Prolonging people's dying days is often not the best care
When do we want our lives artificially prolonged by medical intervention and when do we not? When we are frail and being cared for in a nursing home, maybe incontinent and unable to walk without help, maybe yelling and hitting out due to the brain changes of dementia, do we want to die then of natural causes or do we want that life prolonged?
Medical professionals would often decline treatment for ourselves under these circumstances but are reticent to recommend it for our patients. If you refuse life-saving treatment in a hospital, we will send a psychiatrist to make sure you don't have depression or other mental health problems - in effect implying that you must be mentally unwell to decline treatment.
all that you say I acknowledge - we live in a very sophisticated society with technology having permeated all of our lives - all to be taken into account and that we now live far beyond what was considered normal just a cupla hundred years ago.
If we were part of an everyday nomadic tribe in the past say in Siberia then the elderly would be left at some point in time to fend for themselves in the wilderness while the tribe moved on. Nowadays we do not live like that in Oz although the tribal traditions in the past would have made the decision a relatively straightforward one.
Now technology and medical care can extend life - albeit not always in the conditions as one would wish. We also push the envelope with the promotion of 'options' being made available, both to the elderly patient and to those who may have become responsible for that elderly patients life. So just like those past Siberian nomads each one of us may have to take decisions that are directly related to anothers life.
As I have stated earlier IMHO whether euthenasia is legalized or not it will always get down to the nitty gritty of what medical state the elderly person is in, what legalities have been put in place or not, the options available at the point in time to encompass the patient and the carer and the medical staff. There is no magic answer.
I have friends who have gone into seniors' complexes and loathe it. On asking why they did so, the common answer was that their families, worried about them living on their own, wanted them to do so. These are single people, who have lost their partners.
Not all experience this. Some couples enjoy the experience, making this decision themselves.
This indicates that those who are single often comply with family wishes, in order to keep the peace, and their families happy.
yet again there is no magic answer - each situation depends upon the individuals personalities, beliefs, families involvement and circumstances etc.
I have an 88 yr olde mother who lives alone in a high rise. She is slowly but surely getting to the state where she will not be able to simply look after herself. She is not eating properly and her memory is failing - not quite dementia though. We have visited several aged care establishments but mother says one day that she realises the risks of living alone yet the next day states that she will stay where she is.
So no matter what you keep on saying it is essentially a very grey area for each individual to endure. Best wishes and namaste.
aquatrek,
I agree with all that you say ... and especially your final paragraph.
Yes, aquatrek, this is a grey area, particularly so with the very elderly who seem to become more obstinate in their later years. I've witnessed similar scenarios to that of you and your mother.
I am not in your mother's age group, and am extremely fit, but one of my daughters is suggesting that I enter a facility. The idea appals me on every level. This alone would incite me to top myself.
With modern medical improvements and developments ideas of age have changed. I have a contemporary who walks from France to Spain annually following a very old pilgrim route, another is practicing for the Masters Games.
Best wishes and namaste to you ...
Twila
That is one of the wonders of knowing Jesus - I never have to fear or worry about what the future holds. I know without a doubt because I have put my life in His loving hands He will provide a path for me through my senior years to my death and then beyond. That is the assurance I have, total assurance. He promises, "I will never leave you nor forsake you." Even through death's dark vale He promises to walk with me. I cannot imagine how it would be to face these things without Him. Such is His grace and love for those who turn to Him.
YesTwilla
There is an 80 year old that climbed Mount Everest.
Abby,
There are so many people of senior years who are achieving things people half their age can't.
A 95 yr old neighbour is co-authoring a paper on the neuroscience of autism with a university academic. This neighbour told me that this paper is to be published next year. My immediate feeling was to wonder if she would be around to see this. No such doubts from this woman. She began her academic life quite late and went from strength to strength.
Sadly, someone observed that it was selfish and pointless of this elderly woman to be studying and doing research as she was taking up room of a younger person. As this woman is judged on the usual academic standards and is contributing to the world of knowledge, I thought it was a disappointing and small-minded thing to say.
there are those who just knock, whinge, complain ad infinitum about any progress/advancement/joy/pleasure/success generally or privately - the morons of society
it was heartwarming to read your confession.
surprised that you can read and that it wasnt your guide dog that did it for you as you are a whingeing moron of extraordinary ineptitude - have a nice day
Just returned from a walk with my blind dog, who, after reading your childish insult, said, is that the same moron? who confessed to being one? He is starting to use words now with more than four letters, also he must be a kind moron suggesting a nice day. We return the nicety, after you wipe the dribble from your chin.
my 25 year old Indian nurse wipes away my dribble - your dog told me that he does it for you because you cant find your foreever whingeing moronic mouth
It must have been wonderful times for your Indian nurse, looking after a moronic child, It must have been tough times for her trying to overcome thoughts of scalping, or maybe she didn't.
so now we have utter irrefutable proof of your whingeing moronicness !!
I said quite clearly in black txt that I had lived in India and your addled brain cells think that an Indian 'scalping' maiden is from some American tribe - duh
You had better book your EOL session with terib and get your things in order [not that you would have much other than the rags that you wear] as the dog will be glad to have a new master.
http://www.exitinternational.net/
sorry seth but only over 50 with a sound mind can attend any sessions so get the dog to go on your behalf
What I hate is when the media - as it always does - puts a person's age into an article. This should be irrelevant unless pertinent to the story.
Unfortunately, people conjure up a stereotype of that age - I confess I do the same - which shouldn't be a consideration.
For a growing section of the community, age has little relevance. The stereotype of age is not at all flattering and is unfair. It is about time this was changed.
People are now working until 67 years, but a person of 70, is seen as decrepid and ancient. It appears that within three years a person "gallops" downhill at speed.
I object to being regarded as "decrepid". I am not afraid to say I am 71 and not in good health structurally wise. Anyone got some spare spines I could have one perhaps. Also a new left foot I broke several years ago & now has to be recocstructed. Otherwise I am doing all right thank you. I still have my most of my marbles and still get out there helping people who are not so fortunate and also the boys in blue. Love that work. I paint whenever I need time out. My children know my wishes so won't put me in an old p...... home. I'll make sure of that.
hence why we encourage all our members at Exit to make out your paperwork and keep the family in the loop, then you can relax. At least until the time comes to fly over the mountain.
I fully expect ( and am somewhat prepared) to be living alone within the future and as I've no family in this country find it most comforting to know that when my time comes I will not be kept in a vegetative state by paid workers no matter how caring they may be, just knowing that my wishes are legally binding removes a great deal of what could be emotionally distressing to me.
This is the main reason people in the older age group join Exit knowing that they are given the right information to make informed decisions on how they want to end their life. It is like an insurance policy having plans made ready.
Anyone who doesn't prepare especially when on their own which I am too. Then they cannot expect people to second guess what they want & will follow the sheep.
I do have children in the next state but they are fully aware of what I want & are happy to oblige. So I am quite content.
terrib, I know exactly what you mean about being thought decrepid - that age presents a 'use by date'. I am 73 yrs of age. I am aware that there are things I cannot do ... but, to be honest, I never did these when I was younger.
When I've answered questions as to what I do with my time, I wait for the response which always has the sub-text ( "amazing at your age"). It is worse when I receive this from contemporaries. I could never do quilting, completely beyond me. It would be similarly stupid to infer the same sub-text when I see the amazing work of quilters of my age and older. What is wrong with these people who imply there are automatic restrictions to age.
I am a skin and organ donor and intended to put a NFR in place. However, another contributor on this forum advised that with an NFR, organs cannot be harvested, so ... I will have to be kept artificially "alive" for some time.
terrib,
I also couldn't bear being put in an old-person's home. If I was, I would fade away within a few weeks.
The women on my mother's side always knew when they were dying.
An aunt went to her husband and calmly stated "I am going" - he comforted her, and she died within half-an-hour. She was in her fifties with no history of illness. My mother asked for a priest, and after the necessary rites, she passed away. My grandmother told the nurses attending her ( she had had a minor stroke) that she was dying. The nurses denied she was dying, which she considered inefficient on their side. Every other woman in this familial line experienced the knowledge of impending death, and calmly sorted themselves out. None suffered in any way. The menfolk plummetted off their perches with massive and rapid coronaries.
I hope I am in a receptive mood when my end comes - otherwise I will be complaining loudly! I have read that many dying people, die in a way to comfort their families. Phoooie ... on that.
This might be of interest in this discussion. Judy Macdonald appears to address all the important issues for end of life.
www.ted.com/talks/judy_macdonald_johnston_prepare_for_a_good_end_of_life.html
That was very interesting. Unfortunately sometimes it is difficult to get people to talk about death let alone do any planning. I think they have the idea it won't happen to them. Beats me why.
terrib,
A surprising number of people die intestate - do not make wills.
Taskid...I am the same.............................faith is a wonderful thing.
Precious Yes all this worry about death and dying, unbelievers do it tuff, but it is their choice.
Yes well, we must all judge what is best for our individual selves 
A European Court has told Switzerland to make its assisted suicide laws more specific, after an 82-year-old woman seeking the procedure on the grounds of old age was denied it.
Alder Gross had requested euthanasia on account of diminishing mental and physical capability and an isolated and lonely life. Swiss doctors denied her the treatment, even after she appealed to the Zurich Health Board. Swiss law does not explicitly limit assisted suicide to the terminally ill.
Gross appealed to the European Court of Human Rights. This court ruled that has that "the absence of clear and comprehensive legal guidelines violated the applicant's right to respect for her private life".
It said Switzerland must specify whether its laws are meant to include people not suffering from terminal illnesses and, if so, spell out the conditions under which they can end their lives.
It also said the lack of clarity "is likely to have a chilling effect on doctors who would otherwise be inclined to provide someone such as the applicant with the requested medical prescription". However, the court did not specify whether the law should allow assisted suicide for non-terminally ill patients.
aquatrek,
The Institute of Family Studies (Australia)
www.aifs.gov.au/institute/pubs/fm1/fm37mj.html
The ill are 3-4 times more likely to be abused contributing figures to the final 3-5% cohort.
The elderly are particularly sensitive to being a burden, this makes them vulnerable.