The Meeting Place

Is violence in Australia worse than ever, and are we becoming too complacent?

There was a question asked in another forum (Hot Topics) and I started to reply but it went so far off topic I worried I was railroading someone else's thread.  So I decided to open a new topic with a new question.

The original question was in relation to the recent terrorist attack and went like this  ...

How safe are we?

My reply ...

Well, I guess that depends on your individual circumstances, but I'd have to say that as a woman statistically, I am more likely to be murdered by a partner or ex-partner than a terrorist.

Not to downplay terrorist attacks, even one is one too many, but keeping it in perspective, domestic violence is a much more serious problem. Statistically at least one woman a week is killed by a partner or ex-partner, and God only knows how many more are injured.

I wonder why it doesn't engender the same outrage?  Maybe because a random stranger deciding to kill people who disagree with his or her religious ideology fills us all with horror.  As does the death recently of a poor man taken by a shark.  Tragic circumstances, both of them, no argument there.

I get that, I really do, but it worries me that domestic violence (and violence in general) is becoming so common it might be losing its shock value and that in itself, is a really BIG problem.

Aside from the domestic violence issue, there also seems to be more general violence out there in the community.  Look at the road rage incidents reported on the news so often now.

Once again statistically I have read that the murders of men in  Australia actually outnumber woman, and they are mostly killed by other men, and by the occasional woman. 

Is it worse than it has ever been?  Sometimes it feels that way to me, but maybe that's just because I feel more at risk being older and frailer than I once was.

A grabbed handbag that pulls me off my feet could mean a life-changing injury for me now, whereas as a younger person I could have just bounced back from a fall and probably chased him or her down LOL.

I suspect our aged (both men and women) are seen as a soft target by some.

 

 

12 comments

Good topic Leonie. I’m not sure that domestic violence is more prevalent than yesteryear because it was a hidden problem until recent decades. Women didn’t talk about it because they (mis)carried the shame and reporting to police was pointless. Same with child sexual abuse.

House burglary seems to be less prevalent too. Back in the 1970s every house in my street was robbed at least once. We were robbed 3 times and we were dirt poor back then so the crooks went to a lot of trouble to get very little. I think bag snatching might be less prevalent too because I rarely read of cases in the news these days. I feel very safe where I live because there is not a lot of crime in my area. 

So in summary, I think violence is not on the increase but we are inundated with news from many more sources so perhaps the reporting of crime is more in our face and that can engender insecurity. 

Terrorist crimes are on the increase as are crimes against men

domestic abuse against males is seriously under reported 

women get away with it because they know most men won’t say anything. 

If a man is assaulted/abused by a woman he should report it. To say nothing because of male pride is not very functional. 

The crimes appear to getting more violent, more brazen and occur every other day from what I can see.  Of course the statistics may say otherwise and perhaps an increasing population makes it look worse than it really is.

Having said that one used to feel safe going out after dark but I am not sure that is the case anymore, especially in big cities where gangs roam the streets looking for a victim to eith rob or bash senseless for no good reason.

Terrorism? How many people die in car accidents or heart attacks every year?  Terrorism is a game in play from a government crying out to take all our freedoms from us and follow us around with CTV cameras so that it can rate us, the same occurs in China.  Nothing to do with terrorism.  Everything to do with manipulation and control.

I have to agree with Lothario's comments above. Robi, your comment is valid but men do take it on the chin more - after all that's what masculinity is about.

Also, there are far more cases of false allegatiions reporting by women increasing the statistics, and police are ill-equipped to resolve complex family disputes - we have a broken system here which URGENTLY needs to be handled much better through compulsory mediation & compulsory counselling rather than as a law & order issue. Organisations such as Relationships Australia need to really take a strong lead here, but the current anti-male climate driven by feminists and their moronic supporters is limiting changes which are necessary to benefit both men & women in difficult family dispute situations and reduce violence.

Trends in violent crime [click for link]

Thanks for that link LJ, and it's interesting to see that homicide stats are actually falling, (contrary to public perception), but assault stats are rising, probably due to more being reported.

One of the things I have noticed lately is the number of murder charges that are downgraded to manslaughter.  I wonder if that skews the statistics a little bit.  Domestic violence that ends in death would be more likely to be considered as manslaughter.  It isn't usually premeditated.  We are even bringing in new laws to cover some of these killings, one punch killings for instance, so they would definitely fall under another banner rather than homicide. 

You know what they say about statistics. :)

Katherine Benson, a researcher for the Red Heart Campaign. Red Heart research delves deep into the issue of violence in Australia. It notes women, men and children who die at the hands of another. Where possible, its data tracks if the death was an instance of family violence.

At the time of writing, here’s the 2018 homicide stats broken down by Red Heart.

• 38 women have been killed this year. 34 of these deaths were allegedly at the hands of men. • Three of the dead women were allegedly killed by another woman. One situation remains unknown.

• Out of these 38 deaths, 28 women allegedly lost their lives in family violence. And out of these 28, at least 23 of them are believed to have died at the hands of a man.

• 69 men have been murdered so far in 2018. It is alleged most of these deaths were caused by another man.

• Of those 69 men who have died, 11 of those are allegedly the result of family violence. It is alleged that out of those 10 deaths, five men were killed by another male, and six were killed by a female.

Red Heart points out that family violence doesn’t always mean one partner killing another.

While all stats and facts are open to twists, interpretation and rejection, any reasonable person can see a clear pattern here. For me, the concern remains; women and men are in danger in their homes.

“We are not at risk of terrorism, we are at risk of each other”, Ms Benson concludes. “Growing up in the ’80s I was taught about stranger danger. Nobody taught me to be cautious of the people that I loved.”

Ms Benson’s work for the Red Heart Campaign has resulted in her being labelled a “man-hater” by some “men’s rights activists” (MRAs).

“I don’t know anyone who works in this field who actually hates men, we just don’t want you to die”, she recently told the @AllMenCanAU Podcast.

“Men are killing men. Men (MRAs) are lying about male violence. Men are lying about statistics around male suicide, and we should all be outraged by that”.

Men’s rights are not under threat by the reporting of these facts. All Australians are under threat of violence — and the statistics show that most of that violence is dished out by men.

https://www.news.com.au/national/crime/shock-stats-show-true-extent-of-violence/news-story/d0471c4cf92c38d1b85a500154a6ee8c

 

Ms Benson appears to be clearly a "man-hater", as she tries to ignore men's views by saying "Men are lying...." about this or that. In fact, a number of women have been reported to lie about how they were treated by men, etc, when in fact they themselves were the bully and even perpertators of violence (which some men did not want to report). Such blatant biased reports need to be thrown in the bin.

So every woman who says "boo" to or about a man is a "man hater?" Ludicrous!

Thanks Kiah, a friend shared that article on facebook and it was what prompted the original post.  Unfortunately, I couldn't find it again when I went looking for it to share it here.

The shared meme on Facebook that linked to that article also had an image that showed the faces (and names) of all 38 women killed this year - so far.

It made them so much more 'real' and it's a sobering thought that we are so up in arms about terrorism but this just seems to slip under the radar.  I so much agree with the comment bolded in red.

I really have trouble getting my head around the fact that more than one woman a week is dying like this and just can't believe it has always been so.   Assaults resulting in injury might have gone unreported in the past, but not deaths, surely?

The Redheart Campaign regularly shares photos of those who die in Australia from domestic violence on their Facebook page … a post from 14 November 2018 says 207 people.

http://theredheartcampaign.org/

Perhaps the photo you’re thinking of was one of theirs.

https://www.facebook.com/TheREDHEARTCampaign/

Is violence in Australia worse than ever?

Hard to say on my part Leonie, but many thanks for a great topic.

From accounts of indigenous Australian’s laws of retribution to the days of British colonisation and its associated brutality and lawlessness, the Rum Rebellion, Bligh, Lachlan Macquarie etc ... to my own fractured family history where my grandfather’s brother was shot dead by a disenchanted female Scottish immigrant housemaid and my granddad was shot (not fatally) by an equally disenchanted Italian intinerant worker, whereupon my grandmother died of shock upon hearing the news delivered by my dad ... and my own poor dad himself who was a great fan of shotguns and lost the plot more than once. Had to escape from his attempted blasts to destroy the imaginary Japs in the garden (and me) on more than one occasion due to WW2 PTSD disorder.

Life is now more peaceful in my case, for which I am very, very grateful ... cheers.

Thank you for sharing your story RnR.

RnR -  you have certainly had your share of family violence. Thanks for sharing.  Bless you.

You have suffered along with your beloved Dad -- I hope all is well for you now RnR

From a real researcher, Bettina Arndt on domestic violence.

Real researcher? A real DH you mean.

This is Bettina Arndt's CV.  Would you like to compare your own with Bettina's?

So you go by a person's CV do you? How fickle!! I don''t think Reagan will respond to you since he's abroad at the moment..but I do know his CV not only compares with Bettina's but far surpasses it. 

Bettina has shown what she really is on so many occasions..I find her a despicable character..very unprofessional.. and some men lacking in some areas may find her useful..

Coming back to the "Jane Doe" case..not only does Arndt support the predator Nicholas Bester..this is what she had to say in an interview...

"In an interview with journalist and sexual assault advocate Nina Funnell for news.com.au, the anonymous woman spoke about how it felt to see a YouTube video in which her abuser had a conversation with commentator Bettina Arndt about her “sexually provocative behaviour”.

The video, which has since been deleted, included Arndt’s defence of Bester, as she argued, “I’ve talked to many male teachers about sexually provocative behaviour from female students.”

“Sensible teachers of course run a mile from these girls but the teachers are still really vulnerable because they can easily be subject to false accusations if they reject or offend the young woman in question.

“The question that remains for me is whether there is any room in this conversation for talking to young people, particularly young girls, about behaving sensibly and not exploiting their seductive power to ruin the lives of men.”

Jane Doe told Funnell, “Ms Arndt never reached out to me… never heard my side of the story; was not present at any stage of the abuse; did not attend any of the court hearings; yet confidently labelled me a ‘provocative’ teenager who used her ‘seductive powers’ to ruin a man’s life.”

Personal Opinion: I do not think highly of any man who supports a so called "professional" who in turn supports predators..



PS:

Forgot to add most of Bettina Arndt's so called "research" is not done by herself..she has a habit of borrowing from other researchers and has admitted this on more than one occasion.

She also thinks wives should submit to their husbands whether they feel like sex or not..regardless of what the wives' day may have entailed..her words exactly are ...

 “The truly lucky man is blessed with a sexually generous woman, one who believes in taking one for the team.”

I guess you know what that means..do you agree with that? Do you think wives should lay back and submit? Is this the sharia way?



Oh and here’s a bit more..you will observe Arndt is giving her “submission” advice to women only. What about men? Not every male feels like having sex when his wife does..why isn’t she advising him to lie back and think of Britain?

Partners who love each other have a way of working out how to give mutual satisfaction to each other. They don’t need Bettina Arndt and her ilk telling men how to react..her advice may indeed be seen by some males with baser instincts as a licence for marital rape.

What do you think of that then?

Well said Sophie, women like Arndt are very dangerous for this society to progress from the dark ages.

Of course a researcher's CV is relevant. Bettina Arndt has provided evidence of her education and expertise that can be checked easily and she has defended her views in public - see her site as well  Next?

Never could stand that Bettina Arndt

 

What exactly is the point you're attempting to make LJ? You asked Reagan to compare his CV with that of Bettina Arndt. Then you changed your tune as to whether a "researcher's CV is relevant". Are you a twister by nature? 

Surely someone as clever as you would take it for granted that anyone doing research has to have a research degree? As for the comparing of CVs, that's like comparing apples with oranges. Bettina is a sex therapist (who appeals to men who have sexual problems) and Reagan has qualifications in sports science. Nil comparison in my opinion.

The reality is that Australia has not had to face up to terrorism until recent years.

Terrorism , in my opinion,is  totally separate from crime statistics.

The fanatical murderers such as the recent four found guilty, and the policeman murderer, are/were relatively unsophisticated.   If or when the next lot of mad murdering fanatics learn how to make a more sophisticated bomb, strap it to themselves or a feckless wife, there may be a situation of mass murder, the likes of which not seen before in this country.

I just don't think we can include these acts in statistics.   

 

  

 

 

 

 

Violence is on the increase IMO ......we have the drug "Ice" to thank for a lot of it - alcohol has always been a problem re violence - road rage is increasing - there seems to be some poor female "partner/or ex." murdered on a weekly basis - the number of brawls outside clubs/pubs is appalling - stabbings are prevalent on the nightly news .......

We have Sudanese gangs here in Melbourne robbing and carjacking people - Muslim Imams refusing to speak out - sexual assault on public transport is on the increase -  being reported more than once a week   (there is a write up coming out apparently in Sunday's Herald Sun tomorrow -  about that!)

Judges are pathetically "weak" in their sentencing and more often than not repeat offenders are already out on bail!

Nooooooo -  nothing wrong here in Oz -  haha 

Breathtaking and dangerous.

Reminds me of some posters on here 

Deny Deny deny - Anne Aly is a liar 

Just read the article in question, although I don't like or agree that two so different crimes should be compared in this way, the figures speak for themselves. 

The person who called Anne Aly a liar based on the attached story is in fact a liar. Party politics playing a part perhaps.

 

An Australian sex therapist has rubbished claims there was a 'rape culture' at universities across Australia.

Speaking to Andrew Bolt on The Bolt Report on Tuesday night, Bettina Arndt said the figures were 'cooked'.

The Human Rights Commission released a report on Tuesday suggesting 51 per cent of Australian university students were sexually harassed last year. 

An Australian woman, known only as Jane Doe, was 15 when she was repeatedly sexually assaulted by maths teacher Nicolaas Bester in 2010.

After six months, the teenager, who was from a broken home and had been diagnosed with anorexia nervosa, reported Bester to the police. He was found guilty and sentenced to two years in jail.

But despite receiving some justice, Jane Doe has never been able to tell her story.

In Tasmania, Section 194K of the Evidence Act means the identity of a sexual assault survivor can never be revealed, even with the sexual assault survivor’s full cooperation and consent.

This means Jane Doe has never been able to publicly speak about her ordeal.

Her perpetrator, however, faces no such constraints.

-----

Until sick people like Arndt stop supporting predators, we will make very little progress.

Where is your evidence that Bettina Arndt is a 'sick person' and is 'supporting predators?  To make it easy for you, specifically, what evidence do you have to dispel this [link]

How are you going on your response to Hildebrand?

Don’t understand what the 15 year olds awful experience in there hands of her schoolteacher predator has to do with Bettina Ardnt speaking the truth about the rubbish report 

Nah, you wouldn't understand Lottie because in your case the light is always on but nobody is ever home :(

There are more people in Australia now, so it would make sense that crime has risen. The poor are getting poorer and becoming more desperate. Nutrition is at an all time low for those in lower income brackets, so brains are not being fed properly and therefore will suffer more stress and the consequences.

Add alcohol to the brain frying, 80% of domestic violence is al related, let alone overall violence...

I am unable to post links but the facts are out there.

I think the main difference between domestic violence and terrorism, is that most people acknowledge that domestic violence is taking place, and I couldn’t agree more that it’s a terrible thing for any woman to go through, it’s usually perpetuated by cowardly men who should be called out on, I don’t know if it’s worse now or if it’s reported more, there was plenty around in the 40s but people just accepted it. Terrorism is a different kettle of fish, there is plenty of evidence that terrorism is taking place, but the people in power up until now have been afraid to call it, if they do they are accused of being racist, the biggest shout coming from the crazy greens and followed by Labor and the LNP. Terrorism can be described as creating terror on the population, on that score the terrorist are winning, it’s not about how many die from terrorist attacks, it’s more about the fear it creates.

Do you not think that over reporting terrorism is playing into their hands.  Terrorists will often take the credit for acts they do not commit just to keep the kettle of fear bubbling away. True acts of terrorism should be reported, but jumping to conclusions as the press seem to do and misnaming violent acts is just playing into the terrorists hands.  It makes them look more powerful and in control than they actually are.

 

""Do you not think that over reporting terrorism is playing into their hands.""

exPS, that statement might have been applicable a while ago, but now, in Melbourne, not so. It's impossible to over report on terrorist acts, terrorist planning, as so much has happened in a very short time.

""Take the news of this past fortnight, which has derailed Labor’s re-election campaign and exposed our immigration program as a menace.

Worst, a Muslim terrorist killed a man in Bourke St. The killer, Hassan Khalif Shire Ali, came from Somalia.

Three Muslims were arrested for an alleged terrorist plot. Their families came from Turkey.

Three more Muslims were convicted of planning a mass terrorist attack in Federation Square. Their families came from Lebanon, yet another Muslim country.""

Melb Her Sun

There is a groundswell of anger and fear  building in Melbourne and Victoria in general, in part, because there has in actual fact been under reporting, because the media, police, and politicians have been too afraid to speak the truth.

Apart from the terrorism, the numbers of gang assaults and robberies have escalated incredibly in the last few years, but especially in the last two/three.

Those who want to bury their heads in the sand, and not acknowledge what is happening here in Melbourne,  are every bit as much to blame as the politicians, etc.

Darcy it is a worldwide thing, not just in Melbourne, the fear that is put into our community via media is not going to solve or help the situation, no bridges will be built, instead it will make things worse. 

As I said, the terrorists are winning their battle to cause a disproportionate amount of hysteria to the harm they actually cause.  There is a difference in burrying your head in the sand and jumping at shadows.

ex PS - spare us your leftie apologist dribble

its thinking like yours that has caused the problems in the first world 

Musicveg, you miss the point.

ExPS simply incorrect as well as missing the point.

Lothario, spare us your mindless Right Wing hysterical misdirection.  Your thoughtless support of a populist directionless government is what is driving us relentlessly to moral and financial ruin as a country and as individuals.

I certainly lean to the left, but so do half the population of this country, I quess that makes me a leaner, but the main danger to this nation are those who are firmly cemented so far to the Right or Left that they can't think outside that very narrow political view that is dictated to them by their mindless politics.  People who are drawn to extreme politics seem to be enamoured with the idea that in doing so they do not have to actually think for themselves, they are comforted by the fact that they will always be told what to think and do by their perfect leaders.

darcy, you made the point that it is impossible to over state terrorist activity, I simply asked the question, is over reporting terrorist activities doing exactly what they want?  The IRA won political concessions and a voice for their political arm by the use of terrorism, yet it caused relatively  litttle damage but managed to make world headlines by deliberatley hitting soft targets.

Every time we incorrectly report an act of violence as terrorism, the leaders of these organizations put a satisfied grin on their faces.

Should we report genuine cases of terrorism, definatley, should we verify the facts before reporting yes.

 

exPS you continue to miss the point....I suspect deliberately. 

12 comments