21st Dec 2016
Public satisfaction with democracy at all-time low

In what should serve as a wake-up call to the Government, a new study has found that Australian public satisfaction and trust in democracy has hit its lowest level in 40 years – with almost half of Australians feeling disillusioned by the current system.

The Australian National University (ANU) has been conducting the Australian Election Study since 1987, though public opinion on some issues has been recorded since 1969. Released yesterday, the latest report reveals the glaring lack of confidence that Australians have in the Government and politicians.

Since the July election, more than 2800 people have taken part in the study, answering questions on whether they were satisfied with the way democracy works in Australia and whether politicians can be trusted to “do the right thing” by the public.

Almost half of the respondents said they were not satisfied with the state of democracy, which has hit its lowest recorded level since 1969. Just 26 per cent of respondents expressed confidence in the Government and only 30 per cent of voters said they took an interest in the recent Federal Election campaign.

ANU Professor of Political Science Ian McAllister said, the results don’t reveal “a crisis in democracy but something is starting to happen”.

Professor McAllister called the current state of affairs “a wake-up call for our politicians and the political elite.” He also said it echoed similar trends in public disillusion seen in the lead up to Brexit and during the US election of Donald Trump.

“What we are seeing in Australia are the beginnings of a popular disaffection with the political class that has emerged so dramatically in Britain, the United States and Italy,” he said

What’s more, while this disaffection with the current democratic system continues to grow, the ANU study also revealed the lack of faith Australians have in the different political parties. Following a record number of crossbench senators being voted in, a record high of 19 per cent of respondents feel no allegiance to any political party – nor do they identify as a Labor, Liberal or Greens voter.

While as little as seven per cent of respondents thought the Government had positively affected the country’s economy during the past year, most voters viewed the economic performance of the country and their household finances as weak.

Read more at afr.com

Read more at abc.net.au

Opinion: Study reveals change is coming

The ANU Australian Election Study is important because it provides essential documentation about public opinion. However, it isn’t actually telling us what we don’t already know. As Professor McAllister said, the results don’t expose a hidden “crisis in democracy” – this we already know from a year of reported political turmoil. Rather, it reveals that a shift is starting to happen.

Australia isn’t experiencing this turmoil alone. This year, we sat and watched as a nation-wide referendum ended a 43-year alliance between the UK and the European Union. We also watched a country, fed up with political manipulation and fearmongering, turn to Donald Trump for help.  

There’s a storm brewing and it has already hit several parts of the world. People are beginning to say enough is enough. By far, the most significant issues mentioned by voters in the ANU study were that of health, specifically Medicare and euthanasia, the right to obtain an abortion and decriminalising marijuana. Voters, particularly those in their 30s, are finding their yearning for progressive change implemented by a ‘good government’ isn’t being fulfilled by the major parties.

The topics that respondents felt the most passionate about – including health, immigration, same-sex marriage and Indigenous recognition – are, of course, hot-button issues that have become the 'playthings' of politics and the media. Many of us feel that these emotive and highly personal issues have been used intentionally to manipulate our perspective. The ANU study shouldn’t only be taken as damning evidence of the dissatisfaction Australians have with the Government and politicians, but as a warning to the nation’s leaders that change, powered by the public, is coming. And come it must.

How do you feel about Australia’s current political direction? Do you think you have sufficient say in the issues that matter most to you? Do the results of the ANU study reflect general popular opinion?

RELATED ARTICLES





    COMMENTS

    To make a comment, please register or login
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    10:11am
    Like in most other countries around the globe - Democracy in Australia has become a "Wolf in Sheep's Clothing".
    In other words - a "Clayton's - make believe - democracy".
    The Corporatocracy "Controls us" indirectly via our Politicians.

    We have allowed our Politicians to circumnavigate the Australian Constitution and allowed Australia to "become a VASSAL" to the "One World Government" crowd and the USofA.

    We once were a PROUD nation and it is about time we regained that status.
    Sen.Cit.90
    21st Dec 2016
    10:29am
    Yes Patriot,
    Your comment sounds about right.
    Franky
    21st Dec 2016
    11:02am
    Well said, Patriot. We have an ex Goldman Sachs banker as prime minister now, that tells us where we are heading.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    11:53am
    So what is being done to stop the rot? You all know my solution.......but many are glued to either Liberal or Labor and continue to hold up the theft of our democracy.
    ray from Bondi
    21st Dec 2016
    12:00pm
    here I agree, governments are only ALLOWED to fiddle around the edges, for example more laws to control or remove our rights while the big picture like our economy and ownership is governed by invisible corporations.
    Paicey58
    21st Dec 2016
    12:06pm
    Who do you propose to lead this country Mick?
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:23pm
    The short answer to you question Paicey58 is IT DOESN'T MATTER.
    The US did well under Reagan who was a B rate actor. We have has leaders who you would not put in charge of a chook raffle. And now we have Trump....who is busy stacking the deck with billionaire mates. So who cares as long as they have the best advice and are helped to make sound decisions.
    Just as an aside governments are not free to do as they like. If you think so then you need to ask yourself WHY do they pursue very unpopular policies?
    Paicey58
    21st Dec 2016
    12:38pm
    That answer does not make much sense Mick, " it doesn't matter".

    The two political leaders you have quoted are from major parties and have the backing of a large political base through out their country.

    Independents in this country will not have that sort of help or basis to rely on.

    I don't think your idea of independents running this country is valid.
    Jon S
    21st Dec 2016
    12:40pm
    The Corporatocracy controlling us via the poiticians is bad enough, but the religious right controlling the Liberal Party and Catholics controlling the ALP results in secular Australia being governed by sanctimonious moralising Christians.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:45pm
    You have to do something other than say I can't do anything Paicey. That is the problem and the reason nothing changes. When the devil is in charge society has to address the issue and not be politically correct.
    Independents DO have staffers. They CAN run the country. The existing power brokers fear that change and will do anything to stop it....including putting out your message.
    Rosret
    21st Dec 2016
    1:02pm
    Mick - The USA did well under Reagan. Sadly it was because after he was shot he was severely brain damaged and while he remained President people ran the government for him. It meant that no risky ideas like going to war etc came into play. If you like - the country was actually operating as a true democracy.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    1:30pm
    True Rosret.
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    1:41pm
    "...we allowed Australia to "become a VASSAL" to the "One World Government" crowd and the USofA...."

    And the USofA is israeli lapdog assisting them in building greater Israel in a region, which people are now running from.
    jackie
    21st Dec 2016
    1:41pm
    I am surprised there hasn't been a revolution
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    4:06pm
    If they were Soldiers they would be a Rag Tag Bunch of Riff Raff :-( :-(
    john
    21st Dec 2016
    5:04pm
    Yes Mick what is being done to stop the rot. Well from every individuals situation, all we can do is vote in a manner that takes total power away from the two main stream parties who are all hacks and follow a party line , cannot think for themselves and are obliged to "do as they are told".
    So independants that can be held to account , it seems the only way, and maybe some private bills brought in wwhile independants have the power to change the rule. The fact that major parties lie through their teeth to get elected. I think if they do not carry out their proposals if they get elected , then they are liable for instant removal from office, or even charging under law.
    The way this could happen is that the Governor General has to keep extraordinary powers to remove a government, which it has now, this can be with or without the royal family, we just change the name. But you cannot control governments once that extended gov gen power disappears, and that is why we have a monarchy is it not , ???For safety. Be bloody aware and beware the republican fools. Also remember, we are a sovereign nation UK has no control over us what so ever, if you think that your a fool.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    5:08pm
    John,

    Top & Correct details & Information!!!
    Beware - beware - beware!!!!!
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    7:37pm
    Going back to political correctness; the most recent best example is the terrorist attack in Berlin, in which a Polish lorry driver was shot, his truck used to kill further 12 people at the German Christmas Market, but German media won't mention who the terrorist is. First it was reported that he 'may be' a Pakistani refugee, then that he is from Afghanistan, and now they are not sure at all they got the right man. They won't mention the word "Muslim".
    wally
    22nd Dec 2016
    12:57pm
    Prof. McAllister's remark that the results do not reveal a loss of confidence in democracy contradicts the headline that Public satisfaction is at an all time low. The idea of democracy is still held dear by most Aussies, but the way our politicians and influence peddlers practice it these days does not reflect this view.

    As currently practiced, the two major parties presented us with what would be a choice between Malcolm Turnbull and Bill Shorten. It was not as extreme as presenting voters with choosing a government for the next three years led by Joseph Stalin and Adolph Hitler, but it does show that true democracy only comes out at election time in Australia. Once elected, the government, as long as it controls both houses of Parliament, can pretty well do as it wants, as John Howard did with Work Choices in what would be his last term as Prime Minister.

    So we find that we have a democratic election system during the run up to an election. Then we must trust that the "Chosen Ones" will govern fairly and wisely for the next three years. Sometimes they do, and sometimes they get it horribly wrong ( think Kevin Rudd during his first term in the Lodge ).

    So democracy is a dream that revisits us every three years and the rest of the time we cop what has been elected until election time rolls around again.
    Sen.Cit.90
    21st Dec 2016
    10:25am
    When skits like this one goes the rounds it confirms that many people are not trusting their pollies.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch? feature=player_embedded&v= WSIUf2hD6Io
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    11:54am
    Why would you, especially with the current rich man's government coming after everybody in the country who is not rich?
    ray from Bondi
    21st Dec 2016
    12:00pm
    here here mick I agree 100%
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    4:08pm
    TRUST THEM ?? I wouldn't turn my back on them in Safety !! :-( :-(
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    4:15pm
    Sen.Cit.84
    Nothing to disagree with in that YouTube skit!
    Teddy
    21st Dec 2016
    10:37am
    I don't see political events in UK and USA as indicative of anything other than the triumph of democracy. Despite the universal agreement of the established political elite on how elections would proceed and the complicity of the media in force feeding these views to the electorate ordinary citizens were able as a result of being part of a democracy to make rational decisions. If we lived under any political system that was not democratic this could not have happened.
    Franky
    21st Dec 2016
    11:07am
    See my views below, Teddy. Have you noticed that our heads of government are changing but not policies? There is always bipartisan support for anything that furthers the interests of the globalization agenda. (Defense spending, taking part in the wars the US is involving itself in, fight on terror, keeping refugees out which are created by these wars and the list goes on. This is why we have the two party system, both are funded by the same corporations in almost equal measure, so they hedge their bets either way. They are feeding us the illusion that we are still living in a democracy.
    Hasbeen
    21st Dec 2016
    11:10am
    Exactly Teddy.

    Articles like this, & Universities & academia are a large part of the problem. problem, not the question. The elites don't believe we peasants should have it so good, or have so much say in how things work.

    If there is anything to fear it is academia & the UN, not our two bob politicians. It is the left that wants the rabble out of the loop. They are the ones we have to worry about.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    11:59am
    Agree Franky. it saddens me when I read conservative 'views' which try to bury the bleeding obvious and push the propaganda from governments like the one we have.
    Our democracy is in danger of being taken away altogether. All one has to do is recall the lies on lies which Abbott and then Turnbull and their cronies delivered in the run-up to elections. They were so blatant but a few months down the track journalists have not held the liars to account.
    I am still wondering why the huge deficit this and the previous government ran up is rarely if never mentioned. It was a daily item when Abbott presented himself for election. Now that the debt has all but doubled who cares???? You can smell corruption and media collusion a mile away.
    Tombo
    21st Dec 2016
    12:54pm
    Of course MICK, I dare say you would claim that Honest Bill Shorten was doing nothing more than telling the unvarnished truth with his 'Mediscare' lie, as well as frightening pensioners out of their wits with robocalls on the matter.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    1:36pm
    Back onto the trolling again eh. Who brought up Bill Shorten? Mediscare was dishonest but that paled into insignificance compared to the government's LIE LIE LIE campaign aided and abetted by the (not) free Press.
    My intent above was not to play one side against the other but rather to put focus on the corrupt and incomprehensible dishonest spewing out of one side. Your side Tombo. I find it mildly amusing listening to the government rats squealing 'unfair' when they themselves perpetrate every dishonesty they can get their hands on, sold by the business media as being legitimate.
    By all means roll out the usual BS. Next you'll be back on to pink batts and debt (Rudd debt, not Abbott & Turnbull debt!).
    Tom Tank
    21st Dec 2016
    3:09pm
    You make a good point Tombo re the Mediscare except recent actions by the LNP show that altho' run as a scare campaign, a la Abbot's Carbon Tax, there is every reason to believe that Shorten was correct.

    This is fundamental to the discussion here in that politics in this country now is all about creating a situation to "wedge" the other party. John Howard was a master at this and has set the tone.

    People are simply fed up with politicians playing games in Canberra trying to make their opponents look bad. Meanwhile the big money controls the Government
    john
    21st Dec 2016
    5:11pm
    Teddy, we aren't the US or the UK, we're Australia, and we are lied to by a pack of second rate politicians, who never do as they say they will. So stuff comparing us to them,the only thing we have in common with the UK is that we have a Governor General with a power to remove a dangerous government.
    The last 20 years has seen the quality drop into the toilet, in both major parties, I would like something totally new and something of a system that can be held to account.
    If the majors don't move into listening mode and action they will not exist. That's what I see coming.
    Franky
    21st Dec 2016
    11:00am
    What democracy? We have a dictatorship of capital (banks and multinationals) This resulted in the present frustration with our system. For the last 2-3 decades the rich have gotten richer and the poor got poorer. In the West we change governments but not policies, in China they change policies but the government remains. In China too, the government is in charge of money, in the West money is in charge of governments. This in my view is the root cause of our problems, and I believe the collapse of capitalism is imminent. It may come fast, just as when the communist system collapsed in 1989. China and Asia in general have a better system of government which is why the power shift is happening. This is also the reason why Western media is engaged in 'China bashing' hoping to engage in a war with China and / or Russia. It's a last ditch effort to avoid the inevitable changes that are coming and cling to power and control.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:04pm
    You are spot on Franky. But there is worse to come. Digital currency is being forced onto us. They cry 'prevent crime' and 'stop terrorism' but the real agenda is to control everybody's money. When they have that they can use bail in provisions already put in place to steal your money whenever banks get into trouble. It happened in Cyprus and that was the experiment. It worked well so now that will be the template for the rest of the western world. We have a frightening future unless we kick both sides of politics out and elect Independents, whom we can fire if they show any signs of being bought out.
    What frightens me most is the apathy of the masses who trust governments and who are too bone idle to do their own research and find out what the game plan is. Too late wailing once humanity is burnt!
    Eve
    21st Dec 2016
    11:03am
    I have long regard Rupert Murdoch as the biggest danger we face to a functioning democracy in the west. His gross partisanship of the far right (masquerading as formerly respectable newspapers like the Australian, the Courier Mail and the Sydney Daily Telegraph, in the US there is Fox News and the dismantling and trivialisation of serious journalism in the UK) had led us to the 1% controlling all our assets, acceptance by many of the sociopathic view that the rich don't need to pay tax, AND our need to justify maintaining basic welfare, health and education provisions long held as sacred to a functioning democracy and that prevents abject poverty. The Post-Truth era is here, and the 'age of entitlement' has officially shifted to the rich. So yes, I have lost faith in our democracy, but it's still better than the fascism proposed by Murdoch and his ilk. We just have to fight bastards like him and stop buying the crap they are selling - i.e. bigotry, greed is good, everyone for themselves.
    Franky
    21st Dec 2016
    11:12am
    Murdoch is only one cog in the wheel, Eve. As the system is now failing at last we are seeing for the first time a split amongst the elite. In the last US election Murdoch supported Trump, whilst CNN supported Hillary. This is why the election result was quite close and it got people to take sides and buy the 'democratic illusion" It's all a part of their strategy, I don't expect to see any major changes with Trump becoming president. To get to where is is he had to be approved by the same powers behind the scenes that put Hillary up, and Obama before her.
    Eve
    21st Dec 2016
    11:30am
    There is no split among the elite Franky. The 1% still end up with everything, we still have to argue for things we are entitled to, and the rich and corporates still don't pay tax, while the actual taxpayers subsidise rich people's schools, retirement and massive incomes. But fortunately we are not (yet) America, and there is some crap we just can't buy (like Joe Hockey and Tony Abbott). So, regardless of your view of American politics, we still need to fight these bastards and, as this country's pre-eminent media mogul, Rupert Murdoch genuinely deserves all the abuse we can muster.
    Batara
    21st Dec 2016
    11:47am
    Eve, you are so right. It beats me why a traitor who took out US citizenship so he could own papers in the US, and the same traitor trashed the UK print media by criminal activities, can still own 75% of Australian media. Why can we not have the guts to throw Murdoch out? He made his choice to be a US citizen.

    Apart from the media machine we have far too much unsubstantiated nonsense pedalled throughout our media. Look at how issues are fabricated and opinion twisted as a result. One example I see is the misinformation about human activity causing the world's climate to change - scientifically justifiable but people with no intellect but loud voices and a vested interest in extracting fossil fuels persuade weak minded people to believe their fabricated claims. Then there is the dehumanising of people fleeing war and oppression in foreign lands. Keep them away from us has become an article of faith for the knuckle draggers. They promote this so hard that public opinion is swayed - as shown in the poll reported in this article.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:07pm
    Once again I agree Franky. Murdoch is a big player but in the scheme of things is a small cog. The machine of control is well established and has been grinding away for decades. Next phase: digital money. Then governments and their banking masters have us where they want us and can take depositor money (called a bail in) with a keystroke.
    To the optimists I say the future is anything other than bright. They are a coming and you need to be prepared or alternatively vote in Independents by the bus load. If not we are all done.
    Happy cyclist
    21st Dec 2016
    12:20pm
    Spot on Eve!
    Tombo
    21st Dec 2016
    1:15pm
    Eve for your information:

    Australian Taxation Office data show that based on income tax returns for the 2011 year, the top 1% of individual income earners - who in that year were those with taxable incomes of more than $281,800 a year - paid 17.7% of the total income tax haul. Meanwhile the top 10% of taxpayers (with TIs of more than $105,500) paid 46% of the total income tax haul. The bottom third paid less than 5% of the total haul.

    On this sit never let the facts get in the way of a good whinge.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    1:43pm
    And of course Tombo you are guilty of the old adage 'lies, damned lies and statistics'.
    The top income earner might have had an income of $10 million or more (after all the accounting dodgy deductions). Even if this person was paying tax at the rate of 10% (avoiding the 49% rate!!) he would be paying $1 million. Now add in the rest of the 1%. Then you have a good picture as a taxable income of $10 million is equivalent to 20 $50,000 income earners. So here is where your figure of 17.7% of total income comes badly unstuck. Rorters!!! And the bastards complain that they pay TOO MUCH TAX. Well that is the deal: you earn big you pay some tax....but the only rate acceptable is zero.
    Your post is intentionally deceitful and you mean to deceive using misleading numbers.
    Janran
    21st Dec 2016
    7:00pm
    Terrific post, Eve. I think you've perfectly summed up the global malaise we all now face in this post Abbott/Brexit/Trump world, where the truth is considered to have no value.

    I've been quite despondent since that dickhead Trump won in the US but I'm heartened by comments such as yours and others. There is a groundswell of us who are fair-minded and agree on these topics but unfortunately, our votes are fractured and sprinkled onto the fringes of the major parties, so our voices remain unheard.

    Xenophon is the only Independent who comes close to being sensible, but even he stood up against penalty rates for people working on Sundays in the hospitality trade, even though they only get short shifts (but enough to wreck their day with the family). Why can't businesses incur a surcharge on Sundays? Are the rich so tight they'll go without?

    Labor has sold out to fossil fuel interests. The current LNP mob are worse, and useless to boot. They're still peddling "trickle-down" nonsense. The media is merely a propaganda machine for Big Business. They've all sold their souls.

    We need policies to be inclusive of all people without discrimination. We need policies to be skewed to benefit working people on low wages, not the other way around. We need a government to rule with fairness, not the word and power mind games we see in Parliament, where they cheer their mates and declare "Touche!", instead of doing something positive for their constituents. THEY are meant to be OUR servants, but most of them are just smug arseholes - "Winners", to quote Christopher Pine.

    Can we have a new Party called the "Fair Dinkum Party"?
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    7:17pm
    Jaran & Eve
    Very much agree with the discussion.

    However, I like to make one point which is somewhat Off Subject.

    Whilst Donald is NOT my "Favourite Person" either he is certainly better than the Clinton Crime gang being in charge once again for another 8 years!!

    The West & USofA are poking quite some sticks in the Bear's eye (Russia) and we are very lucky that - over the years - the Bear seems to have pacified considerably.
    However, Vlad will take the Insults & Abuse & Lies only for so long!

    Nuclear waste & Radiation is IMPOSSIBLE to "Clean Up" in less than a few million years.
    Environmental waste - whilst deplorable - is easier to deal with and occurs gradually (Generally) so at least some can hopefully be prevented.

    If Killery would have been elected, I think there would have been a good change of a Nuclear exchange in the near future (21st Jan - 2017???).
    She's "chomping at the bit" for war in order to support the Military Industrial Complex in the USofA.

    My guess is that Obongo will be hanging in there by creating a situation like "Marshall Law" which than supports him as President indefinitely.
    Idontforget
    21st Dec 2016
    11:16am
    Anybody surprised by this must have been asleep for many years.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:08pm
    A lot of people have. But then what do people know about what is being done to us by the elites who have their own unelected pseudo 'government' grinding away to pervert a fair financial system.
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    1:23pm
    A lot of people HAVE been asleep.

    They get their news from Murdoch and commercial TV, so the truth has bypassed them.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:43pm
    As it is meant to do.
    Snowflake
    21st Dec 2016
    11:34am
    I am fed up with the lies and lack of accountability in government and politicians. There is a definite shift in the mood of everyday people about the way our political system is failing us.
    Education is poor, good health care is far easier to obtain if you are well off, pensioners are a soft target for governments and the utter bullshit and spin that politicians feed us on a daily basis makes you feel that you are being treated like a fool. Change and accountability must be forefront in the coming years of politics otherwise all but the select few will be suffering. And remember this, we all get sick and we all get old and none of us has the ability to predict how our lives might turn out. One day you might get sick, lose your job and end up on the streets. We need governments that are cohesive not decisive.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:09pm
    So who did you vote for at the last election Snowflake?
    Snowflake
    21st Dec 2016
    11:40am
    That should be divisive.
    grounded
    21st Dec 2016
    11:47am
    This article thoroughly speaks of....refers to disaffection, coming change, and a recent electoral shift by the US populace, in reaching out to Donald Trump for guidance and help, yet the commenting 'progressive comrades' immediately equate that to Goldman Sach, a serving Vassal, One World Government, Clayton's Democracy etc., etc.,

    Whew...I can clearly see and understand why the 'progressive comrades' well and truly had their behind's whooped - thoroughly -. in the US on November 8.

    Oh well, with the fall of a few more red ragging Governments in Western Europe during 2017...the penny just might drop, as to who and what the 'SILENT MAJORITY' are totally p...ed off with.

    As has occurred in the US, the faux progressives will then again scratch their heads....and ball, 'we was robbed'. Lol....Patriot, Sen.Cit.84 and Franky need to urgently get along to Specsavers.....and perhaps even Headspace.
    Batara
    21st Dec 2016
    11:54am
    Grounded, the "silent majority" is a misnomer mate. For silent majority read easily led intellectually challenged masses. All sorts of misinformation is taken on board as factual and becomes the mantra of this so called "silent majority".

    We are heading for chaos in the world where truth means bugger all and lies and distortion rule the day.

    As for the great shift to Donald Trump, did he get more votes than the other side? I think he came up 2.8 million short, but the electoral system won him the day despite not getting a majority of votes.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:12pm
    Good post Batara.

    You are the problem grounded. Read some of my responses above and then start googling some of my calls. It may be conspiracy theory to the intellectually impaired but one might think some of the things which have happened recently and in the recent past would strike a nerve with people. Clearly not you. Please come back to me IF you are bothered to uncover the state of play for yourself, something I doubt you could be bothered doing.
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    1:24pm
    Yes, the "silent majority" is a lie.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    1:45pm
    Oops. Sorry Batara. The comment was directed at grounded, not you.
    Paicey58
    21st Dec 2016
    11:52am
    I'm surprised Mick hasn't made a comment about this ?
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:13pm
    Bingo!
    Read some of my comments above, do some research and then contribute something useful. I look forward to this.
    Paicey58
    21st Dec 2016
    12:27pm
    Thanks Mick.

    So which of our independents do you want to lead this country?

    Hanson, Palmer Xenophon?

    How will we get all of these independents to cooperate together to form a government? Don't you have to have a certain number of seats to form government?

    You said that we could kick the independents out if they show any signs of being bought out? I thought we would have to wait till the next election to vote them out unless it's a criminal matter and they are convicted of a crime of course.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:49pm
    Palmer is a wolf in sheep's clothing. Don't even know why you mentioned him because he is long gone!
    Xenophon might be a good place to start but what we need is a much bigger pool of Independents to choose from. You are kidding yourself if you really believe that only the major parties can put up a leader and that is the sort of rhetoric one might expect from somebody protecting the current system and vested interests.
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    1:25pm
    Xenophon WOULD be a good start.

    Not Hanson. She prides herself on her wilful ignorance.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    1:46pm
    Hanson does give a damn about the country but she is too dumb. It is good to have her in the parliament but not as a prospective leader.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    11:52am
    You mean there is actually a problem with 'democracy'? Gee average people are slow. I would have thought it was bleeding obvious decades ago that there is a ruling class which controls governments: never elected but doing their business (for themselves) nevertheless. If anyone has any doubts about that then the current handout of $50 to the wealthy should be a timely reminder....and let's not forget the refusal to collect tax from multinationals and offshore tax shelters which more and more well off Australians are using.
    The problem of an unelected government controlling governments is accelerating. The current game plan is to force the world into digital currency and the withdrawal of large notes in India is the first shot with countries like the US, Australia and Great Britain not too far behind. Once we are on digital currency then our money is not ours again and to stop citizens using gold as an alternative currency governments will make gold illegal to own and will show up at your door if you own any.
    It is important that we all remember what happened during the GFC. Banks in Cyprus simply confiscated deposits over 100,000 euros. Given that world debt will collapse the financial system at some time not too far down the track governments will need cash. Yours! If you have digital money then you cannot avoid that. Deal done. As are you.
    Some people reading this account will smile and think 'conspiracy theory'. Good luck to you if that is what you believe but better we all do our own research and examine the bad bad position which nearly ALL western countries are in. This is not imagination and there is no way out other than a total collapse of the financial system and/or stealing your hard earned money to recapitalise insolvent banks.
    Please tell me what you think of my analysis people. I can already see a few of the responses...............
    grounded
    21st Dec 2016
    12:12pm
    Damn it Mick, you have done it again...I agree with a good percentage of what you say...then you start reciting a measure of tripe.

    Hilderbeast, Illumanati, Skull and Cross Bones Society, Agenda 21, The Basel Club etc., etc., = 'The Ruling Class' Come on Mick you can do better than that.

    Try just straight out old fashioned greed. A capacity shared by EVERY last person on this Planet. Yep...from the Duma in Moscow to the Congress in DC....From the Cayman Islands to Basel, Switzerland.

    As Freud once commented....humans are essentially low lifes. You Mick, do a fine job as one of the many millions of apolgists for your 'Ruling Class' theory.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:17pm
    I sort of expected a comment like that grounded. Please do yourself a favour before you brand me a nutcase: do a lot of wider reading. I really look forward to being proved wrong but drawing from the hip is not the way.
    There is enough research from eminent economists and the like and you should not simply stick your head under a rock and cry 'she'll be right' with a flat earth policy grounded. This issue is too important.....and it transcends all politics.
    grounded
    21st Dec 2016
    12:19pm
    Get back to you later this afternoon Mick....have to head out to the Shops...
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    5:25pm
    You've got Money ???
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    5:46pm
    Some people have particolor. Doesn't mean they are rich. Just that they have accumulated a bit in their lifetime. Hope that does not make me a target as I am for the battlers. Always have been.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    6:03pm
    Mick,

    There will always be those who have more than others and or are "Filthy rich".
    There is nothing inherently wrong with such conditions.

    That is: "as long as the GREED of those who have" does not "Cross the line" and results in not leaving enough for others to have a "Quality, decent & meaningful" life.

    Once that line is crossed - and it has currently - societies "Fall into decay" and - if necessary - a revolution (if necessary) will eventually result if the balance is not redressed in other ways.

    This - fortunately - is becoming quite evident right across the globe!
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    9:16pm
    I entirely agree with your sentiments Patriot. What I am not sure about is that the greed at the top will use military force to suppress those calling for justice.
    At any rate revolution normally occurs when people go hungry and I'd be willing to bet those at the top controlling the game make sure that does not happen.
    The bigger game will come with robotics as workers are laid off. The big end of town depends on income being earned so that it can sell its goods. That will be interesting....although I heard the other day that a trial is under way where people are PAID a base salary for doing nix. That will indeed be interesting....not that the greed at the top of this country will ever agree to passing on anything other than higher costs.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    9:28pm
    Mick,
    Schemes like "Paid a loving wage" for being unemployed are trialled in Holland and some of the Scandinavian countries.

    What the "Big end of Town" is forgetting that - if the pleb are reduced to serfs - the won't have any money to purchase their crap.

    And so the whole scam unwinds.

    I agree that the Elite is quite willing to use force against those who will not comply and oppose them.

    Look at Iraq, Libya, Syria, North Korea, Iran & Russia.
    These countries refuse(d) to accept the US dollar as exchange currency and are opposing the One World Order. They are (being) demonised via Propaganda & Lies at the risk of Nuclear war.

    As Donald says: "Drain the Swamp".
    Hopefully the resulting pollution will NOT choke us to death!
    MICK
    22nd Dec 2016
    3:10pm
    Sounds like you have been on a porn site Patriot. Chuckle. Just kidding.
    dougie
    21st Dec 2016
    11:54am
    Why does it take a university study to tell us that change is coming. Of course it is every day of our life brings change. Whether it be lifestyle - health - politics - wealth - religion or whatever, change will occur. And it will occur in all of these things.
    Just by reading the postings to this column one knows that change is afoot. Look at what has happened around the world with Brexit - Trump - Isis - China - India - The Arab States, problems within the churches and the probable spread of Islam, change is
    inevitable.

    We have to be intelligent enough - demanding of our politicians enough - careful enough in our personal dealings to ensure that we prepare for this change.
    All that I can add to this is the conversation needs to be inquisitorial - polite and respectful of others feelings and we may achieve something in our wish to make the changes relevant to our community. Those who deride and abuse do nothing for our society whilst those who are temperate will achieve much.
    TREBOR
    21st Dec 2016
    5:21pm
    Oh - we need to rely on the advice given by 'experts'... don't you know? Economists, statisticians, social scientists, you name it - unless it is signed off by a leading professor of BOSHT (The Bleedingly Obvious Stated In High Sounding Terms), it cannot be clear that the sun will rise in the East tomorrow.... or even did today....

    yardle, yardle, yardle.....

    One day on this site and on OzPolitics would give a politician an eye-opener.... and yes - their flunkies do look at these things for them.... perhaps that explains some of the obvious trolls here with the same old message......
    bob
    21st Dec 2016
    11:55am
    you need to show data in a way that we can draw conclusions - eg a graph over time to show how things have changed. Otherwise the couple of numbers you quote dont enable us to draw any conclusions except from your words - that is to either agree or disagree with your analysis without access to the evidence you say you base your view on.
    floss
    21st Dec 2016
    11:55am
    Change is on the way one day after the next election.
    floss
    21st Dec 2016
    12:05pm
    Great post Eve you have said it all.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:19pm
    I fully agree.........but what is on the drawing board is a whole lot more. It does involve the elites maintaining their status and wealth but the way they are going to get there is something very few people are even looking at.
    Dave
    21st Dec 2016
    12:23pm
    Our politicians appear to be in power for their own financial gain and to hell with the rest of the country. They do not want to tackle anything too controversial for fear of losing votes.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:51pm
    They are but another small cog in this wheel. The 'system' is far far bigger than any of us can imagine. The fact that Abbott and then Turnbull loaded up EVERY position of importance with right wing cronies says a heck of a lot about where the country is headed....and this is not unique to Australia.

    21st Dec 2016
    12:32pm
    Democracy is when you live under a political system which governs for the good and betterment of the people through representatives (those in political office) who represent the majority of the people, and attempt to achieve this majority's wishes. Take a moment to think about what our government has/has not been doing to/for it's people and their hopes and wishes.............very little or sod-all is more than likely your, and true, answer. Sad for us all, isn't it?
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    12:52pm
    I could not have said it better myself Eddie. This is what many Australians are picking up on but it is the tip of an iceberg which is much larger.
    Rosret
    21st Dec 2016
    12:58pm
    Democracy. When Caesar represented the head of the Roman parliament they had shifting groups of alliances rather than political parties.
    I don't think they spent billions of dollars on two wealthy people lobbying the population for Head of State. I don't think the populous had twitter to demand the loudest noise vote.
    Democracy is a wonderful form of government however we have learned how to analyse people and their psyche, the means to win without actually winning, and the means "to buy" parliamentarians.
    We have just seen Brexit and Trump and that's democracy gone wrong. However we can do something to stop this happening here.
    Plebiscites - a mistake. The population of a country does not necessarily know what is right or wrong for the economy.
    Money funded politicians - a mistake. People who have money may be good at making money but have no idea of the challenges of the plebs.
    Uncensored news articles - mistruths presented as fact. Never in the history of government has one person got away with so many lies. Thank heavens FB is going to fix that one.
    Do keep our British constitutional form of Government. We need an impartial Governor General to oversee politicians and ensure the constitution is upheld.
    I also think its time to educate the population about the economy and government because one thing that has become overwhelming apparent is that the assumption people do understand the way the government works is a mistake.
    Tombo
    21st Dec 2016
    1:36pm
    Rosret: are you seriously suggesting news censorship at the same time as preserving 'our British constitutional form of Government'. I couldn't care less what is published, or not published on Facebook. I be a lot more concerned if you are talking about the press in general.

    And you might consider why the Brexit and Trump results occurred when you contemptuously dismiss the voters as 'the plebs'. Are you not a pleb?
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:02pm
    I see things similar but a bit different on a couple of issues Rosret:

    1. Democracy is wonderful but we allow people to be poisoned by toxic media owned by business....which promotes its agenda and not that of society.
    2. Brexit - I fully agreed with Brexit. The English people did not want immigration from people with a toxic religion forced onto it.
    3. Plebiscites - same 1. above.
    4. Money funded politicians - I think you need to look a lot further than the politicians themselves. This is BRIBERY on a national scale where big business and other rich interests enter into FRAUDULENT relationships with political parties to get something. In the case of the coal industry it was the repeal of the Carbon Tax and the destruction of renewables. The Abbott and Turnbull governments have done their best here. And then we have banks...which wanted the Labor legislation providing accountability scrapped. It was. And now we have the Adani coal mine....who cares about the Great Barrier Reef!!
    What is need ed LEGISLATION TO BAN ALL MONEY FLOWING INTO POLITICS AS WELL AS AFTER POLITICS AND TO FAMILY MEMBERS & ASSOCIATED COMPANIES AND TRUSTS.
    5. The media is a player. Owned and/or controlled by big business the media is the method of control. The right wing propaganda machine determines elections and this in itself is not democracy and there should be MEDIA LAWS WHICH JAIL EDITORS WHO RUN THESE SORTS OF CAMPAIGNS. Given that this is another protected industry there won't be any time soon.
    IMpartial governor general? John Kerr? Don't know how you get that when politicians choose their man/woman.

    Your last point is pretty spot on. We do need to educate the public but I fear that this would be a lot harder than anybody could imagine. We already have attacks on teachers for being 'lefties'. That is what happens when you try to teach children to analyse information and facts. And then there is the public generally....too lazy and plain stupid to want to do a bit of reading and try to understand the facts. I see little hope here as people have been groomed for a long long time and they are too stupid to understand that we still have slavery. It's just that this is an economic slavery which better fits the times, but with the same results.
    TREBOR
    21st Dec 2016
    5:24pm
    Here's a good youtube on the subject of donations:-

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKpXbA9DCSo
    Rosret
    21st Dec 2016
    7:06pm
    Yes Tombo I am one of the Plebs - hence the word plebiscite.
    By oxford definition
    Mid 17th century: originally as plural plebs, from Latin plebs the common people. Later a shortened form of plebeian.
    Rosret
    21st Dec 2016
    7:19pm
    Also Tombo in regard to censorship and the constitution. I didn't mention censorship there is a difference. I am insisting on the truth and making it clear it is opinion not fact. Lying and /or writing defamatory comments is slanderous and has always been illegal. If what is written is true then these people making the posts are free to do so. However, they don't have "parliament privilege" on the internet and the law applies no matter what or where they make the comment.

    21st Dec 2016
    1:28pm
    The old political parties are the problem. Independents are good. Even Hanson, though I can't stand her wilful ignorance, is of some value in this because she is removing the rust between some voters and the big parties. They will hopefully move on from Hanson to something more sensible and moral.
    Eve
    21st Dec 2016
    2:24pm
    I'd be happy if our press were independent, and presented issues intelligently so the 'silent majority' would be better informed. Then democracy can work. But with so much of the media failing in this basic responsibility, I must despair. And even some that try to present a balanced view are attacked as 'left-wing', thus empowering the extremist crazies to say whatever they 'feel' because that is so much easier than dealing with facts.

    With an independent media, we could also hold politicians to account - but that ain't going to happen. Vested interests rule!
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    1:37pm
    The biggest problem that we have is the political correctness and the minority ruling the majority. Democracy is a deception!
    Read more here: https://weapedagogy.wordpress.com/2014/12/06/deception-and-democracy-convincing-the-masses-to-help-the-rich/
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    1:42pm
    Please define political correctness. I find it's a term used to mean different things by different people, often by racists who are upset they can't say racist things.
    Tombo
    21st Dec 2016
    1:54pm
    I think it's easier to define 'racist' as a term used by the politically correct to describe opinions with which they disagree, do not want to discuss, and require their opponents to simply shut up (or preferably be shut up by the government. Cf Bill Leak).
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    1:56pm
    Too many generalisations there. Please define political correctness.

    Who is Bill Leak? Relevance?
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    2:04pm
    Well said Tombo !
    Political correctness simply means suppression to freedom of speech.
    Political correctness serves this purpose. If someone says or does something that causes the slightest emotional discomfort, they are charged with racism, ageism, sexism, or genderism to name a few “isms” on an ever-growing list of politically correct transgressions.
    Political correctness is now being marketed as “Insta-win.” If you are losing an argument or failing to bend others to your will, pull out a can of “Insta-win” – accuse them of racism, homophobia, xenophobia, antisemitism or sexism. You win; they lose. And society grows weaker with the suppression new ideas and opposing views.

    http://www.thepublicdiscourse.com/2013/08/10737/

    @ Barak

    The continuing deception of Political Correctness

    http://onlytheghosts.deviantart.com/journal/The-continuing-deception-of-Political-Correctness-605137469
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:08pm
    How long is a piece of string Barak?
    If you are an Aboriginal and disagree with the community then you are a racist.
    If you are a female and a male calls you out you are sexist.
    If you disagree with homosexual marriage you are homophobic.

    Politically correct? Methinks this is when a 'norm' has been set up which much of society decides to agree with and you also decide to agree........not on the facts but because you joined the queue. You would then rightly be POLITICALLY CORRECT because you did not have the balls to say it like it was for fear of being publicly shamed. You would know by now that I have no such fear...whether I am right or wrong as somebody has to break the mould when it is manipulated and crooked.
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    2:10pm
    Please define political correctness.

    "Suppression of(?) freedom of speech" is obviously not a good definition. There are some things probably almost all of us can agree we don't want aired in public, such as promotion or detailed descriptions or imagery of paedophilia.

    So, please define political correctness.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    2:14pm
    Mick,

    Political correctness has been designed by the "Powers that Be" to negate those of us who DARE to disagree and "Speak Up".
    After all, we are many of the names you have outlined & more. Conspiracy Theorists is just another one!!!

    It is "Merely a Tool" administered by the evil powers who ultimately are aiming to achieve for "Their minute Minority" Totalitarian Global Hegemony & Control!
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    2:27pm
    @Barak

    Criticizing Israel's action against Palestinians is not allowed.
    Questioning the Holocaust Industry today is a criminal offence and one can be jailed for it. Investigating and exposing Judeo-bolshevism and its crimes can get one eliminated.
    Opposing vaccination can prevent your children from being enrolled to schools. One cannot question the BigParma. Holistic doctors are already dying in suspicious circumstances. Not agreeing with public display of homosexuality may get me in trouble and be summoned to Court. Opposing Council Rates ( tax on properties, NOT the services) may result in me loosing my home. I cannot voice my opinion in this frigging 'democracy' because people like you will do everything to shout me down. I'm not entitled to my opinion as you have already proved it by your stubborn demands of defining political correctness. Haven't I expressed myself good enough? What else do you want?
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    2:33pm
    @Barak
    I won't bother defining political correctness according to "Law".
    I have my own interpretation. So, don't attempt to shove words into my mouth.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:48pm
    The point being guys that we all know it when we see it and it is normally o whole pile of people agreeing with what is often BS put into the public domain so that some outcome can be achieved.
    People arriving by boat is one such issue.
    So is homosexual marriage.
    So is muslim settlement in Australia.

    Disagree with any one of the above and you are set upon and get nasty comments. Then your rather mild post which expresses nothing other than a point of view is taken down.
    As I said we all know it when we see it in operation.
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    3:02pm
    HKW - I haven't shouted down anything. As one who understands the science, I do happen to regard anti-vaxers as child-abusers and a threat to innocent people, but I am happy to discuss it.

    "We all know it when we see it" is a pretty crappy definition.

    If it can't be defined, it's just a whinge.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    3:30pm
    Barak,
    That is why - after extensive pressure from the Vaccine Manufacturers - The USofA government has legislated to protect these companies and "Place them above the LAW" as they cannot be sued of ANY ill results from their vaccines!

    Fancy you buying a "New Car" and killing somebody (as you drive the new toy home) as a result of a design/manufacturing problem on the vehicle.
    Say faulty steering for instance.

    I suppose, you'd be quite happy NOT to SUE the car manufacturer and happily accept to be reduced to "Pauper Status" in an instance.

    If the vaccines were really causing NO HARM, the BigPharma vaccine manufacturers would/should gladly take responsibility for their product!

    ALL (just about) other manufacturers of products do!
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    3:34pm
    Not discussing it here. It's too far off-topic.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    3:39pm
    Barak,

    I quote verbatim from your previous posting (3:02pm) in relation to vaccinations:

    " . . . . . but I am happy to discuss it."

    Why the sudden change?????
    Thing getting "To Hot"????
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    4:30pm
    I never meant discussing it in this thread. It's the wrong place. Draw whatever conclusion you like from that. I know it won't be a nice one.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    2:06pm
    Jackie,
    It's a coming & the sooner the better.
    The longer we wait, the more painful it will be to "clean up the mess" as a result of "Draining OUR Swamp"!!!!
    libsareliars
    21st Dec 2016
    2:07pm
    Is it any wonder we don't trust politicians to have the peoples' interests at heart when year after year they are caught out rorting and giving their own supporters contracts etc or preferential treatment? I despair for Australia and its people.
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    2:12pm
    Never forget Choppergate.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:14pm
    This is generally summarised under the heading of POLITICAL DONATIONS...........you give me money so that I can get re-elected and I'll let you write your own legislation and will get it passed. That is how the fraudulent system works. Were this to happen in the private sector there would be lengthy jail sentences but because it is happening in politics the crooked pollies award themselves big pay rises and give their cronies high paying ambassadorships and heads of department jobs which pay up to 3 times their parliamentary salaries. Fraud by any other name and they should be jailed for behaving in this manner.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    2:19pm
    Mick,
    Just think that the Banksters create "Money out of Nothing" - Just 1 & 0's in a computer.

    The pollies just let it happen and are not enforcing the Australian Constitution which clearly demands that WE - the People - have all the power required to generate our own "Debt Free Currency".

    If that is not fraud, I'll be dammed (The Banksters Actions that is).
    However, only in Iceland are these criminals now finally serving jail sentences.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:50pm
    I have been aware of this for years. It tells me who is in charge. Is it any wonder when Gillard tried to bring in protections against fraudulent banks just before the election that Abbott won?
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    3:05pm
    Patriot - I just checked and found no mention in the Constitution of a "Debt Free Currency".

    I don't love the banks, but let's get facts right, eh?
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    3:22pm
    Barak,
    Get yourself a copy the the "Annotated Australian Constitution of the Commonwealth of Australia - 1901".
    This document is 1300+ pages and a worthwhile investment as if will "Come in handy" in the near future.

    Perusing & Studying this document "In Depth" will get YOUR "Facts right". eh?
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    3:52pm
    Barak,
    The above document is and excellent & very Educational "Holiday Read".

    As you hate banksters now, it should provide us with One More Convert who is convinced these criminals belong in jail!!!!!

    The flimsy document our politicians have told us to be OUR Constitution does certainly not tell "the Whole Story".

    May be that's why the have ensured that the Aust. Constitution is NOT being taught in out Schooling System???????

    Providing the younger generation with some "Facts & Knowledge" that may highlight their criminal actions might be counterproductive!

    Keep them in the dark & feed only BullShit!
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    4:25pm
    Patriot, here is a link to Annotated Australian Constitution of the Commonwealth of Australia for Barak to peruse.
    https://archive.org/details/annotatedconstit00quicuoft

    346 COMMENTARIES ON THE CONSTITUTION [Cl.5.

    § 33. "And all Laws."

    No difficulty is suggested by the words, " and all laws made by the Parliament of the Commonwealth under the Constitution." The words " under the Constitution " are words of limitation and qualification. They are equivalent to the words in the corresponding section of the Constitution of the United States " in pursuance thereof. "Supra. Not all enactments purporting to be laws made by the Parliament are binding; but laws made under, in pursuance of, and within the authority conferred by the Constitution, and those only, are binding on the courts, judges, and people. A law in excess of the authority conferred by the Constitution is no law; it is wholly void and inoperative; it confers no rights, it imposes no duties; it affords no protection. {Norton v. Shelby County, 118 U.S. 425; see note § 447 " Power of the Parliament of a Colony.")
    The Act itself is binding without limitation or qualification because it is passed by the sovereign Parliament, but the laws passed by the Parliament of the Commonwealth, a subordinate Parliament, must be within the limits of the delegation of powers or they will be null and void. To be valid and binding -they must be within the domain of jurisdiction mapped out and delimited in express terms, or by necessary implication, in the Constitution itself. What is not so granted to the Parliament of the Commonwealth is denied to it. What is not so granted is either reserved to the States, as expressed in their respective Constitutions, or remains vested but dormant in the people of the Commonwealth. The possible area of enlargement of Commonwealth power, by an amendment of the Constitution, will be considered under Chapter VIII.

    " Every legislative assembly existing under a federal constitution is merely a subordinate law-making body, whose laws are of the nature of by-laws, valid whilst within the authority conferred upon it by the constitution, but invalid or unconstitutional if……….

    - from the “ANNOTATED CONSTITUTION OF THE COMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA” by John Quick & Robert Garran.

    www.rightsandwrong.com.au
    John Wilson, Chairman, ACLP
    Anonymous
    21st Dec 2016
    4:32pm
    Patriot, I got my PDF copy of the Constitution from a Year 12 student who was studying it.

    Your conspiracy theories aren't always right.

    Why are annotations needed? They can have no legal standing.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    5:05pm
    Barak,

    The Australian Constitution has been "In Power" since 1901 and, at that time the CBA was FULLY Government OWNED & CONTROLLED. (Keep in mind - Important)

    Unfortunately in 1927 the International Banksters forced privatisation of this institution and as part of this act the international banksters forced (enticed the Pollies) the government to introduce laws that allowed private banks to create debt money.

    SO, OUR POLITICIANS SQUANDERED OUR "RIGHT & DUTY" TO COIN OUR OWN MONEY FOR THE BENEFIT OF ALL AUSTRALIANS. There's a name for such acts!!!

    The Aust. Constitution states the following:

    POLICY 5 – MONETARY POLICY
    Under our current Constitution, Part V – Powers of the Parliament, Section 51 (xii), it states that “The Parliament shall, subject to the Constitution, have power to make laws for the peace, order, and good government of the Commonwealth with respect to: (xii) currency, coinage, and legal tender;

    No referendum was passed or held to change the way how the Australian Economy was to be financed so - the USURY as is currently practised is ILLEGAL as it was not tested via Section 128 of the Australian Constitution.

    Just to "save you some reading over the Xmas period".
    TREBOR
    21st Dec 2016
    5:29pm
    Lest we forget - "those are not core promises"..... (falls about laughing)....
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    5:38pm
    Barak,

    The following also applies further to the above:

    " . . . . . .In 1937 when the Commonwealth Bank was “the People’s Bank” there was a royal commission into the Monetary and Banking system. In Section 504 of the Commission’s Report the following statement appeared. “…the Commonwealth Bank….can even make money available to the Governments free of any charge…”

    This statement created such controversy that the Chairman of the Commission, Mr Justice Napier was asked to explain.

    He replied through the Secretary of the Commission as follows: “The statement means that the Commonwealth Bank can make money available to Governments or to others on such terms as it chooses, even by way of a loan without interest, or even without requiring either interest or repayment of principal.”

    Wonder why there currently is so much opposition from OUR politicians to hold a "Royal Commission into banking"?
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    9:30pm
    Patriot: think about almost every bit of legislation put there to protect consumers. They all have holes in them so the crooks can ignore the legislation....but it looks good to the public which believes it is protected.
    So it is with much government policy. The bastards believe that they can do as they like. And they do...with the business owned media mostly looking the other way as they run nonesence stories to entertain us all hoping nobody will notice.
    SGW
    21st Dec 2016
    2:20pm
    Totally Agree Franky
    chris
    21st Dec 2016
    2:37pm
    we r imperfect people (world wide that is) so how can we expect perfection from those that govern us. However I feel that Democracy is far far better than the alternative, communism or totalitarianism, at least voters have some control
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    2:54pm
    If the public were as corrupt as some politicians were then we would need dozens of new jails.
    Democracy? When Abbott wanted to sell off the ABC (to Murdoch empire???) then our democracy was dead. Since that time they have replaced a truly independent CEO with an ex Murdoch/ex google CEO. Now the job to turn the organisation into the next right wing propaganda machine is happening.
    If you believe we are not heading towards a totalitarian future then you are ignoring the behaviour of this government and its powerful supporters. I wish you were right.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    3:17pm
    Chris,
    Democracy as it is "Rammed down our throats" is merely Capitalism. As the corporations are "In Charge" democracy in the Western world is "A Farce".

    And so, there is only a minor difference in the way of it's execution between Communism/Totalitarianism & Democracy/Capitalism.

    In a practical Communistic/Totalitarian State the control that is enforced by the 5% of the "Ruling Class" is via "the "Point of a Gun".
    Like the KGB in Russia in the "Olden Days"!

    In a Democratic/Capitalistic State the control exerted by a much reduced percentage (Much lower than 5%) of the total population is by the "with-holding or supply of Financial resources" which induces the mechanism of SLAVERY.
    Just think "Boom & Bust" cycles. The Banksters create them and so they benefit from such events whilst we - the people - loose our assets due to these (G)(B)andsters confiscating them.
    And our politicians are not objecting!?!?!?!?
    I call this accessories to Crime (The Pollies).

    So, in the end, Democracy (as it is enforced) is a much more efficient mechanism to control the population and commit them (YOU & ME) to "Serfdom"!!!

    After all, there is no happier Slave than the one who thinks he/she if FREE!!!!! That's why they promote the idea that we are "Young & Free" so fiercely!

    What a joke!

    There is only one way the ensure Freedom and that is in the form of Participatory Government where the people have the opportunity to object to laws introduced and can SACK Pollies.

    Therefore, I will not vote for any independents who are not committed to introduce Citizens Initiated Referendum & Voters Veto mechanisms.

    To "Sum it Up".
    I believe that some pollies are honest & decent when entering into Government initially.
    However, the fierce pressure exerted by the others, the temptations offered to them and - most of all - the lack of "Keeping the Bastards Honest" on our part allows the system to be slowly converted into the Tyranny we currently - for the benefit of our (grand)kids - MUST deal with.
    After all, it happened on OUR WATCH!
    Tombo
    21st Dec 2016
    3:27pm
    MICK, what evidence do you possess that Abbott 'wanted to sell off the ABC to the Murdoch Empire"?
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    3:33pm
    Have a look at the ABC CEO !!
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    4:36pm
    Voters have control?

    How?

    Liberal or labour

    Labour or Liberal

    Liberal or Labour

    Labour or Liberal

    All pulled by the same strings and things are getting worse and worse each year.
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    4:42pm
    Very well said Patriot.

    You are a true Patriot and fully AWARE.
    TREBOR
    21st Dec 2016
    5:36pm
    Spot on, PATRIOT - I've long used the term 'Social Control by induced poverty'... and similar.... take away a person's opportunity to prosper and they have no power - and we've seen heaps of this in recent years with the criminalisation of disagreeing with your missus or with a Gypo or a Black, or drinking 2.1 beers in an hour and driving, or owning a legitimate firearm, and so forth.

    Once 'criminalised' in any of these and similar ways, the individual concerned - MOSTLY MEN - lose their social and economic power. For years the NSW Police, for one, were under direct orders to CREATE situations with men in domestic violence issues, and thus charge them with often a number of criminal offences.

    Why? Because men are and always have been the mainstay of democracy, have always stood for a steadily upward movement in social and economic conditions for all, and thus were targeted by successive waves of what I call 'Created Crimes' - since they are not REAL crimes at all, but are only there to offer to the State the opportunity to attack a demographic most likely to oppose just what we are discussing here - a despotic government of two parties.

    I may well hold the record for my recorded views - having opposed Meredith Burgmann's idea that girls were somehow disadvantaged in the school system so massive changes were needed to disadvantage boys and advantage girls - goes on to this day and look at the results.
    morrowj1122
    21st Dec 2016
    3:05pm
    Step 1 : Regulate the Banks
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    9:31pm
    Great idea but banks 'own' politicians on the right. Bought and paid for!
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    3:31pm
    Absolutely nothing will Change !!
    The Entitled Elitist's are just LAUGHING AT YOU !! :-) :-) :-)
    Democracy went to the Gallows :-( :-(
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    9:32pm
    That they indeed are. THEY make the rules and care not about the rest of society and political parties are simply their pawns.
    Fisherman
    21st Dec 2016
    3:46pm
    We are being played for fools. I wonder how many of the commentators have read and understood "The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion"? I know it is supposed to be a hoax, but if you believe that, could you explain to me why it has become evident that these plans have been implemented world-wide? It should be required reading in every Defence training establishment, every induction program in government departments, and every high school curricula. Also, why is Shakespeare's "Merchant of Venice" banned in so many state schools in USA?
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    3:54pm
    Fisherman,
    You're not "Fishing for the truth", you're exposing it with Firm logic.
    HKW
    21st Dec 2016
    4:29pm
    Fisherman, I am one of them who read the Protocols.
    Supposed to be a hoax?

    Look what is taking place around us....

    The powers that be make sure people have no time to read the Protocols
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    5:50pm
    What most people rule out is that we do have an unelected government which directs all governments. Sounds preposterous but most half intelligent people would feel this around them as the system is rigged against them and for the top end. Never changes.
    And now there is a move to digitise money.........then you are done as they can take (bail in) as they see fit and YOU will have no choice to say no. Coming folks!
    Oldman Roo
    21st Dec 2016
    3:55pm
    While true democracy is still the best type of Government , the problem is how it has been allowed to be structured by Politicians to the detriment of true democracy .
    It appears acceptable to make all kinds of statements before an election and dishonour them after the election is won.
    There should be no political parties allowed and every member of Government should be representing their electorate and their own opinion , Under the present system what is in the best interest of the Party is Number one consideration . Number 2 consideration is what is in the members best personal interest . Number 3 consideration is what is in the best interest of financial backers and what is best for the country is the last consideration .So let us get rid of the Party system and pay a set amount to candidates at election time , and eliminate donations that are really an inducement for favours .
    The above would clean up democracy but we will never see that change while our present Politicians are in charge .
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    4:14pm
    And you thought Stalin was a Mongrel !!:-) :-)
    You aint seen Nuthin yet !! :-(
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    5:53pm
    "True democracy"? And who determines that? Bankers? Multinationals? Business owned governments?
    What we have is the 'appearance' of democracy but the reality is that OUR chosen representatives are puppets for a much bigger game which they and we have no control of.
    I see the only way out voting in bus loads of Independents to break up the game. That is a bit like shuffling the deck to mix them up. That is why BOTH sides of politics try their best to stop voters from doing this. They're scared sh*tless even about the thought of voters doing this.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    7:51pm
    Particolor
    Agree, at least Stalin kept Russia for the Russians - or should I say tried to keep it all for himself.

    The clowns we have in charge seem to be selling of Australia to any foreigner willing to hand out "Large brown paper bags".

    STUFF AUSTRALIA!!!!!
    Oldman Roo
    22nd Dec 2016
    10:01pm
    Mick read what I am saying how true democracy can be achieved , you could only disagree if you are following one of our political Parties . Of course it will not happen in Australia . As someone said " a nation of sheep will breed a Government of Wolves " .
    heyyybob
    21st Dec 2016
    4:00pm
    I think there is only one answer. If Australians are disillusioned with the status quo they should forsake Forums (such as this), social discussion, social media commenting etc. It has the same result as the other 'social media reaction' of seeing something/anything unpleasant and simply whipping out your phone and photographing it instead of REALLY reacting and doing something positive about the situation. Don't like our Government and what it is doing ? - then become more political and actually join a political party, a real political movement or Action Group. It is amazing just how small (relatively) the numbers are that steer these groups which WILL have more and more clout as disillusionment grows. Got to be in it, to win it, not just whinge about it ;)
    heyyybob
    21st Dec 2016
    4:02pm
    P.S. and to all the Happy Chappies here - Merry Christmas *anyhow ;)
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    4:16pm
    :-) :-) :-) :-)
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    5:56pm
    Good try heyyybob. You are using the mushroom methodology: feed 'em BS and keep 'em in the dark.
    The issue IS the political parties. Both of them. It's a my turn/your turn game owned by influences who we are unaware of. Follow the money trail............that will take you to who is pulling the strings. Ain't pretty.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    6:05pm
    Guys,

    "Just follow the Money"!
    heyyybob
    21st Dec 2016
    9:01pm
    Not all Mick. Read what I said. If what we have doesn't work - do something (realistic) about it. Don't just whinge and whine with your fixed complaint on Forums (social media) like this. Do you honestly think anything will change when people simply parrot their usual lines. No - nobody will change their views here and even if they did it would achieve squat !! Get really active in politics is what I suggesting not just blithering on and on and on here unless you reckon your 'arguments' here and people with similar inflexible viewpoints actually change peoples minds and belief :( Not happening, unfortunately.
    knarf
    21st Dec 2016
    4:16pm
    Have there been major changes to the way democracy operates or perhaps it has always been the way it is with human faults built in. If so, what has changed? We now have greater access to information, whether correct/well-informed or not, especially through social media. We also have a mainstream media hungry for something sensational or ahead of their competitors and seem to scan the social media for leads. We all seem to feel we have the right to have our say sometimes with lack of factual basis or based on prejudices or fears and we are encouraged to do this. Has any study been done on any possible relationship between satisfaction with any action by the government or any other authority and the advent of social media and the 24 hour demand for comment. Maybe past satisfaction was based on lack of information and despite this, democracy seemed to work well most of the time. Perhaps then we elected people to govern and let them get on with it and then made a judgement at the next election. Perhaps we are demanding too much and believing too much information provided by too many who are ill-informed or set out to mislead. Are we making it impossible for elected governments to make decisions based on what they set out to do? I guess we could go along the lines of electing independents who most closely align with their electorate. Initially I believe this would be somewhat chaotic but I am confident it wouldn't be too long before alliances are formed to gain strength and ultimately new parties would be created and we will be back to where we are now.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    6:00pm
    In the old days it was put them to the sword to create serfdom. These days it is financial servitude with the same end albeit technology means we do not starve any more.
    Your suggestion of Independents is on the right track. This is the way to break up the political cartel. If this started to accelerate I'd be willing to bet that the cartel made it all but impossible for INdependents to stand by creating artificial barriers like having a few thousand supporters to be eligible to stand. Silly me, they have already done that one....but they could increase the number of supporters. That'd fix one problem for the crooks.
    Ronin
    21st Dec 2016
    4:17pm
    A morality tale - If I was elected as leader of a government, that had a majority in both houses, I would implement the following:-

    1. All politicians, irrespective of position, to receive $100,000 salary per annum plus necessary work expenses. Increases linked to cpi.
    2. Politicians to be on the same Super plan as ordinary Australians, with the same conditions.
    3. Previous politician entitlements to be scaled back as far as legally possible.
    4. A focus on economic stability rather than growth. No focus on a Big Australia.
    5. Reduced immigration and only from cultures/societies that can easily assimilate into Australian culture.
    6. A reasoned Euthanasia regime with appropriate controls.
    7. Free tertiary education, but selection on academic competency only, and education is retrospectively free once degree obtained.
    8. A colourless non-racial society where race is not a recognised criteria for anything.
    9. A reasoned position on the fact that we are all Australians, and resources will be allocated by need not by ethnicity.
    10 Taxation of all multinationals and corporates will be on a transaction tax basis. Tax to be paid on all transactions that emanate from or in Australia. Then they can put their profits where they may.
    11.Consideration and investigation of a universal basic income to replace all current welfare payments. Paid to all adult citizens and without a work requirement. Needed to overcome the job losses from technology and robotics, outsourcing overseas etc.
    12. A 100% inheritance tax where all one's estate, say over $200 million, is acquired by the state on death.
    13. A focus on Gross National Happiness rather than Gross National Product. How does a policy impact the citizens of Australia from an overall perspective.

    Would it work? I believe so. Chances of happening - Nil!
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    4:20pm
    Ronin,
    Excellent ideas - Just those "Flocks of Pigs keep flying overhead"!
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    4:22pm
    Sounds Good in Theory ! :-)
    Wont happen on this Planet !
    Greed Rules :-(
    By for now, Gotta Go, Massive Thunderstorm Descending upon us here at the Moment. BYE !! :-)
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    4:34pm
    Australia's Democracy Rating has just DROPPED to the Lowest Point since Goff got the Boot !! :-( :-( :-(
    Says it all Ay ??
    TREBOR
    21st Dec 2016
    5:41pm
    Can't agree with 12 - sorry... won't join the conga line - your property is YOURS - not the State's, nor will we be vassals of the State set up to serve us....
    Rosret
    21st Dec 2016
    7:33pm
    Ronin - would put yourself and your family up for the media crucifying politicians endure for $100K. I doubt that lowering their salary would improve the standard of politician or remove the graft and corruption that comes with low pay.
    Also their superannuation payout (while rather over generous) is because they give up their careers to be a politician for whatever period of time and most of them earn less as a politician than they did in their workplace.

    21st Dec 2016
    4:38pm
    This thread is revealing.

    A lot of people are unhappy with what we've got, but it's really hard to agree on what we want.

    That's the big problem with populist politicians. It's easy to agree that things are crook, but much harder to come up with sensible solutions.
    TREBOR
    21st Dec 2016
    5:09pm
    If change is not on its way, the people of Australia might as well just go back to sleep and hope it is all over when they wake up.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    6:01pm
    You have to make things happen TREBOR otherwise it never will.
    niemakawa
    21st Dec 2016
    7:47pm
    All Globalist Governments ,of which Australia is one of many, have in effect denounced democracy as we know it. The recent events in Europe, Brexit and Italy and of course the US with the election of Mr Trump as the next president have brought hope for many. To reverse the trend of Globalism, in effect a dictatorship, will be long and hard, but the wishes of the people will prevail. I do not trust our Government and The EU is run by despots and if I may say traitors to democracy. God bless us all.
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    9:44pm
    Pretty well have to agree with you other than with Trump. Have a look who he is giving all the top jobs to: billionaires. This is multinationals taking over government from what I can see and I am thinking Trump will do the same as Abbott and Turnbull....lie his way in and then do what he always intended to do.

    21st Dec 2016
    7:55pm
    reading the comments of the dumb and dumber, ain't it good that the majority of our population still got it right at the last election!
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    8:03pm
    heemskerk99

    Only the alternative wasn't any better.

    And then again, choosing between evils is never easy as it is near impossible to predict the amount of hurt that will apply to plebs like the rest of us!
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    9:46pm
    Ha, ha, ha, ha. What a jerk.
    Only a half wit would think electing a liar who was head of a whole pile of malicious and dishonest misfits giving the big end of town truckloads of money "got it right". If you are the average voter what chance does the nation have.
    cdbstock
    21st Dec 2016
    8:04pm
    It's not so much a lack of faith in our democracy - but a lack of faith in our politicians. This is shown by Brexit, US election etc, & here in the poor performance at elections of our major parties eg 'One Nation'
    Expect to see a great increase for independents & 'One Nation'
    Paulodapotter
    21st Dec 2016
    8:27pm
    We have a political party and many independents who want to see (a) donations by corporate bodies stopped (b) the wealthy pay for their good fortune in a country that provides opportunity (c) policies that defy the lie of trickle down economics (d) support for future industries that will underpin the country's growth (e) emphasis on education and health as a future guarantee of economic growth (f) genuine initiatives that will tackle climate change outcomes. We have parties and people who support and promote these policies, but they are villified by the major parties that have the bulk of media exposure and who clevely reiterate lies, obfuscation, obtuseness and defamation of those who promote these ideas. Perception has more sway in this country than truth and evidence of truth. The less educated we are, the more likely we will believe the rubbish put out by the major parties. Australians need to do more than wake up - we need to educate ourselves and support those who want to see education in this country catch up to the rest of the world.
    Paulodapotter
    21st Dec 2016
    8:29pm
    True democracy is when truth overtakes propaganda.
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    8:44pm
    Paulodapotter
    I would go further and suggest that True democracy is when "Blatant Propaganda & Lies" are a punishable offence by LAW.

    Sadly, we are far removed from such ideals.

    For the rest, I agree with your post. I think that "Change is coming" but it cannot be too soon!
    Tombo
    21st Dec 2016
    9:26pm
    And who decides, Patriot, what is the "blatant Propaganda & Lies" that is punishable by law? Gillian Triggs perhaps?
    Patriot
    21st Dec 2016
    9:33pm
    Tombo,

    Good point - I suppose "We, the People" should.

    Not hard to "Fathom Out" some of their BS though!

    9/11
    Tonkin Bay incident - Finally was admitted to be a false flag
    1917 - Sinking of the Lousitania which was a passenger ship with a known cargo of ammo for the UK. Sunk to bring the USofA into the war. Loss off life was NOT considered!
    Russian interfering with US elections
    Bowwowing money @ interest whilst our Pollies have the duty to create it interest free as per the Aust Constitution!

    etc
    etc
    etc
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    10:14pm
    One thing to add: the media is mostly owned and/or controlled by BIG BUSINESS. So who do you think they are rooting for? Not us!
    disillusioned
    21st Dec 2016
    8:50pm
    Of course trust in democracy has plumeted! This mob that's in at present rob from the elderly and vulnerable, and give to themselves and their rich cronies. The concept of "A fair go" has long gone! The cost of living goes up, the national debt goes up, elderly superannuants like me lose out because I've scrimped and saved, BUT - surprise, surprise! - politician's wages, entitlements and staffing levels all go up! Not to mention the huge tax breaks and concessions for their Big Business cronies! The elderly ordinary man/woman, the backbone of this country, is being screwed!!
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    8:59pm
    I've looked around the Country and there's not much left I can Sell Overseas ! So I Guess you will just have to Suffer in Silence from here on in you Old People :-
    MICK
    21st Dec 2016
    10:15pm
    It gladdens my heart that people are beginning to see what is going on around them. If only the mindless many had even a clue...........
    particolor
    21st Dec 2016
    10:28pm
    I've lost ALL hope now Mick of ever seeing this Country back to a decent once was !! :-(
    Paulodapotter
    21st Dec 2016
    10:49pm
    Take pride in the fact you are aware of what is going on and determination to improve educational outcomes in this country. Time and again, knowledge and education has always been the undoing of the liars and oppressors. Democracy will return, but until then I hold my head in shame at being an Aussie. I lost pride in that, when Howard took over as Prime Minister. He has really screwed this country into something unhealthy and definitely un-Australian. We have become something else and I wish I knew what it was.
    MICK
    22nd Dec 2016
    8:54am
    Once you understand what is going on, even if not the full story, it is incumbent that you spread the information. The (ignorant) masses need to be educated otherwise the ground swell will never happen. The reality is that people live in their pile of dung, feel warm and nurtured and are happy to go along provided they do not go hungry. That is exactly the wrong way to feel.
    Given technology, mass production, automation and (coming) robotics the pie is much much bigger and a fair share needs to be doled out to all. This is where the elites with their immense il gained fortunes don't get it. it's not all theirs!
    Keep up the good fight.
    JAID
    22nd Dec 2016
    12:04pm
    We are closer, for what it may be worth, on that on that response Mick. Only one word stuck strongly. "...doled...."

    We are owners of this society, we fairly clearly lean toward a few ideas:

    That people should be fairly free to build their own dreams

    That there are minimum standards of health, education, access, food and shelter that we want Australians to have.

    A future where more manual toil is relieved by robotic and other invention can be a gain for all and specifically within these two general categories. It does not need to perpetuate a system where some work and some provide the balance to wage explosion by not having jobs. Nor do we even have to accept that the nature of work look anything similar to that which it does today.

    We do need to find ways of extracting value in exchange for wealth by all that live here. Not dole out the gains available from automation but find the individual strengths of individuals, rationally re-organise work, re-orient our expectation and valuing of exchange and see all contributing to the provisioning of society.
    MICK
    22nd Dec 2016
    3:18pm
    JAID: I get the feeling that you believe ordinary people are in control of a country's destiny? The reality is that there are forces shaping us and using every trick in the book to keep us in slavery. That may sound like a strange statement but that is the reality. Your perception may be of people in chains. Mine is having much of our lives controlled and a financial dependency like a drug addict on ice. Some get out of the poo. Most do not. So the elites keep us in our places whilst they reek out huge fortunes with rules that do not apply to the rest of us.
    Your post does not recognise that there is a power beyond governments and that no matter which side is elected things happen which politicians are powerless to stop. But if you follow the money trail it starts to paint a picture which is quite ominous.
    Yeah...conspiracy theory. So was Einstein's Theory of Relativity.
    JAID
    22nd Dec 2016
    3:45pm
    :-) If we are not (as a whole population) in control we need to be Mick.

    The writing is on the wall, it will take less manual labour to provision ourselves as time goes on (failing calamity.)

    The challenge is written, an agile society needs to adjust to keep ahead of the game. It needs to adjust faster than we presently are and we need to consistently re-imagine our relations maintaining valuable change. I do agree that it is a mighty change (as any major change of mind can appear) but it is a necessary one.
    JAID
    22nd Dec 2016
    6:35am
    These comments are interesting and perhaps most reflect symptoms but i am more inclined to the notion that the problem with Australian democracy is us.

    Australian democracy has never been 'perfect' but what we see as a slide is paralleled by intensification of lawmaking and neutering of individual responsibility by the growth in expectation that government should salve all our cares, the sense of entitlement regardless of input, the sacrifice of good decision-making to the slovenly demands of a population dreaming of the Jones' typified in this or that television innanity, the irate comfort of radio talkback or endless news creation.

    At least politics is fairly reflective of us; the way we are now.

    It goes without saying that we need to pull our socks up, feel the world, take responsibility for it and act in it.
    MICK
    22nd Dec 2016
    8:56am
    Politics is reflective of us? I don't think so. politics is about CONTROL and making sure the rich get an ever increasing slice of the pie. What keeps this perpetuating is ignorant human beings who are too busy in selfie mode, going to the club and footie and working to sustain themselves.
    JAID
    22nd Dec 2016
    9:10am
    Well, fairly obviously we differ Mick and I would argue that WE are about control, we are responsible for the manifestation of a system aimed at hiding our own responsibilty.

    Yes, politicians struggle to make a place for themselves in our history and sometimes they even fraggle the fringes but their collective view is so in synch with our own generally that mollificaton is routinely mistaken for appropriate change.

    Real leadership, strong leadership is something completely different. Not something where every decision is lauded by the public but something that firmly begats a more positive future. At the moment and for too many moments to remember, our short-term memories and short-term objectives owe more to our jaded view of responsibility-free comfort than any imagination as to what a better future may be like.
    heyyybob
    22nd Dec 2016
    11:06am
    Jaid - your first two paras in your first comment here ? And your reply here ?....... YES !!!! :(
    Popeye
    22nd Dec 2016
    8:05am
    This is what happens when Gov. don't listen to the people who vote them in. Turnbull for instance after giving a rant about the way Julia Gillard knifed Kevin Rudd did the same to Tony Abbott, Australia is supposed to be in debt but we give millions to that useless UN, bringing in people who will not assimilate and the Somalians and Sudenese that are criminally involved in Melbourne and other states are not deported.
    MICK
    22nd Dec 2016
    9:01am
    Funny how the mainstream media attacked Labor (and still do) for every little indiscretion but barely mention it when coalition governments do exactly the same.
    The deficit is rarely mentioned from this lot despite having increased by a huge sum with no GFC in sight. The mismanagement of the economy is rarely reported for what it is. The fraudulent tax evasion by multinationals and the offshore tax shelters frauds got a mention but have been forgotten about and nothing has been done to end these.
    The issues we face is corrupt governments who are supported by big business owned media and multinational electoral donations. This is not politics. It is however close to a dictatorship by any other word.
    JAID
    22nd Dec 2016
    9:21am
    I wonder if mismanagement of the economy is ever reported for what it is. Just the same I do not agree that mainstream media don't attack approximately like for like when nastiness or criminality touches major party members. We may have heard a bit of Labor in these things but there are possible reasons for this including the beckonly unfamiliar for the labor camp and the satisfaction that the overall system is comfortable enough for the Liberals no matter which side has 'power.' (that is a further reference to the notion that we are a highly conservative electorate voting in our own image; comfort ahead of strategy; security before joy.)
    Jacqui
    22nd Dec 2016
    10:56am
    We must not tolerate our government bring in 3rd world refugees and expecting the hard
    working tax paying citizens to pay for it. They will live off our welfare and when their numbers grow will begin to dictate their Sharia law and child marriages…they have already
    began this behaviour.
    We have no right to give away our country to parasites who will deplete our social welfare
    safety net of which should be for Australians
    We have our own citizens unemployed homeless and our government wants to accommodate
    refugees in our aged care facilities!
    Vote out this leftist government who blatantly refuses to put Australians first.
    NO to the NWO mindset of this government.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Dec 2016
    12:11pm
    Jacqui, it's your ignorance I am talking about. Only a decent education will inform people of the misperceptions you help perpetuate. It's not your fault, but you could do more to educate yourself and stop this level of mindless bigotry and propaganda. You may be unaware of this, but many refugees now work in our Nursing Homes - not as clients, but as employees.
    Oldman Roo
    23rd Dec 2016
    8:34am
    Paulodapotter , Ignorance is the problem with you and Jacqui is expressing the real situation applying to the majority of refugees . There will always be the exceptions but the overwhelming majority is making no beneficial contribution and are already leading us to our demise .

    22nd Dec 2016
    12:32pm
    I don't know what you're all complaining about!!

    You've got the finest politicians in Australia, that money can buy!!

    Just look at Gordon Nuttall and Eddie Obeid, as upstanding examples of this great system!!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Dec 2016
    1:19pm
    Either that or we're not paying them enough so they think they have to steal to get by.
    MICK
    22nd Dec 2016
    3:20pm
    And....surprise, surprise.....the crooks only ever come from the Labor Party. Obviously there are no crooks in Liberal ranks. Funny that!
    Anonymous
    22nd Dec 2016
    4:58pm
    don't forget hooker thomson
    particolor
    22nd Dec 2016
    8:15pm
    Democracy is now "Twenty Thousand Leagues Under The Sea " :-(
    particolor
    22nd Dec 2016
    8:23pm
    JH.. Sent our Troops to WMD War and there was no WMD ?? :-(
    JH ..Introduced Methanol ..And his mate owned the Methanol Plant :-) :-)
    Outstanding Examples all right !! :-)
    When's the Trial ??
    particolor
    22nd Dec 2016
    8:35pm
    And the Three Stooges are Alive Well and Kicking :-) :-)
    This mornings Radio.. 1.. "Malcolm Turnbull Is the BEST Prime Minister we've Ever Had" :-) :-)
    and Straight after.. 2.. "No! I have to disagree with the last caller. I think that John Howard was the BEST Prime Minister " :-) :-)
    This was followed by a Paid Advertisement.. 3.. Get your Christmas Ham at.......... :-) :-) :-)
    Oldman Roo
    22nd Dec 2016
    9:53pm
    Paulodapotter , No, we are certainly paying them too much . It really is not a case of paying peanuts and getting monkeys . We have got monkeys and their greed knows no limits . You only need to follow their lack of achievements for a while and it could put one off Politics forever .
    The only alternative party is unfortunately saddled with their irresponsible Left faction and the Ghosts of their last 6 years in Government .
    Anonymous
    24th Dec 2016
    1:06pm
    A farmer client of mine summed up every politician very succintly, many years ago.

    He said to me, "You wouldn't let any of them run a sweet shop next to a girls school! They'd send it broke!"

    "The reason they're in Parliament, is because they couldn't hold down any responsible job! You wouldn't give any of them a job if they came to you!!"

    "After all, they don't even have to fill out a job application form, or go through a job interview, to become an MP!!"

    "Little wonder our Govts and Australias finances, are in such a mess!!"

    "The people who should be running Australia, are too busy running their own successful little businesses and farms!!"

    Never were truer words spoken.
    particolor
    24th Dec 2016
    1:30pm
    Well said Aaron :-)
    JAID
    24th Dec 2016
    2:03pm
    It is an interesting thought Aaron. Despite his failures, Mr. Trump may not agree but that doesn't make it not worth contemplating.

    Whether by conventional thought or just because we accept without thinking we have accepted Gods and Kings, Presidents and Chiefs as necessary to our wellbeing. We have had them around for longer tan we can remember. When they needed to they took the position by force; media sway and masses of campaign funds make that a little less necessary and probably more certain.

    When we started to find the bossyness of these leaders boring we came up with democracy...to change the deck chairs and let us feel a bit more in control. Fewer may have risen to power because daddy or mummy was able to hand it on but the aspiration remained.

    Even where we saw these people as a necessary evil we still accepted the necessity. Was that without thinking?

    We accept the same in business, is it without thinking there?

    We have seen some as natural leaders. We (outside of Axis lovers) laud Churchill with a fair certainty that all the skins that were lost were actually worth it in circumstances where had he not been there to motivate, ours and many other skins may have not been worth living in.

    Are there leadership skills or just those, finding themselves in place who succeed and those who do not? If you accept that there are, need leadership be more than a role where we as owners find and buy the most skilled and creative we can contract?

    Are we capable of setting or agreeing goals and measuring success?

    Would that capability release new-found respect for others and understanding, easing relations without the yoke of compulsion?

    Is it time to talk about, not of Republic but of tossing democracy? of building fresh pertinence? Would its replacement favour a fuller state of liberty, knowledge and of rational and productive relations?
    particolor
    24th Dec 2016
    2:26pm
    Why cant they just get on with doing the Right thing by Their Country without considering it necessary to crawl up other nations and Establishments Back Passages to achieve the required results for the Good of their Country !! :-)
    Longest sentence ever written !! By me anyhow !!:-)
    And I don't care if you don't understand it, but I do !!
    MERRY CHRISTMAS:-)
    Anonymous
    25th Dec 2016
    9:14pm
    particolor, you are never to late to put an intelligent comment in these columns, better late than never, Merry Christmas to you all and I wish you all an Happy but more importantly a Healthy and Successful 2017. sharpen the blades and resume hopefully an intelligent conversation in 2017.
    particolor
    25th Dec 2016
    10:17pm
    What a lovely Christmas day here ! There's been 2 Brawls, The Cops have been 3 Times ! A bunch of Galahs have pitched a Tent in the Middle of the Car Park FFS !:-( and there's a Pack of wild Banshees (Kids) running around the Paths with Long sticks at 10pm. I'm not sure they are not my Dalia Stakes ? :-( :-( but I'm not going out to find out either !! OH the joy of living in NSW Housing :-) :-)
    PlanB
    26th Dec 2016
    9:03am
    Politicians are puppets nothing else -- they are told what to do and if they refuse then they get nowhere.

    We are heading towards World Government -- FAST
    Oldman Roo
    26th Dec 2016
    9:32am
    Congratulations for expressing what is the only logical explanation for our Politicians irresponsible actions .
    Paulodapotter
    26th Dec 2016
    11:13am
    As I said previously ad nauseum, we must educate ourselves and our children so they can make rational informed decisions based on fact, science and research. We are still sprouting uninformed emotional nonsense which is, unfortunately the lot of our generation, the majority of which lack knowledge and commitment to change our biased perceptions. Until we do that, there will be no real change to our political culture. Ranting about the shortcomings of our politicians achieves nothing. It's our shortcomings that need to be addressed. Dividing opinions between left and right is simply avoiding the issue. Corruption which is on the increase in our political structure is endemic and becoming worse because we allow it. Propaganda blinds us into outlandish perceptions. You can change yourselves. All you have to do is do it! Keep thinking and stop blindly following. As archbishop Spong noted about the blind religious, "People hang their brains up with their coats when they walk into the church!" People hang their brains up with misconceptions as soon as the word politics is spoken. Here's a good New Years' resolution. Keep thinking about things openly without a biased mind. You never know, you might eventually get to see things more clearly and honestly.
    Oldman Roo
    26th Dec 2016
    11:26am
    Despite all the efforts in getting your points of view across , I can only come to the conclusions the Liberals have put another plant on this forum . The trouble is most of us have already been thinking openly without a biased mind but our Politicians are not accepting your philosophy .
    Patriot
    26th Dec 2016
    12:17pm
    OmO
    Just because one has "Eyes & Ears" does not mean that one "Sees & Hears".

    For these events to occur, the "Will To" must first be "Enabled"!
    With our current Politicians, the Integrity if lacking & they obviously gain more personal advantage by "Selling us Out"!
    Just "Follow the Money".

    "Come the Revolution"!
    particolor
    26th Dec 2016
    8:15pm
    I think the Revolution is here !! :-(
    People from Foreign Lands are Attacking Us !! :-( :-(
    HKW
    26th Dec 2016
    2:07pm
    The corrupt behaviour of both the Australian and British Governments.

    http://basic-fraud.com/
    PlanB
    26th Dec 2016
    2:29pm
    If this doesn't make you think nothing will -- what they don't want you to know
    ( there MAY be a little swearing )

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KgrR3XKt1eQ&feature=youtu.be
    particolor
    26th Dec 2016
    8:02pm
    I've read some Horrible *TRUE* Stuff in the last few days on the Net !!
    And NONE of it has appeared in Our Media ! ??? What is going on ? :-(
    JAID
    27th Dec 2016
    1:33am
    It can hardly be denied that individuals and groups seek to control the behaviour of others. That runs so thoroughly through our society that those who effect control are also controlled. Certainly, some gain and some gain greatly. Some normative regimes are strategically placed not only at the pleasure of those of greatest gain but those who have become conditioned to see a clearly defined path in a world where alternatives outweigh to an infinite degree doctrinal truth. An individual who appreciates that they own their society and world along with all others respects and claims the responsiblity which comes of that.

    Structures are put in place and some design to place them there and maintain them. "They" do not allow them to be placed or allow them to remain.
    PlanB
    27th Dec 2016
    8:42am
    Particolor, the MEDIA is controlled by the big wigs that control -- or are trying very hard to control us thats why -- they now call the REAL stuff FAKE news --- LOL the MEDIA is the FAKE news, that tells us what they want us to believe and also divert our attention away from what really going on. Always has.
    HKW
    27th Dec 2016
    10:07am
    PlanB - Absolutely right! The Main Stream Media is fake most of the time promoting their own agenda and undermining the real truthers. We must, however, beware of certain "truthers' out there posing as independent media, for they tell a little truth and then try to divert it onto a wrong/false path to confuse.
    They are being placed by those who run the Mainstream Media.
    One must carefully analyze what they read and compare with other truthers.

    Guys please check out where we are in Australia....

    The corrupt behaviour of both the Australian and British Governments.

    http://basic-fraud.com/

    Australians need to wake up!
    particolor
    27th Dec 2016
    2:22pm
    And WAKE UP Very Soon !!
    Your being taken for a Ride !!
    Obama and Hellery have Sold America to the Saudis ! And they ( Hell & O) cant move the troops in quick enough before the new prez takes over !! If you don't believe me, check out the unvetted thousands of Muslims being allowed into the US :-( :-( :-(
    OH ! DEAR. :-( :-(
    Patriot
    27th Dec 2016
    3:07pm
    particolor,
    The criminals you refer to are they - by any chance - also known under the names Obongo & Killary?
    particolor
    27th Dec 2016
    3:19pm
    I've seen the Americans Refer to them as OBummer and Hell !!:-)
    And the Dems (Libs) or Snowflakes :-) over there cant take Losing !
    They cant understand that Hillary wasn't Loved !! :-( :-(
    PIXAPD
    26th Dec 2016
    10:56pm
    I do NOT vote, no Christian should...Governments come and go, things change, births and deaths.

    The only lasting Soap Opera is the US election..and the circus that is ahead, tune into Americans latest Soap, The Days of Our Trump. So far we have seen the trailer, but Series 1 Episode one begins in January
    particolor
    27th Dec 2016
    3:05pm
    OH CRAP !! Some people Suffer from Libitis something Shocking !! :-( :-(
    PlanB
    28th Dec 2016
    7:11am
    Everyone should read this and ACT on it -- read it page by page

    https://stopforeignownershipinaustralia.com.au/category/government-selling-australia-out/
    Adrianus
    29th Dec 2016
    10:33am
    It's a real shame that certain people want to deflect from the real issues by blaming democracy. We had an ideal opportunity to give democracy a chance of working, by asking the population to vote on the issue of changes to the Marriage Act. One side voted against democracy on that occasion, why?
    Most people I talk to are happy with democracy but not happy with the political platitudes and profligacy of pussy politicians who are not taking responsibility for their lack of loyalty to the Nation.
    Popeye
    29th Dec 2016
    11:23am
    Frank I quiet agree with what you just posted. The problem is big business is pushing to increase migration to boost their profits and you look at the weak leader we have Turnbull I can only see things getting worse. Same sex marriage is to an important issue to leave to polliticians who want to push their own agenda
    Popeye
    29th Dec 2016
    11:23am
    Frank I quiet agree with what you just posted. The problem is big business is pushing to increase migration to boost their profits and you look at the weak leader we have Turnbull I can only see things getting worse. Same sex marriage is to an important issue to leave to polliticians who want to push their own agenda


    Join YOURLifeChoices, it’s free

    • Receive our daily enewsletter
    • Enter competitions
    • Comment on articles