tax, we all need to be changing our habits that have led to this situation the world finds itself. Yes, the climate has changed several times over the centuries but the changes that are taking place right now have sped up recently more than any other time. That alone should show us that humans are contributing to this. We caused the problem and unfortunately we all have to pay. Information about climate change can be found through other channels rather than the media. Ah, well, I guess things are going to get very interesting over the next several months.
stevo
11th Jul 2011
7:25pm
Kaye, Why do people like yourself believe the "crap" that the Labor Party spins. 99% of Australian know that this "Carbon Tax" is just another TAX and won't change anything to do with climate change. Do you really believe that this tax will make a column of air, stationary over Australia and be cleaner than anywhere else in the world.
Take your head out of the sand and except that it is just another tax to make up for all of the over spending this Labor Government has done in the past.
WAKE UP AUSTRALIA
wazza
11th Jul 2011
7:42pm
Kaye, while Aus is the largest per capita contributor compare total contributions to get the real picture. China pop. 1.3b, 7.7bmtpa, USA pop 300m, 7.1bmtpa, India pop 1.2b 2bmtpa, Brazil pop 193m 1bmtpa, Australia pop 22m o .bmtpa. 5% reductin in output for Aus is 30mtpa, not a huge contribution.
Pines
11th Jul 2011
8:50pm
Kaye, I really feel the negative comments you have received are reflective of Tony Abbott's negative attitude.. They talk of Labor brainwashing people, but I think Abbott has gone all out to brainwash Australians with his constant reference to "stabbing Kevin Rudd in the back" etc., and Great big Tax. He is like a broken record. He was perfectly willing to work with the Greens and Independants before the last election so surely would have had to follow the same route if he had been successful. His mentor John Howard was also in favour of a Carbon Tax. OK Julia Gillard may have lied when she said she would not have a Carbon Tax but John Howard also lied when he said "There will never be a GST" but we got it anyway. Are they gullible enough to believe Tony Abbott will abide by every promise he makes, I can assure you all he won't. He hasn't in the past and I don't expect him to do it now. Furthermore as Ms Gillard said we have time to see how it works and if it is genuinely a bad tax, well vote for Abbott next time and try your luck. And no! I am not a died in the Wool Labor voter, I originally voted more often with the Liberal Party and class myself as a swinging voter. People should vote more with their heads and not because they feel some allegiance to a particular party because "We have always voted this way" Lots of the criticisms I have seen directed at Julia Gillard are directed at her appearance and clothing and I am sure some voters do not like her because of this or the way she dresses etc., or merely because she is a woman. It's ridiculous and childish. I am the first to admit I don't know the full extent of Global warming and Our Carbon Footprint
, but it stands to reason with the amount of appliances everyone owns and uses nowadays plus all the resources we use, we must be having some detrimental effect on our world, it's just common logic. As far as Labor wasting all the money, would we have fared so well during the GFC if they had not taken the steps they took. People should wake up and think for themselves. Good on you for having a strong opinion on this matter and I applaud you for the stance you have taken
raffel
11th Jul 2011
9:26pm
Hi Kaye
I think that people here have missed the point. If you come at it from another direction you could say wouldn't be nice not to have all that pollution in the La Trobe Valley Vic. or in Lithgow NSW and other areas. Or what about all the car pollution in the inner suburbs. We should charge those that pollute and put the funds into research to reduce this pollution. How many times have we complained about fuel prices which will only continue to increase. Not long ago it was stated by 2020 that petrol would be $8.00 a litre. How about we use some of the moneys raised from the polluters to come up with something that's cleaner and cheaper just like Brazil, ethanol pump price 75cents a litre, or make electric cars cheaper.
It would be nice if people would take action without being prompted but they don't. You don't see the same outcry about the charges for garbage collection. Why do we have rules about polluting rivers and not the air?
I'm one of the working families and I can see the advantages of changing my behaviour.
For example, scraped together enough to put a 5kw solar system on the roof. And now will not have to pay another electricity bill ever. Savings over 25 years of the system over $50000.00. Can't wait for electric cars savings from power bills will pay for this.
All I can say now is thank fully the majority of Australians voted the right way.
ozimarco
11th Jul 2011
9:33pm
Tony Abbott is living proof of the fact that, if you repeat something long enough and with enough conviction, people will start believing it. What really disappoints me is that so many Australians are not smart enough to see right through him and his negative tactics. Abbott does not care about the future of our grandchildren nor anything else for that matter. His only aim is to win the next election, by hook or by crook. Even if Labor had the best policies any government had ever devised, he would still be screaming his head off and oppose just for the sake of opposing.

It's refreshing to read an article such as Kaye's, obviously someone who cares deeply about people and the future of our planet and who has done her homework on the subject.

Because of our small population, we are only a small part of the total problem. That does not mean we should not do our bit and even set a good example for the rest of the world. There is no doubt in my mind that carbon reduction is going to be an issue for every country in the years to come, so the sooner we start doing something about it, the easier the transition to a low carbon economy will be. If we leave it for another ten years, the impact on the economy and people's standard of living will be far greater. The sooner we start the slow adjustment process, the easier it will be on business and the general public.

I commend Labor on this brave step. They may not win the next election but they will always be remembered for initiating courageous projects such as the NBN and the carbon tax. The Coalition, on the other hand, will be remembered for saying "NO!NO!NO!" to everything the government has ever done or proposed.

Mr Abbott, your carbon emission target is the same as the government's. Now that you know Labor's way of getting there, stop your yelling for a moments and give us the details of your policy. Or are you going to keep screaming BIG BAD TOXIC TAX for the next two years?
Kaye Fallick
11th Jul 2011
10:06pm
Dear YOURLifeChoices members

Many thanks for such thoughtful feedback - i am loving your comments
Keep them coming !

Kaye
verity
11th Jul 2011
10:20pm
Why is Julia Gillard running around trying to sell us the "Carbon Tax " when it doesn't
mean squat when we can't vote on it. Give us an election, put all the cards on the table
from both sides ,and let us decide. I thought we lived in a Democracy but it seems more
a Dictatorship at the present. John Howard did change his mind on a GST but he had the
ticker to go to an election so the people could decide as to what THEY wanted. This
woman was not elected by the majority but by default by her devious bribery of the Independants. If people want Tony Abbott to state his case then so be it, call an election, and both sides can run a proper campaign with the winner take all after the winner is decided by a democratic vote.
And as to Climate Change, I can remember when I was a child living in a terrace house in Sydney, when in February we would have a week or so of temperatures above 100F, no airconditioning, no fans just hot. It still gets hot in summer and it still gets cold in winter. Climate Change has been going on since the year dot. The trouble with the so called experts of today is they haven't lived long enough.
starbright
11th Jul 2011
10:22pm
The Australian Public has bought into Tony Abbotts scaremongering, you say Julia Gillaird is a Liar, cough cough what about John Howards "there will be no GST while I am in Government" my how we all have short memories, Do you think for one minute that Tony Abbott wants to wait till the next election, NO No by then we will have seen that his crap has been a storm in a teacup, To say there is no such thing as climate change, open your mind and your eyes Australia, think for yourselves for Heavens sake dont let Tony do it for you, you will be misled..............?????
starbright
11th Jul 2011
10:24pm
The Australian Public has bought into Tony Abbotts scaremongering, you say Julia Gillaird is a Liar, cough cough what about John Howards "there will be no GST while I am in Government" my how we all have short memories, Do you think for one minute that Tony Abbott wants to wait till the next election, NO No by then we will have seen that his crap has been a storm in a teacup, To say there is no such thing as climate change, open your mind and your eyes Australia, think for yourselves for Heavens sake dont let Tony do it for you, you will be misled..............?????
rogerh
11th Jul 2011
10:55pm
Just remember that "good old New Zealand" is ahead of Australia because well in excess of 50% of its power is from hydro-electric generation, then there is about 15% from geothermal sources and the balance from gas and black coal. I would be in support of the carbon tax and the ETS if there was an alternative source of power - nuclear perhaps?
Curley
11th Jul 2011
11:10pm
If you doubt the reality of climate change I'd suggest you have a look at the curley
following URL Then you can make up your mind. A quick look at the Carbon 11th Jul 2011
Cycle wouldn't hurt you either considering the rainforest destruction worldwide. 11:09pm
http://www.boston.com/bigpicture/2011/06/is weather becoming more extre.html
rayj34
11th Jul 2011
11:39pm
Two years ago I had the pleasure of travelling the perimeter of Iceland. To my lasting consternation I was shown by the locals what is rapidly happening to their Island. The number of glaciers that are quickly melting in front of their eyes is alarming. The evidence is very clear to them. We can talk about figures and percentages forever.....but talk to the people who are already being affected..... whether you call it "Climate Change" or some other fancy words...... the facts are undenyable AT least our Government is attempting to do our little bit. All Mr Abbott has done so far is scream NO.... to everything. If he was far more positive I would listen to him. But while he remains the entirely negative "NO" man, I have difficulty. Clearly he only wants to become PM. All else is negative abuse which is below a person of his stature.
Please, let's have some honest debate based on factual information, not the childish name calling that our politics have descended into. Our Nation's future is too important to continue this name calling, no matter which area of politics we support. Come on Mr Abbott, show us what you can really do..... with NO negatives, please.
RaymondLJ
grmc1
12th Jul 2011
1:17am
Well done Kaye, spot on in my humble opinion. You certainly got the opposition trolls, both paid and unpaid frothing at the mouth, as usual, against any idea beneficial to the population at large but detrimental to their own narrow minded dogma. They are characterised by their strict adherence to their playbook, necessitated, of course, by the fact that they are simply incapable of independent thought. It goes something like this:1 Bash the Prime Minister with nasty denigrating comments that have little basis in reality but certainly hook the basest emotions of other unthinking people. 2. Bash any or all political parties that do not subscribe to their particular view of the world. 3. Misrepresent any available statistic that can be said to support their view, judiciously avoiding any supporting facts. 4. Raise any past errors of the government to the level of a mortal sin and declare it is typical of their entire term, never forgetting to cast aspersions upon their money management and accusing them of needless waste, again judiciously avoiding the real facts. 5. Excuse any mention of their own mistakes quoting sufficient misinformation to effectively, if invalidly, justify the excuse. Support nuclear power as the preferred safe non polluting source, despite it being a contradiction in terms that even the most dim witted amongst us is able to discern. 6. repeat the aforementioned points as often as possible. I was pleased to read other rational contributors calmly and peacefully but them back in their boxes, revealing the benefit of quoting genuine findings and realistic assessments.
Deanna
12th Jul 2011
2:31am
Well, I've just gone through all the replies to your article Kaye, may I say it is fairly obvious what side of the fence some of the replies sit, may I say first and foremost my allegiance does not necessarily lie anywhere in particular, I will read and decipher what I can from all points of view.
Having said that, I'm sorry but I don't agree with your view, I don't agree with the Carbon Tax, I personally feel that the Govt needs to top up the treasury, they can't up the GST as they need agreement from All States for that and with there being three Lib States now, that is not going to happen, hence a Carbon Tax.
Another point is the Govt doesn't have a mandate for this tax as Gillard did say there would be no Carbon Tax under her Govt and the people voted accordingly, if she had admitted at that time there would be a Carbon Tax under her Govt, then the election result may have been quite different.
A couple have mentioned in their replies that Howard had brought in a GST after saying there would be no GST under a Howard Govt, yes, that is correct, but, if I remember correctly, he did put it to the next election and the people still voted him in, which gave him the mandate to introduce the GST with the clause that it can't be increased unless agreed by all States as I mentioned above. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
As for Tony Abbott, how i wished there was someone else in his party that could step up to the plate and give us more of an idea as to what a Lib/NP would do to reduce the Carbon problem, that way at least, we could see an alternative.
As far as Climate change goes, I have followed the weather since I was very young, I still have a rain guage in our back yard and I still follow the weather patterns. Yes, we have had drier winters in recent years but, are the summers getting hotter, No, not with my records, are the winters getting warmer, no not with my records.
You can call me a Climate Change, Ozone Layer (which I believe is closing above Aus), Global Warming skeptic but I believe our seasons run in cycles.
I use to listen to the 'Old People's' stories when I was young (use to love them) and some of those old timers use to tell of the droughts and lack of rain for years and then it would all turn around again, 100 year cycles they use to call it. I'm not saying no damage has been done with all the pollution but I do believe that a lot of work has already been done in that area, if we continue on the path we are going down it would do more good than any tax that a Govt could impose. Just my opinion and my view, I hope I haven't offended anyone by them. Cheers
PlanB
12th Jul 2011
6:53am
This Carbon tax is a rort, they tell us that we are the ones responsible for this, but it would be the damning and the cutting down of forests in the likes of the Amazon and else where that would be doing the damage. WHAT are they doing about that NOTHING !!! Because it is BIG business that controls all Governments and always has been. This Tax is a way of the Government to get back in surplus nothing more. The Climate has been and will continue to change since time began.

As far as Abbot goes, it is about time he stepped down, not that there is anyone in that party at the moment I could vote for or in Labour.
All Governments are the same just go under a different name--they are all liars and treat us like Mushrooms. We are told what THEY want us to know NO more
Watto
12th Jul 2011
10:09am
Kaye , you look more sensible than the picture your article paints of you . The reason why the majority of comments are not in your favour is that you are talking to a section of the public who are in the more "mature" bracket . You must understand we have seen all this before. This "change" in the weather pattern happens in a cyclic way. I love it when these global climate alarmists say things like " it is the hottest June day since 1934" and these dumb journalists listening never ask the obvious question . What caused the temperature spike in 1934 ???
A lot of people are making a lot of money out of this b---s--- . Look at Al Gore and his fictional movie . He's lying low since the drought broke and the temp dropped .
If it was not for the Greens putting Gullard in power she would not have even thought about this rubbish .
Unfortunately Gullard is well on the way to stuffing up a great Country...think of all the other policy failures. Has there been one good decision...apart from getting rid of Krudd ?
sydneycl
12th Jul 2011
10:38am
If Kaye did her research properly, she would discover, to her undoubted amazement, that during their occupation, the Roman’s grew grapes and brewed their own wine in England during their occupation in the early A.D’s. and that cows used to graze well into the Arctic Circle. I could give many more examples, but I’m sure these are sufficient. Both Gillard and Brown must be cured of their “King Canute Syndrome”. This whole secular religion of global warming is getting to look more and more like the Y2K scam which cost us billions (literally) for nothing.
It was in November 2009 that a huge cache of emails between IPCC Climatologist Michael Mann (author of the bogus ‘Hockey Stick Graph”) and other IPCC scientists was imported to the Internet where it rapidly became clear that they were very worried that the Earth had entered a natural cooling cycle in 1998 and discussed how to pressure scientific journals to not publish the research of sceptics refuting the hoax.
As far as shunning all fossil fuels is concerned, even Kevin Rudd said that he didn’t want to be Prime Minister of a country that didn’t make anything and I can assure Kaye that no steel manufacturer (One Steel, Bluescope etc.) or similar heavy engineering or power generation company could ever satisfy their energy requirements using renewables such as solar or wind for their base load power. It won’t be much more expensive at first Kaye, but it would simply ruin Australia and our literally ‘millions’ of jobless would become the poor white trash of Australasia.
And I haven't even mentioned wealth redistribution, social engineering, rubbery figures affecting the budget, or following the money trail all the way to even more bloated bureaucracy than we have already. Oh Yes, and if you believe that Treasury officials are politically neutral or that Ross Garnaut isn't Gillard's chief sales director, then you'll believe that the power station pictured in Cate's Carbon ad. isn't a 30 year old picture of London's Battersea Power Station which closed many years ago.
Ellis
glendapalmer
12th Jul 2011
12:34pm
Dear Kaye, I think, judging by the comments already 'blogged' that you have got the message! I just wonder how many of the 'climate changers' have actually visited our outback, seen for themselves the vastness of our land, the crystal clear skies - the lightmeter on pre-digital cameras used to go right off the scale, the light was so bright. Have they seen the billions of carbon-munching trees (remember that "Hyzel", said Bob Hawke in one of his speeches, had just planted the first of a billion trees). Your comment that a carbon scheme had been 'happily operating in Europe for the past six years' almost made me choke. Everyone reading my blog should Google "Redcar Steelworks Closure" - it is mind-boggling. 1700 men out of work in just one area - and we have had emissaries from the UK coming here and telling us that not one job had been lost! Jules got into bed with the Greens to snatch power and it is quite obvious even to Blind Freddie that this is why she changed her stance from "There will be no carbon tax under the government I lead" to the introduction of it - but don't say this is a tax, because, as Jules tells us, it isn't a tax. Kaye, you appear to me to be a dyed-in-the wool socialist, with the extremist views of the Greens. If the government wants to introduce this ridiculous tax, they should seek a mandate from the country. The billions that have been spent on this non-event could have funded the drought proofing of Australia, flood proofing and bushfire fighting facilities (why do we have to borrow 'Elvis' every year - we should have a couple ourselves), not to mention health and education facilities. If you want a real picture, Kaye, read Andrew Bolt or watch The Bolt Report, read Miranda Devine and economist Terry McCrann. Kaye, I realise that you said your comments were "just an opinion", but honestly, I think it's you, not Abbott, who should 'get real' - Glenda Palmer
Sheppie
12th Jul 2011
5:02pm
I can't believe how selfish we seem to be! Our generatioon has had the best of our beautiful country and planet, and we have become so unspeakably selfish that we don't care about the people who will come after us.
Sheppie
12th Jul 2011
5:03pm
I can't believe how selfish we seem to be! Our generatioon has had the best of our beautiful country and planet, and we have become so unspeakably selfish that we don't care about the people who will come after us.
Sheppie
12th Jul 2011
5:03pm
I can't believe how selfish we seem to be! Our generatioon has had the best of our beautiful country and planet, and we have become so unspeakably selfish that we don't care about the people who will come after us.
zedi
12th Jul 2011
5:27pm
Hi Kaye

Congratulations on a thoughtful comment about climate change. Frankly, I find it incredible how many people flatly deny the reality of human-caused climate change. The evidence is overwhelming. Can I suggest that people who doubt the reality visit this site: http://climate.nasa.gov/ This sets out the evidence and the reasons in a very easy to understand way - and it is based on measurements by NASA - the same people who put the man on the moon! So they are not "idiots" as some of your commentators believe Julia Gillard etc to be. Sure, there can be debate about the best way to tackle the issue, but to deny it exists is just sticking your head in the sand.
PJ
12th Jul 2011
5:52pm
I have been reading all the above comments for and against the carbon tax. I think both sides have written their thoughts very plainly. I for one do not believe in the carbon tax as humans being what they are will go along their own merry ways. I think Tony Abbott should shut up until he has an honest & accurate answer to all this. What ever government is in power will do exactly what they want to fill the coffers. No matter how we the people speak up against the government in what we think is wrong nothing will be done to correct matters to satisfy us all. God save Australia please before its to late.
sparkplug
12th Jul 2011
6:11pm
Hi Kaye, I feel sorry for you. How can you be so naive as to believe the bunk being fed to us by our "beloved" Prime Minister. After all there will never be a carbon tax while she is Prime Minister. God save Australia from all politicians...... but I guess that is already too late!!!
southern192
12th Jul 2011
6:16pm
I've never yet heard ONE WORD from all these weather-climate "experts" about all the volcanos going off, which, just one would expell more crap into our atmosphere than every man that ever walked the earth. The latest volcano in Chille blasted out so much crap that airlines were grounded, and right here in oz. Further to these "experts", these are the very same characters that gaze into their crystal ball of tricks to see what the weather will be in 100-1,000 years time right, but these very same "experts" are unable to even guess what the weather will be like next monday. I have no doubts of some sort of change in our weather, but, not one of these idiot politicians has even turned to the sun, which controls our weather. Now what little is known of our sun is that it too has cycles, one of 11 years, no doubt there are many more. Our weather "experts" have been studying weather patterns for a little over 100 years, yet our world is over 6 billions years old, and, the earth has cycles as well, that is not yet understood by these same "experts"? Finally, who would believe one of our damned politicians?? Especially with Gillard's disgusting track record. Put it to the people to vote on, not incompetent blithering politicians that are run by the loony greens mob
allen61
12th Jul 2011
6:44pm
Well Kaye we are only on this planet for a short time and how many civilisations have been here before us we will never know. The Earth is a living breathing ball of energy and no matter what we do is of little consequence it will do as it wants If we sit down and think about how this planet controls itself spinning on its own in the universe and if it just varies off the same course by a few hundred kilometres or so that alone could alter weather patterns as the world is not a fixed object attached to some immovable pendulum and for a few humans as we call ourselves to think that we can alter the very fabric of this planet that spins around the sun and has done so for millions if not billions of years is beyond belief and arrogant, our scientists know a lot about us as humans and how we behave but to think that they know anything relative to the way this planet behaves and think they can control it is pure fantasy we are like fleas on a dogs back and when the planet has had enough of us it will shake us free and then go to another adventure I guess as I do not know just as our so called experts don’t. The politicians and the so called experts have one thing on their minds and that is securing large salaries for themselves and a very comfortable lifestyle while they are here and at whose expense they do not care human nature being what it is. This climate change fiasco has been jumped on by every con man and political manipulator on the planet just for financial gain personally I would like to know who are the big investors in the power industry to-day it would probably be the very people who are putting up the most noise to protect their investments . If we sit down and think about how this planet controls itself spinning on its own in the universe and if it just varies off the same course by a few hundred kilometres or so that alone could alter weather patterns as the world is not a fixed object attached to some immovable pendulum.
Nautilus
12th Jul 2011
7:27pm
The Gillard/Greens carbon tax is high risk for Australia's economic future and with that, the future quality of life and freedom of generations to come. It does not even address overpopulation and its effects on increasing the carbon footprint. Nor is there any attempt at decreasing the carbon production of government, which is strangely ruled out of the equation. But the main problem is its inherent risks and the uncertainty it produces, as this article identifies,
http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/2788496.html

There are a number of threads on this site dealing with the Gillard/Greens proposed carbon tax. Some are presently running parallel to this thread. All are relevant.

I do not intend to repeat anything written elsewhere, but suffice it to say that this policy is the desperate ploy of a very average, accident-prone politician who was given every chance as Australia's first woman Prime Minister to do some good for the country, despite the sorry politics by which she assumed the role. The record shows that the scheme proposed by her deposed predecessor, Kevin Rudd, was superior to the one Gillard and the opportunist Greens now propose, yet they sledged and undermined Rudd.

Julia Gillard has earned the wooden spoon as Australia's worst PM by a very long distance and there will be many who will now argue and rightly so, that if her term should result in anything useful and productive at all it would be a review and cutting of the overly generous retirement conditions for life enjoyed by ex-prime ministers and others such as governors and governors general.
Waterbaby
12th Jul 2011
7:50pm
I used to believe that we lived in a democracy where the Prime Minister doesn't impose things upon us and that things would go through the various Houses. How wrong can one be. Julia's words "Australia WILL have a carbon tax"...sounds more like a dictatorship country that we live in and all this by a non-elected Prime Minister. We have three people running the country...the Greens. What a debacle. We are one of the most taxed countries on this earth and the poor are getting poorer, the middle-class is disappearing...what on earth is going on? Julia, if you listened to the people of Australia, you might just get it right for once. As it is Australia is on the brink of destruction.
Ted Nth Qld
12th Jul 2011
8:26pm
Hi Kate. Your comments disappoint me - especially as you appear to be so intelligent but still capable of making stupid statements - my opinion only. Surely a P.M who is leading a minority Govt. who made a solemn pledge just before the last election that there would be no Carbon Tax and only a few months after just scraping into Govt. with the help of Greens and Independents announces there will be a Carbon Tax cannot be trusted. The figures they are quoting now are there to sweeten up the unthinking. Once implemented the current figures will no doubt go out the window. After all everything this Govt has tried has been a disaster so why should we expect different now.She has no mandate for the Tax and we should be allowed to go to the polls so that Australians can decide.
IanD
12th Jul 2011
8:36pm
After reading all the above comments, I wish people would read some of the books written by real experts on this subject. In particular I think of "Heaven and Earth" by Prof Ian Plimer, who is a Professor of Geology in Adelaide. Geology (from Greek 'Earth Study') often looks at the effects of natural climate change on the earth over millions of years. Many of the so-called experts today are chartered accountants, interested in how much tax the government will raise and spend, or how much little valueless certificates will change hands for in the future, or they may be philosophers concerned about the evil actions of the human race past and present, or may just be believers in the new green religion (absolute faith) as a substitute for the old religions.
The world has had many previous periods much colder than the present and many periods much warmer than today. For most of this time humans were not around to cause any problems.

Let us just accept that the world will always change, and adapt to it.
aquatrek
12th Jul 2011
9:19pm
Kaye Fallick 11th Jul 2011 10:06pm Dear YOURLifeChoices members Many thanks for such thoughtful feedback - i am loving your comments Keep them coming ! Kaye

Well Kaye - is that your best journalistic response ? seeing as how you elicited the debate, though probably not with ideas/words of your own [you are a paid journalist after all - in academia it is called and shunned as plagiarism]. The poll here would seem to be firmly on the side of utter fear that our democracy is being sorely misused for purile political gains [definitively not saving the planet]. Thus I dare you to respond. Steve.
restitch
13th Jul 2011
1:18am
Kaye your figures re amount of carbon per population is not one to judge the amount of pollution Australia emits. To be honest you should tell the truth on exactly the amount each country emits and China is in the lead with USA next, then Canada with most other countries, including Australia, a mere 1% to 2% !!!!!!!!!! The Labor/Green machine is giving false information to the public and should come clean, like they want carbon to!!!
Kaye Fallick
13th Jul 2011
3:46pm
Dear Steve,
Firstly, thank you for joining our debate - that is what keeps a democracy strong.
I would like to clarify a couple of points - I am not paid to blog - I do so in my own time as a way of sharing opinions and fostering debate. It seems to be working as we have 60 responses - which, as an unpaid blogger, means I can continue to love the strong flow of comments whether in agreement of not with my original article. I have been in academia as a student and a teacher - and do not like plagiarism nor do I practise it - my blog is my own work and no one else's. We will publish our poll results in the next week or so, as it is important for our site members to know what this community thinks on topics such as the proposed carbon tax.
Steve, it is not necessary to dare anyone on this site to respond - a simple invite will probably work even better :-) So keep telling us what you think .. and respecting everyone else's right to do the same.
Kaye Fallick
13th Jul 2011
5:36pm
Hi Restitch
Thanks for your comments and request for me to tell the truth re carbon emissions. These statistics are not from the Labor Party. They are based on United Nations data - and were also published in the Herald Sun - a newspaper not know for its Labor Party support.
barbarajean
13th Jul 2011
6:39pm
Who would have believed that a can of hairspray would make so much difference to the ozone layer?
Thirty, maybe forty years ago we all began to look at the spray-cans we used for convenience in our lives to see if the propellant was a CCF. Industry joined in and removed CCF’s from many of the manufactured products we used daily.
Lo and behold the ozone hole began to decrease in size and now Tasmanians can go back to playing in the sun and to enhance the level of their Vit. D!

CO2 and other pollutants are having a much larger effect on our environment than CCFs including slow but measurable effects on the climate. In relation to the acknowledged natural changes which have occurred over the millennia, scientists can now, with confidence, say that the changes are not following the same pattern as in the past, that is, the changes have been occurring more rapidly since the beginning of the industrial revolution than at any other time in history including pre-recorded history. The science is in with a confidence level higher than that which puts most of the pills we all take on the pharmacy shelves and which few question. No, it is not at the 100% level but such confidence is rarely, if ever, seen in any scientific endeavour and would in fact attract much scepticism in the scientific community.

Julia G said a carbon tax would not be how she would tackle climate change if she were to lead the government. She also said that it was her intention in government to re-introduce an ETS program and that a carbon price would be part of that. In addition she canvassed the idea to a “citizens’ assembly” a fairly common process of negotiation in some parts of the world but the response from the opposition and the public was very clear. Tony A plus many Australian voters said that “we already have a “citizens’ assembly” and its called the parliament!”.

Tony A, on the other hand had said that the science for climate change was “absolute crap” but he went to the election suddenly believing that “climate change is real”, a ‘statement’ which he continues to espouse. On what grounds did he change his mind?

Let us, at least, in this argument, stop calling one of them a liar!! Perhaps it was that “circumstances” changed and a different emphasis had to be considered on both sides of the table.

The election led to Julia G forming a minority government, which was done under the rules of our constituted parliament. She very soon responded to the “citizens’ assembly” criticism to form a multi-party committee to represent all parties of the parliament and therefore, those representing the “citizens” to tackle the question of climate change and how the parliament might proceed. Tony A, on behalf of those who voted for the Coalition, refused to be part of the process. Negotiations went on without LCP representation whilst their leader went into “destroy Julia” mode.

I think I’m agreeing with Kaye.
thehobbit
13th Jul 2011
9:47pm
It's time we turned the focus to the positive. It's about a 'sustainable' future and that has to mean utilising renewable energy resources, not the finite ones we are currently digging and sucking out of the ground. Let's embrace the next revolution and secure a future for our grandchildren's children. It's time to pension off the horse and cart (coal and oil) and embrace hydro, solar, wind, wave, tidal, geothermal, and all the other wonderful renewables being developed. What an exciting time we live in and what a great future, with clean air and inexhaustible energy within our grasp. So what if it takes some financial incentives (or disincentives) to motivate the Luddites to embrace the future. Let's stop whingeing, and arguing about climate change and face the facts - the current energy sources won't last forever, and their extraction and use is polluting our environment.
DC
14th Jul 2011
10:01am
I am sorry but I have lost faith in Labor Governments and Julia's especially. Nothing they say is believable but for the sheep half the voting public seems to be. The Greens claim to have won a fair share in the last election but only for the abomination of our so-called proportional representation system. People scraped in because of preferences ONLY. There is no mainstream move to them. For Labor to pander to Bob's unreal believes is the damaging the country. Anyway, what would either BB nor Julia know about kids and the real costs and demands involved? Neither has a family in the constitutional sense.
As to Tony, he does not need to nor is required to justify anything at this stage. If Julia calls an election then I expect them to detail any proposals - not before.
Howard had the fortitude to go to an election with his GST!!! Not like this toxic government trying to sneak this past the Australian people. If Julia is convinced her policy is a winner call an election now, which will of course not happen. Surprising also is the fact that the unions are rather quiet about the carbon tax issue. Then again, what can one expect if the government consists of their mates, by and large. Oh, and one other thing: Tony the only one scare mongering?? How about the other side of the coin: Government paid "expert" dooms day consultants!!
trip
14th Jul 2011
6:14pm
I am not sure you can argue with people quoting the rainfall they have measured in their backyard or Bolt & Devine. I don't claim to be an expert but I think I will believe people like the CSIRO. Please don't write something about all the world's scientist joining together in a secret plot to falsify data and get themselves more grants. The new tax seems pretty fair to retirees, self-funded or otherwise & low income - it looks like people will be compensated for the things they can't change - and your grand children may gain. Some jobs will be lost, some will be gained, their will be an incentive to get rid of old, dirty coal-fired plants, the environment will be cleaner (even if it is just at a local level), we will broaden our base of fuels & encourage innovation. Some things might get more expensive, I doubt it will cause the end of Australia as we know it - although things might be slightly less air conditioned. Come on you all loved John Howard and he wanted it too.
newvogue
15th Jul 2011
2:30pm
Professor Ian Plimer (a member of the School of Earth and Environmental Sciences at the University of Adelaide . He is also a joint member of the School of Civil, Environmental and Mining Engineering) could not have said it better!

If you've read his book you will agree, this is a good summary. Are you sitting down?

Okay, here's the bombshell. The massive volcanic eruptions in Iceland last year and more recently in Chile , have, in just FOUR DAYS, NEGATED EVERY SINGLE EFFORT you have made in the past five years to control CO2 emissions on our planet, all of you.

Of course you know about this evil carbon dioxide that we are trying to suppress, that vital chemical compound that every plant requires to live and grow, and to synthesize into oxygen for us humans, and all animal life.

I know, it's very disheartening to realize that all of the carbon emission savings you have accomplished while suffering the inconvenience and expense of: driving Prius hybrids, buying fabric grocery bags, sitting up till midnight to finish your kid's "The Green Revolution" science project, throwing out all of your non-green cleaning supplies, using only two squares of toilet paper, putting a brick in your toilet tank reservoir, selling your SUV and speedboat, vacationing at home instead of abroad, nearly getting hit every day on your bicycle, replacing all of your 50 cents light bulbs with $10.00 light bulbs...well, all of those things you have done have all gone down the toilet in just four days.

The volcanic ash emitted into the Earth's atmosphere in just the first four days - yes - FOUR DAYS ONLY by the volcano in Iceland, has totally erased every single effort you have made to reduce the evil beast, carbon. And there are around 200 active volcanoes on the planet spewing out this crud any one time - EVERY DAY.

I don't really want to rain on your parade too much, but I should mention that when the volcano Mt Pinatubo erupted in the Philippines in 1991, it spewed out more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere than the entire human race had emitted in its entire YEARS on earth. Yes folks, Mt Pinatubo was active for over one year, think about it.

Of course I shouldn't spoil this touchy-feely tree-hugging moment and mention the effect of solar and cosmic activity and the well-recognized 800-year global heating and cooling cycle, which keep happening, despite our completely insignificant efforts to affect climate change.

And I do wish I had a silver lining to this volcanic ash cloud but the fact of the matter is that the bush fire season across the western USA and in Australia this year alone will negate your efforts to reduce carbon in our world for the next two to three years. And it happens every year.

Just remember that your government just tried to impose a whopping carbon tax on you on the basis of the bogus ''human-caused'' climate change scenario.

Hey, isn't it interesting how they don't mention ''Global Warming'' any more, but just ''Climate Change'' - you know why? It's because the planet has COOLED by 0.7 degrees in the past century and these global warming bullshit artists have got caught with their pants down.

And just keep in mind that you might yet have an Emissions Trading Scheme (that whopping new tax)
imposed on you, that will achieve absolutely nothing except make you poorer. It won't stop any volcanoes from erupting or bushfires, that's for sure.

But hey, relax, give the world a hug and have a nice day!

PS: I wonder if Iceland and Chile are buying carbon offsets?
newvogue
15th Jul 2011
2:30pm
Professor Ian Plimer (a member of the School of Earth and Environmental Sciences at the University of Adelaide . He is also a joint member of the School of Civil, Environmental and Mining Engineering) could not have said it better!

If you've read his book you will agree, this is a good summary. Are you sitting down?

Okay, here's the bombshell. The massive volcanic eruptions in Iceland last year and more recently in Chile , have, in just FOUR DAYS, NEGATED EVERY SINGLE EFFORT you have made in the past five years to control CO2 emissions on our planet, all of you.

Of course you know about this evil carbon dioxide that we are trying to suppress, that vital chemical compound that every plant requires to live and grow, and to synthesize into oxygen for us humans, and all animal life.

I know, it's very disheartening to realize that all of the carbon emission savings you have accomplished while suffering the inconvenience and expense of: driving Prius hybrids, buying fabric grocery bags, sitting up till midnight to finish your kid's "The Green Revolution" science project, throwing out all of your non-green cleaning supplies, using only two squares of toilet paper, putting a brick in your toilet tank reservoir, selling your SUV and speedboat, vacationing at home instead of abroad, nearly getting hit every day on your bicycle, replacing all of your 50 cents light bulbs with $10.00 light bulbs...well, all of those things you have done have all gone down the toilet in just four days.

The volcanic ash emitted into the Earth's atmosphere in just the first four days - yes - FOUR DAYS ONLY by the volcano in Iceland, has totally erased every single effort you have made to reduce the evil beast, carbon. And there are around 200 active volcanoes on the planet spewing out this crud any one time - EVERY DAY.

I don't really want to rain on your parade too much, but I should mention that when the volcano Mt Pinatubo erupted in the Philippines in 1991, it spewed out more greenhouse gases into the atmosphere than the entire human race had emitted in its entire YEARS on earth. Yes folks, Mt Pinatubo was active for over one year, think about it.

Of course I shouldn't spoil this touchy-feely tree-hugging moment and mention the effect of solar and cosmic activity and the well-recognized 800-year global heating and cooling cycle, which keep happening, despite our completely insignificant efforts to affect climate change.

And I do wish I had a silver lining to this volcanic ash cloud but the fact of the matter is that the bush fire season across the western USA and in Australia this year alone will negate your efforts to reduce carbon in our world for the next two to three years. And it happens every year.

Just remember that your government just tried to impose a whopping carbon tax on you on the basis of the bogus ''human-caused'' climate change scenario.

Hey, isn't it interesting how they don't mention ''Global Warming'' any more, but just ''Climate Change'' - you know why? It's because the planet has COOLED by 0.7 degrees in the past century and these global warming bullshit artists have got caught with their pants down.

And just keep in mind that you might yet have an Emissions Trading Scheme (that whopping new tax)
imposed on you, that will achieve absolutely nothing except make you poorer. It won't stop any volcanoes from erupting or bushfires, that's for sure.

But hey, relax, give the world a hug and have a nice day!

PS: I wonder if Iceland and Chile are buying carbon offsets?
barbarajean
15th Jul 2011
5:25pm
I am pretty sure volcano "ash" is not a greenhouse gas!

I have recently been given a book written by an eminent medical doctor – Dr Paul Epstein and his colleague Dan Ferber called “Changing Planet, Changing Health”. His simple definition of a very complex subject is worth considering, and I quote:

“For more than 10,000 years the planet’s climate has been relatively stable. ..... For thousands of years...humans developed ingenious ways to survive the elements – to stay cool in the heat, to keeps dry when it’s wet, to find warmth in the cold. When the wood, peat and whale oil used to fuel the fires of our burgeoning population ran low a few centuries ago, we discovered abundant new sources of fuel – the coal, oil and gas that began forming more than three hundred million years ago from the buried remains of ancient plants and animals.
For the past few centuries, we’ve mined, and burned these fossil fuels to cook , heat ...... and transport ourselves with increasing speed ..... Fossil fuels are rich in carbon, they combine with oxygen in air to form carbon dioxide when burned ......, we’ve pumped more than a half trillion tons of this gas into the atmosphere. This has raised the atmospheric CO2 concentration by almost 40% over that preindustrial era, to a level the planet has not seen for 30 million years.
Like the glass roof of a greenhouse, CO2 in the atmosphere traps heat.”

This is a very “potted” version of the process of changing a very natural and life-giving gas into a gas which is causing harm to the planet. One might say that a plastic bag in and of itself is not harmful, it is quite useful in fact, BUT, tell that to the “wandering albatross” that has taken it up into its gullet whilst catching a fish. What else is “pollution”?

...and then there is China?

I put “Solar Power in China” into Wikipedia and had a look at the “Energy Policy of the People’s Republic of China”. I quote here a little: ...... “ the country is currently the world’s largest emitter of greenhouse gases .........China’s per capita emissions are still far behind developed countries. {Aust. being the highest} China is also the world’s leading renewable energy producer.”

The inventor of one of the most efficient Solar Panel technologies is a Chinese-born Australian citizen who was educated in Australia. He could not get development finance here, so, although he would have preferred to stay here he went back to China.

The Chinese people aspire to the quality of life we enjoy and why shouldn’t they? They are using our country’s wealth to produce products to achieve this, they are developing technologies to keep their CO2 levels down, they are using our technologies and some of our community are suggesting that we ‘plant more trees’ – give me a break!!!!
jlhf43
16th Jul 2011
6:58pm
For every pro climate change argument put up by all of the armchair experts, there is an even more compelling argument showing the opposite view. I am a total climate change skeptic. Notice that other contributors have mentioned the change from "global warming" to "climate change". What a load of drivel that whole topic is! Listen to the link below for a scientist Professor Timothy Ball's talk with Alan Jones.

http://www.2gb.com/index2.php?option=com_newsmanager&task=view&id=9005

In this talk, Prof Ball speaks about the closure of weather stations which had collected weather and temperature data and in Australia was sent the data to the Bureau of Meteorology &/or the CSIRO. This data was collected by honest farmers, who recorded the data. They simply recorded what they found, but it disagreed with the UN/Al Gore lead mob who were pushing the "global warming" barrow at the time.

The UN is an organization which wants to dominate the world for their own ends, but not for the benefit of the citizens of the world. The people behind the UN aren't the people who we see in public, but powerful businessmen who have their own mutual agenda. I wouldn't trust the UN EVER, about ANYTHING.

Note that CO2 IS given off by volcanoes and the biggest contributors of CO2 are the OCEANS of the world, far in excess of man made emissions. One contributor pooh poohed "planting more trees". What a log head! Trees ingest CO2 and expel it as Oxygen.

Another thing that irritates me is every time we see a climate change report on TV, a chimney stack of a electric power generating station is shown. It's emitting steam not smoke! No wonder our kids are confused about pollution, when they see such misleading footage. I suspect just as many adults are mislead by this sort of reporting as well, which gives rise to some of the total drivel people are uttering.

Since time began, there have been changes in climate. We have been through many ice ages and warm periods. I remember in the 1950s, while in Dubbo, NSW, as a kid in primary school, the daily temperature at my school and my grandparents' house was about 115 degrees Fahrenheit. Nothing unusual at all, up there. And earlier on their farm near Gilgandra, it rained so heavily we couldn't see about 40 metres to the shed which housed all the farming equipment.

Here's another link worth looking at.

http://real-agenda.com/2011/01/31/the-little-ice-age-1300-a-d-to-the-20th-century/

No amount of grandstanding by Juliar Gillard will change my mind about global warming, climate change or whatever else "they" want to call it. It's been changing for millenia.

Oh, just a parting comment - when John Howard changed his mind about the GST, at least he had the guts to go to an election. Guess what? He won. Juliar knows she would lose, which is why she won't go to the polls over climate change
Acushla
25th Jul 2011
6:17pm
Kaye I have been reading about GW aka CC right from the start. When the Scientists made threats threatening statements against those Scientists who disagreed with them I knew something was wrong. Then they changed the words Global Warming to Climate Change they were unintentionally admitting they were wrong about the Winters being Warmer. I live in Brisbane and this winter 2011 has been the coldest winter since 1962. I believe GW is taking place in the summer months but it is not man made it is the SUN. Did you know that back in the past about 90-100 years ago the SUN was so hot even green grass was burning.? I said in my comments over the years the SUN would be burning searing HOT and it is happening. It will be even worse before this decade is over. We can prepare for it but not while the LIE is being told it is man made. You can reply to my Email address.


Join YOURLifeChoices, it’s free

  • Receive our daily enewsletter
  • Enter competitions
  • Comment on articles