12-year-old boy on terror watchlist

A 12-year-old boy is on the AFP’s counter-terrorism watchlist.

12-year-old boy on terror watchlist

A 12-year-old boy is one of an undisclosed number of boys under 14 who are on an Australian Federal Police (AFP) counter-terrorism watchlist.

AFP Commissioner Andrew Colvin has confirmed that the boy appeared on its radar after being listed on a Federal Court control order.

The order was issued for Sydney man, Ahmad Saiyer Naizmand, who’s been prohibited from contacting certain people of interest, including the 12-year-old boy, as well as an 18-year-old boy who is currently being questioned about the death of Curtis Cheng – the NSW Police accountant who was shot dead in Parramatta in early October.

“Unfortunately, there is a barbaric terrorist organisation in the Middle East that are reaching out through social media to our young people,” said Justice Minister Michael Keenan. “We have seen this trend of them reaching out to people in their 20s, then their late teens. Now we find people in their early teens and the government is very shocked about these matters.”

Mr Keenan declined to say how many children in Australia under the age of 14 were on watchlists, saying, “I do not think it is appropriate for me to go into that.”

“We’re shocked that a 12-year-old is on police radar for these types of matters,” said Commissioner Colvin. “This threat has evolved, it’s become younger. We saw the very tragic events in Parramatta a week-and-a-half ago that involved a 15-year-old and I think that’s the most shocking part.”

What do you think about this? Are you surprised that a 12-year-old boy may pose such a serious threat to the community? Or do expect that this will become more commonplace?

Read more at www.sbs.com.au

Read more at www.abc.net.au





    COMMENTS

    To make a comment, please register or login
    Kali-G
    16th Oct 2015
    10:12am
    Simple answer = MOSLEMS here to destroy our western way of life......and
    our new PM wants 12000 more to come to Australia.
    Angola, Hungary, japan, and now Cuba declared that they will take ZERO Arab/moslems....why is Australia so stupid???
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:13am
    A basic question: HOW MANY OF THESE BOYS ARE FROM ISLAMIC FAMILIES?

    If nearly all then politicians need to stop getting in front of the cameras and enact laws to remove citizens who want to destroy the Australian and western way of life by revoking citizenship. It is quite reasonable to make arrangements to settle these people back in the Middle East as that is what they crave. A start might be by refusing re-entry to Australia to those who choose to fight in the Middle East.

    Quite frankly Australians are sick and tired of governments on both sides who have a blind eye approach whilst refusing to fix this festering problem. We need a solution, not political correctness and not electioneering.
    Sundays
    16th Oct 2015
    11:24am
    A large percentage of the 12,000 are actually Christians and other minorities fleeing persecution. Maybe this should be our criteria given the circumstances.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:33am
    I can hear the immigration lawyers and the civil libertarians already Sundays. These groups will demand the right to destroy our way of life.
    Paulodapotter
    16th Oct 2015
    2:47pm
    Kali-G, Rubbish!!!
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    3:32pm
    Its easy to dismiss what you do not want to hear as "rubbish". And then when the unimaginable happens the same people look around to blame somebody other than themselves. What is happening within our own Islamic community as well as those abroad should serve as a marker.
    particolor
    16th Oct 2015
    8:54pm
    Sunday.. You will find out on Friday how Christian they are once they get here !! :-)
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    10:38pm
    Gert Wilders from Holland is visiting Australia this month. He is almost vertain to be the next PM of Holland. The Dutch have been one of the most welcoming countries over many decades. Now the Dutch people have had enough and want to reclaim their identity, albeit probably a little too late. I expect to seem a change in Governments in many EU countries. People want their country run by politicians that consider the needs of their own citizens first. Islam is the biggest threat facing the whole of Europe and to believe that Australia may not affected is pure "dreaming". The Australian Government should now reneg. on its promise to take any refugees. They (all) break promises when it comes to Australians, so surely they do the same as far as the "refugees" are concerned. Failure to do so is to be contemptuous of The Australian people. Again NO TO ISLAM.
    MILA
    17th Oct 2015
    10:21am
    Gert Wilders has been rejected in his own country despite having the courage to face and speaka the truth. Each one to their own. Africans did not wish to be under the colonialists but, now they come in millions to Europe. Islmacis are totally intolerant - specially the fanatics: they even kill each other in their own land to those who disagree to their laws. Education is all based on the Koran: is this a religion? if so, only brings destruction, fear and ignorance.
    geomac
    18th Oct 2015
    12:19am
    Kali
    Care to back up your assertions about the four countries you mentioned ? Japan does not take anybody more or less. Hungary is a transit country and who would want to stay there if you were a gypsie. moslem or negro. Cuba ? Really . Well google gave me nothing but the country has 10,000 moslems and has no mosques but has not declared zero about any group. Angola has declared it is not at war with Islam is what I get from numerous hits in google. So Kali enlighten me where you got your info please. You were quite definite in your statement yet I came up with nothing even approaching what you said.
    Paulodapotter
    18th Oct 2015
    1:24am
    As I said, geomac. Kali writes unsubstantiated rubbish.
    margie
    16th Oct 2015
    10:33am
    Not one bit surprised, these unfortunate 'children' are brainwashed from birth and easily fall further victim to on line grooming, while our 12 year olds are kicking a football.But this death cult wants to force their barbaric way of life on to those who they think are of lesser importance and they do not care who they use to achieve this end. I agree with Kali-G and think by letting in people who refuse to assimilate while trying to force their middle age beliefs on to our society should not enter this country. Moslems are rampaging through Europe, demanding and destroying, so forgive me if I don't want that in this wonderful country. We have enough needy, Indigenous , teachers, nurses, homeless as well as our elderly to show compassion to before letting in people who will drain our resources which can be put to much better uses as outlined above.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:16am
    Yes, the problem is the families these children come from. Given that some of these families have several generations in this country we need to consider removing those who seek to destroy us otherwise this scourge will eat like a cancer from the inside and result in a civil war in the future. So where are our politicians????
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    12:39pm
    mick
    The pollies are hiding under the "Nearest Rock" in order to await for the resolution to these issues and then demand/collect the spills!
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    1:01pm
    They are pretty gutless. First cab off the rank is always votes so you don't get a group like the Islamic section of our society offside. Just pander to it and and use the language of reconciliation. Sadly this does not fix anything and simply kicks the can down the road.
    A bit like the 1 weed in the paddock syndrome: rather than pull it out farmers wait until the entire farm is covered.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    1:06pm
    I do not qualify it to be "gutless" on their part as they are only to willing, able & keen to SQUASH any uprising &/or organised rebellion on OUR part via police brutality etc.
    I think it is just "TACTICS to allow the country to deteriorate and than "Collect the SPOILS".
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    1:41pm
    Australians are by and large peace loving and want nothing other than a beer, a BBQ, the footy and to be left alone. But dissent is brewing and average Australians have had an absolute gut full of islamic thugs committing crimes (with their illegal guns), intimidating citizens, the increasingly anti-social and anti-western behaviour and now the violent and barbaric rebellion against our way of life.
    The community understands that our political leaders will not react as they should so the anti-Australian citizens we have do as they like. Recent events are a clear reflection of where this country is headed and no amount of engaging with this community or do-gooder speeches is going to stop it. Whilst people may not agree with my prediction I invite them to file my position away before putting a 'racist' label on what is unfolding.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    2:41pm
    But Mick,

    Howard removed the "Guns from Communities", so how is it possible that they have guns???

    Or is what was said at the time true that "Only those who should not have guns (the crims) now have guns and that the innocent people just cannot defend themselves!!!
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    3:34pm
    And that is where it is at Patriot. I heard that the 15 year old who was shot last week got his gun from a tree lopper. Islamic person of course. So HOW does a tree lopper own a handgun? PLEASE EXPLAIN......
    buby
    17th Oct 2015
    12:45pm
    RAISES cup of coffee to MARGIE i'm with you there my dear. My sentiments exactly
    Blossom
    17th Oct 2015
    1:06pm
    Let's face it, only honest law abiding citizens surrendered their firearms......except there were a few who had antique firearms which weren't fireable but worth a lot more they would have been compensated so they locked them away in the legal method for licensed firearms. They supposedly would have been crushed, not displayed in a secure manner in a military or similar Museum.
    Paulodapotter
    18th Oct 2015
    1:28am
    Very true Blossom. Most firearms used in crime are firearms not turned in during the wasteful buyback. Stolen firearms from Licenced owners are often blamed as the source of illegal weapons used in crime. Not so. Less than 1% come from legitimate ownership of firearms.

    16th Oct 2015
    10:41am
    And now we're seeing the true face of Islam. Such terrorism (including that of ISIS) is completely in accord with the contents of the Quran. The sooner we excise this cancer from our society, the better; wherever Islam is established, trouble soon follows. Australian authorities should shut down all mosques and Islamic schools, ban the Quran (on the grounds that it is hate speech, encouraging the persecution and murder of non-Muslims), stop the Halal rip-off (according to the Quran, it's not at all necessary!), and - if possible - ban Islam itself. Then, Muslims who don't, of their own accord, leave our shores for good, can be deported. The later we leave all of this, the harder it will be to accomplish.
    Anonymous
    16th Oct 2015
    11:16am
    Good one DrPolymath you are saying what most decent Australians are thinking, but don"t let Chanell 2 and all the do gooders get hold of your comments they will come after you big time.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:19am
    The real question is why do we not have a bipartisan government approach on this issue with real teeth to remove those who seek to destroy our way of life from the nation?
    Islam has no place in Australia. It is not a benign religion and the religion exists in a political sense with beliefs which demand an end to our way of life. It needs to be sent back where it came from.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:43am
    robbo: why single out channel 2 when the media simply reports on what politicians do: talk the unity rhetoric to restore calm whilst ignoring a real solution to a problem which is politically unpalatable.
    The media as a whole should be agitating for a real solution. It won't!
    Anonymous
    16th Oct 2015
    11:59am
    Mick if you watch Channel 2 they support them, use them as reporters and even have accused terroists in the audience in other words they are on there side.

    You are correct that the media as a whole should be looking for a real solution which of course is kick them out of the country.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:37pm
    Hell, robbo, you are just unreal! I'd get an oil change and grease, if I were you.
    Sundays
    16th Oct 2015
    11:19am
    Moslems have been here a long time. They used to go about their business and worship privately. We were tolerant of their beliefs, the way most Australians respect that you can worship who you like. However, the last few years there has been a rise in radicalisation where it seems some Moslems feel hate towards us, and do not respect out way of life. They think we are inferior to them, and in worst case scenarios we should be killed. We need to stand strong against these hard liners. Also, Moslems are not a homogenous group and have been fighting each other for centuries. Come down hard on the radicals, leave the peace lovers who contribute alone
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:31am
    Spot on Sundays. Australians would not have an issue if the religion was benign. Unfortunately it is not and has simply been hibernating. What is currently unfolding is what Islam really is: a social dictatorship to suppress all and a mechanism to destroy all non compliant people. A lot more than simply radicals.
    Sundays
    16th Oct 2015
    12:28pm
    Yes, it's gone to the next step. For example, Moslems think their women should cover themselves to show modesty, but that's not enough now it seems that Australian women are seen as immodest because they don't cover up. Not a very tolerant religion. I don't support White australian extremists, but the Government needs to take a stand.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    1:05pm
    I was sent an email from a friend recently showing pictures of 'then and now'. Detailed countries like Egypt and Syria, etc. Original picture was when people had a CHOICE of what they wore and nearly all opted for western style clothing with no faces hidden. The current picture was one of fully covered women, clearly with NO CHOICE. This is what Islam will bring. And for those who cannot face the reality I feel sorry that their sense of 'being a good bloke' refuses to confront the reality.
    Anonymous
    16th Oct 2015
    6:29pm
    Sundays, don't be fooled: ALL Muslims are radical, in that they uphold the Quran in its entirety. Some act out what the Quran tells them to do (i.e. kill non-Muslims); the rest tacitly support them. You'll never come across a Muslim who renounces the 100 or so verses therein that encourage violence. ALL Muslims seek to see the whole world subjugated under Sharia Law.
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    10:48pm
    There are around 1600 Mosques in the UK alone. The Saudis offered to pay for the construction of 200 mosques in Germany. Countries like Sweden and Norway have seen many recent incidents of rape of their women by Muslims, although the press are not allowed to name the religion in their papers as it is against the "law" to specify. How stupid is that, those at the receiving end are not going to keep quiet are they? DrPolymath, It is true that very few Muslims will attack the regime that is ISIS or speak out against the violence inflicted on Westerners. To question the Koran is unthinkable in their mind as it is a LAW that binds them all. A Religion it is certainly not, a cult and ideology it is. Again NO TO ISLAM.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:32pm
    What a load of excrement!
    Bookworm
    16th Oct 2015
    11:31am
    Aah, the religion of peace.....
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    11:34am
    That's what Australians want Bookworm. But if you look to the Middle East that is not what a few of us want.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:40pm
    And so say all of us as we invade Iraq on a lie. We have invaded more countries over the last 50 years than any Moslem country has.
    Patriot
    17th Oct 2015
    7:48pm
    Paulodapotter

    We ( The West) has been antagonising them in order to get at "Their Oil" !!!
    Just familiarise yourself with the 2 links I gave at the beginning of this discussion.

    Whilst Mohammed was a very "War Like" person in his day, the inquisition in Europe (invoked by the catholic church) took many centuries to dissipate!!!
    So Why throw stones when living in a glass house!!!

    All this Terrorism has been CULTIVATED purposely by the West I would dare to suggest in order to de-stabalise these countries and CONFISCATE their WEALTH!!!.

    And so, it is very difficult to evaluate what the relationship between Muslim & the rest of their environment would be without this CONTINUED antagonism.

    You can only PESTER any a dog for so long before he becomes dangerous & BITES !!
    Paulodapotter
    18th Oct 2015
    1:31am
    This is very serious of you Patriot. Indeed, it is a serious issue and, though not a fundamentalist, I fundamentally agree with you.
    Auction Girl
    16th Oct 2015
    11:59am
    Received this yesterday in my emails. Thought it was timely on the subject:-

    Can a good Muslim be a good Australian?

    (This makes interesting reading considering the number of Muslims flooding into Europe at the moment.)

    This is very interesting and we all need to read it from start to finish. And send it on to everyone.
    Maybe this is why our Australian Muslims are so quiet and not speaking out about any atrocities.

    Can a good Muslim be a good Australian?

    This question was forwarded to a friend who worked in Saudi Arabia for 20 years.

    The following is his reply:

    Theologically - no.... Because his allegiance is to Allah, The moon god of Arabia.

    Religiously - no.... Because no other religion is accepted by His Allah except Islam. (Quran, 2:256)(Koran)

    Scripturally - no.... Because his allegiance is to the five Pillars of Islam and the Quran.

    Geographically - no.... Because his allegiance is to Mecca, to which he turns in prayer five times a day.

    Socially - no.... Because his allegiance to Islam forbids him to make friends with Christians or Jews.

    Politically - no.... Because he must submit to the mullahs (spiritual leaders), who teach annihilation of Israel and destruction of America, (the great Satan), Australia and the rest of the free world.

    Domestically - no.... Because he is instructed to marry four Women and beat and scourge his wife when she disobeys him. (Quran 4:34 )

    Intellectually - no.... Because he cannot accept the Australian Constitution, since it is based on Biblical principles and he believes the Bible to be corrupt.

    Philosophically - no.... Because Islam, Muhammad, and the Quran does not allow freedom of religion and expression. Democracy and Islam cannot co-exist. Every Muslim government is either dictatorial or autocratic.

    Spiritually - no.... Because when we declare 'one nation under God,' the Christian's God is loving and kind, while Allah is NEVER referred to as Heavenly father, nor is he ever called love in the Quran's 99 excellent names.

    Therefore, after much study and deliberation.... Perhaps we should be very suspicious of ALL MUSLIMS in this country. They obviously cannot be both 'good' Muslims and good Australians. Call it what you wish, it's still the truth. You had better believe it. The more who understand this, the better it will be for our country and our future.
    It is a religious war and it is bigger than we know or understand.

    Footnote: The Muslims have said they will destroy us from within.
    SO FREEDOM IS NOT FREE.

    THE AUSSIE DIGGERS WANT THIS TO ROLL OUT ALL OVER AUSTRALIA.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    12:52pm
    Auction Girl
    Not withstanding the above, Jew & Arab liver peacefully together in Israel before the United Nations meddled in this situation after the 2nd world war.

    Ever since then, havoc, murder and corruption has been explosive and human abuse horrendous.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    12:56pm
    Auction Girl

    All those who Cannot & WILL not accept the Australian Constitution (and live by it) should NOT be allowed to live in Australia!

    That's a law that should be passed immediately and - as a consequence - would get rid of about 95+% of our current politicians without any further ADO!
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    1:10pm
    Priceless. Send to every newspaper editor and politician. They need to be reminded that co-existence is not going to work and that the Muslim section of our community is simply waiting for the right time. Surely the demands for Sharia and polygamy over the past 3 years sends a clear message as does the young fighters from this community heading off to join a religious anti-western war.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    1:26pm
    If I was just born in 1995 rather than in 1945, polygamy could be exiting to consider!
    Sharia Law would be very difficult to stomach though!
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    1:33pm
    Don't know. Some people probably deserve to be getting around with one hand. But then seeing some of the leaders in the muslim society tells me that it is pretty corrupt and not sure what you would get other than a much worse system than we have now. It would be easy to lose your head and none of us on this forum would have ours. I think mine would have chopped off twice.......
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:41pm
    Absolutely right Patriot. Fortunately, we don't live by the Old Testament any more.
    niemakawa
    18th Oct 2015
    8:34pm
    Patriot by name and Patriot by word. Very apt. Like you I am a patriot and love my Country.
    Adrianus
    20th Oct 2015
    1:42pm
    Patriot Muslims in Australia will not hear of polygamy. It is actually polygyny they have been asking the government to introduce. Women's rights are being tested on many levels.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    12:50pm
    Whilst I cannot & WILL NOT condone what is happening in Australia in relation the "terror" exerted by SOME groups in our population, I can only suggest this these frightening experiences that are now unfolding globally & in Australia might just be "Retribution" for the atrocities the WEST (and Australia is contributing unfortunately) is & has been committing (or allowed/condoned to) to the Arab world and its inhabitants.

    I cannot help to consider the suggestion that they have been engineered to "bring Down" our civilisation on the way to a "One World Government"!

    I believe that there is s "Universal Law" which states very clearly that "What Goes around Comes Around" & also "actions invoke appropriate reactions!"I
    In other words, "No action is without consequences:!!!

    The YouTube link below should further illustrate what I mean.

    http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/real-house-saud/
    http://beforeitsnews.com/eu/2015/09/germany-chaos-descends-2590664.html
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:44pm
    A very thoughtful analysis, Patriot, but we are dealing with yobbos here who have no sense of history nor an ability to look at themselves with any honesty.
    Not Amused
    16th Oct 2015
    2:29pm
    I don't like how the government/police have adopted softly softly language. Is this because they are scared that if they criticise the incompatibles there will be another killing in retaliation? It feels like they are all too scared to be as publicly disparaging of them as they are of any other badly behaved group. It's a type of blackmail - be nice to us or cop more of the same. A minority group that is tactically getting on top all over the world. Our decision makers won't accept that our immigration policy has caused far too much diversity/division. We are effectively being told how to speak, how to react, appease and and patronise.

    And can they please stop describing these perpetrators as "radicalised". Call them what they would call white Australians i.e. under 18: "dangerous juvenile criminals" and over 18: "dangerous criminals" because that's what they are and throw in traitors. And where is the public apology from the supposed supervising parents of the criminal who shot dead an innocent Australian family man going about his employment? Nowhere to be seen or heard aye.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    3:37pm
    All about "restoring calm". Nothing to do with fixing the problem. That is just too difficult.
    So the game goes on and the public becomes fair game for a community which has been flexing it's muscle and now outright laughs at us and our impotent politicians who are too gutless to act as they should.
    Maks you want to immigrate.
    TREBOR
    16th Oct 2015
    8:31pm
    Nah - it's SOP to play down any threat and thus lull the potential perp into a mistake through believing he/she is not under scrutiny etc.

    Never let your enemy know you're coming. In the history of warfare only twice has war been declared before hostilities commenced.
    Paulodapotter
    16th Oct 2015
    2:57pm
    I've never seen so much drivel as I have witnessed from the majority of the comments made. Marginalised youth exploited by fundamentalists has been around for as long as humans crawled out of their caves. Every religion on this earth has been used to further fundamentalist political aims. I don't have to draw you up a list. You can do that yourselves. We have to show as a truly multicultural society that we can be fundamentally inclusive. This is the only way that so called radicalisation can be combatted. All extra terrorsism laws will do is further marginalise an already seriously marginalised religious group. Not only must the rhetoric change, but extremist anti-muslim groups should be treated no better than terrorists themselves as they are perpetrators of the problems we face with marginalised youth today. People making anti-muslim comments in this blog are infinitely worse thatn those they denigrate. I say this as someone who has no religion.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    3:38pm
    This country has NEVER faced the current threat. Nothing to do with "marginalised youth". Everything to do with ideology and revolting against western culture.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    4:21pm
    Paulodapotter
    Australia is "Attacked & Conquered" from the inside and our politicians (in general) are promoting it.
    Terrorism is part of that equation, so it the TPP which MUST not be changed and so is the trade agreement with China.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    4:27pm
    Paulodapotter
    Australia is "Attacked & Conquered" from the inside and our politicians (in general) are promoting it.Terrorism is part of that equation, so it the TPP (which MUST not be PASSED) and so is the trade agreement with China.
    We are "Being SOLD OUT" by the GREEDY politicians to the GREEDY Corporations & Banksters!

    We have been asleep during the past 5 decades and LET IT HAPPEN.
    We now MUST - in no uncertain term - retain/gain the power that we are supposed to have under the Australian Constitution & EXERT THAT POWER for the GOOD of the NATION rather than to SERVICE the BENEFIT & GREED of the ELITE. !!!
    bebby
    16th Oct 2015
    4:32pm
    Migrants come to Australia fully aware it is a secular nation. They then openly disparage our way of life while taking advantage of our generosity and benefits.
    Forget trying to change our "marginalised youth" as they are only practising what there parents have taught them. There is a simple solution, if you don't like our way of life, leave.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    4:37pm
    And should. ASAP. Passports immediately revoked.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    4:41pm
    bebby

    So right.
    We should NOT be FORCED to accept change of our community & "Way of Life".
    If we accept the changes as an improvement to our quality of Life such is called a contribution and is/should be welcomed.

    INDEED, if we do not "Want to change" and Migrants are not willing to adapt/adopt to our "way of Life" they should leave.
    If not, we should return them to their country of origin where the conditions & Communities suit their desired circumstances.

    I believe that Australians do not want them here and they are obviously not happy here. So this is the best solution for either party whilst preserving the Integrity of Australian communities!
    Yorkie
    16th Oct 2015
    5:06pm
    Paulodapotter - 'People making anti-Muslim comments in this blog are infinitely worse than those they denigrate'! Do you realise how ridiculous you sound? At least the people commenting here do not espouse chopping people's heads off, killing the kafir and rising up as Muslims to take over the world, as The Prophet commands in the Qur'an. Islamists like Man Monis and the youth that murdered Mr Cheng in Parramatta are a very real threat to this country and Australians will not be shouted down, because they have an opinion contrary to yours. Most right minded people do not want to see Australia turned into a Middle Eastern battleground and welcome extra measures to prevent this cancer from spreading.
    Anonymous
    16th Oct 2015
    6:52pm
    I have to admire someone who so publicly parades their own ignorance and foolishness. Have you read the Quran and Hadith? (I suspect not.) Are you aware of the havoc being caused by Muslims worldwide? The only drivel here is coming from you. Stop embarrassing yourself.
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    6:56pm
    You have your opinion and the freedom to say it. That is fundamental to our society. I however do not agree with your comments. Islam will not afford you the same freedom, just remember that. Even now our freedom of speech is being taken slowly from us to fit in with the Islam propaganda. Again I say NO to Islam and all for which it stands.
    BnT
    16th Oct 2015
    7:13pm
    bebby and Patriot have it right. Years ago we had a policy of integration. If you were coming to our county, you adopted or at least respected our way of life and integrated into our society. But as far back as the 80s. I can remember visiting a primary school in a major regional NSW centre (as a guidance counsellor) and having to work with one group or 6 & 7 year olds at one time, and another group of the same age at a different time because they were segregated in their classes and playground / lunchtimes as one group were Croation and the other were Serbian. Back then, I was astounded that these groups were allowed to influence our state education structure to that extent. Well as many of you have said, its only got worse. How many of our beliefs, ethics, values do we have to forgo or change just to accommodate people who disagree with them? The complaint about Christmas lights being publicly displayed (Townsville or Cairns?) because Christmas is not a part of this religion....
    Now we have a youth in Melbourne about to be sentenced because he it was suspected he was going to leave Australia to fight with ISIS. Let him go and don't let him back. At least we are not going to be paying for his keep for the next "x" years or for the programs to try and rehabilitate him into our society.
    As far as I am concerned, you are welcome to come and live in my country BUT don't tell me to change it, to drop my beliefs, or tell me I'm wrong or must cover myself up (I'm female) or ignore me when I am your boss (because I'm female) etc...if you can't live with and respect us for who we are, then don't come or if you are here already, go home....I'm tired of having to change the way I do something to accommodate someone who thinks I have no value or follow the wrong beliefs or whatever....AND I'm very tired of my government spending my hard earned tax dollars on those who do not deserve them and who are making it harder for the average Australian to get a job, live in the area they want to, walk or drive safely down the street etc. Did you know that the USA has had in excess of 300 multiple shootings this year alone? Look at Sydney....where are we heading?
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    8:12pm
    All of the above comments tell a compelling tale. POLITICIANS OF ALL PERSUASION TAKE NOTE.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:34pm
    True Patriot, but the rest of what's been written by Mick et al is unbelievable doggy's do do!
    Adrianus
    18th Oct 2015
    11:23am
    Paulodaplotter, you may be right but who amongst us wants to endure 100 years of pain and suffering to test your theory. Our defence force is preparing for a 100 year war both here and abroad.

    16th Oct 2015
    4:23pm
    There is only one thing to do kick the bloody lot of them out of the country and don"t bring any in problem solved.
    Patriot
    16th Oct 2015
    4:28pm
    Theoretically not a bad idea.
    Unfortunately, I think that the practicalities are somewhat more difficult!
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    4:47pm
    Patriot is right. Just consider the likes of Sarah Hanson-Young and those who voted her in as well as the army of immigration lawyers. There would be great unrest trying to remove those who seek to destroy our way of life.
    The only way to achieve a sensible outcome would be to find a solution and then have a bipartisan approach in parliament. That way those who seek to destroy us (including the do gooders) have nowhere to go other than the media. Game over.

    16th Oct 2015
    5:31pm
    Deport them all back to the Middle East and let them wallow in the pig sty which they made of their homeland. We don't need the trash here.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    8:17pm
    Most of the problematic youth were born in this country. So what do you do? Deport the whole family? The kids for being unAustralian/terrorists and the parents for teaching them to hate Australians? Welcome to politics.
    TREBOR
    16th Oct 2015
    8:35pm
    I've argued that elsewhere, mick, with regard to the fools who rush off to fight with IS etc. Islam under the Islamist concept is a 'kingdom of Allah', and has no territorial boundaries etc. Essentialy is is a spiritual state without borders. As such offering allegiance to this foreign state means you have forfeited your Australian citizenship.

    Simple enough to me.
    buby
    17th Oct 2015
    1:13pm
    i think those children should be seperated from their parents, so they are not taught bad habits, teach them english, and tell the parents if they behave themselves, they might be allowed a visit or two from the children. Because i'm sure they teach their children NOT to assimulate........we really do have to becareful what those children are too, for once in australia, they are our future. Do We want Wars. NO. Those pollies of ours, really need to rethink What the heck their doing!!!!!
    maxchugg
    17th Oct 2015
    2:15pm
    Buby wants the radical children separated from their parents. Then, a few years hence, history will be revised, another "stolen generation" myth will arise, and compensation will be demanded. The fact that national security will be ignored, the children will have been separated from their children because of Islamophobia.
    There is only one way out of the mess that has been created. Bring back the crime of treason and permit magistrates to remove from our society those who refuse to respect our laws.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:36pm
    So what's changed, maxchugg. The police will now jail you for just suspicion alone. You really want that? Fear has won hands down.
    maxchugg
    18th Oct 2015
    3:26pm
    Paulodapotter, what is the cause of the fear that has won hands down, as you claim?
    Nothing to do with people being killed by suicide bombers? Nothing to do with people whose attitude to people they deem to be infidel is identical to the attitude of the Nazis to the Jews?
    If the police arrest anyone on suspicion alone, they have a very short time in which to produce evidence justifying the detention or to release the person concerned.
    What has changed? The arrival of global terrorism coupled with demands for the introduction of barbaric laws into every society. Masses of refugees fleeing for their lives as one fanatical group of terrorists fights another.
    Honestly, where would you rather live right now, Australia or Syria?
    TREBOR
    16th Oct 2015
    8:12pm
    The Israelis used to train fifteen year old boys as fighter pilots because they are younger, faster, and their eye/brain/hand co-ordination can be trained into a proper pattern very quickly. Just look at the video gamers these days. They also think they are invulnerable, and I'm certain that 15 yo thought that he was invulnerable under the protection of
    Allah etc.

    Throughout the centuries many soldiers etc have been teenagers, so this is not a new thing.

    The answer? I have no real answer other than to say 'ban them'.

    I've lived among Middle Eastern people and the Christians are a very civilised lot compared to the Muslims. Not all.. but many Muslims are simply bad news and easily aroused to fanaticism and violence.
    MICK
    16th Oct 2015
    8:27pm
    Invincible?
    Your observation regarding many muslims may not be popular but it is accurate. The civilisation is indeed very backward (generalisation!) and this leads to being easily led. It is.
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    11:56pm
    Can anybody tell me one good thing Islam and its followers have brought not only to Australia but the rest of The Western World. They only cause trouble wherever they go. China and Russia do not tolerate them they know.
    Paulodapotter
    16th Oct 2015
    11:59pm
    China does not tolerate Christianity unless it is headed by one of their own communist approved Bishops.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:01am
    Before the collapse of the Iron Curtain, Christianity was illegal in the USSR. You are so ignorant.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:06am
    Paulodapotter. Yes I know that. But as any educated person would know Islam is not a religion but a political party and Russia and China see that party as a threat.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:06am
    Paulodapotter. Yes I know that. But as any educated person would know Islam is not a religion but a political party and Russia and China see that party as a threat.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:40am
    Oh, so Islam is NOT a religion now, but a political party. Are they contesting the next elections by any chance? The only thing we have to fear is fear itself. Existing laws making enciting racial hatred should be applied to shut down anti-muslim rallies before we irrevocably divide out communties. The leaders should be fined and, in the worst cases, jailed.
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    11:34pm
    Let me make it clear. When the inevitable does happen The Government of the day and most politicians will never admit they made the wrong decision. Instead they will fall back on the Australian people (voters) and declare this is what you asked us to do as your Government. So keep lobbying now to get Islam banned in Australia. Islam is not a religion, anyone with their eyes wide open can see that, it is a political party itself and one that's main aim is to bring Sharia Law to this Country. Again NO TO ISLAM.
    Paulodapotter
    16th Oct 2015
    11:45pm
    And so the drivel continues. You have no sense of history. What you espouse is almost identical to the technique used by the National Socialists in Germany against Jewry. You are playing right into the hands of the terrorists that pose the minimum of threat to our way of life. You are so blinded by your fear, xenophobia and racism, you will be your own worst enemies. I fear more from you than I do from any terrorist threat. Humans are doomed to repeat their stupidity and I would say that you deserve all you get. Unfortunately, you won't be around to reep what you sew, but your children will. Very sad.
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    11:48pm
    Think again. You are very wrong.
    niemakawa
    16th Oct 2015
    11:48pm
    Think again. You are very wrong.
    Paulodapotter
    16th Oct 2015
    11:55pm
    Unfortunately for you, I am at least well educated enought to know you are no thinker. However, nothing I can say will ever change your ignorance. I will never tolerate racism and nor should any decent human being.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:00am
    I was waiting for that word "racism" to appear, you are the first one to introduce it here. Well as an educated person you should know that Islam or Muslim are not races. Think again.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:06am
    Then why are anti-jews referred to as racists. Races are often defined by their religion. You can't weasel your way out of this one. Semantics are always the shelter used by the intellectually challenged.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:12am
    Well I am sorry that you are intellectually challenged. You made the biggest mistake confusing race with religion. As for Judaism it encompasses religion and race. Islam does not. Best you take a rest before you do yourself any more 'intellectual" damage.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:13am
    However, I did not refer to anti-muslim sentiment as racism alone. It merely incorporates racism when linked to words such as Arab, Afgan, Pakistinian, etc. However, I did use the word xenophobia which refers to fear of foreign cultures, in which religion plays a significant influence.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:20am
    YOu are probably totally unware that Sharia Law is simply Old Testament. Judaism, Christianity and Islam originates from the same source - the Bible. When you attack Islam, you are also attacking your own fundabmental beliefs. I suspect you have not studied comparative religion which I had the benefit of doing. You will discover that the 10 commandments are shared by all three religions. It is simply expressed in different terms and the Bible is called the Torah or the Koran depending on what language you speak. Of course they have been rewritten so many times by so many nationalities that the prose/poetry has changed. King James did that to the Bible and a lot was changed from the original Hebrew. Ah, but why do I bother?
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:22am
    Fear of foreign cultures. So if you believe that then Muslims fear the Western culture, since they will not accept it and want to introduce their own laws at the expense of other cultures. Therefore using your understanding you must consider Islam as "xenophobia"
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:29am
    Illogical rubbish! They came to this country for a better life and have, except for a miniscule minority, accepted it with gratitude. However, if you persist in marginalising them, you will breed discontent and hate. You are obviously consumed by hate probably out of your irrational fear.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:31am
    Do you really believe, that Muslims are going to take over this country? Of course you don't. You'd have to be psychotic to believe that!
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:33am
    Unless Indonesia invades us of course. However, it's more likely to be China if we ever refuse to supply them with our abundant resources, like we did Japan.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:35am
    If I fear anything at all it is your complacency and not having a full understanding of the impending threat that is on our doorstep. Your opinion is welcome but I will never agree with it, likewise you will not mine. I have never use the word hate or racism in any of my comments, but you have been able to introduce both. Enough said.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:44am
    It's implied in everything you write, fella. Do you remember the red under the bed? You would have been saying the same thing then. Look out the commies are coming. Then it was wogs, dagos, spics blah, blah, blah. Complacent my foot! I'm watching you like a hawk!
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:46am
    We helped murder 3 million Vietnamese on the basis of our fear of communism. We actually believed they were going to pour down into Australia. Fear is what kills.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    12:48am
    Now I know you are really on the back foot. You can imply what ever you like, but again I will say you brought the words hate and racism into the conversation, now that is fact. Why are you watching me like a hawk, are you a spy?
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:55am
    We've had two lone wolf attacks since 9-11 even with our provocation by invading two Middle Eastern countries. One was perpetrated by a nutter (and most likely one of those killed was by a policeman's stray bullet) and one by a marginalised youth got at by a couple of marginalised and harassed fundamentalists. Now we are chasing our tails like a chook with its head cut off. We are now fearful and confused. From where I stand, the terrorists have won and they've caught you hook, line and sinker.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    12:59am
    I'm always on the look out for trouble makers. People who target groups of people they percieve as different to themselves are people we should always watch carefully. That way we can at least have a chance to duck when the bullets start to fly.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    1:00am
    Nice try, but you know I have won this debate. Have a nice evening, whatever you have planned, hopefully you will wake up tomorrow with a clear mind. Anyway it has been interesting to see your point of view, but I will stick with my own all the same.
    Over and out!!
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    1:05am
    I'm going to a school reunion tomorrow. There'll be big crowd, Moslems, Christians, Jews, Buddists, Animists, athiests and individuals. We're all mates and that's what I value, you poor old scaredy cat.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    1:05am
    Good night!
    buby
    17th Oct 2015
    1:26pm
    Have a nice time at the reunion Paulo, HOpe there are no gun toting nutters there and you come home safely!!!

    17th Oct 2015
    4:22am
    @Mick

    "So what do you do for second generation terrorists?"

    Easy - 'deport' them with a one-way ticket to one of Australia's Antarctic Territories, such as Heard Island. Let them conduct jihad against the seals, sea-lions and penguins.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    8:20am
    Are we talking home grown 12 year old terrorists? Maybe it's their parents that need a smack on the bottom. Or maybe it's our inability to integrate them into our society. I made an educational film for the ABC some thirty years ago whose subject was integrating young immigrants into our society. It's just as relevant today as it was then. As soon as fundamentalism raises its ugly head, marginalised youth becomes its number one focus. We are slow learners.
    Sundays
    17th Oct 2015
    11:01am
    Interesting banter. Unfortunately Paulodapott things have changed over 30 years. I once lived in Lakemba (Sydney) which had a lot of Moslems, but we were all respectful. Nowadays it is an enclave, and it is a fact that a young Australian girl cannot walk around in shorts and summer top without been heckled or worse. It is reverse racism from people who will not accept our culture and have forgotten which country they are living in. I'd like it be different, but it is not.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:09pm
    A prime example of how marginalisation creates enclaves. Cultural groups band together when they find they are not able to integrate. This happened to the Chinese, our first mass migration experiment and later the Greeks, Italians and Vietnamese. They all integrate once they are accepted, intermarry and spread through society. Moslem immigrants are doing exactly what has come before and they will integrate as time moves on. Our challenge today, due to external threats, is to speed this process up. We seem to be doing everything possible to slow it down. The argument, "but this time it's different" is the same old banter trotted out by the same old yobbos.
    Dukki
    17th Oct 2015
    9:09am
    Children can be evil, as well as nice, just like anyone else, but evil as in evil. So I'm not surprised that 12 year olds as on the watch list, they are old enough to know right from wrong but not old enough to see all the ramifications that their actions will do.
    I believe that it is a conspiracy to undermine the he fabric of western worlds way of life, especially in Europe. So if we are to have refugees let's have the hristains that were persecuted by Dash n help them onto a better life. I've lived n worked over in the Middle East and nothing that they do has surprised me so far.
    MILA
    17th Oct 2015
    10:18am
    The Islamic Invasion is taking place wordl-wide: has happened in the past as history says it all. The only Islamics that contribute to mankind are the Emirates: the rest, want us to impose their arcaic/ignorant/disgusting ways to the rest of the world. Russia and China will handle them accordingly - in the manner they understand.
    As far as coming to Australia: what for?
    Radish
    17th Oct 2015
    1:48pm
    Western democracy is not compatible with the Muslim way of life unless they are willing to adapt.

    Obviously there are a great many who are not prepared to do this; if they do not like living in Australia (but do like our welfare) then the door is open for those people to leave. The Head Mufti said that himself...'if you dont like it leave'.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:13pm
    Absolute balderdash, Mila! Moslems are invading Moslem countries. Name a non-Moslem country being invaded by Moslems. Infinitely more Moslems are being slaughtered by Moslem terrorists than non-Moslems.
    Chris B T
    17th Oct 2015
    11:42am
    A leathal wapon does not know who handles it, age, gender, race and religon.
    The American's have fatalities outside of mass shootings because some child has fired a gun.
    The owner, supplier of weapon should be held accountable and charge with the same crime.
    The only excecption is a stolen weapon from a secure place.(OWNERS WEAPON)
    Hate crimes are alearnt behaviour, anyone can learn them.
    The very SAD PART IS THE UNDERAGED ARE GROOMED FOR THIS BEHAVIOUR, BECAUSE THEY ARE UNDERAGED our LAWS are weak/affraid of uppsetting a FEW.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:17pm
    More draconian laws will only exacerbate the problem. You're going to say, "Then how do we fix it?" The answer is simple. We have to inclusive, not exclusive. You're going to say, "But they don't want to integrate". Balderdash! They came here to integrate not to invade. We have to allow integration to happen. When was the last time you befriended a Moslem refugee?
    Chris B T
    17th Oct 2015
    9:12pm
    If you can read or understand English would be amazing.
    I have not IDENTIFIED any particular Group yet you HAVE.
    LAWS AND RESPONSIBILITY FOR ACTIONS.
    Don't bother doing anything is that YOUR POSITION.
    PLEASE READ AND DIGEST YOUR FEEBLE COMMENTS.
    I'm sure the POLICE see it differently
    Radish
    19th Oct 2015
    12:02pm
    We have a Middle Eastern Organised Crime Squad set up...we never had this before and a google search will see how much crime is being committed by those from the Middle East...drugs, importation of fire arms...you name it.

    Yes, they are integrating very well into our crime scene..no problem there at all it would appear!

    17th Oct 2015
    12:22pm
    @Paulo

    Muslims cannot be integrated into Australian society because Islam is fundamentally anti-democratic.
    Patriot
    17th Oct 2015
    12:32pm
    DrPolymath
    General consensus in Canberra seems to - unfortunately - disagree with your statement.
    They seem to feel that Muslims "Fit in Fine" and I can understand that because the CLOWNS we have in charge of our country are "Basically Undemocratic".

    They only adhere to the Australian Constitution when it suits them!!!

    So my solution is as follows: "Build a massive wall around Canberra (Nobody can get out!) and make sure that ALL (Except a few who do not support importation of Muslims) politicians are enclosed within and then fill the rest of the space up with Muslims.
    THEY WANT THEM - THEY SHOULD HAVE THEM !!!
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:19pm
    Moslems have been here since settlement. Afghans being some of the first. They have fully integrated.
    Abby
    18th Oct 2015
    8:59am
    Yes I agree with you Patriot
    The 800 muslims from Afgan last year were relocated to form en enclave in Newcastle ...
    none to ACT. I must ask why are these men not fighting in the army in Afganastan instead of being on the dole in Newcastle.
    Anonymous
    18th Oct 2015
    6:53pm
    @Paulo

    "Moslems have been here since settlement. Afghans being some of the first. They have fully integrated."

    Really? The Battle of Broken Hill (1915) - Australia's first instance of Islamic terrorism - suggests otherwise.
    Radish
    17th Oct 2015
    1:41pm
    If they are able to fire a gun, plant a bomb, I don't care how old they are; they should be under surveillance.

    No matter what spin the government/politicians want to put on it the problem lies within the Muslim community.
    Radish
    17th Oct 2015
    1:43pm
    I have not seen or heard one word from the parents of the boy who shot and killed the gentleman as he left his workplace.

    If it was my son I would be expressing my deep remorse that a child of mine had committed such a hideous act.
    Not Amused
    17th Oct 2015
    5:16pm
    Radish this is exactly what I am wanting to know. Where are the parents - in hiding? Where is their public apology? If this were a real Australian family the parents would be making a statement expressing their distress and sorrow.
    The same goes for all the complaints from detention centre detainees. There reportedly have been dozens of claims of assault and rape. Are they assaulting and raping each other, and if so, would those individuals ever pass the character test anyway?
    Europe is sliding into the gutter. The citizens of their towns and cities have lost their cultures and their futures. Holland was amongst the first European country to experiment with the lovey-dovey multi-culti policy and now they openly regret their generosity because of what has become of them. Then we have seen (and followed to some extent) the UK's social decline. Let's stop it now. Only permit people to relocate here if they fit a pre-determined religious, social and cultural compatibility standard.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:23pm
    That's right Radish, and we should be helping them. Why don't you go and visit the parents. You might be surprised to learn they are as devastated as any parent would be of a child that committed such a crime. Would you be making yourself available to the media after your child committed such an offence knowing that society had you in their sights. Try some empathy and you might just come close to understanding.
    Patriot
    17th Oct 2015
    7:32pm
    Holland in the 60s imported "Migrant Workers" from many "Muslim Countries" as the work was available and the Dutch themselves were skilling themselves for more elaborate work. They performed much of the manual labours!

    As stated above, this is now "well & Truely" regretted as - indeed - Muslim families are far "Outbreeding" the Dutch and their numbers have now increased to such volume that they are dictating the direction of "General Life" of the country.
    Paulodapotter
    18th Oct 2015
    1:49am
    I have visited Holland and have ongoing contact there through friends. I'm afraid Patriot that your observations are incorrect which is unlike you. True that numbers have increased but they are not outbreeding the Dutch. They are the Dutch and like any multicultural society, life is inevitably influenced by other cultures. That's what is supposed to happen and what makes us Australian. Our society is constantly changing and I welcome those changes. What I can't stand are those who profess to be patriots by parroting that they want immigrants to conform to Australian norms. Well, I've got news for you. The norm is change and I embrace it. If you don't like it then leave!
    Patriot
    18th Oct 2015
    9:02am
    Paulodapotter
    I have not lived there since the early 70s and can only reflect on "The Trends" I saw happening then and what I glean from the web.
    Thanks for your input. I will enter that in my DataBase and do some further research!
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    4:51pm
    The overwhelming number of comments posted here shows that the majority believe that Islam is not compatible with our ( Western) society. The feeling is the same across Europe. Yet Governments everywhere persist with allowing more and more immigration of followers of Islam. Governments are at odds with the majority and will pay dearly for this.
    Radish
    17th Oct 2015
    5:10pm
    The Islamisation of Europe is inevitable. Muslim families have many children; westerners do not. Breeding will ensure the eventual outcome which is the long term goal....
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:28pm
    It's because governments are only too aware of the mob mentality. They are aware how dangerous it is and how it inevitably leads to bloodshed, discontent and slaughter of minority groups. To say Islamisation of Europe is inevitable smacks of that very mentality. I would say the opposite is true and atheism will continue to be the major influence.
    Radish
    17th Oct 2015
    7:34pm
    I would say ISIS is doing a very good job of killing off minority groups...either accept their way or you are dead...if that is not so, why are so many fleeing to Europe.
    Paulodapotter
    18th Oct 2015
    1:52am
    There are a lot more factors than your narrow observations reveal Radish. Remember, there's a civil war going on in Syria. People are being slaughtered by their own government, rebels, ISIS, yanks and even Australians. They've got a hell of a lot of reasons to run.
    Radish
    18th Oct 2015
    5:33pm
    My empathy lies with the family of the man who was shot in the back of the head b a coward.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:08pm
    A prime example of how marginalisation creates enclaves. Cultural groups band together when they find they are not able to integrate. This happened to the Chinese, our first mass migration experiment and later the Greeks, Italians and Vietnamese. They all integrate once they are accepted, intermarry and spread through society. Moslem immigrants are doing exactly what has come before and they will integrate as time moves on. Our challenge today, due to external threats, is to speed this process up. We seem to be doing everything possible to slow it down. The argument, "but this time it's different" is the same old banter trotted out by the same old yobbos.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    7:43pm
    Integration means accepting the Laws and Customs of the Country in which a person lives. There are groups that blatantly ignore some of our laws replacing them with their own. This is fact. When Muslims demonstrate publicly that they will make no attempt to introduce Sharia Law here, then I may feel differently. So far I have seen no evidence of this.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    7:50pm
    They do that on a daily basis. Sharia Law is not an option for all Moslems living in Australia with very few exceptions. A kid with a revolver and a madman with a shotgun being examples. Muslims have been demonstrating their loyalty to this country since our forebears invaded the place. Moslems died for us in WWI, WWII, Vietnam and they serve in our armed services today. You should be on incitement charges, niemakawa.
    niemakawa
    17th Oct 2015
    8:11pm
    You should be on treason charges, more like it. Anyway that is my last word to you on this subject. We are poles apart on this topic and to exchange further comments would serve no purpose. So kindly refrain from doing so as your comments are inflammatory and insult the majority of people who love their Country. Have a nice day.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    9:42pm
    Please continue your behaviour so that others can see you for what you are. Your lies hidden behind your false patriotism speaks loudly of what you are.
    Paulodapotter
    17th Oct 2015
    10:16pm
    Will terrorist acts by younger children become more commonplace? That's an interesting question which is dependent on several factors. First, if we, as a society, continue to marginalise Moslems, you can bet on it. Second, if terrorist activities continue to expand overseas and we continue to intervene militarily, this will put more pressure on terrorists to exploit marginalised Moslems, particularly the young who are the most vulnerable. Third, if they see their parents under pressure by ultra right wing bigots, they will translate that as a universal attitude by society. They will feel justied anger and will retaliate if they themselves feel a sense of alienation from their peers. This whole question requires a social solution, not a punitive one. Punitive action will exacerbate an already raw nerve. We need to assist Moslem groups to deal with child radicalisation, not to further alienate them. Moslems are no different to anyone else on a purely human level and there is no substantive evidence to suggest otherwise. Like all religions, their religion is the religion of peace, but like all religions it can be exploited for power political purposes. To say that Australian Moslems want to take over Australia and turn it into a strict Sharia Law society is a blatant unsubstantiated lie. Those that perpetrate that lie are exploiting fear and loathing among the ignorant and intellectually vulnerable. At the reunion of my old schoolmates today, without any encouragement by me, I heard several comments decrying the tone of our society in their treatment and attitudes towards Moslems and refugees generally. I am heartened by this as I genuinely thought after reading the majority of the blogs in this blogspot that this was mainstream attitude. It is not. The majority of thinking Aussies are ashamed of the behaviour of our country over the last 10 years or so and, quite frankly, embarrassed to call themselves Australian when travelling overseas. I feel so sorry for all those who died in wars to make this country a better place. If they could see the behaviour of the our bigotted minority, ....
    geomac
    18th Oct 2015
    12:07am
    When medical staff can get two years jail for reporting sexual and physical abuse of women and children detainees nothing would surprise me. The teenager who killed and was in turn killed recently was not on any watch list so it smacks of a political stunt to me. When these rare killings get to one tenth of women fatalities from male partners or ex partners then I might think these laws might have justification.
    Paulodapotter
    18th Oct 2015
    1:03am
    Well said!
    Patriot
    18th Oct 2015
    8:48am
    geomac
    Most of the times it takes a disaster/calamity for people to "change course" into a new direction where normally they would never have gone.
    Let's examine history to see if we can confirm such a radical statement:
    1 The Port Arthur massacre enabled John Howard to remove the guns from the HONEST people in Australian society. Many Aust people are still trying to prove that this was a “Set Up”. However, the Aust Govt does not allow them to!
    2 9/11 is suspected - at worst - to be a CIA inside job and - at best - an attack that American intelligence & Government promoted/allowed to happen
    3 The "Weapons of Mass Destruction" were never found as the American Govt & CIA knew they were not there. It was a "Blatant Lie". However, combined with 9/11, the American Public allowed the military campaign to destroy Iraq.
    4 Lybia was destroyed on the pretence that Gaddaffi was a dictator! It is now believed that the "Unrest" was started by NGOs funded by the CIA! Lybia is now in "Total Disarray, People are 1,000,000% worse of that under Gadaffi and "THE OIL" is now administered by the USofA or one of their vassals!
    5 The "Gulf of Tonkin" incident convinced the American people to go to war with Vietnam. It has recently been admitted (by the USofA) to be a LIE
    6 WW-II - Pearl Harbour - American Intelligence knew days before that Japan would attack the USofA naval fleet. They just let it happen in order to convince a reluctant American public to enter WW-II.
    7 WW-I The Lusitania not only carried passengers by also transporting six million rifle cartridges and more than 50 tons of shrapnel shells (and more). Whilst Germany warned the USofA on several occasions that the ship would be sunk, these were ignored and left Germany with little choice.
    8 Burning down of the Reichtag in Bonn (1933) was an inside job which lifted Hitler to power in Germany
    9 What about the Ukraine (MH17) & Syria. The USofA is certainly attempting to provoke Russia & China into was by continuously referring to their Nuclear Arsenal. Syria - of course - is the 2nd largest "Oil Rich State" on the planet currently.

    “And There's MORE” - But this should do for starters!!!
    Human “Lives & Suffering” just do not seem to matter or am I seeing this wrong???

    As far as Russia is concerned: Just go to Google and enter "Russia + military bases" and you'll see how the Russian boundaries with other countries a LIGNED with military bases.
    Only one problem, these bases ALL belong to the USofA & its Western Allies. Or should I - like Paul Craig Roberts - call them vassals).
    So who is the aggressor? Who wants to "Play God"????

    Australia certainly is a "Duty bound Vassal of the USofA" as it has (and IS) involved in many of these Global Conflicts which TOTALLY CONTRAVENE United Nations policies.
    IF (and it can conclusively be proven) the above is true why would we expect that Australia and the rest of the Western World does NOT receive ANY FALLOUT from our actions.
    ACTIONS invoke a suitable REACTION What you RESIST usually PERSIST

    And finally, did I as a patriotic Australia miss something ???
    Did our Government ASK US if we wanted to BOMB the CRAP out of Syria or did they - as a few individuals - just decide to "Go & do IT"???

    ARE WE LIVING IN A DEMOCRACY OR A DICTATORSHIP ???
    Abby
    18th Oct 2015
    9:09am
    Geoff
    What you say is quite incorrect ... in fact the reporting sexual and physical abuse of women and children detainees IS REQUIRED by the medical staff but through the correct channels and not sell their stories to some of the distorted media reports we get.
    niemakawa
    18th Oct 2015
    3:40am
    I would like a Muslim to make a comment. Please feel free to engage is an open discussion.
    Open means that some will not agree with you.
    geomac
    18th Oct 2015
    1:57pm
    The idea that a 14-year-old could be subject to house arrest for 12 months, based on secret evidence in a secret hearing, is impossible to reconcile with the values and principles which, until recently, were regarded as basic to this country's character and identity.

    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-opinion/terror-laws-extreme-laws-an-attack-on-what-we-hold-dear-20151015-gkanjm.html#ixzz3ostsYX4z
    Patriot
    18th Oct 2015
    4:37pm
    just read "aldous huxley - animal farm" and you'll get ALL the answers you need !!!!
    Running "True to the story Line", aren't we????
    Patriot
    18th Oct 2015
    4:57pm
    https://www.getup.org.au/campaigns/refugees/bring-her-back/bring-abyan-back-to-australia--3?t=qZg0WfQqR&utm_campaign=URGENT%3A+Abyan+needs+our+help&utm_content=10525&utm_medium=email&utm_source=blast

    I have few words for the issue to which the above link relates other than: "No matter whether we prefer them to settle in Australia or not is a matter of debate which MUST be conducted in a Dignified Manner and is LONG OVERDUE. However, the woman involved is a "Human Being" and has feelings & Emotions! She is NOT an InAnimate Discarded Object on some deserted beach and deserved more Dignified & Humane treatment no matter what the ultimate consequences".

    If we allow those who represent US in Canberra allow to "Get Away" with UTTER CRAP like this we are of "The Same ILK and deserve to be treated like such"!

    Wonder why some of these guys HATE us??? I don't!
    DEPLORABLE
    niemakawa
    18th Oct 2015
    8:35pm
    Not surprised at all. That's a result of his upbringing I suppose.
    Gino
    19th Oct 2015
    12:11pm
    I totally agree with these young boys to be on the terror watch list. At there age they know what's right or wrong and I think when they turn eighteen send them back to the country they came from
    Radish
    19th Oct 2015
    2:29pm
    I "strongly" urge people to read a book called "Infidel" written by Ayaan Hirsi Ali...it is her life story. I am currently reading it myself.

    Eyes will certainly be opened as to what it is like to grow up a Muslim woman and to go on and renounce it. She fights for the rights of Muslim women and her life is in such jeopardy she travels everywhere with body guards and armoured cars.

    I do not need to spell out who wants her killed.
    geomac
    19th Oct 2015
    3:42pm
    At age 12 or 14 its most likely they were born in Australia Gino. Its all a ploy to satisfy people like yourself Gino, smoke and mirrors.
    Radish
    Body guards and armoured cars ? Must be a profitable lifestyle this book writing with so many hungry to read and agree with the author.
    wiki
    On 16 May Hirsi Ali resigned from Parliament after admitting that she had lied on her asylum application. She gave a press conference,[58] saying that, although she felt it was wrong to be granted asylum under false pretences, the facts had been publicly known since 2002, when they had been reported in the media and in one of her publications. She also restated her claim of seeking asylum to prevent a forced marriage, although some of her relatives had denied that on the Zembla programme. Her stated reason for resigning immediately was the news that the Minister would strip her of her Dutch citizenship.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayaan_Hirsi_Ali

    Interesting life and changing attitudes and nationalities.
    Radish
    19th Oct 2015
    5:30pm
    And that proves what? Of course Wiki is absolutely the truth...anyone can edit things on there...I can if I wanted to do so. Of course her detractors will do all they can to discredit her.

    When you turn away from Islam you are regarded as an Infidel and we know what happens to them.

    For every negative comment I am sure I could come up with a positive.

    Ms Ali was named by Time Magazine as one of their 100 most influential people of 2005, Readers Digest European of the Year. Has received numerous human rights awards and now lives and works in the US.

    This woman has her life on the line trying to seek change. People can choose to believe what they like about her.
    geomac
    19th Oct 2015
    7:35pm
    Radish
    Did you read wiki ? It would appear you did not from your comments.

    19th Oct 2015
    5:36pm
    Not shocked at all. UK has had children from age 10 able to answer up to law as they are old enough to know right from wrong. And of course many incidents of child soldiers in Africa, many of these imported here as refugees and when they act out as they will being Muslim, we get the blame from their 'moderate' community leaders asking for even more money as usual. When will we learn?
    Radish
    19th Oct 2015
    5:47pm
    Read Enoch Powell's "Rivers of Blood" speech BV.
    niemakawa
    19th Oct 2015
    5:53pm
    Fair comment. Problem is Governments all over the Western 'World" seemingly have a love affair with all things Islam. I have many friends in Europe and they tell me things will only get worse in the coming months. Many arriving in Europe and young men and unaccompanied children, so rightly most Europeans know what will inevitably happen. The Governments in Europe are at loggerheads in knowing how to deal with the 'Refugee Crisis" as they like to call it, but most of all they ignore the pleas from their own citizens to control the "situation".

    19th Oct 2015
    5:56pm
    If admin leave it up read this story re Saudi Arabia and their laws and see if this is what we should be importing.
    http://nocompulsion.com/islams-useful-idiots-3/
    Bookmark the link tells us what our more left wing media dont want us to know. And Sweden that always held out and up as best of the welcoming socialist countries taking in Muslims. Story on Compulsion also. Go to home and read it too. Sickening.
    niemakawa
    19th Oct 2015
    6:05pm
    Yes I have friends in Sweden, they have spoken to me about what is happening there.
    The whole of Europe is now under threat. Australian (Governments) are far too complacent on the issue, they will wake up soon enough.
    niemakawa
    19th Oct 2015
    6:32pm
    Also Val , Gert Wilders, the overwhelming favourite to become PM of Holland at their next elections, is due to give a talk in Perth tomorrow. It will be interesting to here about the reaction. YLC will more than likely run an article on it, as well.
    Radish
    19th Oct 2015
    6:50pm
    If Islam is a religion of peace, heaven help us when they decide otherwise!
    geomac
    19th Oct 2015
    7:44pm
    Gert Wilders ? A half caste peroxide blond racist giving a talk in Australia ?
    Religion of peace Radish like catholics and protestants in Nth Ireland. Like child sexual abusers in every continent. Like apartheid murders by Jewish Israel. Even Bhuddist in Thailand and Cambodia have a heavy load concerning murder and genocide.
    Name me one major religion that does not have extremists Radish ? I cannot think of any.
    niemakawa
    19th Oct 2015
    7:55pm
    "A half caste peroxide blond racists". UM
    geomac
    19th Oct 2015
    8:19pm
    When speaking to the clique speak their language kawa. Racist not racists.
    Radish
    20th Oct 2015
    6:54pm
    calling someone a half caste is considered racist and has been for quite a long time.
    Radish
    20th Oct 2015
    6:56pm
    I am Australian and I only care what is happening in this country re extremism and at the moment there are only one lot of extremists causing trouble.
    geomac
    20th Oct 2015
    9:27pm
    Radish I too am australian and the reclaim australia and similar types are against every Australian value I know. Thankfully they are a very small minority but noisy. You can add that lot to extremists causing trouble.
    Scrivener
    20th Oct 2015
    12:53pm
    I am going to withhold my ire other than to say while we normalise violence in our culture every Saturday afternoon at one football code or other and then suffer the consequences of revved up airheads beating up their wives it will also be hard to stamp out Islamic fundamentalism. Yes, many Muslims are here because they too fled normalised violence in their own countries - but we did not have Islamic terrorists of ANY age before they came here - for whatever reason.
    Their children MUST go to normal Australian schools - not Madrasas or suffer the poison of fundamentalist teaching in Mosques. Period.
    geomac
    20th Oct 2015
    1:51pm
    I would add to that that public funding of any faith based schools or indeed any private schools be greatly reduced. Let then fund their choice of education. Public schools are for everyone. If you don,t want to use a train there is no govt funding for you to finance buying a car.
    CowboyJoe
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:48pm
    Hollywood loves guns when they are able to utilize them in films.

    Hollywood hates guns when they are able to be used legally by commoners.

    Hollywood ignores guns when the homicide rate in Chicago's drug war approach and occasionally exceed the death toll in Iraq.
    BB1
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:30am
    I don't care whether they are 10, 12, 14, or over 18. Whether they are 'European/English" Australians or from the Arab world. No matter what their ethnicity is, if they are a threat to Australia then they deserve to be watched and for authorities to act on information received quickly.
    No mucking around on this one.
    If they want to destroy the Australian way of life then they deserved to be watched.
    migmag
    23rd Oct 2015
    1:29pm
    I have read most of the comments here and have never heard so many complaints about "do-gooders", phrases such as "cancer within our society" even a few complaints about "Greens". Anyone would think we had all been brainwashed into not thinking for ourselves. There are some genuine concerns raised here about Moslems, Islam, ISIS but can't we higher the debate and perhapse read/listen to some good quality news sources?
    rosie
    23rd Oct 2015
    6:44pm
    I normally would not post about this but not one of you show our so called aussie tolerance and mate ship here..so ashamed of you all...in the 50s 60s and 70s aussies hounded immigrants from Italy and then Greece...my mum a 4th generation Australian married my dad an Italian....I took after my dads side of family...my sister and brother mums side peaches and cream complexion and freckles..my life was hell as a child..called awful names and told to go back were I belonged..followed from school and made to feel afraid...yes children learn from their parents dont they..all same issues as now..its all about immigration there are only 500,000 muslims to 23,000,000 million australians....muslims have been here since 1870s...I have a photo of their first mosque...I live in a suburb were we have one of the highest concentration of muslims...Never had a problem with anyone of them...I know some who celebrate christmas so their children dont feel they are missing out..take and give christmas cards..by tarring them all with the same brush you are doing to me as a child to them all over again...I find very little tolerance in this country now...only small percentage of muslims follow sharia law and dont want it...This current government until recently has fostered an attitude that muslims are untrustworthy...are most likely the ones who will break our laws...but they also dont want refugess and by doing this implied threat they justify your attitudes..also with these travelling groups who have no tolerance towards other people who follow different beliefs going over all of Australia to protest on any issues concerning our muslim communities.. which is causing harm to our country...making it impossible for people to be rational ...our muslim community feel unsafe in Australia..many are second and third generation also...my 76 year old mother had to intervene when shopping last week a young man followed two muslim women and heckled them and they were afraid...my mother told him to go away and grow up...this is not an Australia I want to live in but you all encourage this with your posts here...