Refugees to be resettled in the US following Government deal

Refugees on Nauru and Manus Island will be resettled in the US.

Young refugee being given a hand

In a deal struck with the US to resettle refugees currently held in processing centres on Nauru and Manus Island, the Federal Government is hoping it’s one step closer to clearing both facilities.

The deal would see those currently in the processing centres offered a new life in the US, although the exact number has not yet been confirmed. It will not apply to any new asylum seeker boat arrivals. Those on Nauru will be prioritised, with a team from the US Homeland Security arriving in Australia this week to begin the vetting process. For those who do not accept the offer to be resettled in the US, a 20-year-visa for Nauru or return to their country of origin are the alternatives.

With fears that news of the deal will encourage more people to try and make it to the shores of Australia, a stringent defence operation is now underway. "We recognise that people smugglers will seek to exploit this announcement," Mr Turnbull said.

Immigration Minister Peter Dutton said Nauru would remain as a processing centre under the Government’s border protection policy. "We still rely on regional processing, which is why Nauru will remain in its current status forever," he said.

Opposition Leader Bill Shorten welcomed the deal, "Labor would be hypocritical if we didn't welcome this because this is the very thing we wanted with the Malaysia solution," he said.

However, not everyone is satisfied that this is the best outcome for all those held in the processing centres, with the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR) saying that a solution must be found for all held, not just refugees. UNHCR's external relations officer, Catherine Stubberfield said, "It's important that they don't remain in Nauru and Papua New Guinea, where they've stayed for far too long and indeed languished in limbo.

"There's still a large number of vulnerable people who in fact have been immensely damaged by these arrangements and who equally will need a solution at some point."

Women and children and family groups on Nauru will be given priority over men currently on Manus Island the Government has said.

Read more at ABC.net.au

Opinion: Shame won’t end with resettlement

For those being resettled in the US, the Federal Government and the people of Australia, the shame of Manus Island and Nauru will live on for years to come.

For the last four years those who have fled their countries due to war, poverty or the need to provide a better life for their children, have been subjected to conditions that we here in Australia can't comprehend. And let’s be clear, we’re not talking about people smugglers, or those who are illegally trying to get to Australia, these are people who have been subjected to horrors in their own country that simply would not happen here in Australia.

Rather than showing them compassion and opening our hearts and minds to the better lives we could help them have, they have instead been forced to live in tents without any indication of how long it would be before their fate was known. We have all heard the tales of horror, of beatings, rape and humiliation to which they have been subjected, yet still we are expected to take some pride in the fact we have signed a deal with the US to resettle these poor unfortunates. All we are doing is simply washing our hands of the problem.

And with President-Elect Donald Trump planning to deport 2 to 3 million undocumented migrants as soon as he takes office, we can hardly say with any certainty that these refugees are being sent to a country that will offer them any sort of stability. Such is the ill-feeling in the US towards migrants, be they legal or not, who knows what type of reception they will receive, or indeed how long they will be able to remain.

So before we congratulate the Government for solving one of its biggest problems, let’s not forget that it had a significant hand in contributing to the magnitude of the problem in the first place. If it had quickly and humanely processed those sent to the centres, then there would not have been the need for such a deal in the first instance. And no one does anything for nothing these days so we will just have to wait and see what the US asks for in return.

What do you think? Do you think this is a win for Australia? Do you believe the US is the best place for these refugees? What do you think the US will request in return? Will it take the form of Australia accepting Costa Rican migrants?

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    COMMENTS

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    Curious
    14th Nov 2016
    10:07am
    I cannot in my wildest dreams imagine what it must be like for those on Naru.
    It pains me to say that many peviously advantaged whites (up to 100,000) are living in squalor and FAR worse conditions than those on Naru. The beatings rape pillage in many white and black squatter camps in South Africa are sadly been ignored by the world.
    Unfortunately this situation is escalating daily with farm murders of whole families and rape of many children (20-30) black and white.
    Bookworm
    14th Nov 2016
    12:46pm
    I agree, Curious. All of Africa and the Middle East (except Israel) are total basket cases. Why import all those illiterate, bitter people who mostly have no intention of assimilating with us? Just look at what has happened to Europe and Great Britain, with hundreds of no-go areas where even the police dare not venture. It is already a death sentence for Western civilisation - by their massive childbirth figures, the world will be swamped in the very near future by ideologies totally alien to our way of life.
    Anonymous
    14th Nov 2016
    12:54pm
    Well said bookworm
    wally
    14th Nov 2016
    8:45pm
    I like the picture of the little hand grabbing the big white hand at the head of this "editorial?" It does seem that the picture is incomplete in that there is no money shown falling out of the big hand.
    marls
    15th Nov 2016
    9:30pm
    Bookworm
    totally agree
    Peanuts
    14th Nov 2016
    10:11am
    Whilst there are moral issues, Nauru is a great deterrent to would be illegal refugees.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:44am
    Detention is an awful fate but then we are faced with mass immigration from the third world, not refugees. The latter is no more than a word of convenience to push the wedge into the conscience of the country so that these people are accepted in.

    I find it hard to believe that Trump will be going through with such a deal and await to see where this goes. Don't believe everything you read in the media which has its own agenda going. If Trump does roll over, he won't methinks, then I am willing to bet that more than a few of the applicants will be sent home despite sewing up their lips in front of the cameras.

    Your statements about 'refugees' are likely half truths at best Debbie. People with no money CANNOT get on even a leaky boat.
    I know I sound heartless but I'm not. My first allegiance is however to my own country and to generations yet to come. The do gooders with the bleeding hearts unfortunately are for the most part programed by media and want to feel good whilst ignoring what mass migration from the third world is doing and will continue to do to our way of life. These people need to tell their grandchildren that THEY did this to them! Not pretty.

    What did Fraser say? "Life wasn't meant to be easy"? He got that one right.
    wally
    14th Nov 2016
    12:26pm
    I do not understand why Ms Mc Taggart is trying to convince us all that we should feel guilt over the plight the illegal queue jumping "asylum seekers" have gotten them selves into. After all, if they do not like living in detention, why do they not accept the $20,000 offer the government is willing to pay them to go home? They might even recoup some of the money they paid to the people smugglers and break even.

    Be that as it may, it would seem that Malcolm is opening the door to allow President Obama to fulfil his 2008 election promise to close Camp X ray (at Guantanamo Bay) and get rid of the captured Taliban combatants held captive there. Or if that takes too long, the incoming President Trump might send some of the illegal lLatinos currently in US jails to Australia.

    It has been the Australian punters' fate of late to see what the bureaucrats and politicians present to us as "immaculate white swans" turning out to be turkey buzzards in the harsh glare of daylight.
    MB100D
    14th Nov 2016
    10:13am
    I think the deal will be scuttled by the Trump camp. I can't imagine the US under the new administration taking refugees from us when they are talking about deporting Muslims and building a wall to keep Mexicans out.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:46am
    I'd be agreeing with you on that. But then there are back flips extraordinary already under way so let's wait till the fat lady sings........and Trump gives his children senior government rolls.
    Abby
    15th Nov 2016
    2:32pm
    This will all happen prior to Trump taking up the office.
    Abby
    15th Nov 2016
    2:32pm
    This will all happen prior to Trump taking up the office.
    MB100D
    19th Nov 2016
    8:16am
    If the deal does go through, the Yanks will take our 1800 or so refugees and we will take their South American refugees....whats the point?
    mudGecko
    14th Nov 2016
    11:06am
    Please stop the wilful deceit, Debbie. This sort of may work with uni children but not to people with extensive life experience.

    The people in question are not fleeing any danger; they are ILLEGAL immigrants, flying halfway around the world to gull the UN and other do-gooders with the magic word 'refugee' which their advisers have told them will circumvent Australia's control of its borders. The Australian people have never voted to be governed by the UN. They've never been asked!
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:47am
    I'm impressed. Always the bleeding hearts vs the realists. Sadly the bleeding hearts are never to be seen when their views destroy what was working well previously.
    GreyViper
    14th Nov 2016
    12:12pm
    Well said mudGecko! I'm sick and tired of these bleeding hearts telling us we should 'feel shame' at how we treat these "poor refugees" by locking them up on Nauru or Manus Island. As far as I am aware they can return to their home country any time they like but they choose not to because all of the 'bleeding hearts' keep giving them false hope by these sorts of stupid comments. The second thing is that most of them are NOT REFUGEES but are simply people trying to come here for a better life because their own country is such a terrible place. We need to remember that every one of these people we allow to enter displaces a GENUINE REFUGEE who is waiting in a camp somewhere hoping for a better chance in life. Also they are mostly unskilled and 80% + are still on welfare 5 years after they arrive. We do not need to import welfare recipients, we have plenty of our own already.
    Debbie, wake up and smell the roses and stop believing the crap that you read/hear on the ABC! Also they ARE trying to get here illegally, arriving on an uninvited boat and then trying to claim asylum by throwing away your papers and claiming to be from another country doesn't sound like the normal way to enter this country! Further, do you have any proof at all that these people "have been subjected to horrors in there own country" or is that more rubbish you got from the ABC. I'm sick and tired of people like you wanting to spend my taxes on people that we know very little about. We should be spending it on our own people! Do you actually have anybody with a right wing opinion in your office?
    tj
    14th Nov 2016
    12:18pm
    Mud absolutely agree with your comments 100% . The author of this article definitely belongs to the ''shardonay'' left bleeding hearts brig
    ade.She must have believed the rubbish portrayed by 4 corners recently
    Anonymous
    14th Nov 2016
    1:14pm
    Well said greyviper!

    There used to be a thing called immigration. If you wanted to migrate to another country for whatever reason, you had to apply and meet certain criteria and then you were either accepted or not.
    These days people, mainly unskilled who don't like where they are for whatever reason (mainly economic) think its just OK to bypass the criteria, get on a boat and just arrive by the thousands and expect to welcomed with open arms! ridiculous!
    If the do gooders think it's ok let them 'adopt' ALL of them into their houses, pay for ALL their upkeep and other expenses forever if necessary and use not a cent of taxpayers money.
    At least in Australia we have taken steps to stop the hordes of uninvited, I pity the Italian and Greeks who are still thousands arriving every month.
    Abby
    15th Nov 2016
    2:36pm
    Manus Island used to be like Paradise on earth ... it saddens me when I look at the pictures now with garbage and litter everywhere ... I truly feel sorry for the native people that are currently living there.
    Crashbang
    15th Nov 2016
    3:55pm
    Well said Mud.Its people like that that want all the changes, then when the shit hits the fan they run around saying it wasn't me or they stick their head in the sand pretending it didn't happen.
    marls
    15th Nov 2016
    9:35pm
    mud
    spot on
    and most of the ppl coming here are nothing more than gym junkies as i see from the pictures, and the latest designer clothes and ipods costing a fortune. the true refugees are dying of starvation with no shoes, clothing and specially not the lastest hi tec phones and dont have thousands of dollars to pay ppl smugglers
    marls
    15th Nov 2016
    9:42pm
    Greyviper
    spot on i applied for citizenship 4yrs ago and i had to prove i was legal. but immigration computer records do not go back to the 50's and i had no idea the date or the ship i arrived with my parents on i only knew the year. i had to go to archieves and because i told them the truth about my details they found me in no time. even told me where i embarked and disembarked and the name of the ship. i guarantee if these people were to give their correct details they would be traced in a very short time. theres reasons people lie. i worked in juvenile and back in the late 80's a refugee was sentenced to 3yrs detention for murder he was a boat person he told them he was 17 therefore sentenced as a juvenile, his actual age was 27 he went on to be high up in the 5T
    '
    jackyd
    14th Nov 2016
    11:09am
    The author should drie her eyes and toughen up and accept the reality of the situation and the many facts effecting border control and the inability of this or any other country to facilitate an open border policy.
    Don't forget where this situation came from either, the insanity if Kevin Rudd.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:48am
    Agreed.
    Rick
    14th Nov 2016
    11:17am
    The people on Nauru and Manus Island are being looked after a whole lot better than the millions in UN Camps in Africa and Asia. No one has drowned since Tony Abbott stopped the boats. When we have secure borders there is general acceptance by the Australian public of increased refugee intakes from the camps overseas. Open borders would result in the same chaos that has happened in Europe, with thousands drowning and increased opposition to accepting refugees.

    Debbie, you need to accept that the views espoused by the ABC and other refugee advocates in Australia, are not aligned with the general public.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:51am
    The ABC normally offers a stringent debate on all issues so a bit unfair to attack it for airing the do gooder views. Unfortunately there does seem to be an alliance between immigration lawyers and the media and we have seen an unmitigated attack on the majority from both. Try having a contrary view on publications like the Guardian and your comment is viciously attacked and quickly removed despite being factual an debating the facts.
    mudGecko
    14th Nov 2016
    12:41pm
    A very good and true point you make, rglarking.

    If the wealthy visa-collecting shysters were stopped, the genuine and poor refugees who don't queue-jump would have a chance. At present the trendy leftist-virtue signallers have completely ignored those genuinely-wretched folk.
    Rick
    14th Nov 2016
    4:03pm
    Mick, I listen to the ABC a lot, and they definitely give more air time to the Green/Left of politics, and Sarah Hanson-Young and the various Human Rights activities get interviewed way more than anyone on the 'secure borders' side of politics. Furthermore, the ABC never asks the fundamental question: what would you do to the next boat arrival when the agreed number of refugees have already been accepted?
    dweezy2176
    14th Nov 2016
    11:18am
    Hopefully, the voice(s) of the "cupcake generation & associated "bleedin' 'earts" will grow quieter after 20 January! I hope President Trump rescinds this deal for the con it is .. since when does a caretaker Gummint make serious commitments? "Malodious" knows this won't wash but, as usual, has failed to come to grips with the changing of the guard that occurred on November 8 .. time he worried about real issues .. after all, his non-invitation to the alphabet soup march much be of some concern!
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:53am
    All will be revealed. The question is what next if Trump does what many expect he will do? I can see the next 'bring them to Australia' campaign starting.
    Personally I am sick of it. About time the media let this one go as Australians are fed up for the most part.
    Gra
    14th Nov 2016
    11:27am
    The "Problem" as Debbie calls it would not have arisen had a tough stance been taken to start with and these people been returned to their home country as soon as their boats were intercepted. If they had destroyed their documentation proving where they were from then the mention of sending them to Syria may have been an enticement for them to tell the truth.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:54am
    Ditto. You are spot on.
    Hasbeen
    14th Nov 2016
    12:21pm
    Yep, the only shame is that we didn't have the guts to kick them out the moment the boats were intercepted. Having our navy run a collection service for gate crashing illegals is almost the most stupid thing that Rudd ever did.
    tj
    14th Nov 2016
    12:23pm
    Gra would have been even better if Rudd hadn't undone our existing border policies in the first place
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    12:27pm
    Agree Hasbeen. I understand it was called a Greens gun at the head.
    cdbstock
    14th Nov 2016
    11:33am
    On this one this gov't has it right - although it has most policies wrong
    We send people to war - some are killed, some are injured for life - but the 'do gooders' accept this
    We import people who work to change us
    We import some who kill us
    We import people who use us
    Yes there are some genuine refugees among them, but granting them entry into Australia would re-start the people smugglers - & we'd be back to square one again
    Re all asylum seekers on Manus & Nauru - there is a strong case for resettling the children (say under 5) here but not their parents - adoption opportunity
    We don't look after our own in need so why do the 'do'gooders' want to expend resources on non-Australians
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    11:56am
    Ditto. Thanks for recognising that not all immigrants from this group are bad. The normal deal is that the do gooders roll out the racism bandwagon when people point to the facts and debates about Islamic people and the high percentage of crime from this group are closed for discussion. Not politically correct to have a discussion about reality.
    Happy cyclist
    14th Nov 2016
    11:38am
    Debbie, don't let the horrid comments above worry you -- except of course it is terribly worrying to know that one is living among people with such horrid, intolerant opinions. These people are so lucky to have never known real hardship, if they had they would certainly not be so awful. Really, I am just gobbsmacked at some of the above comments. How can people be so horrible? It defies belief.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    12:00pm
    Horrible? Not horrible Happy cyclist. What you are missing is that many people have had a gutful being told that Australia HAS to take these people and have become very frustrated as the debate against is routinely shut down with claims of racism and islamophobia.
    The above represents real opinion which is not controlled by immigration lawyers and those in the media using social engineering by posting biased views rather than an honest discussion.
    As I said above do gooders will be nowhere to be seen when they succeed in ruining a well functioning model which has served us well for many decades.
    Hasbeen
    14th Nov 2016
    12:26pm
    You know what to do, if you don't like living among us cyclist.

    Of course you are probably on the taxpayer teat somewhere, so that is not a comfortable option for you.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    12:28pm
    Go easy Hasbeen.
    GreyViper
    14th Nov 2016
    12:29pm
    Happy cyclist,
    Stop living in a dream world. I am all for taking in GENUINE refugees but people arriving on boats are not that in the main. Genuine refugees flee their country and don't have enough funds to make the trek to Indonesia and pay people smugglers so the greatest majority that have arrived on boats are NOT refugees! They are trying to take advantage of us (and did so under the Rudd government) and we are still paying for it. We are not horrible, just REALISTIC!
    Rick
    14th Nov 2016
    1:51pm
    Happy Cyclist, I personally think it was terrible that 1000+ people drowned when Rudd relaxed the successful border protection regime established by the Howard government. Also I'm very happy to increase the refugee intake in our very successful migration program, now that we have regained control of our borders. This helps the UNHCR by taking genuine refugees from the many camps in Africa and Asia.

    My question for you is: Given there are millions of genuine refugees stuck in camps around the world, who would love to live in Australia, what limit would you put on our annual refugee intake, and what would you do when that number was exceeded by uncontrolled migration enabled by Indonesian people smugglers?
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    3:02pm
    You seem to miss the point that the reason the nation is already buckling under infrastructure collapse and social security blowouts is the fast increase in new Australians some of whom will never work but happily take lifetime handouts.
    It's about time we as a nation looked at immigration in relation to needs and the capacity to pay without destroying all that we have grown to hold dear.
    The repeated bleats from those who want the warm and fuzzy feeling derived by being a nice guy always needs to be tempered by what is good for our country. Otherwise you bring in 60 million people and that is the sort of moronic comment you get from those who have no accountability to any of us and who act for the moment in time they are suspended in with nigh a thought about tomorrow let alone 20 or 30 years down the track.
    The Lucky Country can quickly turn into the next India and if the do gooders want this then maybe go and live in India....and may you be truly happy with what you get.
    Travelling Man
    14th Nov 2016
    4:06pm
    GET ON YOUR BIKE, HAPPY CYCLIST!
    ex PS
    14th Nov 2016
    5:52pm
    Happy cyclist, thank you, I was quite sickened by the obnoxious and uneducated remarks uttered so far, you have given me hope that the average Australian is not a selfish, redneck moron.
    This will be my last post as I have become quite disillusioned with the type of person who posts on this site.
    I thought that Australians were better than this, history will see this part of our development as a shameful passage of time.
    PAYEdmydues
    14th Nov 2016
    7:43pm
    Happy cyclist
    I'm with you so don't lose heart.
    These isolationist xenophobes are majority on this appalling site.
    Of course next grievance will be suffering if those who've had lifetime in our peaceful lucky country and can't their retirement. The 'economic' retiree/pensioners. Not much sympathy from me.
    Anonymous
    15th Nov 2016
    11:03am
    COME ON WAKE UP AUSTRALIA............
    No jobs for any of them so no contribution to our country, they arrive get on welfare, they breed like rabbits so their kids will be on welfare also, look at the figures, they keep multiplying, plus how will these people ever fit into our society??
    The crime rate is escalating and guess what nationality they are, look at the news the media is starting to hide their faces.
    marls
    15th Nov 2016
    9:51pm
    Happy cyclist
    how many have you taken into your own home
    actions speak louder than works. the gvt put the offer out a few years ago to date i have not come across one pro that has taken them in.
    and some have in europe opened their homes. those people were raped and murdered
    Boof
    14th Nov 2016
    11:43am
    Good on U Mudgecko. Give us a break Debbie. Toughen up. A lot of the so called refugee's are ECONOMIC. U'd have Oz run over by them with Ur bleeding heart opinions Sri Lanka has better beaches & resorts than Australia. Our aged pensioners can't afford to go over there. Tear up our passports & pay boat smugglers + the cost of getting to Indonesia & come back here & get public housing & $20,000 to start a new life, from us. We haven't even got a rail service from Syd. to Bris. or a bus from Gosford to Woy Woy, of a night.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    12:02pm
    Your content needs discussion. Sadly this sort of dissent is routinely removed and/or demonised by those with vested interests.
    PAYEdmydues
    14th Nov 2016
    7:48pm
    My heart bleeds for aged pensioners who after a lifetime in this peaceful lucky country are suffering so much.
    And all you want is ...more.
    MB100D
    15th Nov 2016
    4:42pm
    Oh come on PAYEdmydues, they are ENTITLED.
    Boof
    14th Nov 2016
    12:15pm
    Yes I have noticed that articles are removed if we speak our mind, which does not afree with the hirarchy. Sad. I thought we had free speech in Oz.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    12:25pm
    That's what they sell us. They also sell us protections from the big end of town and laws to restrain predatory behaviour. But then we have no regulators who do not also look the other way and just like the media average citizens have been made fair game.
    KSS
    14th Nov 2016
    12:39pm
    Section 18c of the Discrimination Act put paid to free speech!
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    3:03pm
    It did. And don't the minority groups yelling 'discrimination' in front of the cameras milk it for all that it is worth.
    HDRider
    14th Nov 2016
    12:52pm
    What a load of bollox, go look at what our soldiers sailors and airmen and women endure everyday, paying tax for these illegals to invade our shores! Give us a real bleeding heart story you dam fool, go see the chaos these people are wreaking upon Europe and their DEMANDS for resettlement in soft touch countries.
    I for one would NOT put my children through what they do. Remember, REFUGEE STATUS ended when they reached SAFE haven, the first country they reach that is not at war, going further in boats is an illegal invasion of foreign shores. Why do they not head for Muslim countries if they are Muslim? Why not demand IRAN?
    Just PLEASE STOP writing this crap and YOUR opinion and forcing it upon others who may not agree and therefore causing great debate/argument, a LOT of people disagree with your opinion, especially those who voted in a government to stop these people smugglers and illegals.
    Then THINK about this, our government has TOLD people there is a correct way to come to Australia, that is the same way as everyone else, APPLY to Australia for immigration and the grounds, you WILL NOT jump the queue of many thousands of HONEST people applying via the correct channels. What part of all this do journos and writers of crap not understand??????
    I have just spent a lot of time checking on what I need to merely VISIT other countries I am traveling to, why? Because I RESPECT THEIR LAWS AND WISHES.
    Please consider writing something that is useful to your readers instead of forcing your personal views/opinions on them.
    PAYEdmydues
    14th Nov 2016
    8:45pm
    Yeah they should go back where that came from and die.
    marls
    15th Nov 2016
    9:56pm
    HDRider
    totally agree
    this is why Trump is now president and the rise of one nation
    grounded
    14th Nov 2016
    12:55pm
    Australia's approach to these boat people is totally wrong. We invite constant censure, and critical judgement from the rest of the graciously kind peoples of the world. Australia has millions, upon millions of acres of land just sitting idle....at minimum at least a 1000 acres for every boat arrival.

    Poste haste, the spineless polly waffling Turnbull should bring every last one of the Detention Centre inhabitants to Australia.

    Upon arrival, every last one of them should be placed on airconditioned Coaches at the Alice Springs airport, and immediately transferred to their very own 1000 acre slice of Aust... just some 500 klms to the western side of the Great Sandy Desert....where those romantic brown plains exist for thousand of square miles.

    How good and noble would that be? Instant citizens, instant land owners....who could berate the loving kindness of Australia then? These boat people would have then found the ultimate sanctuary....who would bother them then, on their 1000 acre windfalls.... just on the other side of the Great Sandy.

    Ah BUT then...they would undoubtedly start moaning that they want to live in Broadmeadows or Bankstown...i.e. Australia's boarders destroyed, and then have them dictate where they choose to live.

    Yep, I know this would not be acceptable at all....just like Waffling Mal's pipe dream is not going to be acceptable to Donald.

    I'm sure those idyllic Pacific havens are going to become more attractive as each day passes towards Donald's inauguration. Moral of the story...don't go arrogantly jumping into a rickety boat....without thinking of the reaction of the people you are going to foist yourself onto.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    3:07pm
    Indeed people have 'rights' and moving into an enclave is one of these. The kindhearted often forget that some of our new arrivals take everything we have to offer and in return hate us and demonise us because we do not have their religion and/or a different to them.

    We sure do have a lot of land but most of it is arid (this is Australia) and the rest belongs to China, America and the UK. Even if not do you really think immigrants want to have a tough life when we have lifetime social security. These people know why they want to come to Australia. It is the land of milk and honey and ready to be milked by the next one.
    Rae
    15th Nov 2016
    7:27am
    MICK that problem could be easily solved by stricter controls over welfare. The government has passed new laws recently to restrict promised payments to retired Australian savers so I imagine other restrictions on who can get money, for how long and under what conditions is not out of the question.

    A welfare state only functions where there is prosperity, a strong middle class and income redistribution through taxation. We simply don't have that anymore. In fact the new game in town is how to avoid taxes and keep all your money for yourself.

    Just where are all these people to be accommodated? We have very little public housing left at least on Nauru and Manus there is shelter.

    They are better off than the growing numbers of poor Australians living rough on the streets.
    KSS
    14th Nov 2016
    12:58pm
    For those genuine refugees (i.e. those already assessed and cleared as such) then this 'deal' with the USA is a good thing. Assuming they can also pass the American security checks, they could be on their way before Christmas. Its my understanding that the American Immigration Officials are either already here or will be this week. For those women, children and families given priority clearance there could be no good reason to refuse to go to USA. Its a first world country with the chance for a 'better-more secure life'. Good education and health care and a social security system that will support them to establish themselves.

    For those who are not genuine refugees (and those who do not pass the American security checks) they still have a choice. They can take the 20 year visa on offer to live freely on Nauru outside the detention camps and being self supporting (of course this does NOT include on-going support from the Australian taxpayer) or go back to where they originated from. I see no problem with any of this.

    The biggest issue is making it very clear to the people-smugglers (and those waiting in Indonesia for a boat) that this will not be repeated and that Australia will NOT become the back-door to America. This I understand was the reason for delaying the announcement of the decision that was actually made some time ago - to enable border protection to be 'enhanced' to stave off any subsequent flotilla of leaky boats.

    And for those playing the 'Trump' card, his threats of deportation apply to those who are 'illegally' in the USA and who have no papers. The refugees accepted under this agreement will have papers to prove they are refugees and so Mr Trump's threats, should they actually come to fruition, will not apply to them.
    Sundays
    14th Nov 2016
    2:22pm
    Yes KSS but what other deals has Turnbull made. I can't believe that the US will take these refugees without more quid to quo. I know he's agreed to Australia taking refugees from Columbia but wonder what else. Hopefully, the genuine refugees can move on with their lives and we can put the savings from closing the detention centres to better use
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    3:08pm
    So you really believe that these people are heading for America?
    floss
    14th Nov 2016
    1:02pm
    What is all the fuss about most refugees come in our front door.It is a big ask but they have to forget their religious difference and live together in their land of birth.The last thing we need in Australia with climate change on the way is a large population.
    phantom
    14th Nov 2016
    1:09pm
    Brexit was an outcry from Britain to stop uncontrolled refugees. 80% of Mediterranean people that entered Australia are still on welfare still after 10 years. Most don't assimilate and their beliefs vastly differ from ours. Yes we should welcome REAL refugees awaiting in camps but not accept people that have traveled across numerous countries to try out our generous welfare entitlements.
    mudGecko
    14th Nov 2016
    1:21pm
    In summary, I think this discussion leads to one truth: any people in Australian detention have put themselves there, through dishonesty, and they can leave at any time. But of course those that feed off their alleged misery will lose income, that is the lawyers and others in the "victim grievance" industry. And that simply won't do!...

    I will say that non-p.c. (therefore honest) views ARE permitted on this site (and only this site as far as I know), and for which genuine congratulations to the management are due.

    On another point raised in this discussion, my observation is that the ABC has long been the propaganda arm of the green-left and even sillier fellow-travellers. The ABC is/are actually in legal breach of their contractual obligation: to be fair and offer equal coverage of ALL views.

    The ABC management should be replaced and the inner-city darlings' "latte-lefty" culture be not the only view broadcast. Sadly, no government has so far shown any courage to do the right thing by the ABC's employer, (all) the Australian taxpayers, and this is not likely to change without significant pressure from the ignored. Please help.
    stekmer
    14th Nov 2016
    1:26pm
    The use of a couple of 'r' words are really starting to irritate me.
    Why is it the words 'refugee'and 'racist' are being used (by a minority) to prevent any rational, logical and realistic debate about what is best for this country?
    To me, the rise of right wing political figures and movements (Trump, Hanson, Le Pen etc) are a backlash against uncontrolled migration and perceived threat to a way of life.
    Trying to shut down rational, balanced debate by using the 'r' words will achieve nothing but disharmony and bitterness. Sighhhhh
    Rae
    15th Nov 2016
    7:37am
    Well the controlled huge increase in immigration was all about destroying the unions and keeping workers in their places and underpaid. It has worked really well.No complaints from the latte set about it. It didn't affect their salaries so they didn't care one itty bit.

    I'm surprised the author of this piece hasn't realised that with the theories of Hayek and Rand comes total dismissal of compassion and empathy. No time for that in a winner takes all world.

    That is our real shame. That we allowed a system to evolve that leaves the weaker members of our communities and weaker communities behind completely.
    Eddy
    14th Nov 2016
    1:30pm
    This whole issue is history repeating itself, we seem to have to have some group to demonise. Before Federation it was Chinese. Back in the 1920's and 30s it was the Catholic menace pushing their Popery onto Australia. In the 1940s it was our enemies Germany and Japan, In the 1950s it was immigrants from Europe, the Italians, Greeks, Yugoslavs and others (but not the British). In the 60s we had North Vietnam and in the 70s boatloads of Vietnamese, Cambodian and Laotian 'asylum seekers'. In the 80s and 90s it was Iraq (or at least Saddam Hussain) and since 2001 it has been asylum seekers from the middle east and Sri Lanka.
    Opinion polls in 2001 indicated that the Howard Government would lose the general election to Kim Beasley's Labour opposition. Then in August along came Tampa which JH saw as his salvation, tough action by sending troops to occupy the Tampa (in Australian waters of course) and JH went to the November 2001 election trumpeting about how only he would protect Australia from this new menace. A brilliant political move and he won the election. But what if he had taken his predecessor Malcolm Frazer's lead and welcomed the Tampa asylum seekers, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation with it's name calling and passionate fury on both sides. As I said at the beginning this is history repeating itself.
    KSS
    14th Nov 2016
    2:06pm
    And we would have had far more than the 50000 'unauthorised arrivals' than we had and far more than the 1200 deaths at sea on the way here from Indonesia.
    Jim
    14th Nov 2016
    3:06pm
    Ok eddy why do you mention the Brits in brackets, I am sure I have seen some of your responses in the past that seem to be anti British, not sure what your problem is mate, I arrived in Australia in the 60s and was immediately required to register for national service and do service in Vietnam. Non of the other migrants from other European countries had to register because they were not British subjects, and let's not forget the Brits have been coming to Australia for a couple of hundred years, they may have even helped in some small way to make this great country what it is today. Or have I misunderstood your comments once again.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    3:11pm
    I suspect this time it's different Eddie.
    In the 20's there was abundant work for Australians. The ruling political parties have now exported our jobs and THERE IS NO WORK and we cannot afford to have these people sitting on social security like our own home grown bludgers. So why bring them?
    Eddy
    15th Nov 2016
    12:42am
    Sorry Dim, I am not anti-British (except in cricket of course). My parents and 3 older siblings emigrated from Britain in 1938 and I have a long British heritage stretching back generations. My '(but not the British)', to which you take exception, was to indicate that the Australian populace of the 1950s did not relate to or like non-British immigrants.
    To KSS, the point I was trying to make is that we welcomed tens of thousands Vietnamese, Laotians and Cambodians in the 1970s and now they, and their children and grandchildren, are as much a part of the Australian community as anyone else. But for political expediency the government of the day chose to demonise the current crop of asylum seekers.
    Mick, I suggest there is plenty of work in Australia but too many 457 visas which business's exploit rather than employing Australians. I know of one business which sacked it's Australian workforce in their warehouse and employed cheaper 457 visa holders in their place.
    Swinging voter
    14th Nov 2016
    1:48pm
    Left wing media calling people names such as racist no longer works. Western societies have experienced too much damage to our cultures and belief systems over many decades. Self-righteous politicians presided over failed immigration experiments, the first of which were the Dutch. When they saw integration wasn't happening, they tried to force-feed "togetherness" and that didn't work either, in fact it introduced anger and resentment. It's up to the Arab countries to pull their weight because it's not the West's responsibility to meet the demands of foreign populations who are unwilling to make the changes they want in their own countries. As for the "deal" with the Obama administration to accept our illegals, I feel it is arrogant to do this when the present government knows that the incoming President is unhappy with the hundreds of thousands of illegals already in the US. Trump is a successful deal-maker. I think he would regard this "deal" as sneaky and incompatible with his policy promises. Next we will see more paying boat people hoping to get to the US via Australia which is, in the majority of cases, not their first country of asylum. imo the adamant rise of the right is the result of decades of politicians ignoring public feedback and the insidious displacement of host country white anglo host citizenry.
    KSS
    14th Nov 2016
    2:03pm
    The difference in this case from what Mr Trump is threatening (he is NOT the President yet) is that he is intending to take action against the millions of 'illegal' people in the USA without any kind of papers.
    In the case of the genuine refugees from Manus and Nauru Islands, they would have papers issued by the American Immigration Officials who clear them, showing they are genuine refugees and would be accepted under the USA refugee intake for the year.

    The reason given for the delay in making the announcement of this agreement was so that our Border Controls could be enhanced to ward off the very thing you anticipate; that the waiting thousands in Indonesia would see this as the back-door to USA. The people smugglers (and those waiting) need to be under no illusion that this is only a one off deal, that it applies to those already in detention in Manus and Nauru and that it will NOT be extended to others in the future.
    Eddy
    16th Nov 2016
    11:07am
    Well Swinging Voter (I like the sound of that, not being 'rusted on' to any political ideology) the right wing media's name calling (ie 'bleeding hearts', 'do gooders' etc) is just as ineffective as the left wing.
    One thing I note from the postings on this forum, on this and many other subjects, is that some people merely parrot the either the Government line or those opposed to the government), they seem unable to see through the smokescreens.
    I have been witness to massive government lies from both sides of politics (but having been in government service at the time, I was not at liberty to divulge the truth as I saw it). It proves to me that Dr Goebbels was right when he said, and I paraphrase, 'if you say the same lie often enough and loud enough people will come to believe it'.
    nena
    14th Nov 2016
    1:53pm
    This apparent positive action taken by M. T. is keeping mi very anxious. Hopefully it can be materialised before R. T. takes over Obama other ways the response from the new president will be: Hey Australia, thanks but not thanks, it is your problem so you keep it. And by the way, this global problem with migrants has only one and one only solution; which is, by stoping bringing any more miserable humans to this over populated…over exploited …over abused and over and over Planet.
    Charlie
    14th Nov 2016
    2:24pm
    That's what happens when the illegal refugee situation gets out of hand, by people thinking you can just let them wander off down the street without being detained and processed.

    Sooner or later the genuine refugees are suffering because of the lifetime criminals living among them. What better way to escape the law.
    Aussieiam
    14th Nov 2016
    2:25pm
    Debbie, thanks for your news, BUT, we don't want what happened to Europe to happen in Australia, as well. Yes, i feel sorry for the refugees, but, how many of them are genuines and that we are not accepting refugees who wants to change our Laws as well? We need to look after our own, first and foremost.

    14th Nov 2016
    3:03pm
    Is Don. Is Good.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    3:17pm
    It appears to me that the government trolls are out in force today. All the normal suspects. Sadly I have to agree with most of them on this issue as I love the country.
    People who are of the 'poor refugees' mindset need to think this out with their intellect rather than using emotions.
    You have taken a bit of a hiding today Debbie but I suspect that Brexit is brewing in our own country from jobs snatched from Australians and given to the third world to immigrants and ethnic groups who use laws put in place to protect them as weapons to silence the majority.
    In the end we have to choose a side and a real pity you cannot have it both ways, but that is the reality of life. Cheers.
    micko
    14th Nov 2016
    3:29pm
    Why do I feel no shame? Am I old and cynical ? What happened to the idealism of my youth?
    But I do know that on a recent holiday in Sihanoukville in Cambodia I did think:
    "...what a lovely place, why wouldn't those stuck in detention not opt to come here and open a restaurant (financed by Oz taxpayers) and feed the tourists? Surely that would be a better life than that which they claim to be fleeing."
    jackyd
    14th Nov 2016
    10:40pm
    Exactly Micko
    I spend a bit of time in Snooky myself and what's needed is more kebab outlets, non halal of course.
    Bill
    14th Nov 2016
    3:59pm
    Keep up the good work, Debbie, and ignore the dozen or so bullies. They are so thick they think they can beat you down with BLOCK CAPITALS.
    Rick
    14th Nov 2016
    4:05pm
    I use block capitals for acronyms and the first letter in proper nouns; my arguments don't rely on shouting, merely facts and logic.
    Dot
    14th Nov 2016
    4:06pm
    I for one do not care about illegals, I view them as a human termites who have spread right across the western world and turn each country into slums.
    There are thousands of Dinky Di Aussies who are homeless, there are many more thousands who are losing their jobs on a daily basis due to the globalized world, Governments and big business are responsible for this bloody mess.
    I for one am looking for a extreme far right party that puts Australia and Australians first and try to return Australia to what is was before the Vietnam War.
    Swinging voter
    14th Nov 2016
    4:20pm
    Never heard it put more accurately. Your pin-pointing the beginning of Australia's social and cultural slide as the era of the Vietnam War is noteworthy. That timeline also coincides with the downturn of the USA. It has taken long and heavy-hearted decades for our populations to say enough is enough and put their foot down. Loud, left-wing extremists have got away with shouting down alternative opinions but suddenly they find the electors have had enough and are not taking their bullying any more. The USA, UK, Holland, Australia and probably Germany/France are taking their countries back from those who think they are entitled to force entry and take control o, the foundations that all Western societies have worked so hard to achieve. It takes a long time for a worm to turn, but turn it has.

    14th Nov 2016
    4:07pm
    Have you ever "crashed" a party? Have you ever gone anywhere without an invitation when you were supposed to have received one? Have you ever gone anywhere without any money and expected someone else to foot the bill? Have you ever trespassed on someone else's property? Well, if your answer is "No" to these four simple questions then why would you feel shame about the contents of this article? YOU have done nothing wrong whilst OTHERS have. This perspective in this article is arse-backwards trying to exonerate wrongdoers by overlooking the rights of other people.
    MICK
    14th Nov 2016
    4:43pm
    I think you are on the pulse here Eddie. The majority have been silenced and our opinion is either moderated or not published. Thanks God for YLC.
    I've had this issue with the Guardian in the recent past. After many discussions they no longer run repeated articles portraying minorities as victims and they have shut down comment on stories of a sensitive nature. Common sense has prevailed with at least media outlet.....but the majority is still shut out of most others and article 18C is still silencing a real debate.
    I like you believe that the majority has a right to determine the future of a nation, not the political elites. Brexit and Trump are testament to this and we may be having our own in the next election.
    Campbell
    14th Nov 2016
    4:25pm
    I do not feel any shame at all.
    These so called refugees came here uninvited and without proof of their status and they should be glad we did not shoot them as China Russia Korea and many others would have.
    CindyLou
    14th Nov 2016
    4:54pm
    Agree Campell and other posters who express similar sentiments. Weren't these uninvited people housed, fed, etc with the cost of this being borne by us taxpayers.

    14th Nov 2016
    4:59pm
    In my opinion we should not be taking any refugees or illegals due to the fact that why should only a few thousand be let in what about the millions of displaced people (savages) throughout the world? We cannot possibly accommodate all of these people cause we are in deep shit as it is. Also all the people or do gooders in Eltham should wake up to themselves letting refugees into aged care facilities. If they want to do good they can let them into their own houses not send them to aged care facilities. WAKE UP AUSTRALIA BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE............................................
    bandy
    14th Nov 2016
    5:02pm
    Im just wondering what its going to cost the Australian tax payer to relocate these illegals as it was not long ago the Aus government forked out $40 million to the Cambodian government to resettle 5 people none of whom are in the country now as they have moved elsewhere.Again very poor management by the powers that be.
    Phil1943
    14th Nov 2016
    5:10pm
    Not surprised at the volume of comments. It would be good if something - anything, could get the 1800 detainees (surely not 'prisoners', but...) off of Nauru. However, it all depends on the new President Trump. He's probably not going to accept the 'deal' unless more goodies are added, and those we can only try to guess at this stage. Regardless of how you feel about asylum seekers, economic migrants, Muslims or queue jumpers, these are human beings we've locked up for three years when all they wanted was to get away from conditions we wouldn't tolerate in their own countries. Time to end the farce and beef up the border protection mechanisms. Resettle this bunch in Australia, give them the medical and psychological care they need, and do something we pat ourselves on the back for - assimilate them into this country. If this depends on President-elect Donald J Trump we're both stupid and screwed. Lets do it for ourselves and do it now.
    Rae
    14th Nov 2016
    5:21pm
    Don't think we can provide the medical care they need. Have you seen the waiting times. The public hospitals left are broke and the private and privatised ones are not going to do it.

    Australia simply isn't the rich country these people were promised.
    Aussieiam
    14th Nov 2016
    6:37pm
    Resettle the 1800 refugees in Australia? If they themselves kill each others back in their own country, what guarantee can you give that they will not bite the hand that feeds them? How can they assimilate, when they have so much hatred?
    ex PS
    14th Nov 2016
    6:04pm
    This is my last post on this site, I look at the majority of posts about this subject and am reminded of the comments and excuses used by individuals and nations when millions of Jews were looking for somewhere to go.
    History does repeat itself, I feel sickened by the attitude of my fellow Australians and no longer wish to read any more comments by self satisfied, closed minded, selfish Luddites.
    I hope to god that Australia is never in a position where we need this kind of help from other nations because we will probably get exactly what we deserve.
    I mean, looking at these comments, who would want to let people like us into their country?
    older&wiser
    14th Nov 2016
    6:19pm
    Ex PS - Must have changed your mind - you said at 5.52pm that would be your last post. Let's hope this one is.
    Anonymous
    14th Nov 2016
    6:48pm
    in2sunset, the 5:52 comment may have been deleted because this guy "lost it". I hope he's gone too, as most of his drivel was just more half-baked crap anyway. No loss.
    Anonymous
    15th Nov 2016
    9:55am
    ExPS you are a nerd. We cannot possibly take millions of refugees why should only a few thousand be chosen?? They are not wanted by their own governments so why would these countries want to help us if we were in need. They have never lifted a hand to help us, never will either, and they don't have the ability to help their own. Time for governments around the world to look after their own people. This should be implemented by the UN.
    CindyLou
    15th Nov 2016
    10:46am
    One good thing about reading ridiculous posts such as ex PS is that I learn something new - the word LUDDITES, definition 'a member of any band of workers (1811-16) organized to destroy machinery etc... Anti industrialization. Luddism appears to be a term that people incorrectly try to use to describe people behind the times - wrong.
    Pathetic.

    Also how ridiculous to compare this discussion to millions of Jews etc.

    PS is pathetic - glad he/she has disappeared - good riddance.
    Holland
    14th Nov 2016
    7:37pm
    They will get over it and so will we.

    14th Nov 2016
    11:42pm
    Let's be perfectly clear on some points that are trying to be airbrushed out of history, there are people smugglers, those who try to enter a country without proper authorisation are doing so illegally and the majority of people trying to enter Australia illegally are not coming directly from the country which is persecuting them but are leaving from a safe third country. Both sides of politics agree that resettlement in Australia will most certainly start the people smugglers nefarious industry once more and may well lead to more deaths at sea. What has been overlooked by those who want the refugees to settle in Australia is the obvious security risk as most arrive without ID and confirming their ID is very difficult in most countries from which they are escaping.

    Yes, we have all heard the tales of horror, of beatings, rape and humiliation to which they have been subjected but in almost every instance, these allegations have proven to be wrong. Even Gillian Triggs was wrong when she stated that she was confronted by armed guards on Christmas Island when it was shown that no guards carried weapons. These stories have been fabricated by people who want illegal immigrants to come to Australia and will go to any lengths to gain support for their cause.
    Crazy Horse
    15th Nov 2016
    12:09am
    "Women, children and family groups will be given priority over men".

    Tell me again about male privledge
    CindyLou
    15th Nov 2016
    11:15am
    Youve got to be kidding
    Just google gender inequality....
    Crashbang
    15th Nov 2016
    3:51pm
    Didn't want the bludgers,didn't get asked by our corrupt Govt if people of Australia were going to support these bludgers.The people of Australia are tired of the media & do gooders tying to shame us to believe the UN is not corrupt & they offer fair & considerate treatment for ALL races & religions. The article as above is written to incite racism & trying to shame people into taking a different stance.
    FIX the homeless & local issues here before giving away taxpayers $$.
    one just has to look at the current issues happening with these people all over Australia. whats it going to take for people to wake up?? a few more murders, rapes,beating. look how unsafe other parts of the world are. there are suburbs in Australia that it is suggested that certain people do not travel though as it is deemed unsafe..
    Send these refugees (if you believe they are that) back to where they came from
    Anonymous
    15th Nov 2016
    3:53pm
    AGREE 100%
    Mausy
    15th Nov 2016
    5:13pm
    OMG!! I cannot believe the comments above. What a sad sad bunch of people you are.
    EX PS you are right not to want to comment ever again. Most of the comments expressed belong to a Trump website. Good on you Debbie for continuing to comment as I would have given up a long time ago. Australians with a heart and conscience have to band together to fight ignorance and hate.
    Anonymous
    16th Nov 2016
    8:39am
    What a load of croc, look at the big picture.
    Anonymous
    16th Nov 2016
    8:41am
    Something has to be done and one can only hope that Trump can do it. Look at what is happening in other countries all you do gooders and I can tell you it will happen here if our government does not stand firm.
    CindyLou
    16th Nov 2016
    7:31pm
    I actually was furious about Debbie's article - felt like complaining as its offensive.

    Some people appear to have a Pollyanna - bury head in sand mindset. (ostrich, little brain, bird thinks if it can't see threat or enemy then the enemy can't see it - dumb).

    It appears some people can't see what's happening overseas and indeed in some locations in our beautiful country.
    Eliza
    16th Nov 2016
    8:13am
    I feel totally nauseous as I read the unmitigated lack of empathy, compassion or understanding for the victims of wartorn and worse countries. YES the world situation is very complicated but we as human beings must pull together and find humanitarian soulutions.
    What if it was YOUR children ... YOUR loved ones ... These people are HUMANBEINGS ...
    The spewing out of BIGOTRY, VITRIOL, RACISM ... and unbelievable small minded NASTINESS is truly frightening ... truly shameful.
    Anonymous
    16th Nov 2016
    8:38am
    Be realistic we cannot possibly take in all of these people from your comment from war torn countries there are millions of them why should only a few be allowed into Australia. We have no jobs for them, the go on to social welfare and so do their kids, they breed like rabbits, can you imagine what Australia will be like in 10 years?? We are fast becoming a third world country, with the crime rate ever increasing. Look at the big picture. If the do gooders were to take these people into their homes that is fine, but I live in an area where there are huge numbers of people from the Middle East, they do not abide by our laws. I am sick and tired of hearing about the poor refugees, most of them are illegal. Fair call if they are legit but sorry to say they are not, and I would assume a lot are still getting in from the North unseen by the authorities.
    MB100D
    16th Nov 2016
    10:36am
    I wonder how those posting their anti sentiments would cope in the same situations that the present refugees find themselves and their families. Most posting their bigotry are themselves Economic Refugees living off the taxpayers. Oh that's right, they are entitled.
    CindyLou
    16th Nov 2016
    7:10pm
    Wrong retired knowall, you know nothing about each poster - furthermore, I have observed people who are 'know it alls' and they consistently know a big fat zero.
    MB100D
    17th Nov 2016
    7:13am
    I wonder how you would cope Cindy Lou, you bigoted moron.
    taylah
    18th Nov 2016
    10:36am
    We take genuine refugees hopefully women and children not opportunists whom can afford the exorbedant people traffickers . If we open our borders we all would end up refugees, and that would not help anyone
    In Outer Orbit
    18th Nov 2016
    10:58pm
    On a per capita basis, Australia is in the top 10 wealthiest countries of 196 nations of the world. We could be forgiven for thinking that some active generosity to refugees might be relatively affordable.

    However, on the same per capita basis, Australia is ranked 67th of 196 nations for its acceptance of REFUGEES, ie acceptance of those with very legitimate reasons to HAVE to relocate.

    So, objectively, Australia's current place in the world looks rich and mean.

    The world sees that over 2000 hopeless souls in the Nauru and Manus detention centres have been used as EXAMPLES - ie their very plight appears deliberately created and exploited in a misplaced belief that this achieves deterrence.

    The trouble is that there is no evidence that 'deterrence' influences the desperate. (To say nothing of the legal and ethical obstacles of unlawfully detaining and psychologically torturing over 2000 vulnerable men, women and children)

    Evidence for a lack of deterrence? The Mediterranean sea is peppered with the bodies of drowned migrants, year after year. Those that make it to Greece and Italy face hostility and detention. They know all this before they travel. Does any of this deter the truly desperate from setting out? Apparently not.

    What Australia has done is mere 'target hardening', only. Target hardening doesn't prevent behaviour, it just displaces it towards softer targets. Australia has effectively pulled up its own drawbridge, and dangled 2000+ poor souls from its castle walls to scare off any others. And implicitly therefore Australia, one of the wealthiest countries in the world, has left the other 195 nations to pick up the problem it has deliberately only displaced. So is Australia shouldering its duty in our small interconnected world or not?

    Manus and Nauru's detention centres are obviously a complete disaster. Shameful, selfish, unethical, cruel, and criminal in its neglect of Australia's legal obligation to refugees world wide. Their existence speaks volumes about the ethical foundation of National Governments, or ultimate total lack thereof. Immoral pragmatism rules. Amoral at its est.

    'Bookworm' on this site incongruously predicts both the death of Western civilisation, and swamping with children.

    Perhaps bookworm and any followers could try reading a little about the development of ‘our’ civilisation (in Africa and the middle east), and the origin of so many key advances by peoples NOT currently listed anywhere in the OECD. Bookworm might then understand that 'Western Civilisation' is no more than a plagiarised political construct which does not bear even light intelligent scrutiny. Frankly, it’s a meaningless construct, as would be its ‘death’.

    Secondly, Bookworm et al might like to do some research on current demographics, and the desperate growing reliance of 'Western Civilisation' on migration in order to sustain sufficient numbers of economically productive members. Angela Merkel did not embrace 1 million refugees out of compassion alone. Long term, the German economy desperately needs that migrant labour force, and will look back in gratitude one day, when the current teething difficulties are resolved and forgotten. Just as Americans know they really do actually need their 11 million working Mexican guests.

    Our World is homogenizing. We all have to simply ‘get over it’, just as it is digitizing with the inexorable march of AIT (robotics etc). Drivers for example will soon mostly lose their jobs, just as horsemen became an anachronism between the World Wars. One dimensional societies everywhere are diversifying, whether you live on the Tibetan Plateau or Sydney's north shore. Bloodlines are mixing, everywhere, and as Cuba has long demonstrated, the hybrid vigour of a truly mixed population creates beauty and resourcefulness. There is nothing to fear from this but fear itself. To avoid fear and anxiety we might all benefit from simply accepting that. ‘Life is change’, inescapably.

    Increasingly the challenges the world faces are beyond the competence of National Governments acting alone - as we see here, Australia alone cannot manage its ‘refugee problem'. So, just as peoples are homogenizing, Governments are having to work multilaterally and even globally (eg the climate treaties).

    It is as sure as the grass is green that humanity will move eventually to a post-ethnic melting pot (ie all heritages mixed and nobody remotely bothered about it anymore – the truth is we are already highly mixed, if we did the DNA tests to confirm it – most true blue dinky di white ozzies have plenty of black African within them). And it is also certain that society will soon have to accept Gobal Government (if it wants sustainability – perhaps we will choose extinction instead, courtesy of The Donald perhaps).

    From that stable and happier future place, a long arc of history will look back at the prisons on Nauru and Manus, at the thinking of 'Little Englanders' voting for Brexit, and at the rust belt protectionists supporting Trump, as throwback examples of a less enlightened era. Our same voyeuristic fascination for the Roman Amphitheatre will no doubt one day apply to history's judgement of Australia's refugee treatment. Evidence? Look at the White Australia policy which ended in 1973 - it has taken us only 43 years to acknowledge what a misguided example of control freakery that policy was. The squabbling boats in the Mediterranean Sea or Torres Strait will one day seem no less bizarrely misguided.

    Australians are ALL immigrants, even the Aborigines (probably via a land bridge from what is now PNG). Europeans are ALL immigrants, probably African. I wonder how many thousands more years it will take the slowest among us to evolve beyond the parochialism, bigotry and ignorance that drove these refugee detention centres to ever arise?
    Miranda
    19th Nov 2016
    3:58pm
    I see that the man that set a Commonwealth Bank branch on fire this week is a refugee on a bridging visa.
    In Outer Orbit
    20th Nov 2016
    6:40am
    And if many other crimes that day were committed by Australia-born and raised citizens, which of course they were, what is the only logical conclusion to this evidence? People are people are people.


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