14th Nov 2017

Turnbull's dual citizenship debacle

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Turnbull's dual citizenship debacle
Drew Patchell

In a deal between the Federal Government and Opposition this week, all MPs and senators have until 1 December 2017 to declare and provide evidence they are not dual citizens.

This dual citizenship debacle has been taking up a large portion of air time in parliament over the past month, preventing important legislation changes from being proposed and discussed.

Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull may have his own dual citizenship troubles according to a report today in TheNewDaily, which suggests his Jewish heritage may present a citizenship headache as Israel’s ‘Right of Return’ and Citizenship Law’ allows Jewish descendants to settle and claim citizenship.

Tasmanian independent Jacqui Lambie is awaiting urgent advice from British authorities as to whether she is a dual citizen. If this information is confirmed, Ms Lambie is expected to resign immediately.
*Jacqui Lambie has announced her resignation from Parliament after confirming she holds British citizenship.



Two Lower House MPs have already been claimed in this citizenship saga –  Barnaby Joyce and John Alexander – forcing December by-elections in their seats of New England and Bennelong.

During the week, Malcolm Turnbull lost his twenty-thirdconsecutive Newspoll with Labor leading the Coalition 55–45 on a two-party preferred basis. Mr Turnbull is expected to wait until after the by-election result in Mr Joyce’s seat to then account for a full reshuffle of his team.

What do you think? Should this citizenship saga be wrapped up as soon as possible so that our parliamentarians can focus on legislation?

*Updated 9.40am 14/11/2017

Related articles:
Citizenship fiasco’s bizarre twist
Government entitlements update
Dual citizens may score two pensions





COMMENTS

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Waiting to retire at 70
14th Nov 2017
10:20am
Forget wasting money on cases for the High Court. Forget getting legal advice from the Solicitor General. Definitely forget changing the Constitution.

Hand it over to the Debt Collectors from CentreLink used early this year to 'hound' support beneficiaries who MAY have been overpaid (up to 10 years ago) or filled in a form incorrectly, or who didn't know the full range of rules. The 'onus of proof' was placed on many of these less fortunate from our community. In the words (slightly paraphrased) from Christian Porter, the minister, 'we've reviewed it, found people guilty of failing to comply with the rules and we're sending in the debt collectors.'

The 'born to rule' rabble in Canberra have:
broken the law,
failed to complete 'the form' correctly,
taken moneys they weren't entitled to and
NOW MUST PAY IT BACK.

In addition, because of their duplicitous actions they should also be made to pay for any by-elections that have to be run to fill their vacated seats.

"A plague on their houses."
Rosret
14th Nov 2017
10:29am
The trouble is - this mess costs the Australian public.
Neither the decision of the High Court or CentreLink is serving our community and who will it hurt - US.
Waiting to retire at 70
14th Nov 2017
10:37am
Rosret, I want them to 'share the pain' by paying back their ill gotten gains. Wages, super, travel expenses, ... all their 'entitlements' actually.
Annie
14th Nov 2017
10:55am
Sadly this will never happen. Have you ever seen or heard of a politician repay any ill gotten gains from the public purse? What a waste of money ...just have them ALL state under oath with the proof that they don't hold dual citizenship before the end of this year and have done with it!! So sick of this saga.....time to govern the country MT...not sit on your hands!
Rosret
14th Nov 2017
11:22am
Waiting to Retire - trust me - they are feeling the pain.
What is the most important thing to a politician?
Power, money and respect.
All three are very much under scrutiny.
...and Annie YES. I thought it was already checked along with criminal records etc.
I couldn't get a job without the boss running checks on me - surely people in such an important role should be scrutinised as well.

Given that they weren't, then isn't the Government Department which failed to check responsible. In which case the High Court should have held them responsible and declared a bureaucratic over sight.
Then the High Court should have set an amnesty period whereby all Parliamentarians could check and renounce their dual citizenship by 1st January 2018.
Rosret
14th Nov 2017
11:39am
Annie I don't think they really can make any Parliamentary decisions until after these by-elections. As the balance of power is so fragile the Labor party may reject all decisions made by parliamentary vote during this period.
It is actually quite a messy situation.
MICK
14th Nov 2017
2:24pm
Probably the worst of it is that this 'born to rule' government believes there are two sets of rules: one for it and another for everybody else.
The sooner Turnbull and his low life front bench are put out of government and out of office the better. Personally I don't care if Billy the Blacksmith is elected as we need a government not a rich man's tool to get more money in the bank account.
roy
14th Nov 2017
5:18pm
Poor little down trodden MICK, never mind diddums.
George
14th Nov 2017
8:49pm
Fully support your comments, Waiting to retire. As I have myself stated earlier, we need an immediate Audit of ALL MPs and those not eligible need to pay back all ill-gotten gains (by there own actions) using Centrelink's Robo-debt recovery approach. Can't have different rules for MPs.

After the Audit of current MPs, the net needs to be cast to include past MPs who are getting any taxpayer-funded benefits and the same rules applied to them.
ZIPPY51
14th Nov 2017
10:54am
iF THAS THESE POLITICIANS HAVE BROKEN THE LAW THEY SHOULD BE KICKED OUT OF PARLIAMENT
AND MADE TO REPAY ALL THE SALARIES AND PERKS INCLUDING SUPERANNUATION THAT THEY HAVE ILLEGALLY BEEN PAID.IN OTHER WORDS TREAT THEM IN THE SAME WAY AS THE ORDINARY CITIZEN WOULD BE TREATED IF HE OB SHE BROKE THE LAW
George
14th Nov 2017
8:50pm
Yep.
Anonymous
16th Nov 2017
1:18pm
Turn off your Caps Lock button, Zippy.
BrianP
14th Nov 2017
12:38pm
Make these corrupt law breakers pay back their salaries for all the years they received them.
Polly Esther
14th Nov 2017
1:42pm
Yes, well off you go then and get to it BrianP :-))
Triss
14th Nov 2017
3:06pm
Yes, BrianP, and let's not stop there, there are many retired politicians who have been fleecing the taxpayers for decades, we need to check their citizenship status as well, stop their pensions and perks.
George
14th Nov 2017
8:51pm
Yes, BrianP and Triss, agree, Wonder why the Media is silent about this issue!!!
Poppa Bear
14th Nov 2017
1:03pm
Zippy, you are one person with anger problems. Using all capitals on a forum used by many people, to vent your spleen in such a manner highlights your problem
Anonymous
14th Nov 2017
1:27pm
Yet they are speaking the truth, no?
George
14th Nov 2017
8:52pm
That's understandable as we do have a BIG problem with these self-serving leeches!

14th Nov 2017
1:25pm
What else can one expect from the bumbling, idiotic, incompetent Lieberal-Hillbilly COALition government? They are MORONS! Bring back Labor who, though far from perfect, are vastly superior.
KSS
14th Nov 2017
1:33pm
Oh Yes Lets. Then we can watch Mr Shorten squirm as his own MPs are put in the spotlight over their own potential dual citizenships which have, until now, been protected by the very duplicitous Mr Shorten.
Old Geezer
14th Nov 2017
2:21pm
It wold not surprise me that Labor had more duel citizens than the Liberals. Why else are they so quiet about it?
roy
14th Nov 2017
5:19pm
Shifty Shorten as PM, perish the thought.
GrandmaKathleen22
14th Nov 2017
6:55pm
OG, duel citizens? Lol.
They are dueling, some of them, especially LNP.
Labor has a process. Actually, it is quite easy.
First of all, do not put your head in the sand and not check. That is a big help!
Then ask your parents. Some must not be talking to them.
Next, check via ancestry site.
Assume nothing, find out for sure.
It is not rocket science.
George
14th Nov 2017
8:55pm
Forget Liberal or Labor or Greens, vote only for a candidate independent of these failed teams!
Anonymous
16th Nov 2017
1:23pm
The Rightard Martians are out in force here today. At least Labor is more competent than the Lieberal-Hillbilly morons.
Old Geezer
14th Nov 2017
2:01pm
How many has Labor got? I'm hearing atleast 6 maybe 8.
Triss
14th Nov 2017
3:09pm
Really, OG? Out damned spot. Now.
Old Geezer
14th Nov 2017
4:01pm
Yes just watch them fall too.
Rae
15th Nov 2017
10:01am
It is way past time the government fell and the Governor General call a new election. They sacked Whitlam over one damn $4 billion loan deal and look what this mob have signed away so our descendants will be owned by the corporate fascists.

WW11 was fought to stop this very thing happening.

And not one journalist telling anyone what's going down.
Aussie
14th Nov 2017
3:12pm
Unbelievable another Poli with dual nationality (Jacqui Lambie) are all this people STUPID DO THEY KNOW HOW TO READ ????? Shit we are surrounded by STUPID POLITICIANS

God Save Australia's future .....
Aussie
14th Nov 2017
4:55pm
And of course they will not get penalised in anyway at all ..... but we do nothing and get penalised by reducing our pensions .....

How unfair is that ???? they get away with murder every time .....
Knows-a-lot
19th Nov 2017
12:44pm
Politicians are a problem for Australia. Immigration to this country is an even bigger problem - overpopulation and cultural/religious dissonance.
Aussie
19th Nov 2017
5:47pm
Knows-a-lot....????? Overpopulated ... I do not think so ..... look at other countries where you cannot walk or drive like you do in Australia, .. For example when you arrive in Australia the airport is empty.... we have so much land empty that can be utilized and develop maintaining the natural beauties and provide the necessary infrastructure but we do not we only build in the main cities with no proper planning for infrastructure like transport hospital access etc etc ......wowowowow let's learn from other countries a bit.

I agreed that we have to control immigrations and stop been so stupid and let everybody into the country without a severe check.

Most immigrants that come into the country this days do not speak the language and do not contribute in any way they only take take and take and the gov's keep giving and giving .... We are idiots ....we need to learn to give only when is a real need and been proven and fully tested.

But instead we the pensioners that pay so much taxes and contribute to the economy gets penalised .... WTF is happen in our beautiful country ..... we are forced to look overseas to have a decent life .... Our governments area big big problem as you are saying for all of us pensioners and all citizens .... What a mess
Cassius
14th Nov 2017
3:14pm
In the current dual citizenship debacle we have individuals that have entered the parliament or senate in a fraudulent manner which was endorsed by their respective parties.

Apart from resignation or dismissal should we not expect these individuals and or parties to suffer some penalty for this deceitful and unconstitutional behavior.

These individuals are guilty of receiving money (salaries and perks) under false pretences and whilst they are not being pursued for that, either them or the parties that endorsed them should be required to meet the cost of recounts and or by-elections they have occaisioned by this criminal conduct.
Janran
14th Nov 2017
4:47pm
ZIPPY51 has every reason to write her/his comment in capital letters.
This is the elephant in the room: people who make false claims on legal documents are usually charged with fraud. Why not these pollies?
Turnbull even held Banarnaby's hand WHILE HE CLAIMED HE KNEW HE HADN'T BREACHED THE LAW and kept him in Parliament passing legislation as a Minister, no less!
Parry and Alexander waited far too long to put up their hands. The double standards portrayed are truly incredible.

Send them to Centrelink or a court of law - that's all they deserve. They made a false declaration and there should be immediate consequences, like for the rest of the population.
ozirules
14th Nov 2017
3:51pm
this is a witch hunt and there needs to be some common sense applied here as to who could be reasonably unaware of their entitlement to dual citizenship. Of course everyone is aware now the excrement has hit the fan but lets judge people on what was a reasonable assumption of citizenship entitlement prior to this debacle.
If you were born overseas and/or held more than one passport or were registered at birth as a foreign national then there are grounds for denouncing non Australian citizenship.
If you were born in Australia but have a birthright entitlement to seek foreign citizenship but have never done so then lets draw a reasonable line in the sand and say you are not a dual citizen.
How many ordinary Australians would pass the test of dual nationality under the conditions expected of our pollies (and no, I'm not a fan of our mob in Canberra, but what has happened to giving someone a fair go in this country).
Correct me if I'm wrong but weren't all Australians British subjects at the time of the constitution and isn't the head of our armed forces the head of state of a foreign country.
Lighten up, folks.
Alky
14th Nov 2017
4:45pm
It would be so much easier to "lighten up" as you put it, if the rules were equally applied to politicians AND ordinary folk. If the pollies don't want to pay back all the entitlements they claimed when they were ineligible, then they shouldn't be chasing and vilifying so-called "Centrelink cheats" who were falsly billed for a debt that was created by a clearly faulty computer system. It should be one rule for all, not one rule for all except politicians.

I personally believe that the politicians went into govt knowing full well that they breached the constitution on dual citizenship. Ignorance has never been a valid defense in the courts and it should not be allowed now. They signed on the dotted line that they were not entitled to dual citizenship and it was up to them and their party to ensure they were not telling fibs. Now they've been found out as the liars that they are, there should be some form of punishment to deter future liars. Justice must not only be done, it must be seen to be done to ensure the publics' faith in the system.
Rosret
14th Nov 2017
10:17pm
Yes ozirules there were no Australian citizens until 1946.
Rae
15th Nov 2017
10:05am
Giving people a fair go in Australia died the day they sacked Whitlam in my opinion.

There is nothing fair about the last 30 years.

You have no idea of the danger of the agreements signed on our behalf by these ring ins.

Lightening up and apathy have got us to this point.
Bob
14th Nov 2017
5:13pm
Do you know what I love about this dual citizen debacle, is the fact that these individuals and all of us with immediate family links to other countries are all deemed dual citizens due to the fathers foreign lineage. Now isn't that a stupid thing to say, because your DADDY could be the bloody milkman, so other than your MOTHER'S say so which does not really have to be true for obvious reasons, making your DADDY your DADDY. When one thing is for certain your birth MOTHER is definitely your MOTHER and you can bet your life on that. So why do we have such a stupid ruling, isn't it about time we changed the rules to provide certainty of heritage.
ozirules
14th Nov 2017
5:56pm
the only way to be sure Bob, is to eliminate everyone who has any genetic connection to any soul, living or dead, that didn't live in Australia before the first fleet arrived....beam me up Scotty
johninmelb
14th Nov 2017
5:27pm
Paying back the money isn't gonna happen. End of story.

Stop wasting your time and energy railing about it. Both Libs and Labs would fight that tooth and nail.

Nothing in politics is going to change no matter what colour tie they wear. When you finally learn that lesson, you will live a longer and more happier life not worrying about stuff you cannot change by writing stuff here on YLC.

You could of course stand for parliamnent and clear the swamp, but that would be too easy. Much better to sit on the sidelines and carp.
Janran
14th Nov 2017
5:40pm
Yes but what political Party would have me? I'm honest!
And therein lies the problem - only scammers are successful, a bit like big business.

You are correct, johninmelb, the LNP and Labor would stop any paybacks of $$$ and perks.
George
14th Nov 2017
8:56pm
Stop being so weak. Vote all sitting members out - put them last in preferences.
Rae
15th Nov 2017
10:13am
Thinking seriously about that john.

I'm really concerned about the future and the rise of fascism within the deals and policies going on right now.

This is a very dangerous time for our grandkids and their kids.

Think 1934 and the rise of fascist groups within our government who idolised Hitler and Mussolini as the "saviours" preventing communism. The newspapers actually supported these groups.

Russia was never the enemy they were selling but the corporate fascists using bigotry as a weapon certainly were.

History repeats in a slightly different disguise.
Janran
15th Nov 2017
4:43pm
You'll get my vote, Rae!

Fascism is on the rise and "freedom of speech" is allowing them a loud and clear voice, especially in this age of the internet.

The rise of Trump and the amount of people prepared to forgive him for all sorts of abuses, like boasting about assaulting women, without considering the consequences, is truly frightening. Even intelligent people are stupid if they don't study history and understand that not just us ordinary/average people are fed propaganda.
ex PS
17th Nov 2017
9:12am
Maybe we need to start talking about the responsibility of speech, yes you may have the right of freedom of speech, but you must take responsibility for the consequences of exercising that right.
johninmelb is quite right, but there is only one problem, as soon as you are voted in, you become a politician. And in the system we have, to do any good you have to compromise your values and once you do that you start to lose sight of what you stand for.
Janran
17th Nov 2017
1:02pm
Very true, ex PS, especially true for the two major parties.

Remember the hapless Peter Garrett standing for Labor? I'm so glad to see he's regained his soul and is back playing music - something he's very good at.
ex PS
17th Nov 2017
5:38pm
Unhappily it seems that when you enter Parliament House there is a sign above the door "Please remove your conscience before entering", there seems to be no distinctions between party's.
willie
14th Nov 2017
8:26pm
CHANGE THE CONSTUTION IF YOUR BORN IN AUSTRALIA YOUR AUSTRALIAN AS ALL OF US CAME FROM OTHER COUNTRIES ORIGINALLY ONLY US ABOES ARE DINKY DYE
Aussie
14th Nov 2017
8:45pm
yes Willie ... you are the real DD ... we are just visitors of your land until we die .... thanks mate
Janran
15th Nov 2017
6:02pm
Some dual citizens are whingeing about feeling like second rate Aussies. They don't seem to appreciate the benefits they have over us solo citizens. If that weren't the case, why then are they so reluctant to give up their dual status?

These people want their cake and eat it, too. If they choose to stand for Federal Politics, they SHOULD have to choose - no 2-way bet.
Rosret
14th Nov 2017
10:04pm
Jacqui Lambie served for 10 years in the Australian Armed services. She was prepared to give her life for Australia and yet she has had to resign because her loyalty to our country is in question.
If Parliament must accept the decision of the High Court who oversees the Judicial system?
Aussie
15th Nov 2017
1:25am
Great Rosret and I am proud of her service for the country but unfortunately is a question of written law been correct or not is the law as part of our constitution.

If the Polis do not respect the constitution why should we ????? and if that is the case the country will be in a total mess ....

We are in a total mess anyway Thanks to the LIB but that is a different issue ....
Rosret
15th Nov 2017
7:30am
I agree Aussie that the Constitution must be upheld and I agree that the Parliamentarians must accept the decision of the High Court.

My question is : When it gets in a mess, as it is at the moment, who has the authority to sort it out and readdress (appeal) the decisions of the High court and make a more rational and logical decision that will not cost the Australian tax payer $millions?
ex PS
17th Nov 2017
5:41pm
I do not agree with Ms Lambies' politics, but it seems to me that she has more right to be there than most of the waste of space seat warmers who are there now.
At least she says what she means and does what she says, what a refreshing change she made.
Rae
15th Nov 2017
9:48am
I'm thinking of running for the Senate.All my ancestors on both sides were here before 1830.

We need an immediate full election with citizenship checks and also to take a look at the past sales of our assets and free trade deals to see if Australians actually made those deals.

There has been a lot of bankers and such arriving, selling, dealing and then going back to cushy jobs which needs to be investigated in my opinion.
Old Geezer
15th Nov 2017
11:57am
Think I might too. Then again I'm not a duel citizen but a citizen of at least 3 countries maybe more. It's hardy worth all the paperwork.
libsareliars
15th Nov 2017
1:39pm
Couldn't agree more Waiting to Retire at 70!! Send in the Debt Collectors. Useless lot.
brainstraina
17th Nov 2017
5:51pm
libsareliars!! Your chosen moniker could easily suggest that you are 'pure as the driven snow' and have never told a lie. To many, it may indicate you are indeed a liar of the first order. ( A former daughter-in-law told her very young children that she had never lied.) If my math is correct; that makes two of you.

16th Nov 2017
1:08pm
Kick all of the Right-wing bums out of Parliament House and start again.
brainstraina
17th Nov 2017
6:02pm
It seems that you're saying every person should think as you do. (It would make life much easier.) If everyone thought as I do; life would also be easy. However; I do believe that 'life was not meant to be easy'. We cannot really ever win. So, let's relax a little and not get ourselves worked up with hatred and ill-will.
ex PS
16th Nov 2017
3:46pm
The funny thing is, when the Constitution was written, we were all British, there was no such thing as an Australian citizen. So how can it be such a crime to be of British ancestry and sit in Parliament?
What am I missing here?
ozirules
16th Nov 2017
4:41pm
as you say it could not have been a crime nor could the intent of the wording of the constitution been to create the nit picking interpretation being applied to some so called dual nationals now. Time for the constitution to change to reflect the reality of life in Australia at present. This whole mess has only blown up because of the precarious grip on power of the government leading to pollies on all sides seeking to extract whatever mileage they can get in weeding out the numbers. There wouldn't be a time in the history of both houses of parliament when they wouldn't be peppered with members not able to withstand the scrutiny being applied today.
ex PS
17th Nov 2017
8:45am
We have seen what problems unthinking and unreasonable loyalty to an outdated and outmoded document can produce. Just look at the USA where it is ingrained in society by their Constitution that they have a right to bear arms with no check on mental health or other basic competencies.
Why are we not constantly reviewing and amending our Constitution and making it relevant to the lives we are leading now? Less foot stamping and hair splitting by parliamentarians would release resources that could be better employed to form working groups to do this.
Members are required to fill in a form and renounce citizenship to another country, big deal, someone with ill intent would do so in a heart beat and think nothing of it. You can sign all the documents in the world but it will not change what is in your heart.
Treason is treason, the penalty is not any different just because you have filled in a form.
brainstraina
16th Nov 2017
9:27pm
Just read through all the comments. Mostly a load of codswallop. Thanks 'ozirules' ; you sound like the voice of reason. Mick and his followers have become a bore. Most of the derogatory/name calling comments are about our Prime Minister who was elected by the majority. Personally, I believe the Prime Minister is a very busy man and cannot be answerable each and every day to the flogging of the poor old dead horse; whichever 'horse' is on trend today with the mad media; some of which is hell-bent on achieving fame and notoriety in being the creator of the sheep-like acolytes of foot stampers and sabre rattlers.
ex PS
17th Nov 2017
9:21am
The Prime Minister was elected by his party, the only people other that them who had a say were the voters in his electorate. He is answerable to the Australian people as to how his government performs, as is any other Prime Minister.
How long does an issue have to go without being addressed before it becomes a dead horse?
I do agree with one thing though, too much time is wasted in Parliament with having to answer stupid questions that have no relevance or importance to the average voter.
Janran
17th Nov 2017
1:10pm
Question time is a bloody farce, in my opinion. Is ANY useful information gleaned from it?

Why not have members write down a question, if it's sensible, and have the relevant person answer it on paper, to be submitted to Hansard?

That would solve all the BS and wasted time and money, not to mention the shouting, interrupting, bullying and game-playing.
GET RID OF IT!
Ray
16th Nov 2017
9:46pm
Section 44(i) effectively means that dual citizens are not ordinarily eligible to be elected to parliament.The High Court has previously held that becoming naturalised as an Australian citizen is not enough on its own to escape this disqualification. A person must also take “all reasonable steps" to renounce their foreign citizenship. Some of them thought they could get away with it, no excuse, so off with their heads!

Section 44(i) was originally designed to ensure MPs had a clear and undivided loyalty to Australia, and would not be subject to any improper influence from foreign governments.
There is no doubt that the integrity of parliament and the loyalty of MPs are vitally important. This issue has been highlighted only recently with claims about the influence of foreign donations. Added to that, we have new migrants from all over the globe who have relatives in their homeland. Where is their allegiance going to lie if there is a war and they are MPs?
Nerk
17th Nov 2017
10:29am
Funny eh so over the past 100 years or whatever, all laws that been passed by parliament made may be invalid, because of past dual citizenship?
john
17th Nov 2017
12:37pm
Waiting to retire.
GEE WE GET ANGRY AS WE GET OLDER HEY? I HATE THE USELESS BLUDGERS WITH TOO MUCH MONEY TOO.
brainstraina
17th Nov 2017
5:34pm
Janran, how true; your comments on Parliament Question Time. There are times when one would like to hear a response which becomes impossible when the heckling, jeering and cat-calling begins. Those engaging in that behaviour are not interested in the process and out to be ejected.
JAID
17th Nov 2017
6:04pm
It is reasonable to expect-would be politicians to read the constitution and abide by it. Just the same, it is not something many of us are likely to do. If a politician proceeds to election knowing that they fail to meet criteria and interpretation of subsecton 44 then that is a level of disrespect we should not have to bear even if only they know it.

If unaware, either of their dual citizenship or of the requirements of the Sub-Section then, failing some other mechanism such as a constitutional re-write, we need to ensure that it is sufficient for a person, on becoming aware of dual citizenship to renounce their other citizenship formally.

As the current hoo haa has been loud and painful there should be little reason for future confusion and a simple note on the form would-be candidates sign should suffice to ward off future unintended breaches. I am inclined to the idea of expecting all incoming politicians to affirm their allegiance to this country before all other allegiances anyway.

Should be a pretty simple matter. In other matters we leave it to reviews to sniff out any criminality and this should be no different. A politician unknowing that a parent's nationality meant that they themselves automatically held citizenship should not be a criminal matter and it is a waste of their and our time to have them away from their job. Local criminal implication should not be implied as the rights conferred are only those conferred unilaterally by another country and not ones formally accepted by the politician.

I cannot see how any of this is Mr.Turnbull's problem. It would be concerning but it is a matter govenments over the years should have applied themselves to. His also but others have had much longer to fix it than he.

This is the type of thing where a respected individual in charge of an agile group with investigative powers could be asked to review, advise in relation to the governing legal framework, give advice regarding any criminality but most importantly make commonsense determinations (where they can be made) which can keep the ship on course pending any structural changes.
brainstraina
17th Nov 2017
6:09pm
Finally. Common sense. Thank you JAID.
ozirules
19th Nov 2017
7:47pm
Australia's greatest rock band has sadly lost it's founder member Malcolm Young...they are widely claimed to be Australia's greatest but did the Young family denounce their UK citizenship or should we not allow them to be so called....what about Jimmy Barnes and Russel Crowe etc.etc. We Aussies have convenient rules when it comes to determining who is worthy of being true blue.
Aussie
19th Nov 2017
8:03pm
We are talking about the LAW and the the Politicians breaking the Law and the established rules as per our constitution.

Barnes and Crowe and many others like you and me are not politicians and we are allowed to have as many nationalities we want as long as we are not enter in politics
ozirules
19th Nov 2017
9:10pm
the rules as per our constitution were set by British subjects as there was no such thing as Australian citizenship back then. The foreign power referred to in section 44 could not have meant Great Britain as all Australians were British subjects and politicians actually swore allegiance to "Her Majesty Queen Victoria, her heirs and successors according to the law". At least for those pollies with British backgrounds like Jaquie Lamby, this debacle is a nonsense. It's a cynical exercise in political point scoring by all parties. The reason 'the established rules' are coming under scrutiny now is merely to try to gain the ascendancy in a finely balanced numbers game. Lets face it, denouncing foreign citizenship means absolutely nothing in ensuring members of parliament give unequivocal loyalty to Australia and that was all that section 44 was trying to achieve.
Aussie
19th Nov 2017
10:03pm
ozirules ..... mate there is so much we need to change in our constitution to be able to be part of the world in 2017.

Also a lot of the current laws that the courts still have to apply and penalties is just a joke .... yes I agreed with you unfortunately all those constitutional laws like he 44 and many others are active today and nothing we can do until someone with BIG BALLS decide to make a change and make this country powerful again like was before.

Maybe we need to became the "Republic of Australia" ??????

I hope the future is better because at the moment is a total mess and all our politicians are just a bunch of seat warmers as far I concern and they do not deserve my vote.

Mate I agreed with you hope all this shit finish and changes start flowing into our Laws and constitution soon but with this bunch of seat warmers I do not have any hopes.
Cowboy Jim
20th Nov 2017
10:58am
Getting a small overseas pension of $100 a month and every year I have to get the local
council to sign a document that I am still alive. This piece of paper I have to send overseas.
Marty1
21st Nov 2017
2:53pm
If Australia is still under the Queen as our head, then anyone who’s a British/Australian citizens should not be a problem as I see it. Instead of the shamozzel that taken most of the parliamentary year to try to get sorted out.
1. They should be ensuring the public that they will have enough power to get us through this summer and for the many years to come, this would also have to be at an affordable price for all.
2. The health system is in great need of funding to continue to care for the young,middle aged & the elderly. We have wonderful nurses and doctors trying to work with outdated medical equipment & paperwork coming out of their ears . The public do their best to help with fundraising & private health insurance which I have & I’m a pensioner.
3. The education system is failing with all the new rules & regulations that teachers have to put up with in this PC madness we have been sucked into, let’s get back to the 3 r’s. The cost for parents is a joke with uniforms and new books every year and if you have a children that are say p4 & the next one is in p3 as they move up a grade they can’t hand down their books because it’s changed again. Teachers are stressed because of this roundabout they are on with circiculem changing so much & the after hours work they have to do plus parent teacher meetings which the teachers can’t tell the parents the full truth about their children because they have guidelines that they must follow even if the child is a little p****.
This wonderful country has gone to the dogs “sorry dogs “ our so called leaders from all parties are more interested in looking for some other scandalous stuff to bring each other down, I’m sorry for how I feel but I don’t even want to vote in any election.
Aussie
21st Nov 2017
3:22pm
Marty1 .... That is why many Australians pensioners are now enjoying a great life overseas with units or house in front of the beach or nice mountains with nice warm weather and very very cheap to buy anything you want and only with pension ... no super or nothing else and they all pay cash for any medical needs ..... wowowowo What in hell happend with our beautiful country ....totally invaded by stupid politicians seat warmers ... they do not work for us they work for them self ..... and yes we are going to the Dogs ....Sorry we are already with the Dogs ..... Agreed with you mate


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