4th Mar 2015
Older workers key to our future
Older workers key to our future

Older workers are the key to Australia’s economic growth, according to the Federal Treasurer, Joe Hockey. In an article published yesterday in The Age, Mr Hockey brought to light the discrimination of older Australians in the workforce, and how this is holding the nation back from its full economic potential.

Mr Hockey stressed that Australia needs to increase the number of mature workers in the workforce if it is to keep its economy growing. Failure to ensure this, he says, will mean “tax revenues will struggle to fund the same level of government services we enjoy today.”

Mr Hockey argued that an ageing population such as Australia’s cannot afford to reject the skills and capabilities of its older workers. He claimed that “we are discarding valuable older workers far too early.”

“To safeguard our way of life, we must maintain our incomes and keep people in jobs. In short, we need to keep the economy growing. One of the key drivers of long-term growth is widely recognised as having more people in the workforce,” he said.

Finally, Mr Hockey referenced Deloitte Access Economics, which estimated that “a three per cent increase in participation by the over 55s would generate a $33 billion annual boost to the national economy. A five per cent increase in participation would see a $48 billion boost to the economy.”

Mr Hockey argued that the benefits of longer term employment of older Australians would be seen across the board; not only would the government experience less of a budget strain, but also people remaining in the workforce, whose tax revenue would bolster older Australians relying on government support. Mr Hockey also discussed the health benefits that working longer and staying occupied have on older Australians.

Read more at The Age.

Opinion: Real issues, real action

It is all well and good to be an idealist, but when you are responsible for a country’s economic prosperity, idealism simply isn’t good enough. Real issues call for real action. Mr Hockey is bound by his role as Federal Treasurer to put his money where his mouth is. If he believes that older Australians should remain in the workforce, why won’t he offer Australians (young, old and in between) real promises about ensuring that there will be jobs for them?

The Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) classifies a mature worker as someone aged 55 or older. Figures from the ABS reported that in 2009/10, more than 35 per cent of jobseekers aged 55 and over stopped looking for work based on their belief that potential employers would think they were too old. Sadly, this trend is likely to be a considerable factor influencing low mature worker employment statistics today.

Currently, unemployment of older Australians sits at 64 per cent. Data from the Australian Human Rights Commission (AHRC) says that, on average, it will take a mature worker looking for employment more than one year, or an average of 70 weeks, to find employment. This is a direct result of the ageist attitude towards older workers seen in Australia.

There is one thing Mr Hockey said that I believe: “Older workers contribute knowledge and skills based on years of experience and expertise. We need older people working and contributing to our economic growth.”

Teachers, tradespeople, media professionals and corporate and business professionals – it is only when we can encourage all Australians that their input in their industry is appreciated, while still making jobs available for newcomers, will the nation flourish socially and economically. 

We need to be a ‘doing’ society and not just a ‘talking’ one. Most importantly, we need to make everyone feel valuable and relevant, to encourage them to continue contributing to our economy and – this is a crucial point – to reward them for it with lasting pensions. To Mr Hockey (and all your mates up there), consider this a little tip (free), from me to you.

Can having more mature workers in employment help Australia’s economic situation? Have you struggled to remain in or re-enter the workforce because of your age? 





    COMMENTS

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    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    9:56am
    Ill go back to work if they have Free Disabled Parking and a Walking Stick Rack in the Office !! :-)
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    10:00am
    Anyhow its 3.10 on the clock up there ! Time for afternoon Tea ! I'll have to Dunk My Ginger Nut biscuit in My coffee or I'll break My remaining Teeth !! :-(
    Precious 1
    5th Mar 2015
    12:44pm
    Older than 65 who still work for a living are both more intelligent and interesting people...I find them everywhere in shopping malls gee a lady there almost 80 now and still holds a wonderful sensible conversation......and shops , cleaning jobs and all sorts of areas garndening particularly a fleet of them about......don `t laugh if you don t use it you lose it...and never a couple of words more true..we are not all cabbages sitting and watching the soaps on TV
    lololol...When the beach and surfing loses its delights what will all those people do...sit and remember ???
    Precious 1
    7th Mar 2015
    4:52pm
    Jesting of course but it cannot be all that bad surely...I at times feel wretched first thing in the morning but as the minutes go by and I make breakfast things come back again and we have to move and faster , dressed etc plan for the day or Clubs to go to and so on another day managed very well considering ,,,,,it is in the mind...its always ticking over as we live on...me towards 80 now and so many of us in the same boat........we now all old and wrinkly but heading into an even newer era where many may have several professions, apprenticeships, partners, countries to try out.....I spoke to some yesterday and said if I could tear myself away from family I would love to try living in another country as well...my spark is still shining bright and am so interested in the fascinating stuff out there one lifetime is proving maybe not really long enough to find it all
    Simo
    4th Mar 2015
    11:00am
    Yes I too would work and yres age vcomes into it I ran a small Maintenance Plumbing Business after I turned 65( I am now nearly 75 ) and the business delcined on asking aroud I found out that one of the resons I missed out on jobs was I was considered too old and therefore too slow at my work never mind that my qaulity of work was i am sure a lot higher than some ofthe younger Plumbers and I had the experience to nit out the cause of a plumbng Problkem easier and quicker than younger inexperienced Plumbers in the district.
    Young Simmo
    5th Mar 2015
    12:52am
    OK Simo, same name different line of work, as I was a Mechanical fitter come Mine Manager etc, etc, etc.
    Also I am 75, but the difference is I had a Triple bypass at age 62 and Rio Tinto decided I would be a wreck, where as with a rebuilt engine I was twice as good as before.
    Anyway I retired when they said, "We are not renewing your contract".
    So I retired 3 years early, which buggered up our plans to get prepared before 65, but we adopted very quickly, and now after 13 years of retirement have no regrets. Rio Tinto actually did us a favour.
    Now I find that being retired takes all day, and there is no time left to do anything else. The lawn needs cutting, the wood needs chopping, the patio needs painting and the Mrs needs a cuppa tea, but all that will have to wait till I finish my next game of Solitaire.
    Pass the Ductape
    5th Mar 2015
    5:10am
    I'm with you guys. It might be okay for someone like Hockey, who likely as not, has never done a good days labour in his life, to recommend we oldies continue on working until we drop, but the bloke needs a reality check!

    At 63, I was pretty well buggered from a labouring perspective, thanks to the advice of previous bosses who continually suggested I - 'put my back into it'. I did that, but now I'm only 71, I can hardly stand for more than 30 minutes at a time before I have to sit down again! No sign of those bosses now however.

    Work until seventy? For many of us it'll only be in your dreams Joe!
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    8:38am
    Ductape,
    The thing for Joe is that he'll have people like yourself on the dole which pays about $100.00 less per week.
    A sneaky way of saving money!!!
    Precious 1
    6th Mar 2015
    11:10am
    A rellie of mine spent 30 years here and born in UK left to come here when he was 21 after he did his apprenticeship....He well into his 60 s now and 12 years ago went to live and marry in USA...He still working and found different things to earn a living which has led on to gaining the promotioons he well deserved....I would do something myself indeed even trying another country too but age is against me but the spirit is forever willing...I like vision for the future...our grandchildren will have very different views I hoping to make themselves and the country they will be living a much more varied and pleasant place/s
    Precious 1
    6th Mar 2015
    11:14am
    You got to alter that age and not to be so honest it won`t get u anywhere only in the retirement centre lol I took ten years off my age and the world suddenly changed around me....Don`t be frightened...opportunities came to ne when I was actually seventies with taking a ten years off to 60s I think some give up the goat sooner than they really should...The amount I chat to on friendship sites is remarkable but they all been sitting in those chairs for years waiting for what I would love to know...
    Precious 1
    7th Mar 2015
    3:01pm
    Simo, Its the advertising and putting yourself out there to attract the youth....all sorts of ways now talk to some advertising folk...(you probably find them mostly over fifty now)....and still have a spark in the eye.....look at some of the stuff coming onto our TV screens these days some shocking etc some interesting but all ouot there and people do see them...I find older men far more interesting in many ways..don`t give up at all...its your bank account all you need to be your main interest....
    buby
    9th Mar 2015
    5:10pm
    Yes patriot, me thinks you are right, he can't think of any other way, so now its how he's gunna pick us oldies......the bludger needs to give up cigars, and put his back into it!!!
    cause if he's a smoker when he gets ill, i hope they don't look after him???
    the cunning shark
    justme
    4th Mar 2015
    11:07am
    Opinion: Real issues, real action

    It is all well and good to be an idealist, but when you are responsible for a country’s economic prosperity, idealism simply isn’t good enough. Real issues call for real action. Mr Hockey is bound by his role as Federal Treasurer to put his money where his mouth is.

    Or should that be "to put OUR money where his mouth is" TIC
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    2:05pm
    Joe is responsible for the country's economic prosperity>? When did that happen? Or did he fail to read the job description and work out that 'country' means the people in it first and foremost?
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:23pm
    I haven't been seeing a lot of prosperity of late either. Just selling off more jobs and assets.
    Kato
    7th Mar 2015
    4:10pm
    http://www.tai.org.au/content/richard-denniss-joe-hockeys-debt-bomb-false-alarm
    Pammy
    4th Mar 2015
    11:14am
    It's all talk and no action. All very well to make inspiring statements about getting the young and the old to work, but where are the jobs? What are the jobs? What are governments doing to create jobs?
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:13pm
    It is indeed. Talk is cheap and there is an election a comin'. Time to make more empty promises and con voters into voting for you. The behaviour from Hockey is treading a familiar line.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    7:04pm
    Pammy,
    They are creating ample jobs!!! OVERSEAS
    particolor
    5th Mar 2015
    12:27pm
    And the Chinese said..#$%$$#% & $%#@$ < Meaning THANK YOU VERY MUCH !! :-)
    Precious 1
    7th Mar 2015
    3:07pm
    Surprising where jobs and work can come from...A young fellow I know recently started his own business with his mate having got his apprenticeship over and done with and the work is flowing in....He also modelling his FEET would you believe a girl friend told him about it....and lastly he doing garden planting and designing....so there you go and he is only 23 yearsold......and its all happening cos he wants it to....
    Hasbeen
    4th Mar 2015
    11:20am
    This writer must be one of the fairies from the bottom of the garden, with this fairy tail thinking.

    Governments can't create jobs. They can destroy them with things like overpriced electricity, & carbon taxes, but any make work programs simply cost more than they help. That is why we have the dole.

    While we have an obstructionist senate, whose only interest is stopping this government from making the necessary changes, in an attempt to make this government look almost as bad as the last couple, there is little chance of getting the economy as good as it was 7 years ago.

    Perhaps it doesn't matter much, the stupid love affair with ridiculously expensive wind & solar power has turned the EU into a basket case, & their refusal to harvest their own gas with fracking is going to bury them. Obama has done almost the same for the US.

    There is little chance we are not going to be part of this slow collapse. So hang on folk, & protect what you have, the next decade is going to be very tough, even if we can fix our senators attitude. I expect it to get a whole lot worse, before it gets any better.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:20pm
    Sounds like another troll post. BS!!

    1. I seem to remember that high electricity prices were due to the Carbon Tax. That's gone now. So what's the new spiel?
    2. The senate: the job of the senate is NOT to be a rubber stamp to the Lower House even though this is what the Abbott government is demanding. Tut, tut, tut. It must be awful when you cannot get your way and do your dirty business without hurdles. So get over it Hasbeen. The senate is working EXACTLY as it is supposed to.
    3. Join the coal industry and wreck the planet. Your rant defies the facts that renewables are FREE. This is an issue of coal wanting to close down any competition. Nothing more.

    So you want to get rid of the "slow collapse"? Then DO NOT VOTE FOR EITHER SIDE OF POLITICS. That is why the game never changes.
    DC
    4th Mar 2015
    12:35pm
    Mick, Mick, How much are they paying you for your continued hard core left wing BS??
    You need to get a life, man. You seem to have lost all sense of reality.
    Hasbeen is spot on with his comments!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:43pm
    Instead of talking the Party line DC, whoever you are, stick to the facts and you cannot go wrong. Nothing of what I have said is manufactured. Everything about your post is.
    Polly Esther
    4th Mar 2015
    1:07pm
    yes mick, what on earth is the matter with you, you appear to have lost the plot completely. A lot of people around here are wondering if you are in fact Bill Shortens father, and how much Labor is paying you to write the rants that's you do.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:13pm
    How do you explain that I am critical of both sides? This is the sort of serve I keep getting from posters who seem to be taking up from where Frank/Solomon/miss aisle left off. I'll stick to the suggestion that there is a paid troll on this site advertising for this government. The posts give themselves away and the storyline (Labor bad, Liberal good) is always the same......with almost always misleading information and gutter attacks.
    Come to think of it this sounds like this government down to a tee.
    Dave V
    4th Mar 2015
    1:15pm
    Sorry Mick, renewables are actually not free. It costs a lot of money to set the facilities up and the only reason wind power is at all viable at the moment is because you and I pay huge subsidies to the companies. That may or may not be justifiable from an environmental point of view - just don't say it's free.
    KSS
    4th Mar 2015
    1:15pm
    Again Mick, put up or shut up. Where's the evidence? Your opinion is NOT evidence.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:44pm
    You are right Dave. But once set up and operating it is free apart from the renewal of equipment. This would be much better than using oil to dig it out, transport it and then pay for the power station operating costs.
    Lets not have an argument though about the merits of renewables Dave. I hope that we might agree that no CO2 emissions will always be better than what is currently happening.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:46pm
    KSS: you and the other trolls cannot dispute the facts. My 'opinion' comes in with judgements of logic.....like giving a solution to stop the rot in politics. You on the contrary frequently tow the government line and make outlandish claims rather than stick to the facts.
    dougie
    4th Mar 2015
    2:38pm
    Mick,

    Ka - Boom There goes the brain again.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    3:10pm
    If sounds like a duck and looks like a duck...its a duck. The brain works fine dougie. As I keep saying....stop posting the obvious government advertising and I will lay off.
    I know it is hard for you guys to stick to solid facts but this is where we are at.
    Welcome to the Matrix!
    dougie
    4th Mar 2015
    3:26pm
    Mick, When are you going to get the brain into gear? You seem to have some intelligence but little ability to understand the right of a person other then your self to have a valid opinion. Why don't you go and play in the sandpit with the rest of the children. Come back and join the conversation when you grow up and learn some manners. Don't be a bully, it's not nice.
    DC
    4th Mar 2015
    4:48pm
    Hey Mick, "Welcome to the Matrix'?? Yep, I now know where you are coming from - FICTION!! and "Opinion with judgements of Logic"?? My God, you sound like someone from 'Trades Hall' who has been brainwashed to repeat the Socialist Left garbage we have to listen to from time to time. As to towing the Government line - Not at all, but I do remember only too well recent years of Labor Gov waste. Oh, what is the point - you will never accept anything but your view.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    6:41pm
    Sounds like the trolls are getting frustrated with not being able to get their way. Sounds like our current government.
    dougie
    4th Mar 2015
    6:54pm
    Mick,
    What a sorry little man you must be. I have made the decision to ignore any future posts from you until you can act like a gentleman and treat others with some form of dignity. I would suggest to others that they do the same. Ignore him and he may go away.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    7:11pm
    Hasbeen,
    A lot of jobs whould have been created if we had opted for building our own submarines. Additional to the direct jobs, the benefit would have rippled onward to many other associated industries.

    Not to think the SECURITY of building our own rather than others exactly knowing what they're capable of. Not looking after Aust secerity very well - are we?
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    8:59pm
    Yes !! Its like the Captain saying up Scope and seeing... This Submarine is still on the Surface Dopey !! Written in the Scope !! :-)
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    9:38pm
    Mick,
    Get OFF the Turps and have your "Head Read"!!!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    9:42pm
    dougie: you are using the exact same words that Frank used. That is because YOU ARE FRANK.
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    12:35pm
    Mick,
    You must have been able to "Delete & Re-post" the remark addressed to me to which my posting as above refers to. It was posted earlier than my remark (of course as otherwise it is difficult to comment on) and the wording is/was exactly identical to those now addressed to Dougie - Mistaken Identity???
    Adrianus
    6th Mar 2015
    3:47pm
    mick let me be absolutely frank with you. You are wasting your time. These people are intelligent and can read you like a book. Your cover has been blown. If you are not Bill Shorten's father then you must be on the ALP/Union/Greens/Independent/GetUp payroll.
    Kato
    7th Mar 2015
    4:40pm
    http://www.tai.org.au/content/richard-denniss-joe-hockeys-debt-bomb-false-alarm
    Young
    4th Mar 2015
    11:22am
    The key for Australias economic future is for us to work harder,receive less pay and fewer holidays and less annual leave.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:21pm
    And that is the end game for this government and in fact all liberal governments. It is Class Warfare where the rich should get more and more and everybody else should be their slaves. Also known as "Work Choices".
    Radish
    4th Mar 2015
    1:57pm
    In America the hourly rate is around $7.25...in Australia it is $16.
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    2:07pm
    Radish - and the reasons for this are.....?
    (hint - higher costs of living, often generated by the same government that whines about high wages etc)
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:25pm
    Have you been to America Radish? You need to go. What you see on American TV will not prepare you for the poverty.
    At the same time the wealthy are obscene and they control the game. Is this what you want to see for your children?
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    2:55pm
    IPhone... USA...$200
    IPhone... Australia $800 ?
    Does that Explain it ?
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    3:12pm
    Not sure if you are right about that particolor. I mean the iPads are about the same. So buy a Samsung Galaxy for $250 in Oz. You can use it as a travel computer as well because it does Skype and Messenger as well as all the other things computers do.
    Jen
    4th Mar 2015
    3:12pm
    Browny. Yes that's what our current government is trying to achieve. But if you believe that's ok, then you can go straight to Cambodia for the rest of your life and see how it works. Better than waiting around here for it to happen, if that's your dream.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    3:24pm
    I got that off Google Mick ! So don't blame Me ! Tell them their Lying !! :-)
    KSS
    4th Mar 2015
    3:26pm
    Mick geo-pricing is rampant in Australia. We pay far more on most things than the USA or UK for that matter. This is especially apparent in electronic and digital devices and software. Most galling is downloading software does not incur transportation charges (the excuse often used) yet we pay significantly more just because we have an Australian ISP address.

    It is the geo-pricing that causes people to shop on-line from international suppliers. Adding GST will not prevent this given the cost difference is generally significantly more than 10%.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    3:54pm
    And worse still is all the Profit is Shovelled into a Hercules and Flown back Home !! :-(
    wally
    4th Mar 2015
    4:43pm
    There are a lot of Aussies that head off to Asia for dental work and medical procedures because they can't afford to pay what they would be charged here in Australia for having the same work done.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    6:43pm
    From what I hear wally there are a lot of Aussies getting surgery as well, and then coming home to get fixed up. Don't know the numbers which go wrong though. Rolling the dice!
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    7:01pm
    Browny
    I believe the key to a prosperous Austraslian future is to ERADICATE & ELIMINATE those individuals who tell us that they are OUR government (For the People by the People - Remember???).
    They really are IMPOSTERS as they do not enact the Australian Constitution for the benefit of ALL Australians and are selling us out to the Fat Cat Multinational Corporatiopns!

    Julian Assange told us about them and his reward is to be confined to an Embassy far away from home.
    Such whilst we keep feeding the IMPOSTERS in Canberra and every Capital City in Australia. The Federal & State Government & Local Shires/Councils.

    NO PROSPERTITY will happen in Australia (at least not for us) until this has been achieved! Our kids will be slaves!!!
    wally
    5th Mar 2015
    12:34pm
    mick, I've read that too. It would be interesting to see some figures regarding trips for o'seas work and remedial work done here as a result. Your point is a sensible and cautionary one. Of course any statistics would almost certainly have to be taken with a grain or two of salt. Considering the ramifications such a survey might have on livelihoods here, you could imagine the AMA and other groups hoping that the results would put them in a more favourable light.
    surfer
    4th Mar 2015
    11:32am
    Economic future, are you joking. We only start progressing after we pay the enormous interest bill. No wonder we are behind the eight ball. Add to that, the decline in our export earnings and you don't have to be a genius to see we are in deep trouble and will be for many years. Our senate stops any pay back saving schemes. Bloody dickheads. Just take a look at the power these drongoes possess. Imagine Queenslands debt at 80 Billion. Phew, I think I will take off for the Bahamas.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:25pm
    Whilst you are correct about debt surfer the national debt created by Labor did keep us all working through the GFC. No mass job losses like in the rest of the world. No 50% youth unemployment like in some European countries either. So understand that there was a choice. You can't have it both ways.
    The trick is to now work on lowering this debt and not to keep spending. So what has this government done to achieve this?

    1. removed the Debt Ceiling so that it could keep borrowing and spending.
    2. go after average and poor AUstralians whilst giving the rich a tax cut.

    What can I say?
    KSS
    4th Mar 2015
    1:11pm
    No new spending Mick (The Senate has seen to that)just keeping up with the commitments from the previous Government (the Senate has seen to it that no savings can be made). No wonder the debt has increased. If nothing is done, the debt will continue to increase unabated.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:20pm
    Fair comment KSS. I have issues with taxing.......BUT START WITH THE RICH who have a whole range of outs from the tax system as it currently stands. One of the main gripes I have with this pathetic government is that it went after the easies marks (average and poor Aussies) whilst giving its big business owners (the rich) a tax cut. It ain't right!
    Whilst you are on the debt KSS perhaps governments of both persuasion could start by slashing their very fat and unnecessary public service and showing wage restraint by not doubling their salaries. That would be leading by example. But don't hold your breath.
    wally
    4th Mar 2015
    4:55pm
    The problem of taxation of the rich is over simplified to the point of being another bumper sticker slogan. Do you mean individuals? They'd "P off" to tax havens the way the Pommy celebrities have done to escape paying UK tax rates for the wealthy. International Corporations? After they paid their taxes, they'd just raise their prices (not in a way that would give off a smell of collusion, mind you) and proceed to make up what they paid in taxes by screwing it out of their customers. (That means us mug punters).
    I do agree with mick about trimming the waste from the public service (including the Australian Human Rights Commission and the lawyers that represent asylum Seekers at taxpayer expense, for a start).
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:09pm
    wally: the reason tax havens exist is because governments, who know full well how they work, refuse to outlaw them. So why do you think that is?
    I am not down on those fortunate enough to be rich for what they are. But I am down on this group because it has every tax minimisation tool you can point a stick at and also funds the election of candidates who then become their defacto employees. And so the rich get a leg up...wink, wink....say no more!
    wally
    5th Mar 2015
    12:39pm
    If I ran a country that provided tax havens for wealthy tax dodgers, I wouldn't change the laws as it would be killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. And you'd probably get a better class of Riff-Raff coming in than Australia has had with our influx of 50,000 boat people soaking up our taxpayers' dollars.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    11:42am
    So Joe,
    You, and the previous government, have been/are exporting OUR Austrealian jobs overseas (Submarines just to mention one close to home at the moment) via trade agreements and numerous other mechanisms.

    Now you say, keep older Australians in work and employed in a "Job Market" that keeps declining ????? How can this work ????

    Or, for the sake of economic factors - do you rather waste the Young Lives of Australians who - now with CERTAINTY - will not be able to get a job because US "OLD BUGGERS" are occupying them (their jobs) !?!?! I know it would save about $100.00 per week (for every person on Govt support) which is the difference between the Dole & Old Age pension!!!

    For STUFFS SAKE, provide jobs for the younger generation (so they can have a meaningfull life) and let us oldies retire in peace !!!!!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:29pm
    Nicely said. Selling more and more jobs equates directly to more and more unemployment. Sadly governments from both sides are either too stupid to realise or know and are playing a sick game on us all.
    To say it for the hundredth time: vote for an INDEPENDENT and change the game. Keep doing the same and don't be surprised or frustrated that nothing changes. It won't...other than the faces.
    wally
    4th Mar 2015
    5:05pm
    They govt should help small employers and encourage them to take on more apprentices. It might also be a good idea to pay apprentices more than dole recipients so that becoming an apprentice would be preferable to staying on the dole. If it is true that Aussie fruit growers depend on foreign backpackers to harvest their crops, perhaps paying travel expenses and some sort of "Away From
    home Allowance" might encourage unemployed youngsters to move out of districts with high youth unemployment and move to where the jobs are waiting. After all, apprentices pay taxes, the unemployed don't.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    5:19pm
    wally,

    Who is going to pay for that! We're already broke as we are told !!!
    I see the only solution is to the "end of Free-Trade" and reintroducing "Input Tarifs" on the goods we can manufacture ourselves.
    Do that, and Australian Small Business is automatically encouraged to start manufacturing.
    Yes, we'll pay more for the good manufactured in Australia but we will be paying MUCH Less for support of Social Security Payments.
    As an added benefit, we'll preserve people's dignity by allowing them to contribute!!!

    Oh Yea, nearly forgot !
    The bankers and multinational Corporationw will NOT like it either as it will reduce their BOTTOM LINE!!!
    The pollies will not do it, because the Corporations won't like it.

    May I then ask, "Who then is in the Saddle to govern Australia?".
    We, the people or the Corporations!

    Answer this and you'll understand why Australia is "Going down the Gurgler"!
    wally
    5th Mar 2015
    1:27pm
    Somehow I find it hard to believe that our big 4 or 5 banks would not like to see more people employed as you suggest. Not many people on the dole borrow much money from the banks for mortgages, car loans, personal loans or anything else. So how does going without increasing your "borrower base" of loan takers adversely affect the banks' bottom line? And what happens when the apprentices finish their apprenticeships and enter the workforce as fully fledged tradespeople? I'd suggest that they'd wind up on the borrowing from the banks treadmill so many of us have been on.
    You mention the Multinational Corporations. Please explain the relevance they have in this discussion. It would seem that they have stitched things up in their favour so much, whatever happens is a win win situation for them.
    As far as where's the money coming from to fund apprentice training, I would think a sort of "HEX" loan scheme similar to what funds university students' education might apply. At least you are not going to see graduate hairdressers and panel beaters skipping off overseas to Silicone Valley to dodge repaying their HEx debts like so many University graduates have done.
    As a last resort, I would predict that an increase in the GST is on its way, but not until after the 2016 federal election. This would allow Australia's plight to worsen and to soften up the population to make an increase more acceptable to the voter
    I do not think Australia had become a Corporate Fascist state yet, (where we have big business and big unions running the show and reducing the people to the status of ands in the big ant hill) We do not have corporations "owning" the government, In China is is the opposite, where their "state owned" corporations are busily buying up Australian agricultural land for food production or mining, all for shipment back to China.
    If only our politicians in Canberra were to focus more on the big issues facing Australia and less on taking cheap shots at each other, we might see some improvement. This is also an indictment on the media for concentrating on the petty politics of personality (which has as much relevance as microscopic in depth reporting World Wide Wrestling matches) to the governing of Australia. But then we are living in a "Dumbed Down" society with a population, by and large, lacking the attention span needed to fully understand what is happening and to understand the possibilities before us.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:12pm
    Older people key to growth? But there are no jobs and there is extreme discrimination against anyone over 50 and most cannot get work other than stacking shelves. Employers prefer instead to hire younger and much cheaper workers and it matters little that often they end up with employees who are illiterate and have such poor experience that they are a real liability to their employer.
    I heard recently that there are currently around 750 000 Australians seeking work with only 125 000 jobs available. Perhaps the BS coming from Hockey needs to be sanitised a bit.
    wally
    4th Mar 2015
    5:09pm
    The only way I can see older people being a key to growth will be as residents in the aged care/ retirement home (or village) industry. There will be an ever increasing need for nurses and carers in these places.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:11pm
    Plenty of older folk (up to a point) have a lot to give. Whilst the mind is alert and the body still works why not? Some self employed people work on well into their 90s wally.
    wally
    5th Mar 2015
    1:40pm
    There's plenty of us old geezers that have something to say, and it would ne nice to get paid for saying what we think. Even into our 90's! Do you think the ACTU would hire a few of us as trolls?
    Tom Tank
    4th Mar 2015
    12:20pm
    Joe is just indulging in talking up the employment of older workers so that he can force them onto unemployment benefits until they reach the official retirement age. He is all about cutting welfare rather than go after the top end of town and their blatant tax minimisation schemes now apparently much worse than "bottom of the harbour".
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:31pm
    I think you meant 'keep them off unemployment benefits'. At any rate remember that an election is coming and this government is on the nose. Time to beat the drum and rattle the sabres.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    5:20pm
    wally,
    Who is going to pay for all of that?
    wally
    5th Mar 2015
    1:51pm
    Pat, you're a few years too late. You should have been asking Kevin07 that when he was in the midst of his "I am Santa Claus" delusional period when he was on the brink of drowning Australia in debt courtesy of his misguided stimulus schemes. Of course we know that now, but Kevin didn't tell us the answer to your question. "It will be your grandchildren".
    Kupsha
    4th Mar 2015
    12:22pm
    particolor,
    Seems to me you have a disability, but are not disabled.
    If you have a disabled parking sticker you are probably rorting the system!!!
    The Government will be checking on people like you and doctors who hand out certificates like toilet paper..
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    12:32pm
    I've got a parking sticker for my garage.
    mangomick
    4th Mar 2015
    12:59pm
    I'm thinking someone doesn't know when someone is trying to be funny.
    So particolor does that mean you can't dance because you have two left feet???
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    1:02pm
    Go and get Stuffed !! I'm Bloody 70 You Creep ! And Yes I have a Bad Hip ! But I don't get a Disability Sticker because there Are Worse-off than Me, Some with "Mental Illness" I've Noticed :-(
    Go and Have a Shave and put some Decent Clothes on !! :-)
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:15pm
    Hold up there particolor....don't take it personally.
    If you tell people to "get stuffed" they are going to think you are posting for Jackie Lambie....chuckle.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    1:24pm
    I was talking to Kupsharia !!.. :-( I've had enough Anyhow Mick !! I'm going down
    now
    to get a Disabled Sticker !! Not that Ill need it When They cut all our Heads Off !!
    GOOD BYE !!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:49pm
    Can you get me one too. Some of our trolls are already making out the case so that I stop taking them on for their perverse paid posts.
    I am a pain. Sorry. Just cannot let the crooks go on their rampage without a crash tackle....where's the red rag???
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    2:10pm
    I'm the proud owner of a disability sticker and a job - casual but still - returns a buck or two.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:26pm
    You've got my tick of approval Trebor.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    2:36pm
    Give them a Red Card and send them Off Mick !! Kicking the Ref in the Dooberrys is not Nice !! :-(
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    3:14pm
    Better to expose who they are so that posters can avoid their lies and deceit. Somebody give me a cape!
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    3:28pm
    Just what the Wold Needs a SUPERMICK !! :-) :-)
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:12pm
    Just watch out for the frankonite.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    8:20pm
    Glowing Green Leftovers from Crypton !! :-)
    never give up
    4th Mar 2015
    1:14pm
    Good to see your support for older workers kike myself...74 and still part of the workforce... but...it is NOT governments role to create jobs but to create a climate to encourage buisness to develop their buisnesses so that a natural flow on is a creation of jobs
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:21pm
    Congratulations that you have not been pushed out.
    Radish
    4th Mar 2015
    1:56pm
    Spot on Never Give up. Yes, it "is" the role of government to create the climate to encourage businesses to develop and employ more workers. We cannot crush them down.
    MITZY
    4th Mar 2015
    7:07pm
    never give up: you are doing really well and obviously enjoying working at 74.
    Maybe you could give this government some pointers on how to create a climate to encourage businesses to develop their businesses. They don't seem to know how to get started as they've been talking about job creation since elected and it won't be much longer and we'll be in election-mode again.
    Cheers
    Adrianus
    7th Mar 2015
    8:49am
    never give up, you are aptly named. Just reading your post has given me some inspiration. There is far too much negativity from other members.
    particolor
    7th Mar 2015
    8:55am
    Do give up !! He will get the Idea to work us till 75 if He sees that !! :-)
    lynecoo
    4th Mar 2015
    1:16pm
    Perhaps there would be more jobs if large companies did not offshore jobs and 457 visas were abolished. Let's train our own workforce via a well-funded government- run education system.
    Education and health care when treated as commodities are degraded and more expensive when run by the private sector whose first priority is profit.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:23pm
    This is the reason why there is such a huge disparity between available work (125,000) and job seekers (125,000). It is going to get much worse.
    KSS
    4th Mar 2015
    1:44pm
    Its not THE reason MICK, its A reason!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    1:49pm
    Not often I agree with you KSS or any of the trolls. On this one we will concur.
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    2:14pm
    Job seekers are around 800,000 acknowledged, Mick, add times two semi-employed and wanting to upgrade. The figures don't balance.

    As for government creating an environment in which business can create jobs - that is not done by offering huge discounts to low level employers of hugely profitable corporations and offer their boards and such meg salaries for doing nothing - it comes about by offering incentive to small businesses who employ more overall. A fine example is 'mining' which employs a miniscule number of people for its mega-profits and thus is not worthy of any funding.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:27pm
    It is also not achieved by flogging off jobs to the third world and we are beginning to see what happens when you try to have it both ways.
    wally
    4th Mar 2015
    5:12pm
    The countries that shift their manufacturing operations overseas is in response to the ever increasing demands by the unions for higher pay and restrictive work practices that they have led the union rank and file to think is their entitlement as union members.
    wally
    4th Mar 2015
    5:15pm
    Mick, do you know if the unions are hiring any new trolls?
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:15pm
    No Labor trolls here from what I can see. But then Labor does not have unlimited funding to employ these deceitful lying Australians. And of course you have to be morally corrupt and dishonest to behave like this. Sounding a bit familiar?
    wally
    5th Mar 2015
    1:32pm
    The Labor Party might not have the money, but the unions do! Unless there are more Craig Thompsons running them.
    wally
    6th Mar 2015
    11:02pm
    Besides, the union bosses have seen what Labor politicians do when they get their mitts on the chequebook!
    Jen
    7th Mar 2015
    8:13am
    I did read once how many millions the LNP spend on social media propaganda. It'd be hilarious if it wasn't so sad. But they got caught out a beauty a few months ago and I was on the spot and saw it for myself. They paid 18 thousand Indians to "like" Tony Abbott's facebook page, as well as Christopher Pyne and a few others. But they neglected to remove the "Insights" which showed the biggest demographic on Tony Abbott's page were Indians aged 18 - 30. The next time I looked, his Insights were hidden. Hilarious and pathetic at the same time. How an Australian government behaves. All smoke and mirrors.
    particolor
    7th Mar 2015
    8:23am
    I've sent You a Blank Cheque for Your comment Wally !! ;-)

    But I "liked" Jens ! :-)
    Dollars over Respect?
    4th Mar 2015
    1:52pm
    When recruitment agencies start training and hiring more experienced recruitment officers (ie over 25 years of age and more experienced in real life events ideally) it may be possible for an older person to be seriously treated as a potential valuable employee and have the opportunity to present to the client in person. These young recruiters are basically salespeople with a check list to guide them. I have an amazing reference, but have constantly been 'filtered' out and hearing the common reason: 'the client is looking for a better "team fit" (meaning you are too old to fit in for Friday night pub teambuilding). I have been made redundant twice since turning 62 years of age (both of these companies shared the 'executive team's' agreement that, as staff needed to be culled, they would start with the older workers and keep the 'fresh blood/new ideas people for their future growth. The big bonus for the company was that the younger employees weren't expecting to paid at the older worker's salary level (earned over many years of hard work). Savings all around...until bonuses paid to the execs for achieving their key initiatives - ie reducing staff levels! I have minuted meetings in both the corporate world and heard Government department heads express this same view over and over. I hadn't earned enough superannuation and still wanted to work for many years longer, unfortunately, this 'cull viewpoint' is still common. Joe Hockey needs to listen to the real reasons of why older people are being compulsorily retired 'against their wishes'. Good luck with getting businesses to change this ingrained attitude! Across the board, our western society appears to value youth and beauty more than appreciating proven achievers.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:30pm
    You are on the money. At a national level though Australian governments rarely create anything other than more public service jobs. What they are really good at is flogging off assets and jobs and living on the capital. The obvious end is coming.
    in2sunset
    5th Mar 2015
    1:35pm
    Dollars over Respect? - you are dead right - your words are exactly the same as mine. I have been absolutely disgusted at the way I have been treated by Employment Agencies. and always, always they are 20 something little upstarts who tell me to 'lower my expectations'. Can't lower them much more if I can't even get a job as a cleaner. Some almost roll their eyes when I walk into an Agency. Strict rule now is NEVER apply for jobs through an Agency - is demoralising, and a total waste of time. One thing I differ on - many employers now think that the older you are, the LOWER the pay they can offer you. In other words - 'you're old so you should be grateful of even having a job, let alone worrying about the pay'. I have seen this first hand. If I hear 'team fit' once more - like you, I will just about puke. I get in to the job and I work - I can survive without a mobile phone in my hand, I am not a clock watcher, I never take sickies, always on time, don't need time off for sick kids, etc. Don't anyone, ANYONE, tell me it is not age related. Like you, I have very little super. And then the government has the GALL to complain about seniors 'retiring on Newstart'. THAT was a total insult. RETIRE on Newstart? - the only reason senior people are on Newstart is because they cannot get a bloody job!! And if there are more seniors on Newstart now, it simply means that MORE employers are deliberately discriminating against the older worker. It is NOT by choice!! Just shows how totally out of touch, and ignorant, Hockey and his gang are.
    in2sunset
    5th Mar 2015
    1:35pm
    Dollars over Respect? - you are dead right - your words are exactly the same as mine. I have been absolutely disgusted at the way I have been treated by Employment Agencies. and always, always they are 20 something little upstarts who tell me to 'lower my expectations'. Can't lower them much more if I can't even get a job as a cleaner. Some almost roll their eyes when I walk into an Agency. Strict rule now is NEVER apply for jobs through an Agency - is demoralising, and a total waste of time. One thing I differ on - many employers now think that the older you are, the LOWER the pay they can offer you. In other words - 'you're old so you should be grateful of even having a job, let alone worrying about the pay'. I have seen this first hand. If I hear 'team fit' once more - like you, I will just about puke. I get in to the job and I work - I can survive without a mobile phone in my hand, I am not a clock watcher, I never take sickies, always on time, don't need time off for sick kids, etc. Don't anyone, ANYONE, tell me it is not age related. Like you, I have very little super. And then the government has the GALL to complain about seniors 'retiring on Newstart'. THAT was a total insult. RETIRE on Newstart? - the only reason senior people are on Newstart is because they cannot get a bloody job!! And if there are more seniors on Newstart now, it simply means that MORE employers are deliberately discriminating against the older worker. It is NOT by choice!! Just shows how totally out of touch, and ignorant, Hockey and his gang are.
    particolor
    5th Mar 2015
    7:17pm
    Your like Me ! If I hear that again I will Peculate !! I was in a Shop the other day and the Attendant said "Ill get another Team Member ?? I said "Where's the Football ? :-)"
    And shouldn't that be Hockey and His Team are ?
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    2:01pm
    A nice sounding little byte for the cameras and the microphones... real results = 0.

    On a lighter note:-

    http://www.inkcinct.com.au/web-pages/cartoons/past/2014/2014-219--The-paid-maternity-leave-funding-platform-age-pension-cutback-australia-social-political.jpg
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    2:03pm
    Oh - I work and have just applied for another job.... on top of building a house. Not bad for a 65 year old with fifteen disabilities. If guts and determination were a requirement for jobs - the oldies would beat the youngies hands down.
    Flytestar
    4th Mar 2015
    2:18pm
    Sadly there are jobs advertised, and the stats each week approximate (in my area of employment) of 85 Jobs, 4000+ applications for those jobs.

    My considerable experience is not desired - Why: because I'm not a blonde bimbo who is going to get married, have kids, take time off when they are sick, or come to work hung-over from partying all weekend, or not even bother and take the Sicky!

    I am reliable, healthy and I want to work, and to be productive. Not getting the jobs, over-qualified, might get bored, or just not pretty any more, or not fitting into a profile.

    Sadly there is a strong bias out there about older workers. We are not all set in our ways, we are so keen to work, and prepared to accept lower wages than we have in past, just to be out there keeping ourselves sharp and active.

    I have thoroughly been put through the hoops by Centrelink; humiliated by Jobsearch staff, eg that with my skills I can "walk into a job tomorrow" - Sure - WHAT JOB? Or I can allow the Government pay me to study a Diploma, not have to pay fees unless I earn over $53K p/a. Terrific at 64, with 12 months until retirement age, who is going to give me a job (even if armed with a nice new Diploma - when they feel I should be retiring?
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:32pm
    What you complain about is what has happened through both sides of politics deciding it is better to flog off Australia jobs and national assets rather than create new jobs. The result is that we are paying dividends to the new overseas owners of assets rather than to ourselves and of course many of the jobs are gone with no replacements.
    So why did you say you keep voting Labor and Liberal????
    Sceptic
    4th Mar 2015
    3:12pm
    Yes be like mick, do not vote for Labor or Liberal, follow his lead and vote for an independent as long as the first preference is Labor. How is that for not supporting either of the two major parties? Sounds like a Labor troll to me.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    3:17pm
    Here you go trolling again Sceptic. New aliases but same old Frank/Solomon/miss aisle.
    The only time I stick up for Labor is when you under your variety of names start the Labor bad, Abbott good deceit. Other than that THEY ARE BOTH BAD. Having said that this government does not deserve to be returned and voting for an Independent needs to give careful thought where the preference is going to go if the Independent does not get up. Sorry, but NOT TO THIS GOVERNMENT!
    Sceptic
    4th Mar 2015
    3:35pm
    Okay mick, like others have done, I call you out and expose you for the fraud that you are. You are great at calling names but never offer proof. I am able to prove that my opinions are my own and they have never been paid for, maybe unfortunately, for if they had I may be able to spend as much time on this site as you seem to do.

    I have no aliases mick, so come on, put up or shut up. Provide some proof or admit you are just a liar who denigrates anyone whose opinion deviates from yours.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    4:39pm
    Sceptic,
    I have outlined (many times) the mechanism how NOT TO VOTE FOR ANYONE except the Independent you want to vote for.
    Cannot you read! If you can read, you KNOW WHAT TO DO at voting time so STOP personal attacks and - if you like the mechanism as outlined - promote it.
    If you think it's BS - "Take-it-to-bits".
    I HATE this NEGATIVILY whinging about things rather than discussing alternatives that Might/Will work!!!

    You're playing the game the Politicians have "Set Out".
    Stop bitching about Problems - Start discussing VBiable Solutions !!!
    in2sunset
    4th Mar 2015
    4:55pm
    Flytestar - thoroughly agree with you - sounds exactly the same as me. It is demoralising, humiliating and downright discriminatory. Our skills are not valued, or wanted. I see jobs that I could run rings around with my eyes closed - yet they hire someone, and a few weeks later is advertised again, because the previous applicant didn't work out. In my last job I worked with the biggest dill brain girl - she was hopeless, absolutely useless. BUT - she was very pretty, often wore the shortest of skirts, and thought nothing of fluttering her eyebrows and playing the 'woe is me' card. She was utterly hopeless at her job - but she stays. We called her 'Decor' (for decoration). No matter what skills I upgrade to, without experience, again, it will only be the same - my age will be against me.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:16pm
    Sceptic: if it talks like a duck and walks like a duck...then it's a duck.
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    10:35pm
    Jesus God - 85 vacancies and 4000 applications.... we need a revolution in this country.. and I mean that. Revolt at the ballot box.
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    10:38pm
    Guys - have to agree with you.. in2sunset etc.. I've been knocked back for jobs I could to standing on my head... then the same job is advertised three months later... they simply didn't choose the right person when that person was standing right in front of them.

    What does that say about employers and management in this day and age?
    TREBOR
    4th Mar 2015
    10:44pm
    Sceptic.. Mick.. let's not argue over virtues... the issues are more important. I've been a Union delegate and have rejected Labor along with the .. others... a long time ago... same as Mick.

    I vote for neither party nor for anyone who offers them a preference that I am aware of. I have no doubt Mick does the same... and Sceptic I don't know so well, but I'm sure he/she is a good soul and well-intentioned.

    Let us go forth like kings and destroy the usurpers of democracy and freedom (FREEEEEE-DOOOOM!), regardless of their political stamp and colour.

    None are worth it... let us see them to the door....
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    8:27am
    TREBOR
    Well said & so much my feelings.
    Let's discuss solutions after we have identified the problems - I Know we have.
    When we keep whinghing about the problems we are NOT IMPLEMENTING solutions! The Pollies know this well.

    A very simple bloke by the name of Einstein once suggested that it was Impossble to resolve issues via the same methodology that caused them.

    We know that this - and many previous - governments have caused the problems by simply rejecting us and accepting the bankers & Corporations as their masters.

    We now MUST confront our elected reps & tell them in no uncertain terms to "Get Back" on the path of the Australian Constitution and looking after Australia(ns) first again. WE MUST APPLY PRESSURE and one of the methods to do this as outline by Arthur Chresby in his booklet: "Thy will be done".


    GO . . . Go . . . Go
    MITZY
    5th Mar 2015
    11:21am
    There was a discussion this morning on tv regarding getting older workers (i.e. what they consider "older" is 55 years plus) into the workforce.
    One point for discussion was that "older" workers when applying for an advertised job go forth to the interview with a full resume of their experiences which most of the time is impressive. However, the person interviewing the older worker is not particularly interested in their "past" history and give it only a cursory glance. They are more interested in what the person can bring to the advertised position.
    The way to getting a job [when you are apparently over the hill at 55 plus(!)] is to attend the interview with a very positive approach full of enthusiasm for the "advertised" position, projecting how much you really would like to have that job.

    However, if there are "big" numbers applying and "small" numbers of jobs available, enthusiasm can wear out quite quickly, I would imagine.

    Another point was to get with modern technology in applying for jobs etc. don't be an "oldie" afraid of it. And, what was considered a most essential point was after being interviewed to "follow-up" by contacting the person you spoke to at the job interview which shows him/her you are "enthusiastic".
    Hope this helps.
    MITZY
    5th Mar 2015
    11:46am
    A further point mentioned was that the job seeker should contemplate moving to an area where they were more likely to find work in the field they excel in. I think this was rather harsh. If you have lived and worked in a certain area you have obviously built up a lifetime of friends/relatives etc. social networks, moving to a new area would be mentally challenging to say the least. As we age it is very comforting to have our friends and rellies around us. You are more likely to find "acquaintances" if you move, but not really true friends like the ones you have built over time. Lots of people move to different lifestyles after retiring and quite often regret the move. Others adapt. We are all different, aren't we.
    Sceptic
    5th Mar 2015
    1:18pm
    Patriot, firstly I was not addressing you. What a stupid comment - "can you read." I have avoided calling you out on your perpetual shouting in text. Try to leave the uppercase alone for a while - it does not impress.

    mick is fond of labelling persons as liars and trolls, which is pure hypocrisy as he doesn't have the guts to respond when called out on it as he cannot have any proof to support his arguments when it does not exist. I will continue to call him out as a liar until he apologises for his false accusations.
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    2:33pm
    sceptic,
    I am sure that mich cannot prove the allegations.
    However,, in another threat I referred: "to Pollies in Canberra being criminals"
    Frans could not help himself but Kick labor pollies in nthe guts deservedly, but certainly did not seem to agree with the liberal pollies.
    Such events tend to provide the "Circumstantial Evidence" that Mick (& I & probably others) are dealing with.

    My use of capital letters is meant to "highlght" rather than SHOUT!
    Sorry if this intimidates &/or offends!
    Judy in the hills
    4th Mar 2015
    2:21pm
    I think the work force should be concentrating on getting the YOUNG ONES INTO WORK rather than trying to think about keeping the genuinely "older workers" in jobs well past their ideal working life. There seems to be far too many young ones NOT working, and NOT EVEN LOOKING LIKE THEY CARE - if you can live on the dole as a young kid, some would feel they don't need to work and gradually they will become the long, long term unemployed. By all means give them a few months to hunt for work, but people these days need to be trained to work and save for the things that matter in life and that training needs to start right at school lever age.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    2:35pm
    Work should be a mandatory part of life. There should be no free ride or having the 'right' to choose to work or not. That is what the problem is.
    And before anybody starts name calling remember.....YOU are paying for people who are sponging on the system.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    2:41pm
    Its like that here Judy !! They think the Dole is an Apprenticeship for the Life Long Unemployment Benefit ! :-)
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    3:21pm
    particolor: I am not down on those who have fallen on bad times. I am down on those who believe that unemployment is a rightful way of life if they so choose. It was never meant to be that and it will collapse under its own weight unless Australians of this opinion get off their behinds and do something in their lives other than expect those who do work to pick up their tab.
    Sorry if that offends. Not meant to. These are the facts of the problem...and yes there are many shades of grey as well...but not all.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    3:36pm
    Mick I'm not down on genuine ones either I was commenting on what I see in these Parts !! Some wouldn't work in an Iron Lung ! And the others ? Well ! No Bloody Jobs anyhow ?? :-( Looks like were Stuffed ??
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    4:48pm
    Mick,
    I agree with you.

    However, until there are adequate jobs to have no unemployment anymore, it might as well be that those who want to work get the jobs (they'll do it much better) and those who - unfortunately - do not want to work be on the dole as they would not do that job well anyway.

    Whilst some of this argument defies logic, unfortunately I believe that this is a better slution.

    Another solution might be to restrict a second job in the family (parents) for those who are in genuine need of the money rather than saving for overseas hollidays, 4th THs etc.
    particolor
    8th Mar 2015
    4:47pm
    Mick If there's 125.000 Jobs awaiting, and 450,000 Job seekers Why isn't there just 325,000 Job Seekers ?? Which side is TOO FUSSY !! :-( AH ! You cant Believe the Latex Figures Nowadays Anyhow !!
    Jen
    4th Mar 2015
    3:08pm
    Without the jobs, it's just all so much white noise. I'm sure if the jobs were there, lots of older Australians would happily take them up if they were able. But they're not there. And anyway, I believe we should be getting our youth into the work place as a far more important priority.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    3:23pm
    Maybe older Australians should be doing more volunteering. My wife has made some offers to some of the charities but all they want is money, not free labour.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    3:41pm
    Mick Australia doesn't even run most of the charity's now either ?
    KSS
    4th Mar 2015
    3:41pm
    Older Australians already do most of the volunteering as it is. If your wife is interested then contact volunteering Australia here for your state/territory body:
    http://www.volunteeringaustralia.org/contact-us/stateterritory-peak-bodies/
    Go to your state page and find the application form. It has lists of skills/interests etc which help them to find something of interest.

    They will usually be able to put people in touch with organisations who need volunteers.
    Judy in the hills
    4th Mar 2015
    4:18pm
    I agree - without the older people volunteering, lots of things just couldn't happen, eg. Meals on Wheels is about 90% effort from those in the older generations (retirees etc). I helped with MoW as did my husband for 22 years each - it was fulfilling, etc. etc. etc. but we had already worked into our mid 60's. I think we've both pulled our weight. Now in our mid and late 70's we are starting to feel we've done our share - health starts to interfere unfortunately.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    6:45pm
    Jen,
    Shows the intellect of our pollies of should I say: "Shows how gullable they think we are". According to them we do not seem to have a "Brain to Bless ourselves with".

    Nothing will work without jobs.
    So lets stop Free Trade and introduce Import Levies on the goods we can & Should manufacture ourselves.
    Exporting OUR jobs overseas only benefits the "Fat Cats"!
    in2sunset
    4th Mar 2015
    4:46pm
    Struggling to get back a job? - you bet!! at age 62, I recently finished a contract position. I have never been out of work - till now. I have a folder with over 167 emailed applications. PLUS there are the more than 100 applications that I have cold dropped with local businesses, then followed up with phone calls, then visits. I have had a few interviews - but the absolute minute they SEE me, it's all over, finished. Not interested. Despite impeccable resume, and references, plus skills and experience, cannot get a job. I have applied at Coles & Woolies - told not jobs, then the next week see ads. A neighbour told me I was 'too smart' - if my resume said I had been a housewife for 20 years, I would have got a look in - they don't want anyone that is too smart because it might show them up. tend to agree, as I know allot of people who have applied but can't get a foot in.
    I live over 40kms from the city - what absolutely galls me is that local companies (near where I work) use a city based employment agency. They expect me to go all the way into the city, JUST so that they can SEE me. Nothing else. They have my resume, they have my references, etc This was put to the test recently. I was perfectly qualified for a local position. But had to go to Agency in city, as they rang me a number of times to come in. Appointment at 10.30am. Drove in early as wasn't too sure where to park, etc. Arrived around 10.15. At 11.15 girl came out and said 'position has been filled'. I asked why I needed to come into the city to see about a local job and she said (exact words) - "oh we need to see you first'. Straight away I asked 'what has seeing someone got to do with their ability to do the work?'. She realised her mistake, and tried to get out of it, but I was very hurt and upset. I had wasted hours of my time, plus $35 in parking, all for nothing. And no - I am not the hunch back of Notre Dame!! - I dress well, am fit healthy and well groomed - BUT I am 62. I look 'senior'. My neighbour (around late 20's) told me the local school was desperate for cleaners - went down, spoke to them, but they told me no, they were not looking for any cleaners. spoke to my neighbour again - he said 'rubbish - we are desperate'. He went to the school and said he had a mate who was interested in one of the cleaning jobs - was told to come in straight away to see them. The ONLY difference between the 2 of us? - age. nothing else.
    I have applied for a job as a dog washer, and flower picker - told I 'lacked experience' (yet the job ad said no experience required). I have been asked straight out when I plan to retire, and why do you want to work at your age?
    I cannot get a job - and the small amount of Annual leave payout that I got makes me ineligible for Newstart for months (so they say). That money has to cover my mortgage. I am single, and I face the real prospect of losing my house. I have always been a positive strong person, but on the weekend, I had a mini breakdown, as I simply cannot do much more. It is not just finding the jobs for people to do - it is breaking down this total discrimination that employers insist on perpetrating with senior workers. I have almost given up on even applying for jobs now - it is a waste of time.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    5:23pm
    In2sunset
    You are 100% right and I have compassion for your situation.
    Londongal
    4th Mar 2015
    5:18pm
    What a good idea Joe Hockey but how about helping older Australians who would like to work, find a job???? Why don't you get Centrelink staff to contact businesses and offer them incentives to hire an older worker???? Or perhaps you could staff your useless job agencies, such as Max Employment with older people who may actually do a better job of finding people work
    Barbara Mathieson
    4th Mar 2015
    5:33pm
    But many of us are still working! What about all the senior volunteers helping out in the community for quite a few hours each week? We save the Government $$$$ each year!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:17pm
    I take my hat off to these people. The salt of the earth.
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    6:23pm
    I haven't always been self-employed. I started as a teacher and did a stint at all three levels of education, primary, secondary & tertiary, but decided to branch out on my own in several different professions over the years. I am past retiring age and still self-employed. I do believe that my generation can be a great boost to Australia's economy, but we need to think beyond the concept of being employed as a salaried worker. Most of us have had enough experience and are knowledgeable enough to exploit our own skills to create our own income through self-employment. We can provide services for income. We can create/build/manufacture things to sell. You don't need a boss. You can be the boss of yourself. It may take a bit of courage, but you can do it. You are never going to save the country more money by being a volunteer though you may be providing an essential and worthwhile service. Volunteerism is a constant and a dwindling one at that. Your ability to exploit your skills to earn money will provide important tax dollars while you are taking a load off the pension for those who need it. It will keep you fit, healthy and active and I recommend it as long as you are physically able. Productivity is what keeps a nation growing.
    Jen
    4th Mar 2015
    7:20pm
    True Paulodapotter. That's what I did. I live in a lovely area of high unemployment but had enough confidence in my own ability to start my own work from home business. Nearly 5 years later I've never been happier or freer and I'm totally independent. And I know lots of people my age with wonderful skills in various fields who could do the same. I would recommend it.
    Patriot
    4th Mar 2015
    7:32pm
    Jen,
    I've done the same.
    However, looking at this forum, it becomes very obvious that we are ALL made different in relation to physical, mental and physiological attributes.
    None of the variations is wrong as it would be a boring world without diversity.
    However, some people just like a job and do NOT want the hassle of their own business. They just may NOT have the aptitude for this, but are much better artists than I'll ever be!!!
    In a fair world, there MUST be opportunity for all to lead the lifestyle their taslents are suited to!
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:22pm
    Paulodapper: you are a wonderful resource for the nation. There are hundreds of thousands, if not more, just like you. Guess what? Your skills, understanding, perception, morals and work ethics are given zero value because employers are too stupid to see that older workers, whilst being paid more money, are probably worth every dollar they earn. What a loss to the nation.
    You just hear the crap from Abbott about "learn and earn" (the next slogan) when there are no jobs and whilst older workers with all of their assets are burned....and they continue to vote for this cretin.
    DC
    5th Mar 2015
    12:15am
    My apologies but I was not going to comment again on anything out of Mick's mouth but I just saw a glimpse of reason in the comment to Paulodaotter: Up to .."what a loss to the nation".
    Then, alas, brain snap short circuit again. You need help.
    Oh, and just for your info, Mick, I was actually made redundant by one of those "corporates" but I don't blame the then Labor nor any other government for that matter. Shit happens, as they say - and I moved on as well!
    Jen
    5th Mar 2015
    11:04am
    That's true Patriot. Like any job, it's not for everyone. It was for me and I feel extremely lucky. The fact I haven't had a holiday for 5 years is the downside. But lucky that I enjoy what I'm doing. (7 days a week.)
    Savo
    4th Mar 2015
    8:06pm
    The govt boys better start looking at the Insurance side of employing older employes as once you have stopped work and then try to go back into the work force over 70 they will not cover you irrespective of your health. Also re the shortage of money in our country's coffers, Joe if we are are so short why the hell are we giving $600,000,000 a year to Indinoeisa and gods knows how much around the world if we cannot afford it. Charity starts at home. Stop giving away what we don't have.
    MICK
    4th Mar 2015
    8:28pm
    Well said Savo.
    So why are governments GIVING AWAY money they are borrowing from China? Only the insane would do that.
    Insurance for older workers might be available if the government leant on insurance companies to cover these workers. The same also applies to overseas travellers who are pretty well on their own after age 70. Discrimination methinks.
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    8:33pm
    I said that after being HORIFIED Hearing it on Tonight's news !! :-(
    Only Vote Government's in for ONE YEAR Until they learn to behave themselves !! :-)
    particolor
    4th Mar 2015
    8:34pm
    ONE TERM I meant !!
    gilstamp
    5th Mar 2015
    12:57am
    The foreign aid money is going mostly to Australian companies which do the construction and project work in the recipient countries. It is therefore an important stimulus to our economy by government.
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    9:32pm
    Patriot, you made a very good point about the diversity of people, their attributes, aptitudes and preferences. Being self-employed is not for everyone, but my encouragement goes out to those who can, particularly those who have all the desire but not the courage to strike out on their own. The amazing thing is, that once you do step into the unknown, it's not all that frightening. If you are intelligent enough to read this blog and understand it, you will definitely survive and how rewarding it is psychologically, physically and spiritually. There's nothing better for the soul than feeling as though you are making a contribution. So many stop living when they lose that feeling and it doesn't matter how young or old you are.
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    9:45pm
    It's no easy feat to get employment once you get past a certain age and of course insurance companies don't like to fork out money to people who are more likely to die due to age. My argument has always been, "Don't allow fear to dominate your thinking." Insurance companies thrive on that fear. There are plenty of options even for the decrepit with insurances. It just gets more b....dy expensive. Anyway how much do you want to cover yourself for as you get older. You won't benefit from it. I have a rule of thumb. Only cover yourself enough to ensure you don't leave anyone a debt. Oh, and Mick, get yourself a credit card that covers you with travel insurance if you use it to travel overseas. You can always toss it when you get back home :-)
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    9:52pm
    What I meant by "use for travel", some credit card providers will cover you with travel insurance if you purchase your travel tickets using their card. Citibank does this, but so do many others.
    Jenny
    4th Mar 2015
    11:08pm
    All well and good for older people to keep working as long as they are fit and able, but if we clog up the system how are our young people going to be able to get jobs if the vacancies are too slow to arise? It's a conundrum!
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    11:40pm
    That's why it's important for able oldies to create work for themselves. I.e., to become self-employed. That way they create jobs, not take them away from the young
    Jenny
    4th Mar 2015
    11:08pm
    All well and good for older people to keep working as long as they are fit and able, but if we clog up the system how are our young people going to be able to get jobs if the vacancies are too slow to arise? It's a conundrum!
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    8:29am
    Solutions to get the jobs that were exported overseas back in Australia for US.
    whatsupdok
    4th Mar 2015
    11:33pm
    Give me a good deal to get my pension without penalizing me for going back to work and a job at a decent income and I'll give it a go.
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    11:44pm
    It's not wise to tie yourself to your pension. That's one of the great traps. Why stop living to save your pension? You can always go back to the pension when you can't work any more. I know so many people who work at things they hate just for that huge super they are sweating on. When they get it, they haven't a hope of spending it on anything that will give them quality of life. So many die before they can take advantage of it. I have never understood why people put their life on hold for some dream that may never happen. Life is for living ---now!
    Paulodapotter
    4th Mar 2015
    11:49pm
    Some people who take the pension because they think they deserve it for all the tax and hard work they have done, get lost in the ideal that somehow the world owes them something. Sorry, but it doesn't. You owe yourself a life and some meaning for living. Grab it if you still can.
    whatsupdok
    4th Mar 2015
    11:51pm
    There is no point in trading off the pension just for a few extra dollars because of Centrelink's rules of letting you get what you already deserve and have worked for and don't say it isn't deserved and already paid for with taxes because it is. If a person wishes to work and it is a personal decision at every step to do so, then tax the income as normal and give them their pension and give us a break. I personally am not giving up anything no matter whether I work or not. Because once I have made the decision to do either it is one I except as my choice.
    kitkat
    5th Mar 2015
    10:08am
    To in2sunset I’m sorry you have had such a struggle to find a job as the lengths you have gone to highlight a terrific work ethic and you're very much on the ball. I can identify with many of your experiences. At age 52 I left my city job, moving to a country town to be near a friend and a treechange. Straight away I was employed to run a community centre. Four years later I was made redundant after nearly two years of bullying by my boss to force me to resign failed. There was no lump sum payment (less than 15 employees), my holiday entitlement meant I had to wait before I could claim Newstart. For over 30 yrs I had always been a valued employee and given 200% regularly working extra hours, including the 4 years I was on home haemodialysis until my kidney transplant 2 years prior to moving to the country. My outlook has always been the glass half full (ie I never doubted that I would be given a kidney & new life) but being mentally & emotionally crushed from the bullying, the job search experience plus nearly ending up homeless several times almost broke me. Never married, no family in Australia, at times I had to rely on the charity of caring friends. Very hard to accept as I have always been independent and employed. I had a mini breakdown and now occasionally get depressed because I am not employable despite my skills & experience. Renal failure, the years waiting for my kidney transplant & osteoporosis prematurely aged my appearance but NOT my brain or my ability & willingness to work. But the reality is that where I live there are very few admin jobs unless you run your own business. My jobsearch was not limited to my country town but so many applicants on the spot elsewhere meant I did not get a look in and eventually I could no longer afford to move back to the city. While not for all jobseekers, I now volunteer with a neighbourhood centre, landcare projects and other community groups where I am warmly welcomed, affirmed and feel useful.
    in2sunset
    5th Mar 2015
    1:44pm
    Kitkat - I fully understand your situation. I am actually right at the point of moving out to a friend's place 600kms out of the capital, simply to try out there. There is nothing where I live. She is constantly telling me there are plenty of jobs out there for people with my experience, so I will give it a go. Need a job. I don't relish the idea of renting out my house (packing and storing or moving stuff) so will give it a few months trial. I too have no family, a few good friends, but I cannot reply on them to support me in my old age. So looks like a new adventure awaits...
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    2:42pm
    In2sunset
    Good Luck - Hope you do well!!!
    Precious 1
    5th Mar 2015
    12:40pm
    Many are working still but no one ever sees or reads about them....Its only common sense that we would be working longer and longer if jobs were made public not kept to a select few...Many older men on dating sites tell me and ..
    they still parttime in Bowling Clubs etc etc, handy men, and lots of other things especially shop owners...I really don`t know what the Govt or media think we are all doing...I would still be working now after retirement but Centrelink used to tell me not to bother looking for job and go and find a husband to look after me.......maybe easy said then done....I enjoyment singleness for two long and established my own financial basis long ago if marrying again some of these things would be altered drastically...theres always changing my surname though
    Precious 1
    5th Mar 2015
    12:41pm
    Many are working still but no one ever sees or reads about them....Its only common sense that we would be working longer and longer if jobs were made public not kept to a select few...Many older men on dating sites tell me and ..
    they still parttime in Bowling Clubs etc etc, handy men, and lots of other things especially shop owners...I really don`t know what the Govt or media think we are all doing...I would still be working now after retirement but Centrelink used to tell me not to bother looking for job and go and find a husband to look after me.......maybe easy said then done....I enjoyment singleness for two long and established my own financial basis long ago if marrying again some of these things would be altered drastically...theres always changing my surname though
    particolor
    5th Mar 2015
    3:25pm
    Do You think Sir Precious 1 would suit You though ? :-)
    Not Senile Yet!
    5th Mar 2015
    4:35pm
    If Costello..(of Abbott & Costello)...means what he says...the very first thing required is action to remove all the limitations on the aged if they are on a Pension......income allowed is out of date and behind the times.
    I know you all think this twiddle.....however there are plenty who would like to do 1 or 2 days a week.....but are currently penalised for doing so!!!
    Change to a reward instead of a Penalty and I am sure quite a few would like to!!!
    Same goes for the disability pension....they should be encouraged to work art-time without penalty....if possible!
    The other area the Government has refused to address is Re-Training!!! One cannot do the physical work maybe...but with a little re-training.....maybe other work is possible....even if only part-time!
    But no-one can access their super to pay for it!!!!
    As for putting the younger ones out of work....bahhhh!!! Most are penalised for doing part-time work as well!!!
    Joe needs to change the Penalty Mentality of the System so it encourages people to be self sufficient or contribute.....not put up money to employers......put it up to those that qualify to re-train....then don't penalise them for having a go!
    Reward them by offering Private Health Insurance Guarantees or Subsidies because that way it lessens the burden on Medicare!!!
    Not a big Fan of this Mug Party and their arty Puppets....all talk and lies!!!
    The only debt.....budget deficit....that I see is that they are all overpaid and do not seem to be able to come up with an original idea of their own!!!!
    You do not get an economy to grow by doing secret TRADE DEALS that give work away to overseas companies whilst causing our own to shut down.
    Nor do you grow by taxing the low income earner's more and thus shrinking their ability to spend.
    Cannot name anything that has not gone up by more than double the CPI off the top of my head.....but recently all the Regos and Fuel price taxes have increased way in excess of the CPI.
    Average worker's Wages have stagnated in the last ten years, whilst all the CEO's have run away to the extent they get what their equivalent bosses get overseas.....however....they are not responsible for one tenth of the Capital or employees!!!!
    Hard to justify a Premier getting more than the USA President...let alone our own PM.
    We are way too TOP HEAVY for our Population base....and they know it!!! Too many Pigs at the trough for my liking!!!
    May as well become a State of the USA the way our Policies look more and more like USA.
    Sack them all next election....do not vote for any of the Corrupt Party Puppets.....vote against all the Parties....and win back control of our Parliament!
    particolor
    5th Mar 2015
    4:54pm
    You've got My Vote NSY !! :-)
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    6:06pm
    NSY,
    Doing what you suggest only upsets the pollies as this would remove them from a powerfull position and not convert us into slaves anymore. Fancy Freedom, Dignity & Self Supporting Sufficiency for the people. Just does not fit their durrent plans!!!
    Ultimately, they won't/can't be the slave drivers (no Slaves) then.

    So, whilst your ideas would be beneficial for us - the people - The Canberra Crims & Psychopaths will ensure that the country (& us) will keep going down the gurgler sothat they then can be the "enslaves Slave Drivers".
    That is, Unless we STOP them of course. There is LITTLE TIME LEFT for this!!!!
    I have said it before: "There is no honour amongst thieves".
    They should realise that!
    in2sunset
    5th Mar 2015
    6:45pm
    Currently, unemployment of older Australians sits at 64 per cent..... If THAT was said about (say) the under 25's.... there would be national outcry, and probably a royal Commission. But because we are old, and at the end of life's journey, we don't count. After all, if you are on the pension, you don't pay tax, so the Govt looks at oldies as a lost cause.
    particolor
    5th Mar 2015
    6:56pm
    Why do people say We don't pay Tax ? I recon Half the Pension goes Back In Tax !! :-(
    Patriot
    5th Mar 2015
    7:15pm
    particolor,
    Good one!
    Indirect taxes are very high whilst not very visible.
    particolor
    8th Mar 2015
    3:42pm
    Oh they're Visible alright ! :-( And becoming More Visibler !! :-(
    Lifer
    6th Mar 2015
    9:14am
    I am a 59 year old female who has worked since I was 15. I have had several jobs, sometimes 2 at a time (meatworker/barmaid). I am now working in a small country town in a supermarket where I am the fruit and vege person. I work in a confined space of 2.4m x 1.8m wide. In this area I am required to lift boxes 18kg in weight. Because this is a small but busy shop the cold room in which I work has boxes packed to the ceiling. I share this space with the milk and deli section also. The issue I have is to get to the box of apples needed for restocking, I need to lift and move as many as 5 boxes due to the tightly packed room. Yes work forever, healthy. I come home after a 5hr shift and cannot function. I say to Mr Hockey, trade places, see what manual labour is all about and then tell me I need to keep doing this for another 7 years until I can retire. Is your answer for me to leave home and find work elsewhere, gladly get me a job. So many of my city friends have lost their jobs, so what do you propose I do. I feel that some positions are able to be continued, but there has to be some thought process for people who do manual labouring jobs. We have supported Australia all our lives, let us some life back.
    particolor
    6th Mar 2015
    9:33am
    I wondered why they didn't pack Cigars in 18kg Boxes !! :-)
    Jen
    6th Mar 2015
    10:58am
    Dead right Lifer. This policy is too silly for words. I wish I could find the article I read about a week ago. It was about a Scandinavian country, but can't remember which one, reduced their retirement age from 65 to 60, the opposite of what this government proposes, and the sky hasn't fallen. In fact unemployment has dropped markedly, particularly for youth. It's loosened up more jobs for the young, who are now paying tax instead of getting benefits and therefore paying the age pension for these over 60s. I haven't researched further into it, but it sounds logical to me.
    Precious 1
    6th Mar 2015
    11:06am
    As I read all this posts of some people having had a very tough life I certainly never heard of these things before and from another country UK...somethings seemed quite barbaric in Australia and it certainly is ..in my eyes...a country for displaced people only.....it used to be renowned for people leaving my homeland in disgrace and disappear off downunder to be never seen again....hence the old hillbilly types that are hiddenaway in places in the bush of thier own choices...I feel more than sorry for women too here who obviously have had a terrible life struggling ,,many with kids to bring up alone while their supposed hisbands ran away or disappeared......and we still persist on being Holier than Thou with the Bali 2 ...I think that is more than hypocritical....and should be LOOKING INSIDE THIS ENORMOUS CONTINENT......and managing the affairs here in a different way altogether instead of preaching around the world isn't it a wuuunderful country and everything here is the BEST in the world...Hypocrisy to the max........govts in many places now are drunk with power and loss of vision in many cases.....
    Adrianus
    6th Mar 2015
    2:22pm
    Many of you are repeating the tired old political line that there are no jobs. Are you really saying the glass is 6.4% empty? Or only 93.6% full?
    Patriot
    6th Mar 2015
    2:35pm
    Frank,
    Depends which side of the coin you're on!
    I would say that 93.6% looka at the galss nearly full and 6.4% looks at the glass nearly empty!
    Now ther's some realism!
    Adrianus
    6th Mar 2015
    3:36pm
    If that's the case then it is a strong argument for 'work for the dole.'
    Patriot
    6th Mar 2015
    7:13pm
    Frank,
    No issues at all for that argument. However, the dole payment is not that good that there should NOT be CONDITIONS & ALLOWANCES additional to the dole money:
    1 Car allowance (or other compensation as appropriate) for travel to & from the job as - in many cases - travel would severely "Bite into or fully absorb the Dole Payment". (Recommended Govt. Figures for Mileage allowance are already established for this).
    2 Work is NOT TO BE for "Commercial Operators" but MUST be directly to the benefit of the community. Projects such as gardening, noxious weed eradication & many others come to mind. Office jobs etc. and many other "white Collar" work could be made available also.
    3 People MUST be more than SLAVES and actually gain useful skills in the process so that there is a chance they might get a job during their "work for the Dole scheme (Not to be a scam)".
    4 They MUST be provided with time & Opportunity to look & apply for jobs
    5 They MUST be provided with a range of choices to select from
    6 If sent to "Far Away Places" their accommodation MUST also be part of the compensation package. Strict & Appropriate guidelines MUST be applied
    7 Hours worked MUST be calculated (at the appropriate hourly rate) against & offset with the dole payment

    As Tony found out, NO DOLE for the first 6 months would just not work as these people would have to revert to "Stealing to stay alive" (as many of the first White Australians) or revert to the "oldest Profession on the books". Tony, with his religious convictions also would NOT like that whilst he seemed to “SMIRK” when he responded to a radio called referring to that!
    Encouragement to join the forces would also be good as long as Tony does not suggest publicly that

    EVERY but then EVERY Australian is entitled to Food, Shelter and Dignity of life. Whilst “Tony & Co” are happy to CONTINUE to transfer jobs to foreign countries they still act like there are adequate jobs on the Australian job market for everyone to be gainfully employed. They also allow for the importation of labour to ensure that the Bottom Line of the CARTELS is improved!
    I do not know which planet they are studying these "Facts & Relationships" but is certainly IS NOT EARTH.

    I - and I am sure many others that frequent this forum - have much compassion for those that are applying for jobs and not even getting a response because the employers are dealing with 500+ applicants.
    After many months (or even years of such action - I can fully understand (and have much compassion) that those who are forced into this situation (because of the COMPLETE LACK OF COMPETENCE OF OUR GOVERNMENTSSSSSS) look at the Glass to be nearly empty.

    Frank, I cannot interpret you attitude towards this “Unfortunate Facet of the current Australian Society” in any other way than that you either have always have had a decent paying job or just were born with a "Golden Spoon in your Mouth".
    I am extremely concerned with the - seeming - lack of compassion I detect.
    I know, at the moment, MONEY is GOD - its the new RELIGION.
    I personally am much more comfortable with people as a new resource.
    The Old ECONOMY STINKS.
    We MUST convert to a RESOUCE BASED economic strategy rather than the money based one that we have at the moment as the current economic conviction allows/promotes the creation of the situations/conditions we now live under.

    I look forward to have meaningful further discussions on these & associated matters!
    particolor
    6th Mar 2015
    8:10pm
    Ay Owly Eyes ! The True Figure is 25% Unemployed !! :-( 2 Hours a week is not working !! I could clock up 2 hours a week just being Late For Work !! :-)
    Patriot
    6th Mar 2015
    9:01pm
    particolor - Thanks for your input!
    Agree with what you are saying - the figures you quote are somewhere near the unfortunate truth I assume.
    I have "Glanced Over Them" for the sake of the current discussion in order to get to the Mechanism of the "Work for the Dole" parameters.
    Such RULES MUST be deployed in order to avoid the incidence of "Plain as Dailight" Usery & Slavery of the layer of our population which is paying the highest price for the UNCONTROLLED GREED of the WEALTHY & POWERFULL.

    The people who "Shed Blood" in order to implement the Magna Carta, Habeus Corpus & the Charter of the Forest in the early 1200s must be honoured and their sacrifice SHOULD not be in vain!!!!!
    particolor
    6th Mar 2015
    9:14pm
    I read a lot !! But unlike others on here I don't write everything down just to push a point ! Unless I find something Juicy !! :-) And I did see that somewhere recently .And not in a Murdock paper !! You'll get NO truth Here now only Smudgy Rubbery figures !! :-(
    Patriot
    6th Mar 2015
    9:45pm
    Agreed, Blatant lies and misrepresentations is all we get in the current visual and written media is all we get
    The alternative news channels are much closer to the truth.
    I have not switched the Idiot Box on now for more than 3 months!
    particolor
    6th Mar 2015
    10:00pm
    Same !! I rarely watch The Telly now ! Only the Morning News ! Stabbings Shootings and House Fires ! :-(
    Patriot
    6th Mar 2015
    10:01pm
    Just some light entertainement eh?
    particolor
    6th Mar 2015
    10:04pm
    Yes and that's only if I can Hide from the Barley Nine that they are HOOKED ON !!
    Patriot
    7th Mar 2015
    11:53am
    Frank,
    Looking at the postings this morning, I would assume that you're taking the Grand Kids to sports or some other activity as you seem to only have time for some small responses.

    I am looking forward to your input/discussion very much as, after all, you instigated the subject!That is, if it remains as meaningful & positive as it has started of course. The resulting action /rule proposals from us & other contributors could then be forwarded to the “Minister for the Dole” as a recommendation from a “Discussion Panel” that has “Seen a few X-masses” and therefore should have the experience, foresight & wisdom on their side.

    Wouldn't be great if the deliberations from this forum made a Positive impact on the lives of these Australians by allowing them to make a worthwhile contribution to Australian Society without being forced to make the personal sacrifices that would further impact on their already compromised lives & futures.

    Frank, I hope that, when you find time soon, you'll contribute your views so that we can compose the meaningful recommendations that – I am certain our forum members would appreciate to be part of – and I am certain OUR Government will truly appreciate.
    After all, such would be an expression of “THE WILL of THE PEOPLE” and, as it is our Constitutional duty to express such by informing our Elected Representatives, I'm certain that our Politicians will greatly appreciate it.
    After all, that is what Democracy is all about! Isn't it?
    particolor
    7th Mar 2015
    12:35pm
    What's Democracy ??
    Patriot
    7th Mar 2015
    12:44pm
    particolor,
    That's hard to define in today's world.

    Humility & Consideration of the welfare of the people is certainly a good starting point!

    Maybe the Expression of wisdom from this president could very much form a "Take-Off platform" to restart democracy - in any country - anywhere in the world.
    Collectively, The PEOPLE are ALWAYS RIGHT and have ENORMOUS WISDOM!!!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtCPYneggEY
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hteGnL-8SeU
    Patriot
    7th Mar 2015
    1:03pm
    Isn't it amazing when personal motivation becomes NEED rather then GREED !?!?!?!
    Adrianus
    7th Mar 2015
    1:04pm
    Patriot, you appear to be looking for a political argument. Or an argument of any kind judging by your insults. OK, I'll bite. Which party is stopping employment opportunity for the people who do not want to be unemployed?? :) If you can answer that question honestly then maybe we can have a discussion about solutions. ;)
    Patriot
    7th Mar 2015
    2:55pm
    Frank,
    I have carefully perused my postings on THIS segment and fail to detect where I have treated you with NILL RESPECT. Lleast have I INSULTED you!
    I can, therefore, only assume that my opinions on matters oppose those you are holding dear. For this I make no apology, even if such different opinions offend you.
    YOU started this segment and received my response. Upon my response you made a further statement to which I elected to make an extensive response. Unfortunately, you seem extremely frustrated/agitated with my detailed response as you have elected NOT address/disprove ANY of the issues raised by me!
    I am NOT looking for an argument at all but it seems that your aggressive/bullying stance may attempt to invoke one. I am looking to uncover the FACTS no matter in whose favour these “Pan Out” to be. WHAT IS RIGHT rather than WHO IS RIGHT is my motto.

    OK, I'll – once again – respond to your question without you having responded to my remarks.

    During the past ½ century ALL governments have become “Vassals” of the International Corporate world. We, as small organisations within Australia, have been forced to become incorporated which actually means that ANY Incorporated Organisation MUST be treated & has the same unalienable rights as a HUMAN BEING. This “LEGAL Attitude” transfers a MASSIVE LEGAL Advantage to the FATCAT Corporations in ANY Court Case.
    MEGA Corporations Rule Small Business & The Governments!

    International TRADE Agreements have Made “Level Playing Fields” for trade and dissolved OUR import trade barriers. This means that Mega-Corporations establishing businesses in 3rd world countries can use the local population as “Slave Labour” under inhumane working conditions (Sweat Shops).
    As a consequence, the goods produced can & do – once imported – out-compete ANY local product and (of course) these businesses go broke with the resulting loss of jobs.
    As these goods cost almost nothing to produce, the FATCAT Corporations are the only winners.
    Effectively, JOBS lost are transferred overseas!

    Despite unemployment figures for Australia being high for the past DECADES, immigration figures keep rising (http://www.macrobusiness.com.au/2014/04/immigration-into-australia-rises/)
    If those who are here cannot find jobs, how do we expect additional people (beyond natural birth) are going to find work? Beats ME!!!! Once again, more people in unemployment cues!!!

    If we allow Australian companies (owned by us) like Telstra & Quantas and many other Privately owned Businesses to employ people in the Philipines, Ceylon, India, Thailand etc. what do you think is going to happen to the Dole Cues in Australia. They, once again, are getting longer of course.
    The frustrating part is that OUR Government is NOT applying PENALTIES to these companies to ensure that such actions become unpalatable and they refrain from hiring foreign labour. People in these Countries must be “PEEING Themselves laughing about OUR STUPIDITY”.

    Selling our Prime Farmland to Foreign Countries and allow them to import their own labour force also is a contributor to longer “Dole Cues” in Australia. Same with Mining Companies!

    And SO THE LIST GOES ON !!! Frank, I have no inclination to raise further points to support the case as I am certain you already understand these.

    One last item which is of massive concern to Australia that is taking place at the moment.
    We are negotiating (????) a new Trans Pacific Trade Deal and – if signed – any Company (person) who feels that they get an unfair deal and that their sales have dropped because of this, can sue the Australian government for compensation.
    I believe that the Australian Government – currently – is already being SUED by Phillip Morris for such an issue. As we have enforced laws to warn smokers that “Smoking is a Health Hazard” we are now being sued by a foreign company (whilst our government is doing the right thing for once) for LOSS of POTENTIAL SALES.
    Talking of being a “Stranger in your Own Country”.

    Frank, I now have responded to issues raised by you TWICE, please do me the courtesy to respond (in return) to the issues raised by myself. That is ON BOTH OCCASIONS.
    And NO, I'm NOT BAITING YOU as you suggest!
    Patriot
    8th Mar 2015
    12:14pm
    Frank,
    I have been eagerly keeping “in Touch” with this forum awaiting your response to BOTH my analysis' relating to questions/assumptions you posed. Alas, NO response to either!
    It seems you're doing “a Tony” on me as silence is the only deafening response I get.
    Just in case you don't understand what I mean by “a Tony”, just watch the following link which explains all. “https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9wT9XS_TvzQ”

    I am somewhat disappointed as I – at 69 YO – I am “Still in the game” to seek enlightenment on subjects which I (obviously) have not fully understood.
    Every “Now & Then” somebody comes along and “Cleans out some Ancient Cob-Webs” that have been making a nuisance of themselves in my brain for a long time. I was thinking you, with your strong convictions, might be someone like that.
    Whist such processes - at the time – can be rather confronting (nobody enjoys to be wrong) they always bear “An ample crop of rich Fruit” as they show the environment which I am part of in a more “Truthful & Realistic” light.
    But, “So it is”, your “lack of response” now legally (& in any other way) proves that the facts presented in response to your challenges are correct and I am doomed not to learn from the current “Exchange of ideas(???).
    I “Hope & Trust” that you have though as it is a Universal law that – if not either – ONE Party will always have a learning experience with the resulting expanding personal insight!

    This “lack of additional information” disappoints me further as it proves/confirms also that those who I elect to Represent me in order to “act on my behalf with Australia's best interest at heart” and who I (and other tax payers) pay very well, are really serving their OWN PERSONAL (& other ELETISTS) GREED rather than looking after the COLLECTIVE NEED of Australia.
    They should be “Court Martialled” and awarded appropriately!

    I would refer those who do not understand the “EVIL WAYS” of our government (s) to the “Life & Work” of José (Pepe) Mujica who is now the ex-president of Uruguay (Unfortunately no consecutive terms allowed under the Uruguayan Constitution). Just compare him with/against our Political Leaders!
    The compassion for “His People” and for “What is right” Oozes from his words which are full of practical wisdom fostered by the experiences of a Colourful & Hard life. And ' on-top-of-that”, NO Bullshit, he genuinely “means what he says and attempts to “Follow Through” with appropriate actions. He is one of the few exceptions to the truth that applies to almost every Politician.
    He “Does NOT lie when his lips move!”
    The above is only surpassed his Humbleness as an enlightened Human Being and – in my opinion - the pope does not “Have a patch” on him.
    His “Simple Truths” will unfortunately fail to reach those who need it most because their minds are POISONED & PRIMED with the TOXINS of GREED & SELF-DELUSION!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jos%C3%A9_Mujica
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VtCPYneggEY
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hteGnL-8SeU

    Frank, I'll be honest with you, your behaviour reminds me of an Ancient War Veteran & Strategist by the name of Hannibal. He inflicted enormous damage to the Roman army hordes without EVER confronting them openly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hannibal).
    His Strategy has – in modern times – been adopted by the Fabian Society (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fabian_strategy) which draws its input From & Via candidates who have been moulded via a Educational Scholarship System established by Cecil Rhodes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cecil_Rhodes).
    The emblem of the Fabian Society is a “Wolf in Sheep's clothing” (https://theweathereye.wordpress.com/2010/06/27/the-fabian-society/).
    A list of “High Ranking (Government) Australians that are (were) members of the Fabian Society are listed in the following link: (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Fabian_Society)

    There will come a time – and I hope it is soon - when COLLECTIVE NEED takes preference over PERSONAL GREED

    “This above all, - To thine own self be true;
    And it must follow, as the night the day,
    Thou canst not then be false to any man.”
    Shakespeare

    To conclude: “Frank, I wish to thank you for the opportunity to “Air & Express” my views. I trust that there are a few “pearls(ers???)” amongst the ideas presented for “You & Others” who have explored these lengthy presentations”.
    I would be very happy to receive further communications from anyone who can im/dis-prove on the facts as presented.
    particolor
    8th Mar 2015
    3:16pm
    I wouldn't over worry Myself with any of that Voluminous Speech now Patriot ! You will soon be Marching to the Tune of The New World Order !! :-(
    I think they have voted in some of the Grand Poobahs !! :-(
    Patriot
    8th Mar 2015
    5:45pm
    Trans Pacific Trade Deal

    Sign the peririon now before our Pollies sign it!

    https://www.getup.org.au/campaigns/tpp/tpp/the-dirtiest-deal-youve-never-heard-of
    Patriot
    8th Mar 2015
    5:53pm
    particolor,
    I know you're - unfortunately - right about that!
    However, I want to be able to look my Grand Kids "Straight-in-the-Eyes" when I respond in ALL honesty: "I did ALL I could" when they pose the following question: "And Grandpa, what did you do when all this started to happen".
    I've been on this track for 30+ years trying to convert "Apathy into Actions".
    Obviously with little success. The TV has done a much more efficient job.
    particolor
    8th Mar 2015
    6:54pm
    Gawd there's some Rotten Stuff going on in the World now and You Paper Readers and Telly Watchers Only get to see about a Quarter of it in the WATERED DOWN Version Served up as News in Australia !! :-( !
    Kato
    7th Mar 2015
    4:09pm
    http://www.tai.org.au/content/richard-denniss-joe-hockeys-debt-bomb-false-alarm
    Jen
    7th Mar 2015
    5:27pm
    Don't bamboozle 'em with facts, Kato. :D
    Precious 1
    7th Mar 2015
    4:38pm
    Mick I totally agree with getting that debt down but I fear that it won `t be everones cup of tea.....as its invisible people tend to think it isn't there...?
    Precious 1
    7th Mar 2015
    7:35pm
    I just heard a lady on radio the other day saying she still working in the sex trade over 60........ek
    particolor
    7th Mar 2015
    7:43pm
    Madam Who ?
    Abby
    8th Mar 2015
    4:20pm
    Just proves if you really want a job ...they are out there LOL
    Adrianus
    11th Mar 2015
    11:20am
    * O
    L
    \--/
    particolor
    11th Mar 2015
    5:40pm
    ( o )( o )
    Abby
    8th Mar 2015
    4:23pm
    A lot of us worked since age of fifteen.

    Todays youth start at mid twenty after their trip overseas and Uni.

    Surely it makes more sense for them to do some of the lifting.
    particolor
    8th Mar 2015
    4:29pm
    I just hope a Schooner isn't too Heavy for them ? :-)
    particolor
    8th Mar 2015
    4:36pm
    PS .. Is there something Left to Lift ?
    Mel
    9th Mar 2015
    6:54pm
    You- [a Gov Registry body] actually pushed me out of work on an age related basis.
    Now I am 70 years old & would have liked to have kept working in my field.
    Where is the job you have ???? available for me or my ilk.
    Will you pay the costs for me to re qualify due to arbitrary age related decisions now
    you have changed your minds? Do I get emotional & financial compensation due to
    arbitrary Govt judgements now the goal posts have been moved? P.S. I am Not on a pension
    & go without, rather than rely on fickle politican's policies. I will wait for an answer but
    not with bated breath. You will have mine next NSW state, & federal elections.
    Mel
    Adrianus
    11th Mar 2015
    7:58am
    I notice those who are saying 'older workers are the key to our future' and 'return to work all you oldies' are the young. I remember about 25 years ago my father in law, a teacher in QLD was encouraged to retire at age 57.5. Hundreds of male teachers retired. A few years later the QLD government wrote to them begging for their return.
    particolor
    11th Mar 2015
    10:15am
    There's an Old Song about that ! :-) Baby Come Back !! :-)
    Adrianus
    11th Mar 2015
    11:25am
    I think the rest is also pertinent "I any kind of fool could see" "I was wrong and I just cant live without you."
    Fair Go
    17th Apr 2015
    10:01pm
    If only there were a pool of jobs that older people could do, maybe those that just wanted a day or two, I would love that, but yes, I am dreaming, and what about all the young people in this country who have almost no chance of getting any job, at least quite a lot of them anyway. Starting businesses is all very well, but you need the employed folk to support the businesses. I also feel that Joe Hockey is dreaming, where does he get his ideas from!
    particolor
    17th Apr 2015
    11:17pm
    Walt Disney ! :-)
    Adrianus
    18th Apr 2015
    7:00am
    You can look at the situation and ask why, or dream of how it could be and ask why not?
    Why not dream of a better world? Why not fill your future with hope and aspiration?
    Don't be afraid to dream :) Good post Fair Go!


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