Election 2016: what was all that about?

A vote for the LNP was said to be a vote for stability. Well so much for that!

The media contingent has been quick to jump in and judge what went wrong for the Turnbull Government.

But surely there is a whiff of hypocrisy from those who have rushed in to say how badly Malcolm misjudged the electorate for most of these self-same reporters who called the election as good as won by the Turnbull Government a full week ago in the wake of the Brexit vote. A vote for the LNP would be a vote for stability virtually all newspaper editors declared. Well so much for that!

The Australian public were obviously very fed up with an overly long campaign, but they were also very clear in their purpose and did not simply accept that the $50 billion company tax cuts would sooner or later trickle down and improve the economy, even if this was the centrepiece of the ‘plan’ touted by Turnbull Government ministers. The public simply didn’t buy it.

So all bets are now off.

At the time of writing there are 10 seats yet to be declared, with the Coalition on 68 and the Labor Party holding 67. There are two Prime Ministers in waiting and negotiations with crossbenchers have begun in earnest.

So what does this mean for retirees? It means that the Budget 2016 measures, particularly those related to superannuation, are on hold at best and more likely to be scuttled, particularly the retrospective changes to the lifetime cap for non-concessional super contributions. And should it be the Labor Party which forms government, then a Royal Commission into the banking sector is entirely possible. Such an enquiry may – and should - result in the much tougher application of regulations with much more serious penalties for those who transgress. It also means that an increase in the age of entitlement for an Age Pension – from 67 to 70 by 2030 – is another ‘zombie’ measure which is unlikely to see the light of day.

Those who remember the 2010 election will recall the confusing days following polling day as the nation waited to see who would form government. But whilst it is disheartening to once again not have a clear mandate for one party or another, it is worth recalling that the subsequent so-called minority government led by Julia Gillard, with the support of independents Rob Oakeshott and Tony Windsor, managed to pass an impressive number of groundbreaking, even controversial, legislative bills.

We have no idea who will next lead our nation. It may take as long as two to three weeks before we learn who will form government. But in a world of turmoil and uncertainty, we might remember how lucky we are to live in a country which is stable, secure and where most of us still have a roof over our heads and a meal on the table. A country where governments can change without a drop of blood being shed.

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    COMMENTS

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    Amadeoz
    5th Jul 2016
    10:17am
    The two parties are negotiating with the independents. That is wrong in my view. They should talk with one another, negotiate their plans, agree on what they both aim at, that can be bargained on a compromise and clearly state what will be done about those things that are absolutely unreconcilable. Both parties must work together for the best of the people, not obstruct one another to achieve results for only half the people. Thus they do not need the independents who will otherwise make deals for even smaller interest groups and blackmail the large majority.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    11:11am
    A government of national reconcilation or a government of wrecking a silly nation? Hi, Swag....
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    11:29am
    A bipartisan government would be wonderful Amadeoz but we hear on Q&A last night that both sides do not want to negotiate with anybody. This is the sick psyche they have in their DNA and the reason why the country is being mismanaged by both sides.
    I agree with Debbie who rightly says in the article that Australians did not accept the lie of a trickle down effect. This has been shown NOT to work and I care not if the government has supporters in the Treasury because if it don't work then you don't implement it unless you are doing a wealth transfer from the poor to the rich. That is what was proposed, sold as good for the economy when it was anything but.
    As I routinely allege the commercial media ran their campaign and groomed THEIR MAN...but it backfired. So if the chosen one did not get up with all of that help then the public does not accept the lies which were peddled as fact through the commercial Press. Please sit up and take note Rupert. You are on the nose as are your fellow commercial outlets.
    Travellersjoy
    5th Jul 2016
    12:09pm
    We are not at war or in any other national crisis that would justify taking away citizens' right to have different views of what sort of country we want.

    I cannot imagine any LNP grouping being willing to accept the sort of changes I would want, so I prefer to have distinct parties with, hopefully, intelligent approaches to the future.

    To me, it is clear that 'trickle down' neo liberal economics has served most Australians very poorly indeed, and exposed our economy to the rapacity of the non human corporation devoted only to profit for itself. While there seemed to be a consensus between the parties, people like me who strongly disagree with selling off national assets built over 2 centuries by our ancestors who paid a lot of tax, to allow a few people and corporations to escape tax and pocket the profits, had no-one to vote for. Now I do, because more people have woken up to how we have been robbed of our birthright. That wouldn't have happened without open debate and even dispute.

    Democracy with universal adult suffrage has had about 100 years, against centuries of absolute monarchies and other sorts of tyranny. We are still figuring out how to ensure it works really well for all of us, not just the rich and powerful we inherited from those old aristocracies. I am not ready to give up.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    1:06pm
    Like Oil & Water.. Big News & Unions Don't Mix !! :-(
    Rae
    5th Jul 2016
    1:42pm
    Very nicely said Travellersjoy. I agree.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    1:48pm
    Shakespeare Knew in advance .. "All to do about Nothing " :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:37pm
    Ditto. We are all waking up. That is what the top end of town has not understood. Isn't the information age (internet) wonderful.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    3:54pm
    If the Media Cant tell the Public the Truth about what's going down on Earth ! I CERTAINLY WILL !!
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    3:58pm
    Have a Go at what Shortchange (and others) is saying about One Nation :-) :-)
    They absolutely hate anyone telling the Truth and Enlightening the Masses !! :-) :-)
    Kato
    5th Jul 2016
    8:13pm
    The LNP and the Labour party are the same any way.
    buby
    5th Jul 2016
    9:02pm
    Absolutely MICK, its about time we woke UP, and stopped being GAGA, about whom your voting in.
    Time to stand UP and be counted, and let them know we are not here to become another down country. the oldies worked hard to make it a great country, and the newbies have run it down. Time to Carry ON the oldies good work, but we have so many obstacles to push through.
    Multicultural problems were great until some certain ppls decided they wanted in, and to run down our great country.
    But hey we can make it great again, we have the expertise.
    And why are there other countries coming in to control our utilities... ITs NOT on.
    those at the top are trying to stick it to us......WE might be old, But i'm sure we ARE not that senile......YET
    maxchugg
    9th Jul 2016
    1:31pm
    Buby, I'm fed up with those who wish to cause those of us who are retired to feel guilty about so-called intergenerational debt.

    We were sufficiently fortunate to live in a time when there was plenty of employment, we worked hard and paid our taxes. We had no support with such things as childcare, we made do, and we have funded the infrastructure which now exists and will be passed on to the next generation.

    This is not to say that our current debt problem is not something that we should ignore, but the remedy should fall across the entire community, not just the usual suckers, those on age pensions and the lower paid members of our society. When we complain about the measures available to the wealthy to effectively decide how much tax they will pay, if they pay anything at all, we hear excuses such as that most of the tax revenue comes from the wealthy. Yet is is established that the rich are continuing to get richer and the poor are still getting poorer.
    Amadeoz
    5th Jul 2016
    10:25am
    Malcolm, give Bill a call and invite him for golf, lunch and serious talks about positive, constructive, harmonious government over the next decade. Forget don't call on Pauline etc. they can call you later if they want to contribute their penny.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    10:34am
    I believe this is already happening and they both know that their political survival depends on their co-operation with each other. Neither can win but together they can have a big win.
    Grateful
    5th Jul 2016
    10:52am
    So much logic and common sense there Amadeoz. The way they handle this dilemma will tell us all who has the interests of Australia or their own political ambitions.
    There will NEVER be a genuine, logical and essential total revision of the taxation and welfare systems without bi-partisanship between the two major parties.
    While those vital issues remain political hot potatoes, we will never see the disastrous debt reduced. Paul Kelly is completely right with his comment on Q&A last night that this generation is being blatantly IMMORAL while we selfishly keep demanding to be provided with all the incomparable benefits that this "lucky" country provides when we are no longer so lucky, paid for with debt and then leaving later generations to pay the bill.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    11:12am
    Right, OG - but will the Australian people win if these sets of clowns respective win together?

    THAT is the only question in town today....
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    11:15am
    As for leaving 'debt for future generations' - I figure many of us have paid our dues in more ways than one.... and OUR 'debt' has already been paid.

    Look elsewhere - say to governments and their largesse to self and cronies - for your criticism over debt accumulation.
    Grateful
    5th Jul 2016
    11:34am
    So, Trebor, you clearly have not analysed where that debt came from, starting with the Howard/Costello desperate vote catching budgets of 2001, 2004, and 2007, which took advantage of the billions of dollars coming from the mining boom and provided unbelievable, and now unsustainable, huge taxation and welfare benefits for which we are now ALL having to pay the price.
    This generation has NOT paid for that yet still derive all the huge "benefits" that are provided to TOO FEW. THAT'S what the protest vote was all about here and in Brexit. Too much for too few with the gap between the have's and the have nots having become too great.
    It is happening throughout the entire world. Is anyone brave enough to finally say enough is enough and reverse that trend? I frankly think that many Australians cannot see that from the current parties, especially the retiring government, so we see the massive vote from the minor parties which look like undermining the entire system of government.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    11:52am
    I disagree. Way too many people in this country rely on welfare today. If people would get off their posteriors, stop whinging and have a go Australia would be a much wealthier country.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    1:13pm
    There are manifold reason why this debt has developed - including the sell-off of revenue gathering utilities, which simultaneously reduced revenue to government while creating upward pressure on incomes to cater for the doubled and trebled costs to the consumer involved.

    Indeed, sir - I have analysed this to the max - perhaps you are locked into the ideological stance that somehow all this magic debt arrived in one term from one party - when the truth is that the social and economic directions of this country and the parties that have purported to govern it on our behalf has lead us directly down the path of debt, increasing disadvantage for the many, social disruption, and permanent and growing unemployment in a market with no hope.

    I think that pretty well sums it up.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    1:16pm
    Point the JOBS out Geezer ?? If a job does come up they are lined up for it like a Soup Kitchen :-( :-( Just heard on the Radio in the 70s 96% of Manufacturing was done in Australia, and now its 6% ?? I think We've been SOLD OUT !! :-( :-(
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:10pm
    YOu hit the nail on the head Particolor
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    5:34pm
    Old Geezer, you are quick with the 'simple' and popular solution of blaming the victims of social failure. Get off your posterior and offer the underprivileged work and see how many refuse it. If it's on fair terms, you'll be swamped with willing applicants. Bottom line is technology and imports have taken the jobs and greedy, tax-evading multi-national corporates have taken the profits to Panama, and those you accuse are left to pay for the rich man's greed and the government's abject failure to address the problem.
    ex PS
    5th Jul 2016
    5:35pm
    We have just seen overwhelming support for rational, bipartisan initiatives by the so calleds to get together and try to problem solve the nations woes.
    Not even three comments in and we are starting to bring up what Coles did twenty years ago and how Woolworths would have done it better. Sometimes I just don't get so called intelligent people.
    We can learn from the past, but we can not really benefit by constantly reliving it.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    6:06pm
    I don't have any work now to offer anyone Rainey. With technology I can handle it all myself with time to spare. In fact I have today taken on some freelance work because the person wanting it done can't find anyone to do it for them at a sensible price. I could have said no but this person is a struggles financially so I am more than happy to help them out. Lots of people have now priced themselves out of work.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    6:17pm
    I think the Government might have done the same thing ! :-) :-)
    Alex
    5th Jul 2016
    7:39pm
    Most of us retirees did not get anything whatsoever from Howard/Costello nor did we borrow anything. Much of their largess went in family benefits to younger families. Any concessions to retirees did not compensate for the aged pension that should have been paid. Seniors have paid for their pensions by a life time of contributions and are now having their money stolen as assuredly as if someone went to the bank and withdrew it as most seniors do not get an aged pension. Australia is the only country in the world that has stolen people's pension contributions and does not pay an aged pension/or contributory aged pension. We can live with a level of debt and maintain our social obligations just as families with a mortgage do. It will be paid down when this recession ends as it inevitably will and we have more national assets to sell off. Social policy is as important as economic policy and paying down debt is not an excuse for exclusively robbing old people.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    7:49pm
    O Well Said :-)
    buby
    5th Jul 2016
    9:07pm
    YEs Amadeoz, it time they learn to work together. Cause its not happening in their parties its obvious.
    Yes Alex, the Politicians are really reaping it in.
    I mean my cousin in Canada, get a Pension, as well as her super to live on for the rest of her life.
    HOW stupid do these Aussie Politicians think we are.
    Obviously they are screwing up good and proper.
    WAke UP, and you can't work something out you guys, when you get together for a chat, I certainly won't put a tick in for you guys at all, and completely vote you out :) i wonder how that will turn out eh!!
    Anonymous
    6th Jul 2016
    7:50am
    Absolutely right, Alex. But more importantly, the government needs to recognize that we are living in an age of massive economic and social change. Despite the BS that people like Old Geezer spew, there is LESS AND LESS WORK AVAILABLE FOR HUMANS. Technology is taking jobs. Last night, we heard predictions that in 15 years time there will be 5 million fewer jobs available in Australia than there are today.
    We need to modify our education system, but we also need to restructure society. Telling people to ''get off their posterior'' and work when there is no work to do is stupid. We need to recognize that economic change is disenfranchising millions and social change must happen along with that economic change. There has to be a complete change of thinking, and that, I think, was the key message in Saturday's election - that we are all heartily sick of the notion that economic change should benefit the haves and increasingly disenfranchise the have nots.
    We should be encouraging - and funding - EARLIER retirement, shorter working hours, more full-time parenting, more full-time caring roles, greater freedom to choose a creative lifestyle or move to simpler, more self-sufficient living- all FUNDED BY TAXING THE HAVES MORE. The time for tax cuts is gone. Society can't afford to reduce taxes. And the affluence of the haves and the monies stashed in tax havens proves there is no justification for doing so - except at the low end.
    If we don't embrace social change, we will have increasing poverty driving revolution. Saturday saw a revolution of sorts - a peaceful one. A smart government will listen and respond, not push the disenfranchised toward the greater desperation that drives less peaceful revolt.
    Anonymous
    6th Jul 2016
    7:56am
    Old Geezer says ''I don't have any work now to offer anyone Rainey. With technology I can handle it all myself with time to spare.''

    Just shot himself in the foot. Proved the stupidity of his own argument.

    There ARE NO JOBS, Old Geezer. Technology has displaced human labour, and it continues to do so at an alarming rate. And if we keep allowing the privileged - like you - to LIE and insist the victims of the problem are to blame for their demise (a claim made by the greedy privileged who just want more for themselves) we will have rapidly growing poverty and rapidly growing social unrest that will not end well.
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    3:26pm
    What happened to Robots will take over the Manual Work and the People will sit on the Beach and Suck Pineapple Juice and so forth ??
    All I see is people that once had a Job trying to get one, and living in almost poverty ! Hopelessly !! :-( :-(
    While Fat Controllers Live the Life of Riley ! :-(
    Ever get the feeling You were LIED To ??
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    4:16pm
    Wonderful post Rainey and so on the facts.
    Geezer? A rusted on ex pollie hack is the best case scenario methinks.
    Gee Whiz
    5th Jul 2016
    10:48am
    Malcolm Turnbull and Scott Morrison were always going to lose the election for the liberals.

    They are both egotistical, arrogant, snobbish and so out of touch with the electorate they could be from another planet.

    The crazy budget delivered by Morrison was designed for the rich and famous. The attack on superannuants alienated over two million voters. Did they really think these people would vote for them?

    Then came the $50 billion tax breaks to big business in the belief they would pass the tax cuts onto the public; Disney land economics and thinking.

    The came the $50 billion for Submarines given to a fraudulent French company with a delivery date of between 5 and 10 years; more waste of taxpayers money.

    The list of mistakes by Turnbull and his cabinet are unbelievable. And how much have they given back to Australians in the way of infrastructure, medical improvements, roads, and a standard gauge railway system capable of carrying high speed trains nation wide.

    They gave nothing, zilch.

    Australia has suffered badly under the Liberal party. Labor won't be any better. Both of them are self absorbed with their own petty self interest.

    Changes they are a-coming with the rise of new parties and independents. It is to be hoped they stick to their principles and don't sell out to the highest bidder. Otherwise they could find themselves out on their ear at the next election.

    Voters are becoming more astute with their voting intentions.

    Just ask Malcolm and Bill.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    11:31am
    Correct. Only lies, bigger lies, deceit and nasty vindictive attacks on the Opposition. And let's not forget telling voters who they were not to vote for.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    11:37am
    There is a very simple reason why this happened. Social media where they all decided to see what would happen if they voted for independents instead of the major parties. Why? Because they could and then set about influencing others to do the same.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    1:15pm
    Vox Populi? Bloody Commos.....
    KSS
    5th Jul 2016
    2:48pm
    "Vindictive attacks" Mick? Much like yours then.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    3:10pm
    That's sad I just heard that Wee Chong Long or something similar? just lost 270 Million Bucks worth of Ice in Melbourne !! The Rotten Cops took it of the Importer ! :-(
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    4:10pm
    Mine are better known as the frustration of dealing with the online propaganda campaign from the Liberal Party.
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    5:39pm
    Social media has served Australia well - perhaps too well, in that we didn't want the instability of a hung parliament, but blame Turnbull's arrogance for that! What we did want, and social media and a lot of angry Australians gave us, was a strong message sent to the out-of-touch ruling elite and their greedy snout-in-the-trough supporters that we've had enough. We want a government that SERVES the people - ALL the people, not just the self-serving ''it's never enough, I want more'' privileged who demand a return to feudal conditions.
    scud
    5th Jul 2016
    7:00pm
    I thought the article on the Share Cafe site, Did Politicians Just Get What They Deserved? http://www.sharecafe.com.au/dreck.asp?a=AV&ai=40130 provided a particularly informative and relevant view, a large portion of which follows:

    "For months now, I’ve bemoaned the lack of leadership in Australian politics. I’m not alone. This is why you’re seeing the rise of minor parties. It’s a protest vote as much as anything.

    Looking at the ballot paper on Saturday gave me a real sense of despair. There were no good choices. This is what happens when the politics of conviction give way to the politics of fear.

    Scare campaigns, dishonesty, misinformation and pork barrelling were the hallmarks of the long campaign. The terrible result tells you exactly what Australians thought of that. The politicians got what they deserved.

    Given the poor outcome that this election result represents, it might seem strange to say this, but I think Australia got it right. We need to send a message to politicians that they just don’t cut it.

    Unfortunately the message doesn’t seem to be getting through to the thick and impenetrable egos. Malcolm Turnbull’s speech on Saturday night didn’t even acknowledge what the result said about him or his policies. Even if the Coalition gets in, there is hardly a mandate for their policies, which means the life of a ‘governing’ party will be very difficult.

    This comes at a very precarious time for the Aussie economy. We have no real economic strategy, apart from hoping lower interest rates continue to push up house prices which, in turn, increase consumption.

    The problem is that this form of growth relies predominantly on increasing debt levels. Australia now has the highest household debt levels in the world (as a percentage of GDP), so there are clearly limits to this growth strategy.

    And with the government budget stuck in deficit, there is no capacity for fiscal spending to offset any slowdown in household spending. The uncertain election result has only made this reality starker. As The Australian reports this morning:

    ‘Global ratings agencies are expected to formally warn the incoming government that Australia will lose its AAA credit rating unless firm action is taken to narrow the budget deficit.

    ‘S&P Global is likely to be the first to move; the agency is scheduled to hold a ratings committee meeting later this month to review Australia and has already flagged frustration with the slow progress in tackling the deficit.

    ‘The first step would be to put the AAA rating on “negative outlook”, meaning it would be downgraded within 18 months in the absence of corrective action.’

    Government debts levels, as a percentage of GDP, are not overly concerning right now. But the agencies have an eye on the high levels of household debt, and they know the government would need to backstop this in the event of a house price crash and/or recession.

    Australia is a large net debtor nation. Our net foreign liabilities are just over one trillion dollars. A decent chunk of this borrowing occurs through our banking system, and must continually be rolled over.

    If the government loses its credit rating, foreign creditors will see our banks as riskier investment propositions. They will pay more to borrow; interest rates will increase despite the efforts of the RBA to keep them low."

    All the more reason for our politicians to work together for all of us.
    Kato
    5th Jul 2016
    8:16pm
    I reckon beam me up scotty has his eye on the top job and sold Maelstrom out with his announcement attacking welfare on the eve of the election.
    buby
    5th Jul 2016
    9:16pm
    Given the poor outcome that this election result represents, it might seem strange to say this, but I think Australia got it right. We need to send a message to politicians that they just don’t cut it.

    YOU got it right there scud
    Anonymous
    6th Jul 2016
    7:52am
    Heaven help us if you are right and he gets it, Kato. Australia is doomed with that mentality at the helm!
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    4:14pm
    Happening buby.
    maxchugg
    9th Jul 2016
    1:46pm
    Mick, you are frustrated about the propaganda coming from the Liberal Party? We didn't get the same from Labor? In fact it has been said that Labor actually spent more than Liberal in the propaganda war that plagued us every night before the election.

    How about the Mediscare campaign which worked brilliantly, even though anyone who used their wits would have realised that it was all an impossible dream for Malcolm because he would never have got it through the Senate?

    The Mediscare campaign worked for one reason - people did not trust Turnbull when he denied the story. Hardly surprising when he had previously provided assurances that he had no ambitions to become PM. He was also from the party that invented the non-core promise.

    The public have developed a total lack of respect for the utterances of politicians because of the endless examples of total dishonesty and untrustworthiness that have come from politicians of every colour.
    Strummer
    5th Jul 2016
    11:06am
    At least we know the electorate is not overly influenced by the Murdoch press. That, at least is refreshing.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    12:44pm
    The Murdoch Press is but one of the players. The other big media outlets are owned and/or controlled by media barons and the big end of town. They all play off the same score sheet.

    We are fortunate that the media blitz did not again result in a government which is the plaything of big business. Don't expect the defeated not to find other ways of strangling free speech though. This behaviour is not over by a long shot but at least we have a reprieve. In the meantime voters would do well to take anything they hear as 'news' with a very very large grain of salt.
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:16pm
    It's about time Rupert copped a punch in the nose. He protesteth too much. People simply got wind of the hypocracy spruked by low brows like Andrea Bolt. It could never be sustained. It's a further sign, that people are moving away from the print media towards social media. Rupert is the ultimate newspaper man. Watch how his tune changes now.
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    3:52pm
    I had the misfortune of listening to Ray Hadley today. What a buffoon. Talk about one sided hateful anti Labor spew. Whilst making all manner of excuse for why the coalition lost the election he then had the hide to go on and attack SHorten for going to Tasmania to meet the people. Never saw Turnbull there. Or is that why Hadley is upset....that Shorten went and Turnbull sat in his arm chair watching the polo?
    I don't generally listen to radio but if this is what they call fair and balanced reporting well it leaves a lot to be desired. I sincerely hope that Labor brings in some ANTI PROPAGANDA LAWS to stop this vile sort of hate campaign from occurring and to bring back fair and balanced reporting. We are better than this.
    Jurassicgeek
    5th Jul 2016
    11:11am
    The Major parties did not listen to the people...and they will pay the penalty... The minor parties will now likely control what gets done and what doesnt...This could be a good or bad thing...but one thing is for sure ...interesting times ahead...
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    12:45pm
    A great start. Unless Independents and minor parties get power drunk this is what real government should look like.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    1:38pm
    Democracy... 2 Opposing Party's of Equal Proportions with their Teeth Bared ! And a Mob of Independents in the Middle GRINNING !! :-) :-)
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    11:11am
    What was it all about?

    It was all a out the Australian public finally getting up enough ire with their too-long-in-office Parties to refuse to be the playthings and whipping people for every dumbass ideological and personal interest group thought bubble that comes along to tax the minds of politicians elected to watch over the best interests of all Australians equally.

    I think that says it in a nutshell, and everyone by now should know why I oppose all the major Parties.....

    Back on track, boys and girls, and no more government by and for special interest group - and that includes business groups, feminists, and all the bloody rest!
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    12:47pm
    Yes. We need real government where the vested interests are locked out and only have the same voice at the table we all have. But don't underestimate the 'power of the dark side' Obi won. Big business is not done with control yet so let's see what they do next.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    1:52pm
    And here we are back on the Kerb like an Orphan on Fathers Day !! :-(
    Idontforget
    5th Jul 2016
    11:11am
    Latest comment from Mr. Turnbull.

    There has never been a more nerve wracking and nail biting time to be an Australian
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    11:30am
    I, for one, am enjoying the ride... he meant to be an Australian politician. That grinding sound he hears is not the teeth or dentures of pensioners and poor - it is the knives being sharpened...
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    11:32am
    What about 'there has never been a better time for me to retire'.
    Idontforget
    5th Jul 2016
    11:44am
    And I have just heard that Mr. Jobson Grothe is being tied to the triangle in Liberal Party Headquarters and is to receive fifty lashes with the cat o nine tails for being a failure.

    And also in the spin doctors department there, in relation to Mr. Turnbull's quote 'No Australian will pay more to see to a Doctor under the Government I lead', they have a press release ready, saying, 'I was taken out of context there, what I really meant was that Australians will have to pay more to see a Doctor'.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    2:34pm
    .. but no Australian will have to pay more to see a doctor than any other Australian ..... Turnbull's Theorem of Monetary Justice...
    Fitza
    5th Jul 2016
    11:13am
    I have to agree with Gee Whiz. The Liberals are out of touch with real people and that can be blamed in part, on the Treasurer and the PM, who have no idea of real problems, for real people, in the real world.

    Anyway, the main purpose of this comment, is to alert readers to the latest Centrelink crackdown on Pensioners. I am 70 years of age, so well past retirement.
    Two years ago, the 'Age of Entitlement ' treasurer cut me off completely on 1st July 2014.
    No warning. Pension just did not turn up. I was working full time on casual contract work.
    That dried up around September 2015, when the new Qld Govt began giving jobs to permanent public servants. I re-applied for the pension and to Centrelink's credit, it was restored.

    Now, two years on, the uncertainty for pensioners is returning with a vengeance.
    Yesterday (Monday 4th July) I received a call from a polite Centrelink employee, telling me they were going to suspend my pension payment, until I lodge my tax return and they can form an opinion on how much I will earn this financial year.

    The problem? (From their perspective). Due to lack of work for people at my age, I turned to trading in shares. By April this year, Centrelink were pressuring me to form a sole trader business, as from their perspective, it is too hard ot keep up with the buys and sells.
    The agreement (verbal only) was that I would complete my tax return by 31st July 16 and the pension would continue until the tax return was received by them.

    The Treasurer of course, with his last minute release of the Liberal budget plan, and crackdown on pensioners, has put a stop, immediately, to my pension once again.

    No, I am not wealthy. I do not own a home. I am living with my adult sons and paying rent.

    The whole age care system with the income and asset test, is completely unfair to those who actually try and earn an income of sorts, during retirement. Centrelink wants to knock you down and make you fit in a box where the Federal Govt of the day, has made the rules. So it is not entirely Centrelink's fault - they are enacting the rules as given to them by the Govt of the day.

    I contrast this with the UK, where there is no income and asset test and the Pensions Office does not care how much you earn, as the age pension is your right, paid for by you the taxpayer, from your National Insurance Contributions (NICs).

    I honestly believe the Liberals underestimated the reaction of pensioners. The Liberals left the news of the latest crackdown until a few days before the election.
    We pensioners are once again left with an uncertain future.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    11:45am
    Be aware that you will also have to satisfy the ATO you are a share trader as well as Centrelink. You could end up doing a whole lot of paperwork for very little gain. Depending on your expenses you may be able to claim some GST back but unless you do the paperwork yourself it could be costly. I was classified as a share trader and decided that it just wasn't worth the effort with all the paperwork involved.
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:20pm
    Fitza, you have my complete admiration. Never depend on government if you can possibly help it. What the government giveth the government can taketh away.
    Rae
    5th Jul 2016
    2:27pm
    The liberals have some crazy idea that all retirees are either filthy rich or welfare bludgers.

    There is no middle ground for these people and their advisors need to be shown the door promptly.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:14pm
    And now the Galahs think their Favourite Gum Tree has been Shaken by an Earth Quake ! :-) :-)
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    6:16pm
    Both the Liberals and Labor realises that retirees need to spend their capital as well as living on the interest from that capital. They both realise that it is simply stupid to die with a lot of capital that is wasted by the majority of the next generation.
    Alexii
    5th Jul 2016
    6:54pm
    The problem, Old Geezer, is that they consider self-funded retirees are wealthy even though they are not. They don't want such people to have anything much to leave to their children as that will enable their children to be a little better off too. They want many of us and our descendants to remain relatively poor. But the genuinely well off people are able to leave their assets to their off spring - that's OK, it fits their social rules.
    Kato
    5th Jul 2016
    8:49pm
    And they think we get great interest from the banks, that's why they have such crap deeming rates.
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    9:48am
    Your post Geezer is straight out of the LNP manual. Better known as how to nobble the working class.
    micky d.
    5th Jul 2016
    11:26am
    G'day Amadeoz.
    A very sensible suggestion. It could be done. But will it ?
    If the major parties did take that direction we'd begin to develop new strengths, return our country to its former glory and most everyone would be satisfied .
    Amadeoz for President !
    Cheers.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    12:49pm
    We are all waiting and hoping that the rusted ons can step out of their dogma circles and do what is in the interests of the country. Not tax cuts for the rich!
    mogo51
    5th Jul 2016
    11:46am
    Whilst I would like to see both majors put the country first, I doubt it will happen. Egos are too big and greed and power too important.
    Not Senile Yet!
    5th Jul 2016
    11:48am
    Armedeoz.....God help us all if they do!
    The last time the big two got together and conive'd.was when they Raided the National Pension Fund of Trillions to build their New Parliament House in Canberra......Greatest Legal Robbery in Oz!
    Bad enough One Corrupt Party.....who needs Two working together?????
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:21pm
    Ha, ha! When will they start shooting each other?
    Rae
    5th Jul 2016
    2:29pm
    Don't forget they got together again in 2015 and totally wrecked the retirement plans of many hard working and saving Australians.

    The proved they couldn't be trusted nor believed.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    3:14pm
    Make them pay it back out of their Retirement Packages !! :-) :-)
    Chris B T
    5th Jul 2016
    11:50am
    Mick
    Great time for independents, this will be interesting to see who will do deals with the "Devil"
    No deals was the catch cry.
    Some have no Shame.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    11:55am
    I'd like to see the LNP and Labor work together and stop all this silly nonsense with the independents and their bucket lists for the few they represent. 10 years of that is enough for me.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    12:55pm
    Chris: horse trading is what politics is supposed to be about. Deals are acceptable as long as they are not contrary to most of the population and as long as they do not cripple the country.
    Dirty tax cuts for the rich who are doing quite nicely anyway are gone. They should never have been put up. Now we will see things like s few protections for gambling addicts come about, reforms of courts and other social justice issues. And then there are the Free Trade Deals with the dirty secrets this government hid in them which Xenophon is going to go through...........
    The shame as you call it is in making election promises which you have no intention of keeping. The Abbott and Turnbull governments took this to new heights and should never have been allowed to serve a full term when it became obvious what they had done.
    Let's give Independents a fair go. The last batch did a wonderful job in the senate. The best one can hope for is that the current batch do likewise.
    Chris B T
    5th Jul 2016
    3:56pm
    Mick
    I'm not critical of the Independents, just the no Deals from major parties.
    There will be deals with who ever gives support to what they need.
    Both major parties stated no Deals.(Horse or Donkey trading)
    ;-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    4:12pm
    Glad we have a consensus. I heard the denials but knew they would deal if they had to.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    5:31pm
    I am hearing more about the LNP and Labor working together to run the country this afternoon.
    ex PS
    5th Jul 2016
    5:42pm
    Amazing what a good kick in the pants will do Old Geezer, it would have been status quo if everybody had voted for the ""only two chooses". You could of been part of history but chose to be one of the herd.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    6:12pm
    I actually backed a hung parliament after a friend of mine called me and said there was money to be made in doing so. If that's a good kick in the pants then I'm liking it.

    But is this good for the country? Definitely no. Is it right that a few people do deals to fill their own bucket lists at the expense of the rest of Australia? That is why I think we will see the major parties work together instead. This is not uncommon in other parts of the world.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    8:58pm
    You do not know what you are talking about Geezer. Minority governments were the norm in Oz once and exist all around the world. The trouble is that the Liberal Party is a big business virus which needs to be stopped before all Australians are turned into slaves.
    Your talk is cheap and as always not factual.
    Rae
    6th Jul 2016
    8:15am
    Yes MICK the NSW Liberals need to be examined carefully. What was in that consultancy report from Boston Group on the TAFE and just how much did we pay for it. Why is this sort of information suddenly not available. Obviously there is something to hide.

    Why couldn't the Department of Education write the report?

    A minority government working with others may have less chance to waste out money or make unwise investments with it.

    The sale of 27 valuable TAFE sites will be a bit like the problem Rozelle and Balmain have now. Government sold off the school and now has hundreds of new kids to try to accommodate.

    My Regional city main primary school was forceable sold a few years ago as it was a great site with water views.Sold for a discount price to developers. It is a disgrace that hard earned taxes are squandered this way.

    Old Geezer is right in saying the younger generation will waste the capital because this is just exactly what Liberal governments are doing with privatisation. Wasting our hard earned money.
    4b2
    5th Jul 2016
    11:57am
    Well, well the Top Hat vacillator got it all wrong. The libs stabbed their leader in back, much to Australia's relief, then the new leader was taken over by the back room boys. They conspired to remove the independents from the Senate, called a double dissolution on very dubious bill. Now they reap their just rewards. Not only do they have a larger contingent of independents in the Senate they also have the Ipswich Witch with her other redneck followers. Good luck whoever gains the numbers.

    The biggest surprise is the Libs failure to own up to their own mistakes. The message from the electors is simple. "Tell us what you are going to do, do it, don't break your promises".

    Repealing the carbon tax was supposed to lower electricity prices, it didn't.
    NSW Gov sold off the poles etc. which was to lower electricity prices, not any more.

    HOW CAN WE TRUST ANY OF THEM!!!!
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    12:11pm
    If she is not careful that Ipswich Witch will be back in jail as her comments are extremely racial and the Racial Commissioner is very concerned and says he is willing to act if necessary. CCTV in mosques is just going a way too far.

    The Senate independents have already started their brawling.

    Electricity prices were always going to rise with the privatisation of the poles and wires. All we need is some decent cheap battery and storage technology to make the poles and wires redundant. The high electricity prices go the closer this gets.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    1:02pm
    Yeah 4b2. They tried their best to get their one flavour dictatorship and failed. Hence the tirade from Herr Turnbull when he did not get his way.

    Geezer: you are a hateful blight on the community. Whilst you demonise people who are not your flavour you avoid comment about the fact that SOMEBODY ELECTED HANSON....and the other 4 or so senators she will have in the parliament. Your comment marginalises the voters who put her in and you sound so much like Turnbull and his cronies preaching their hate message.
    For the record please put the "electricity prices" violin away. You know as well as I do that Greg Hunt sold the lie "you have high electricity prices because of the Carbon Tax". Last week they AGAIN went up 12%. No Carbon Tax for 3 years Geezer and 12% is not a CPI increase of any sort. Please tell your lies to somebody who is listening!
    Rae
    5th Jul 2016
    2:36pm
    Well batteries would be great and Australia has some of the best lithium mines in the world.
    But as usual we sold them as deal making is about all we do well.

    I blame electing lawyers, bankers, unionists and developers.

    As for the poles sale it is a perfect example of what Adam Smith meant about the risk of letting them loose with other people's money ( taxpayers money in this case).

    They spent $16 billion to get a sale of $11 billion and lost nearly $3 billion in dividends each and every year. These people are managing Australia's economy.
    Rae
    5th Jul 2016
    2:37pm
    A CPI rise of 12% sounds about right.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    2:49pm
    Why would a Government SELL A Lottery that Made BILLIONS of Profit Annually to Greedy Rich Mongrels ??? :-( And the Prizes are Garbage to the Amounts Invested by the Public !! :-( :-( And that came from a Yank I was listening to on the Radio !! Although I had the same thoughts Way Back !!
    MITZY
    5th Jul 2016
    4:18pm
    particolor: Yes, I was just mentioning the same sell-off of the Lotteries to private enterprise to my cousin on Sunday. Its time the government started some specific purpose lotteries once again, similar to having the "Opera House" lottery many moons ago.
    Seeing as we have so much debts/deficits pulling us back, and we have absolutely millions of gamblers, we wouldn't have a problem funding Health, Education, Unis, etc. Even the gamblers should be happy gambling on a lotto/lottery ticket when it loses, knowing where its proceeds were going.
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    6:00pm
    Excelent Idea Mitzy !! :-) But put Control of it in other Hands than the Cream Scooping Governments we have now ! And NEVER TO BE SOLD !! Decent Prizes ! And Full Accountability !! I'll start buying them again if I can see its for Australia ! Not a Greedy MOB !!
    ex PS
    8th Jul 2016
    4:28am
    She can't help her views she is an ex Liberal Party member.
    Tom Tank
    5th Jul 2016
    12:07pm
    A basic problem is that our Parliamentary system is essentially the British one which is heavily influenced by English Law which is adversarial. This means each side argues with the other irrespective of the rights and wrongs of the issue.
    There is also the underlying aspect of the Conservative side of politics determined to hang onto their privileges and wealth and the other side trying to reduce that.
    We do have an imbalance in wealth in this country and the gap is widening and this is also the case in the UK and particularly in the U.S.
    Put all this together and the people have now shown their displeasure with both major parties.
    Interestingly we have had hung parliaments quite often in this country but we are so used to a Liberal National Party coalition that we so often take them as one party which they are not. There have been times when the LNP have only been in power because the Nats have supported the Libs to form government. The only time they are separate parties are when they are in opposition. Could this be because then the Nats get the perks of being an opposition party which they wouldn't get if they were part of a coalition opposition. Snouts in the trough mayhaps?
    A hung parliament can work very well and actually be in the best interests of the country. They is no reason to think it cannot work provided whichever major party gets the nominal power actually negotiates well with whichever independents support them.
    Keep in mind the only Party that has governed Australia in its own right in recent times has been the ALP. Refer above re the LNP.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    12:13pm
    I think it is laughable that the ALP with only 35% on the primary vote can govern Australia. 65% of the population don't want them.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    1:09pm
    What a lot of crock Geezer.
    Labor currently has 71 seats and the Liberal Party and Liberal National Party only have 58.
    The truth is you and your party were unable to completely rig the system and you are now posting political vitriol. Do you want a rerun of the election as well?
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    1:57pm
    Lets have UK Style Losers Dance !! :-) :-)
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    2:03pm
    Re-Post:-

    National two party count Party / Coalition
    Votes Percentage % Swing %
    Liberal/National Coalition 4,940,888 49.79 -3.70
    Australian Labor Party 4,983,118 50.21 +3.70

    That settles that argument.....
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:24pm
    Good one Trebor!
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    3:00pm
    I meant which ever side loses Have a War Dance !! :-) :-) Its the flavour of the Century !! :-)
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    3:13pm
    It still does not negate the only 35% primary vote for Labor. That's 65% that does not want them.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:23pm
    Are you really that brain dead Geezer? For real? You and your team must be desperate to be posting this sort of misinformation. Ok, I forgot....misinformation is the norm from Liberal Party HQ.
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    4:16pm
    You're wasting good drinking time Old Geezer trying to tell some people the truth. They don't seem to understand the preferential voting system that Australia uses. You are, of course correct when you quote primary voting which, for those too uneducated or biased to understand, is the number of votes showing "1" against the name and is before exhausted votes are preferenced and added.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    5:29pm
    Labor's primary vote was 34.9%

    see http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-07-03/election-results-historical-comparison/7560888

    "The Labor Party has won a primary vote of 34.9 per cent, with Liberal frontbencher Scott Morrison pointing out on election night that this was the second lowest primary vote for Labor since 1949."

    That says to me that over 65% would have preferred someone else but a Labor candidate. That is exactly what is wrong with there preferential voting system...you don't get your first choice.
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    5:46pm
    It DOES NOT say that 65% wanted the LNP, Old Geezer. If it did, there'd be NO votes for minors or independents - and there WERE lots. The LNP is as on the nose as Labor, if not more so. Get over it. Your dumb-arse mates rigged this election believing they could force their will on the Australian people. They stuffed up. We are smarter than they gave us credit for. Maybe now they'll withdraw from their arrogant self-serving stance a little and LISTEN to the people they ARE SUPPOSED TO BE SERVING. (I won't hold my breath!)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    5:56pm
    Liberal party rusted on hacks would not know the truth if it bit them on the bum. Better to look for ways to twist the facts so that you do not have to confront the facts.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    8:59pm
    Anyone here offering the LNP prmary vote figure?

    Oh.. look.. hard to find.. but here's one :-

    " In Maranoa, the LNP has suffered a 6.46% swing against the party on a two-party preferred count.

    The primary vote is also down nearly 10% on the 2013 federal election.

    Despite the swing, LNP candidate David Littleproud was still comfortably elected with 65.82% on a two-party preferred count.

    Over in the seat of Wide Bay, which includes the towns of Murgon and Goomeri, the LNP had a similar swing against it.

    The party secured 57.46% of the vote on a two-party preferred count, 5.7% less than the 2013 federal election.

    The LNP primary vote was down 5.24% in Wide Bay.

    A 8.16% swing against the LNP could see the party lose Flynn, which includes the areas of Wondai and Proston.

    Incumbent Ken O'Dowd is trailing to Labor's Zac Beers, with Mr O'Dowd's primary vote down 10.98% on the 2013 federal election.

    Across Australia, the Liberal/National Coalition has suffered a swing of 3.38%. "

    http://www.southburnetttimes.com.au/news/election-2016-littleproud-relieved-reach-end-campa/3055788/

    Those dratted Queenslanders in their regional seats...
    mangomick
    5th Jul 2016
    12:18pm
    Turnbulls biggest negative was calling a dodgy double dissolution in the first place. There was never a need to call the dissolution under the guise of the Senate preventing the Australian Building and Construction Commission legislation from going through. many cross benchers would have allowed it through with minor adjustments but Turnbull and co wouldn't accept the minor changes. It was all a farce to try to gain a majority in the upper and lower house so the could rubber stamp poor policy and legislation through. Now their chooks have come home to roost and they don't like it.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    1:13pm
    Agrees mango.
    Probably the biggest mistake the man made was to tell voters that he respected their intelligence and that he would listen to them when he became PM..........and then a week before the election started making speeches with "you must not vote Labor" and "you must not vote for an Independent" and "you must vote Liberal to make your vote count". I mean what sort of dictator does this. The guy would have done better shooting himself in both feet rather than one as. Australians DO NOT LIKE BEING DICTATED TO. Even by a dictator.
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:25pm
    The spider got caught up in his own web of deceit.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:24pm
    Mick ! :-) :-) :-) Ve Haf Vays off makink you Vote Liberal :-) :-)
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    4:25pm
    So Mick, when Shorten's mob told us that we must not vote for Turnbull because Medicare would be sold or that we must not vote for Turnbull or Xenophon because they would do away with penalty rates that was OK? That was not dictating to people that was merely giving good advice was it? The lie about penalty rates was that neither Turnbull nor Xenophon had said anything about penalty rates except to agree with the decision handed down by the Tribunal. It is noted that although Shorten also agreed to abide by the Tribunal's decision, O'Connor, the shadow minister, insisted that penalty rates would be maintained regardless of the Tribunal.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:30pm
    "Get something on the Media to turn them off KAOS Max !" "Yes Chief !!" :-) :-)
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    6:20pm
    Turnbull did what he had to to get the country back on track with a stable government. However the stupid voters thought they knew better and didn't think about the consequences or even care what they would be.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    9:00pm
    Still on the "stability" bit are we? Seen a lot of that in the past 2 days. Just like "jobs and growth". A slogan with a use by date expiring when votes are counted.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    9:06pm
    Sounds like the first item of business for any government is to sack the Productivity Commission....
    Anonymous
    6th Jul 2016
    8:01am
    Unbelievable that anyone would be arrogant enough to blame the voters, Old Geezer. Turnbull stuffed up. It's not the fault of the people his policies disenfranchised or the people who saw through is lies or the people who understand that his policies are failing. It's the fault of the dim-witted arrogant fool who THOUGHT he could manipulate the electorate. He thought he could fool all of the people all of the time, and the people proved they are not so easy to fool.

    The consequences are undesirable, but Turnbull carries responsibility for them, and they are far, far, far better than letting self-serving arrogant A...holes run the nation unrestrained and in ignorance of their obligation to SERVE THE PEOPLE.
    Rae
    6th Jul 2016
    8:29am
    On track with these LNP means selling off anything the Nation owns as fast as they can.

    Attacking unions and workers and self funded retirees.

    Attacking public education but throwing money at private education. Much of which is lost because the private company was a fraud.

    Attacking public health but throwing money at private health and insurance providers. Much of which is wasted through greed and poor practises.

    Itching to lower workers wages and raise CEOs bonuses.

    Wanting to tax everyone more for everything to give rich international corporations a tax cut even though they hardly ever pay any tax.

    I won't get into the sales to communist governments nor the appalling environmental destruction as it is way too scary.

    Etc. And people question why we didn't vote for this version of stability?
    Cautious
    5th Jul 2016
    12:21pm
    What a "clown" the author is.
    And mind you I am being polite.
    Even I know that the stability that was referred to was IF WE ALL VOTED FOR MALCOLM.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    1:15pm
    Realit is that there was Never any stability. The next lie. As was the "jobs and growth" propaganda.....show us the jobs Malcolm. Yeah thought so. And then there was the poster from Morrison claiming $2.3 billion found in welfare savings.....on the poster, not in reality.....show us where Scott.
    I find it incredible that average citizens who voted for the bastards were so easily taken in. Frightening.
    Tom Tank
    5th Jul 2016
    1:42pm
    It is quite obvious from current goings-on that the Liberal Party is self destructing.
    There was no way Turnbull could have given us stability with the right wing white-anting him at every opportunity.
    Should the LNP get a majority then stability is the last thing we will get.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:24pm
    I would agree with that Tom. Sounds pretty on the money. "What a difference a day makes"!
    MITZY
    5th Jul 2016
    4:29pm
    Stability was never mentioned in the Coalition's rhetoric until Brexit shock arrived with an unexpected verdict. From then onwards every single opportunity we got "stable and stability" and Jobs & Growth took second place. In a gambling sense when the gamblers heard the words stable government over and over they got off the favourite and onto the other contender for a better price !
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:40pm
    From friends of mine in the UK.. they said that they voted BREXIT because they didn't like the Country getting Flooded with people that want to Kill Them ! :-( :-( :-(
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    5:59pm
    My recollection is that Shorten asked voters not to vote for Independents. He got the message back methinks.
    I do not recall Shorten asking them not to vote Liberal but of course why would he. Turnbull is the one who used the "must not" terminology. The hide of the rich man's representative telling voters who they must NOT vote for. And now the ratbags are calling for a new election.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    6:04pm
    We can give them one they will never forget Mick ! It'll Haunt them for Life !! :-) :-)
    The Other Judith
    5th Jul 2016
    12:30pm
    Politicians should read this blog which is about Brexit but applies equally to Australia. http://dickpuddlecote.blogspot.com.au/2016/07/politicians-look-in-mirror.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+DickPuddlecote+(Dick+Puddlecote) The only people governments listen to these days are lobbyists for various sections of society. Maybe they should talk to the average voter occasionally.
    KSS
    5th Jul 2016
    12:50pm
    Another one sided account by the author of this article. For once I would like to see an even handed approach to this political commentary. Where is the acknowledgement that since the last election, quite a few seats have been re-defined making them more notionally a Labor seat than Liberal as they were for the last election? Where is the acknowledgement of the fact that Labor scattered money around like confetti to anyone and everyone with their hand out even admitting that this would add to the debt Australia already has to repay but doing it anyway? Where is the acknowledgement that the great Medicare lie supported by outrageous texts and phone calls to vulnerable groups and shored up with intimidation at polling booths by union stalwarts? Where is the acknowledgement that Labor has gained the lowest number of primary votes in decades? Where is the acknowledgement that there seems to have been an increase in void votes from people misunderstanding what exactly they had to do on each paper e.g. only numbering 1-6 on the green paper when there were more than 6 candidates for example? Where is the acknowledgement that more than ever, local and state issues influenced the outcome e.g. the CFS in Victoria

    Yes Mr Turnbull made mistakes, he did not explain how the 'jobs and growth' would happen, he did not mention the issues that caused the DD in the first place (the resurrection of the ABC), he did not 'attack' the Labor Medicare lie (well not until election night), he did not canvass hard enough etc etc etc.

    There are many reasons why the election has turned out the way is has but not all of them can be laid at the feet of Mr Turnbull or Mr Abbott. To read this article and many of the predictable comments one would have expected a landslide Labor win. Well it didn't happen. Now we will likely have a minority Government who will face dealing with a few independents each of whom will have their own shopping list of demands and who will side with whoever agrees to their blackmail on each item on said lists. And that's before anything even gets to the Senate.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    1:24pm
    Just like the fearless leader you idolise you are crying 'unfair'.
    Come on KSS. When you run a propaganda campaign through your media outlets and lose it does say something. What is says is that the public (the half with a brain to bless themselves with) do not want your dictatorship. End of story.
    By the way...don't forget to mention the campaign to discredit GetUp by having it hacked and then having the Courier Mail (Murdoch Press) run a headline "Getup Fraud Scam" to scare voters off voting Labor, which is what GetUp was promoting in this election. Funny how you avoid the corrupt behaviour of your Party at all costs.
    Your post has ZERO CREDIBILITY. All about blame with no accountability for dishonest government for the rich where the rest of Australians were simply good for votes and new taxes.
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:28pm
    How soon do we forget the children overboard and the weapons of mass deception. The former has even today legitimised the encarceration of the innocent in hell holes.
    KSS
    5th Jul 2016
    2:47pm
    As always Mick you make wild accusations with no evidence. If you have evidence of illegal hacking or any other activity I suggest you get off your soapbox and take it to the relevant authorities for investigation.

    You are so one eyed you have not actually bothered to read what I said. You are the one who lacks any credibility with your abusive rants and name calling of anyone who has an opinion that differs to yours.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:25pm
    Proof KSS???? The fingerprints are there I would think. Last election the GetUp PAID TV advertising was pulled. Tell me this is a coincidence.
    KSS
    5th Jul 2016
    3:33pm
    You were there were you with your fingerprint kit? Collecting evidence? Where is it then?

    No I didn't think so.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    4:15pm
    You remind me of the crook daring investigators to "prove it". How convenient to be 'innocent' when onlooker know who the culprits were. This is why we have police. So why are the police not doing anything? How convenient for your criminal mates KSS!
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    4:36pm
    KSS, I have the same problems with Labor supporting. abusive Mick. He doesn't bother to properly read a post (or the person reading it to him has a problem) and then flies off half-cocked, usually on a tangent, and attacks the person not the subject matter. He also laughingly claims to be "independent" but to be truly "independent" he would attack those who stand up for Labor.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    6:00pm
    I believe I did that in a post above. I am Independent. You are a party hack. There is a difference.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    12:59pm
    Its a big decision choosing which Poison is the least Toxic ??? :-( :-(
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    1:26pm
    That it is my friend. Hopefully the antidote of Independents do not do the wrong thing. Not sure about Pauline Hanson though as she is not the sharpest tool in the shed.
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:29pm
    I'll swallow a dose of indepencence any day. Just ignore her and she'll go away.
    Young Simmo
    5th Jul 2016
    2:36pm
    I agree 100% with Pauline Hanson, and any Mental Retard that doesn't should do a bit of reading about central England. 1000s and 1000s of English people are too scared to go to the shops. It seems a lot of Aussies want us to end up the same.
    OK, I'm ready.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    2:57pm
    Simmo.. The General Public in this Country are not the Slightest bit aware of what those Barbarians are up to as they are TOLD NOTHING HERE of what's REALLY going on in the World !! That Sarah and her friends want Locking Up !! They will know nothing in this Country till it Hits them LIKE A TON OF BRICKS !! :-( :-( ..Well I'm off to Kirribilli for a Lavish Halal Dinner with the Emperor !! :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:29pm
    Simmo: you sound like you might have a few issues. The media is going to crucify Hanson if she is not politically correct and the coalition spew directors will come out against all Independents if Hanson cannot be more reserved. It is going to be an interesting show. And as Albanese said last night he does not think that the government is going to last more than 12 months.........an observation that not all players are pre programed. The horse trading will be interesting.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:01pm
    NEIGH !! :-)
    Eve
    5th Jul 2016
    1:32pm
    The LNP lost for any number of reasons, but I suggest some of them might be - The attempt to change the nature of this country by Abbot and Hockey through denying even the middle classes access to university ($100,000+ degrees), massive cuts in health, education, foreign aid, pensions, welfare payments, and hundreds of community support services - but huge allocations of funds to 'border protection', sending soldiers and fighter planes to Iraq/Syria and for submarines. And of course the complete defense of tax subsidies and tax avoidance perks for the wealthy, as well as $50b in tax cuts. The LNP got voted out because it was a rotten government - with or without Malcolm, because these measure will be continued if this LNP government is re-elected. Call me naïve, but these seem like good reasons to throw out a government!

    How did we get to this stage of cynicism, because even fewer people voted first for the Labor party? There is a PhD thesis in here somewhere, but I would point out that while Labor got fewer primary votes (than the combined Liberal and National Parties), it appears it got a lot more preference votes.
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:34pm
    Lets not forget, they were the bastards that helped destroy Iraq and created a breeding ground for death and destruction. They were the same bastards that got us into Vietnam based on another lie, resulting in the deaths of millions. They'd rather spend billions on invading other countries than protecting their own people. How long do you think it will be before kicking the dog results in the dog biting back?
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    2:38pm
    All the way with LBJ !! :-( :-( :-( :-(
    Young Simmo
    5th Jul 2016
    1:41pm
    Well the way I see it is.
    Bill Shorton's initials are BS which has always meant Bull Sh*t.
    Malcolm Turnball's initials are MT which means Much Tougher.
    Then you have the 4 Ms, which means Much, More, Muck, from Mick.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    2:03pm
    In the Early days of my Career .. When we had an Engine sitting in the shed with an Empty Boiler we hung a Sign on it MT !! :-) :-)
    Young Simmo
    5th Jul 2016
    2:12pm
    Yeh Parti, I put that sign around my neck at 5 to 5 every evening.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:30pm
    Rusted on troll by the sound of it Simmo. How about some real comment rather than name calling without debate or logic.
    Young Simmo
    5th Jul 2016
    3:39pm
    I Must slow down with poor old Mick, it is getting easier by the day to stir him. But then, when somebody spends their life supporting a mob of loosers, you have to feel sorry for them.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    4:15pm
    Losers? Turn on the TV.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:19pm
    Will I get the Truth if I do Mick :-) :-)
    Paulodapotter
    5th Jul 2016
    2:06pm
    As Mick advocated, people moved to the independent vote and as I predicted, we are very likely to end up with a hung parliament. Contrary to what the major parties' say, we should get better quality legislation through the Senate as a result, just as we did during the last hung parliament. This will most likely be a test for Malcolm's negotiation skills. If he does that well and manages to unite all those disparate interests, he will show his qualities as a statesman and a worthy Prime Minister. It should then result in much needed change to our political culture where the best of all parties converge to get this country going forward again, something that has not happened since 9/11. We need jobs and growth and better education and health outcomes together. It's not an either/or situation. The big end of town has to fund the youth of this country. The disenfranchisment of our future has to end.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    3:04pm
    Do I have to bring my own Chair, Chips and Drink to the Hanging ?? :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:32pm
    The place of Independents are, as Don Chipp used to say, to keep the bastards honest. I just hope that our Independents are level headed and not bought out by either side of politics. That is why they were elected.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:55pm
    An Independent should not be Allowed to be Anything BUT INDEPENDENT !! That's what the People wanted that voted for them !
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    9:01pm
    Yes.
    TREBOR
    5th Jul 2016
    9:09pm
    71-70 with four seats undecided - no matter which of The Big Two takes those seats, they will be negotiating with the Independents all day and night.....

    http://vtr.aec.gov.au/HouseDefault-20499.htm
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    9:44pm
    Give Bill and Mal a Sword each and let them fight it out Like days of Olde !! :-) :-)
    Blondie
    5th Jul 2016
    3:27pm
    Travellers Joy! Thank you for your clear, concise opinion. Yes, as history shows, the rich elites had to scramble after WW1, when poor people realised that they could go out on their own, without 'tugging the forelock' any longer!Watching Turnbull's tirade on election night, was expected by many. The incendiary anger at the Australian public who hadn't voted for the LNP, was disgraceful, and displayed the measure of the man.When uncertainty rears its head, the public will often have a bet each way!
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    3:35pm
    I must say I did not expect Turnbull to attack voters for not doing as he instructed them to do. Obviously his minders told him that the public was compliant. Bad advice. Now we all have to work on the other part who have no idea and educate them as best we can so that these voters judge for themselves next time.
    We live in interesting times.
    MITZY
    5th Jul 2016
    4:54pm
    We go to vote, we elect/select. The winner is "always humble" i.e. for five minutes, and thereafter he/she is thinking "we've fooled them again", we can now do as we please for three years.

    The one thing that irks me quite a lot is when they become the chief they are no longer humble. They are all I;I;I; Me;Me;Me;.
    We vote, we select, and then the Captain tells us all its HIS GOVERNMENT and its HIS CABINET. He completely forgets its OUR GOVERNMENT and OUR CABINET, there are 24 million of us even though some are not eligible to vote yet and its "ours" they are only there as caretakers and highly overpaid caretakers too.!!!
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    5:08pm
    AND THAT ! IM AFRAID IS EXACTLY WHAT OUR GOVERNING SYSTEM HAS TURNED TO !!:-( :-( :-(
    Rodent
    5th Jul 2016
    3:43pm
    Can anyone explain why the AEC has much different seat figures for House of Reps than in the so called Media?

    At the moment they show
    Liberal 64 and 3 close
    Labor 69 and 2 close
    Greens 1 - leading
    Katter 1 - leading
    Xenephon 2 leading
    Independent 2 leading
    Not yet determined 6
    NO SEAT HAS BEEN DECLARED AS YET!!!!
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:06pm
    Have to keep the Brain Bashed buying Papers Etc. :-)
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    5:36pm
    I'm hearing that there has been some sort of counting stuff up and they have to recount everything again.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    5:55pm
    They haven't lost the WA Boxes again have they ?? :-( :-( And if they have another Vote We Will DOUBLE the Peed Off Vote ! :-) :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    6:03pm
    Have not heard that one yet Geezer but I am not privy to information like you are. Sounds more like misinformation so await to see if any substance to it.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    6:23pm
    Here the story about the counting problem.

    http://www.sbs.com.au/comedy/article/2016/07/04/aec-admit-theyve-lost-count-and-will-have-start-again
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    7:12pm
    This might explain what is going on with the AEC website.

    http://blogs.abc.net.au/antonygreen/2016/07/whats-going-on-with-house-seat-numbers.html
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    7:44pm
    In the Middle of counting someone yelled out "Who ordered these 27 Halal Vegemite Sandwiches ?" :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    9:02pm
    Sam Dastyari. Having lunch with Pauline.
    Rae
    6th Jul 2016
    8:37am
    Why am I not surprised that the count couldn't be completed through incompetence. Sigh.

    5th Jul 2016
    3:51pm
    Your ideas have merit Amadeoz and to hear Shorten talk a week or so ago when he said that, if elected, he would be inclusive of the opposition to achieve bi-partisanship were indeed welcome words. Then on Election night he told the Labor faithful that he would block all legislation put forward by the government if Labor lost. As particolor so succinctly said "oil & water".
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:10pm
    There will be Penitrine getting sprayed everywhere later as they try to loosen each other up !! :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    4:19pm
    Funny Old Guy......
    Labor HAS passed legislation put up by the Abbott/Turnbull government. Abbott NEVER DID. Mr No. Remember?
    And now you go after Shorten before he has even gotten going? Maybe look at your own despicable Howard leftover bunch. Lying deceitful bastards who speak down to average Australians and come after their money.
    There is a difference.

    5th Jul 2016
    4:27pm
    hope this is a wake up call to the 2 main parties to start working on behalf of the public, not focus on staying in power, protecting their own jobs and lurks and perks. In the senate I voted for all independents in the hope that they will help keep the successful bastards even partly honest, if it that means upsetting the apple cart now and then, so be it. That's what we need, with no strong senate if Abbotts cuts and budget had passes it would have been horrendous. Its also time for politicians to stop being so politically correct and sucking up to those who are trying to destroy our culture.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    4:44pm
    A N D... So Say All Of Us !! :-) :-)

    5th Jul 2016
    4:58pm
    I have been reading and listening to reports of what some of the Independents will be asking for should they be needed to support either major party to form a government. The costs of their wish list is staggering and whenever the next election is called, the party who they support will be called to account for the blowout in the budget. Is it really a good idea to have so many independents?
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    5:05pm
    All that does is show what the Major Party's were LACKING in their Wish Wash Promises !!
    Anonymous
    5th Jul 2016
    5:50pm
    It's NOT a good idea, Old Man, but it sure beats the hell out of letting the arrogant A...holes run the nation unrestrained.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    6:04pm
    No substance as usual Old Man. Give us the facts.....if there are any.
    Old Geezer
    5th Jul 2016
    6:34pm
    Let's hope the LNP and Labor join forces and work together to run the country instead of bowing to the wishes of these independents.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    9:07pm
    Are you for real Geezer or are you now peddling this solution because the party machine is worried?
    The position of Independents is NOT to come up with an unreasonable wishlist. Their purpose is to modify bad legislation (like tax cuts for the already wealthy and big business conglomerates) and to put through legislation which IS IN THE INTERESTS OF THE NATION. The LNP will find that very very difficult to understand and will expect its rich election funding benefactors to come up with some scheme to steal back absolute power.
    We are all waiting for the next move.
    ex PS
    8th Jul 2016
    4:46am
    Yes if it puts a stop to the so calleds banging on about a mandate that does not exist.
    ex PS
    5th Jul 2016
    5:16pm
    Armadeoz, what you say would make perfect sense to any six year old, and it makes sense to most of us. Unfortunately we have been sold an adversarial type of political environment where co-operation is seen as a sign of weekness both by the politicians and their camp followers who have been groomed for decades to believe that everything that Coles wants to do is bad and everything that Woolworths wants to do is good and visa versa.
    This suits lazy, inarticulate politicians as they don't have to make an intelligent argument to support their policies, they only have to declare that the opposition doesn't agree so their idea must be good.
    We have to take part of the blame, we are just as lazy by letting them get away with it for so long. We should be demanding thoughtful, reasoned debate to get policies through the house not just numbers.
    A Leader who can't or will not negotiate in order to get legislation passed for the overall good of the people he or she represents is no kind of Leader at all.
    Young Simmo
    5th Jul 2016
    5:36pm
    To all the Pauline Hanson knockers you can not have it both ways.
    "A" You supporter Pauline Hanson.
    Or
    "B" You support Child Abuse.
    Because that's what the Muslims do to young girls, sorry if the truth hurts, but that's life.
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    5:50pm
    I voted for Pauline because I'm Racist ! Yeah I don't like Liberal or Labor !! :-(
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    6:09pm
    I agree with looking at muslim immigration as events around the world tell us this.
    I have heard that Hanson has been bankrolled by coal money. Not sure if it is true but if so then it will be an interesting parliament. Time will tell.
    Young Simmo
    5th Jul 2016
    10:46pm
    For any doubters Re my comment, this is one of a million stories on Google.
    http://www.frontpagemag.com/point/218114/87-women-muslim-bangladesh-are-abused-daniel-greenfield
    Go Pauline, you have more courage in your little finger, than Potato Head has in his whole body.
    Even Mick will agree with me on that.
    Rae
    6th Jul 2016
    8:45am
    Not too sure about racism as muslims are not a race as such. It is a religion. You can't have religious intolerance but then again we have severely laid down rules about what satanists can do to babies and what priests can do to children so I suggest human rights issues can be discussed within Islam too without screams of racism.

    I'm pretty sure there is a great deal of sexism going on though within the mosque just by observation. Surely that needs dealing with. Any homophobia as well.
    Young Simmo
    6th Jul 2016
    9:17am
    Yes Rae, what I am saying is, I support Pauline Hanson's stopping the Muslim people of any shape, sort or Circumstances from getting into Australia. Their take over and dominance in England, is there for the world to see, and when you read the millions stories and quotes about how they treat females you will want to vomit.
    2 More examples:

    http://www.religiousfreedomcoalition.org/2013/09/20/muslim-man-rapes-child-bride-until-she-dies/

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1264729/Child-bride-13-dies-internal-injuries-days-arranged-marriage-Yemen.html

    YES, IT REALLY DOES HAPPEN.
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    9:57am
    I really hate to agree with you Simmo....but I do. Here in Australia we currently have a predominant genY group of journalists who, just like their demographic cohort, are running an politically correct agenda where anybody who speaks against any race is 'racist.
    I have no issues with Islamic people on a one to one basis as long as they are decent folk and good citizens. But just like you I see what has happened in almost every country this culture has settled in and it is totally unacceptable to inflict this religion and its practitioners on Australia. And before anybody comes back with the obvious YES there are good people in every culture. The issue with Islam however is that religion and politics are inseparable. Were this race the majority it would be mandatory for the rest of the nation to convert to Islam, some we do not do to anybody who settles in this country. This is one of our strengths.
    So much for a one line response.
    Young Simmo
    6th Jul 2016
    10:05am
    Actually Mick we might agree on 2 things. Australia is a relatively young country and there are millions of examples sticking out around the world illustrating the best and worst way to go.
    Main problem is, where do we find a group of Politicians smart enough to follow the right examples ????
    Eve
    6th Jul 2016
    2:54pm
    Young Simmo - that is Nazi talk, and Mick I expected much better from you. You've made sense up to now. I guess I must just be a supporter of child abuse. WTF?
    Young Simmo
    6th Jul 2016
    3:17pm
    Eve, get your head out of the bucket and read,
    THIS.
    http://www.religiousfreedomcoalition.org/2013/09/20/muslim-man-rapes-child-bride-until-she-dies/
    And THIS
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1264729/Child-bride-13-dies-internal-injuries-days-arranged-marriage-Yemen.html

    Then stop and think, all the do-gooders want this stuff in Australia. If this comment makes me a Nazi, I am proud of it.
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    3:42pm
    The DUMBING DOWN GUVS AND NEWSPAPERS Caused this Simmo ! I haven't got a clue why anyone bothers buying a Paper anymore or listening to the News for that matter ???? :-( Get the TRUTH and Facts elsewhere Folks and have your eyes Opened to what's REALLY Going on ! England MAY have seen it Just In Time ! And I think a Lot of Australians are slowly Waking Up ! :-) Obama the Muslim, is Rushing his Friends into America as fast as He can before he gets the B's Rush !! :-( :-( And we need 50,000 more here a year like a Hole in the Head !! :-( :-( WAKE UP !! FGS !!
    Eve
    7th Jul 2016
    2:09pm
    Young Simmo - I got my head out of the bucket and you are still full of it.

    Wahabi Sunni Islam is who you should be attacking. They are based in and funded from Saudi Arabia. This is evil Islam, run by power obsessed misogynist old men. I hate them.

    For god's sake, lay off the peaceful, normal Muslims - and there are many, many of them that you insist of hurting. They don't deserve you.
    Young Simmo
    7th Jul 2016
    2:17pm
    Eve, now I am not sure, you have to be a Muslim or that other blond mental rertard of a week or so ago POORWOMAN.
    OK you obviously agree with Muslims marrying 1 year olds, and consummating the marriage at 8 or 9 years so, there is no much point in going any further.
    Have a nice day POORWOMAN.
    Paulodapotter
    7th Jul 2016
    3:12pm
    Young Simmo, I have not heard so much uneducated drivel in my life. What the hell are you? A fundamentalist Christian or IS? They believe in slaughtering innocent Muslins too. You're a creep of the worst kind!
    Young Simmo
    7th Jul 2016
    3:58pm
    Paulodapotter, you must be Eve's other half because you don't make much sense either.
    By the way I am a non believing realist.
    Go and make a cuppa for Eve or Poorwoman, and change your name to Adam so you fit in better.
    Eve
    11th Jul 2016
    2:30pm
    Young Simmo, you are clearly demented. Enough said.
    Young Simmo
    11th Jul 2016
    2:38pm
    Eve, I hope you are a single person because the bloke that deserves you hasn't been born yet. OK, maybe Paulodapotter falls into that group.
    scud
    5th Jul 2016
    6:15pm
    The message to the established two party political order is that you are warned. This is reflected in the 23% primary vote for independents. People have and are becoming increasingly dissatisfied with and angry and cynical about the two major parties and their politicians, a phenomenon we are seeing in many other parts of the world.

    Now, how about the two major parties and the independents work together like mature, good mannered, truthful, respectful, listening, understanding, empathetic, rational, inclusive, compromising adults for the betterment of Australia and its people. Wishful thinking I suppose.

    If the parties and their politicians continue to do what they’ve done, then you’ll get what you’ve got to now. They’ve been warned.
    Migrant
    5th Jul 2016
    7:57pm
    Standing back from the present result, makes one ask whether we have considered a system like th Swiss , where the government works for Switzerland , and where the PM is rotated each year, or whether we can learn from the Kiwis how to manage a parliament with no majority power.
    Both work in their jurisdictions. Could one of them work in Oz?
    Migrant
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    8:20pm
    We couldn't get a Polly here to work in an Iron Lung !! :-)
    particolor
    5th Jul 2016
    8:23pm
    Anyhow !! I thought we already hat the Swiss System ? A New Prime Minister every 12 Months !! :-)
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    9:09pm
    Certainly worth a close look. Sadly the Woolies and Coles of local politics would find it hard to accept that they are accountable. They need to be.
    Amadeoz
    5th Jul 2016
    8:41pm
    At every occasion we proudly sing that "We are all Australians". Gives you some idea how backward our electoral system is: stubbornly provincial or even parochial! The country is divided up in more or less "equal" (as to population numbers) divisions and the victorious candidate is the MP or senator who represents the interest of all the people Inthe division. Of course, the MPs who are best networked, equipped with best resources, with the biggest mouth are most successful in getting the best deals for the people who voted for them. Most representatives collect from 50.1% to 60% of the total vote. A small number catch about 60% to 70%. The winner takes all. The remainder, more than 40% of the votes in every division, is lost, worthless, counts for nothing. The losing voters might as well stayed home (@$20), saving time in queuing up. It would have produced exactly the same outcome.
    So if we, in these times of global perspectives, are willing to look beyond our narrow borders and think big as Australians, we should seriously consider scrapping the archaic election system from a British middle-age era and replacing it with a system of proportional representation on a broader, if not national, scale.
    MICK
    5th Jul 2016
    9:15pm
    I'd go further and say that the politician with the biggest chequebook gets to saturate the electorate with their spiel and win the seat in most cases. They call that 'electioneering'. What it is is propaganda and the system needs to be changed to one where the public purse (ouch!) gives each pollie $30,000 and that is all they are allowed to spend. No top-up from any other source allowed The rest is talks and conferences to convince the public that they should be elected.
    I'd like to see how this is received from both sides.....but given that Nick Xenophon's candidate won a House of Reps seat on $10,000 this is not an impossible ask. What it does do is remove the indoctrination of the electorate and gives ALL candidates a chance based on their spiel to the electorate.
    ex PS
    8th Jul 2016
    4:55am
    It would be interesting to explore a better system, but from what I see ours seems to be one of the best of a bad lot.
    I would not like to see an American system anyone can run for President, as long as they have a couple of billion to throw around.
    Grateful
    6th Jul 2016
    9:08am
    The only good thing that has come out of this election is to allow so many people to express their views and get a lot of pent up frustration off their chest.
    But, the Coalition will be the next government and probably in their own right and with no policies for essential changes, we can look forward to another 3 years of nothing.
    Even if they need a couple from the independents in the Reps, the Coalition will not be introducing anything that will alter the status quo. They will still be arguing to get policies in their 2014 budget passed, and that's saying nothing about the problem that they are going to have passing that Company Tax idea!!
    So, as the Coalition won't be moving too far away from their positions, we will see for weeks, probably months, heads being beaten against unmovable walls and all that is going to happen is some egos from the new Senate having their say but getting nowhere.
    The only beneficiaries will be the Fox News "commentators" (participants) getting paid big bucks by Rupert Murdoch and praying for another election.
    The ONLY way that essential major decisions being made in the fields of taxation, superannuation and GENUINE welfare, is for one party to take the bull by the horns and try to get at least 55% of the vote and take the majority of the population with them. Will take enormous guts and leadership. Where is that in Australian politics today???????
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    10:00am
    It's yet to be seen how it all plays out. I am thinking that the Liberal Party will do everything to cause problems and will try its best to push us back to another election as soon as possible as these people cannot live without absolute power. We heard that from Turnbull on election night.
    Grateful
    6th Jul 2016
    10:38am
    Mick. Without being "political", I think that you just might be right. The Coalition MUST get a majority to prevent a hugely disruptive period in our government. The Coalition in particular certainly does not enjoy having to go cap in hand to "outsiders" to beg them for support, and seeing who they are having to beg, there are no obvious matters that will change the status quo.

    The Coalition still hasn't had VITAL legislation passed from its 2014 Budget, matters that they have included in this year's Budget and upon which they have based their entire policy "plan". They are "savings" that still will not be passed and represent a major black hole in the entire budget outlook. THAT has not been highlighted other than they being called "zombie" numbers, but, the Coalition still professes that they have a better financial "plan". It is nothing less than fraudulent to say that they are better than the other lot. And what does it do to their "plan" WHEN, not if, their Company Tax policy, their ONLY policy, fails in the Senate????
    Who is going to call them out on that major problem, certainly not Nick Xenefon or heaven forbid Pauline Hanson, or ANYONE of the new "outsiders" who will be receiving a lovely pay rise and pension with absolutely NO positive outcomes for all Australians. Those "outsiders" will just have their day in the sun and have their egos massaged, just like most other members of parliament.
    There is simply NOBODY in the present lot, with their current policies, that is going to make any difference whatsoever to what we have seen since 2013.
    Can ANYBODY here tell us what changes THEY expect from this parliament with the Coalition having either a majority in its own right, or, with help from"outsiders"?
    I use the word "outsiders" just to identify that they are not in the LNP or ALP, the ONLY parties that can make any effective major changes that are so obviously needed. Like we have been since 2014, we will simply go along like a cork in the ocean, getting NOWHERE. Time for some real GUTS!!!
    Grateful
    6th Jul 2016
    10:53am
    P.S. Reading and hearing what people have been saying does cause much confusion when so many people are saying that Labor can't get the budget in balance when we KNOW that so many people are blatantly rorting both the welfare and taxation systems, primarily caused by the Howard/Costello Budgets of 2004 and 2007.
    We simply cannot afford those hand outs and MUST return to those budgets to make the essential changes necessary to not only bring the budget back into balance but to start reducing that mountain of debt which was exacerbated by the GFC (which Australia did "survive").
    People incorrectly persist with saying that the LNP left no debt but what they did leave is a stack of rorts which are the major cause for all of our economic and social problems.
    Let's get "politics" out of all of these major issues and have SOMEONE with vision and guts do something about it, not, just simply talk and argue which the population is so sick and tired of evidenced by this latest election outcome.
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    3:37pm
    Your post sounds like coalition propaganda Grateful.
    Your assumption that the coalition must get a majority is at odds with the fact that voters think otherwise.
    Your assumption that zombie measures should be passed is on another planet because the electorate DOES NOT WANT some of the aggressive attacks on the public to go through.
    Your assumption that Labor can't get the budget in balance ignores the fact that the current coalition government has run up a further $100 billion in debt and now proposes a $50 tax giveaway to the rich rather than repaying the claimed Budget Emergency debt.

    You are cleverly stretching the facts and pushing the dishonest right wing barrow advocating the taking away of anything and everything which average citizens rely on and need and giving it to the rich. This is the position taken by right wing trolls.
    Grateful
    7th Jul 2016
    10:23am
    Mick. Sorry, but, you have completely misinterpreted my comments, ALL of them. In saying that the Coalition MUST get a majority, I have conceded that Labor cannot get that majority and that the Coalition will get very close to it. If you read further, without that majority, we will have the situation where instead of a party, either one of the majors, having authority which nearly 50% of the population has democratically given them, we will see ALL government business and legislation left in the hands of one or two people who receive a few percent of the populations' wishes, DICTATING to that government.
    That would be a democratic and practical disaster to ALL Australians. It would effectively make ONE person, probably Bob Katter, THE most powerful person in Australia!!! So much for democracy.

    As for you comment about what I said about those "zombie" numbers, I believe that my comment there, calling the claims of the Coalition to be tantamount to being fraudulent, clearly identifies that I am by no means spreading Coalition propaganda that you have stated. In fact, to the absolute contrary as is the rest of your comments.
    I am categorically stating that NEITHER party can get this budget into balance and significantly reduce our debt with their current policies and that it will take a very gutsy party to come out with some extremely tough decisions that will be very unpopular to those to whom they are addressed and I also state quite categorically and have said here for years, that those people are primarily the ones who are benefiting from the hugely generous and unsustainable budgets left by John Howard and Tony Costello in 2004 and 2007. I.E. Those that are getting far to high taxation benefits for their investments and superannuation funds and those that are taking payments specifically designed as "welfare" for those that genuinely NEED them.
    Until one of the major parties gains that courage we will continue with the status quo and leave all this financial mess to our children to clean up. Now where is OUR courage to insist that those hard decision be made and made NOW or are we so selfish to just continue arguing here on political lines??? This is WAY above party politics!!!!
    And will we now receive an apology from John Howard for taking Australia into an illegal war as Tony Blair has just done. Betcha we won't.
    ex PS
    8th Jul 2016
    5:02am
    Don't worry Grateful at first glance it did look like you were advocating an LNP resurrection. Your meaning did become clear further into the comment.
    You are not the only one who gets misinterpreted in the heat of the moment.
    Oliva
    6th Jul 2016
    12:13pm
    The Mediscare, according to the Media Commentators and Coalitian Whingers, was a factor in the Coalitians poor showing. Well if that's true show us-line them up and launch a class action.
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    3:43pm
    I dare the bastards to try it. Then the attack on GetUp's website payment system and fraudulent misuse of some credit cards by the hacker will come out.
    Who does one think launched this cyber attack? Same sort of thing every election. It may be circumstantial evidence but the timing and repetitive behaviour says it all. And lying bastards demonise unions! Yeah right.
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    3:52pm
    I don't think a lot of people took a Scrap of Notice of that Garbage (Or Not Garbage) They were more Interested in listening to what Pauline had to say ! The Truth ! of the matter ! :-) She may not speak too Eloquently but the Message is there !! :-) And sure Beats Career Polly's LIES and Cover Ups !! :-(
    Old Geezer
    6th Jul 2016
    4:21pm
    I certainly didn't take any notice of what Pauline had to say. She will find herself back in jail before long with some of the things she is saying.
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    4:32pm
    But those she is talking about are Saying FAR WORSE !! :-( :-( Or wont the News tell you that ?? :-(
    Young Simmo
    6th Jul 2016
    4:43pm
    Old Geezer, this is what Pauline doesn't like, what are your thoughts.

    http://www.religiousfreedomcoalition.org/2013/09/20/muslim-man-rapes-child-bride-until-she-dies/
    And THIS
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1264729/Child-bride-13-dies-internal-injuries-days-arranged-marriage-Yemen.html
    Blossom
    6th Jul 2016
    12:53pm
    AEC can srat by having enough voting form papers for people to vote on.
    I know for a fact that one Booth in SA ran out of forms by 5.30.

    We don't want a "hung" parliament and that is what it still looked like last night.
    MICK
    6th Jul 2016
    3:44pm
    A hung parliament might be good. Hang 'em all!
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    4:25pm
    Ticket available at Ticked Off Tec !! :-)
    Grateful
    7th Jul 2016
    10:32am
    Mick and others. Have we ever considered that we get the parliament that we deserve. While we continue to vote for parties that will not take the essential hard decisions to make this country fairer for ALL Australians and keep milking the over generous handouts that we don't NEED, nothing will change. So, what do we get, disenchantment and from that small splinter parties to absorb that disenchantment, Exactly what we got on Saturday.
    So, I go back to my first question, have we ever sat back and blamed OURSELVES for the position that we now find ourselves in? OUR GREED and selfishness???? Think about it before we go blaming everyone else.
    ex PS
    8th Jul 2016
    5:14am
    Grateful you are correct, everyone wants something but they want somebody else to pay for it. This was what led to John Howards strategy of cutting back on infrastructure spending so that he could bribe voters with tax cuts in election years.
    The success of this self defeating tactic was so impressive that it was copied by other governments.
    I firmly believe that this action led to the now common belief that the governments first priority was getting re-elected and the needs of the voters came a sad and distant second.
    It is time politicians learnt what public service is all about.
    particolor
    6th Jul 2016
    3:55pm
    Before I get tossed off here forever :-) Have another think about that Honourable Lot at the Top There now !! :-( :-( Honourable !! :-) :-) :-) :-)
    libsareliars
    6th Jul 2016
    4:07pm
    I agree with Mick 11.29am
    Gigi
    10th Jul 2016
    1:46pm
    Negotiating is not new, Labor & Conservative Parties have done it before & during WW2 difference is they were interested in what happened to Australia, whilst our current politicians know more about SELF INTEREST!! No Statesmen in our houses of Parliament just self ingratiating also rans. We are responsible for our current crop of Politicians & until the voter starts demanding more of their representatives we will continue to get no value for our money!!
    catsahoy
    10th Jul 2016
    10:25pm
    sorry folks, this has nothing to do with the subject, but I need DREWS help urgently, DREW I CANNOT LOG INTO THE OTHER SITE, ANY HELP PLEASE, CATSAHOY, THANKSM


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