Joe Hockey’s last hurrah

Yesterday, former treasurer Joe Hockey said goodbye to a 20-year parliamentary career.

Joe Hockey’s last hurrah

As former treasurer Joe Hockey said goodbye to his 20-year parliamentary career, he also threw in a few ‘head scratchers’ for his party to ponder.

During his valedictory speech delivered in parliament yesterday, Mr Hockey was met with praise, good will and applause from MPs on all sides.

The parting speech, which took on the form of a self submitted report card, included not only a list of measures he helped to implement, but also the potential benefits of changes to negative gearing, the introduction of means testing private health insurance, the rollback of super tax concessions, and the restructuring of the GST – all policies he vigorously opposed during his time as treasurer.

“Tax concessions on superannuation should be carefully pared back,” he said, and negative gearing “should be skewed towards new housing”.

He also admitted that the Abbott Government was “good at policy but struggled with politics”, and added, “The real Tony Abbott is more of a decent man than you may know.”

The former treasurer used his final opportunity to speak in front of parliament as a call to end the revolving door and unpredictable changes of government that have led to a weakening of public policy.

"We cannot make it normal to have four prime ministers and four treasurers in just four years," he said.

He finished his speech, saying: "It is far better to dream mighty things, to seek glorious triumphs even though chequered by failure, than to be amongst those poor souls who neither suffer much, nor enjoy much because they live in the great twilight that knows neither victory nor defeat."

Sage advice or a final disclaimer?

After the speech, the applause, and love, was flowing from all sides, with Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull – the man who could be called responsible for Mr Hockey’s job loss – pronouncing his party's respect for the optimistic former treasurer.

“You've executed every office you've had ... with great passion, with imagination," he said. "You've done Australia proud."

Even Opposition Leader Bill Shorten had good words to say about Mr Hockey.

"This is no ordinary day. You are no ordinary Joe," he said.

It is widely believed that Mr Hockey will soon be appointed to a diplomatic post in the United States.

Read more at www.news.com.au

Read more at www.sbs.com.au

How do you feel Joe Hockey performed as treasurer? If you heard Joe’s farewell speech, what was your reaction? What do you think of his potential appointment as Australia’s ambassador to the USA?





    COMMENTS

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    Star Trekker
    22nd Oct 2015
    9:47am
    "How do you feel Joe Hockey performed as treasurer?"
    Should have gone back to school

    "What do you think of his potential appointment as Australia’s ambassador to the USA?"
    Another job for the boys
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:03am
    I started to listen to Hockey giving his self interest eulogy but had to turn it off as it was offensive. It never ceases to surprise me that when pollies die all the pollies who hated the dearly departed then sing his praises. Sickening!
    In the case of Hockey he was not a person to be respected and tried his best to do unconscionable things to ordinary Australians in his effort to move money into the bank accounts of the rich. And on retirement (kicked out?) Hockey had the hide to stand up and tell a whole pile of porkies.
    To my way of thinking Joe was a disgrace and should hang his head in shame. But being a part of an Abbott legacy Hockey has been handed a nice little golden parachute: an ambassadorship. Well ALL of the ambassadorships go to ex LNP pollies....the sort of bias which never happened under the previous governments.
    Tezza
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:23am
    I wonder if Joe will perform better than Kim Beasley in the US posting? What party was Kim part of?
    John M
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:02pm
    Tezza both the major parties look after their mates or hadn't you realized that? From memory we have Alexander Bummer in England at present but he will probably move on to make way for Abbott so Abbott can get closer to his mate Phil the Greek.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:06pm
    mick, to my way of thinking, your way of thinking reflects a bitter and twisted pro Labor bias and you would have complained about the mess if Hockey had performed hari kiri on himself as an act of atonement in Parliament yesterday.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:25pm
    Tezza: I hear what you are saying. What I was saying is that the Rudd government SHARED the ambassadorships equally between Labor and Liberal. The Abbott government gave ALL TO ITS LNP CRONIES. There is a difference.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:03pm
    That's quite right, mick. I hope that under Turnbull, politics will return to some form of bipartinship in many areas.
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    7:55pm
    Politics have returned to normal already. Turnbull and his team are running rings around that motley rabble on the opposition. It is getting to the point where Shorten is almost afraid to ask a question. He always leaves parliament with egg dripping off his face these days.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:31pm
    I always discuss 'jobs for the cronies/mates' - party has no influence on my views.

    Once again - all politicians past should be forbidden from working in any capacity for government due to blatant and obvious bias. No more jobs on the 'board' of Oz Airships Inc and so forth... South Melbourne Beach Sand Reconciliation Commission...... Blue Mountains Rainfall and Escarpment Development Organisation...... Depth Measuring Committee for Inland Dams..... Murray River Flow Monitoring Commission..... Naval Warships Consideration Incorporated...... Infrastructure and Road Map Planning Board.... Lake Eyre Salt Level Analysis Group.....

    .. all on fat salaries and full found and attached to the parliamentary super fund for full benefits.....

    Chrissakes - where is this country going?
    Sundays
    23rd Oct 2015
    9:23am
    Well said Mick, and remember Joe also said 'the age of entitlement is over' but not for him of course!
    wally
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:47am
    Speaking of bi partisanship (as proposed for Malcolm to adhere to), perhaps if there was to be genuine bipartisan ambassadorial appointments, perhaps Mark Latham would be a suitable candidate to be our next ambassador to the US. Or the celebrated Misogynist denouncer Julia Gillard might fit the bill to represent Australia in Saudi Arabia. Or maybe Pauline Hanson to represent Australia in the United Nations!

    But since the ambassadorial appointments have all been stitched up behind the proverbial closed doors long before the public is made aware of who gets what, such discussion is beside the point and no more than chatter.
    Robin7
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:04am
    He was just another LNP party lapdog - Hockey and the LNP hate ordinary Australians with a passion bordering on fanaticism.
    The LNP have gone so far Right Wing they are no longer representative of Australia's values, welcome to 1930's Europe.
    Tezza
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:29am
    Joe had no idea of what it is like to work hard and to look after his fellow workers like Craig Thompson, Billy Shorten, Kathy Jackson, Julia Gillard etc. They have all been set up.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:11pm
    Tezza, are you suggesting that Hockey should have worked harder at feathering his own nest by betraying the interests of gullible Union rank and file members the way Thomson, Shorten, Jackson et al ? Could you tell us what Union Joe Hockey was an official of?
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:31pm
    Tezza: Have not seen you on this website before and you are posting the exact same propaganda which comes from our resident LNP troll Frank. So who are you?
    Robin7 makes a valid comment. The current government has come after ordinary Australians with a vengeance and most of the front bench (Hockey, Pyne, Morrison, Bishop) and the PM have held ordinary Australians in the utmost of contempt....whilst reducing taxes for the rich, refusing to end the Tax shelters for same and doing everything in its power to practice "class warfare" whilst publicly attacking the Opposition for doing this when it spoke out about the policies.
    You can run Frank but you can't hide.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:37pm
    You left out direct assault on the Unions, mick.

    I'm still wondering who exactly is doing any 'standover' on the Deputy Sheik of Auburn's building site - hardly likely to be the tradesmen etc, who like a nephew -in-law, will not be paid and will be told to keep it quiet by the outlaw bikie gang or lose his kneecaps. Certainly not the Union men, who would be holding a place in a concrete pillar by now...

    Just saying - the obvious plan is that destroying the Unions will create an open field for business to romp in majesty over the oppressed workers on a pittance.

    These people are dangerous to life and liberty.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:05pm
    That's a bit tough, Robin7, though I do agree the LNP are a bit overloaded with the "born to rule" syndrome. Hockey was a victim of that hubris.
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:29pm
    Gee Tezza, seeing all those names kind of gave me a dreadful morbid feeling.
    I hope this government can stop all that nest feathering. Their Party President was considered an unfit person to sit on the First State Board and yet could not legally be stood down. How does one get a job like boss of the HSU?
    voodoolady
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:18am
    He smugly sat and smoked his cigars while telling pensioners to smoke less and stop playing the pokies. The deficit emergency he declared while in Opposition was made larger. No Budget he handed down was never accepted and he picked the wrong horse during a spill and lost his job. As a reward for not actually achieving ANYTHING as Treasurer that was promised, he will be given a job representing us outside of this country. When he retires, he's guaranteed free travel, superannuation, a parliamentary retirement package for life PLUS benefits (he's not even means tested or asset tested which we ALL have to be) For a complete failure who achieved nothing...he did ok...for himself!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:07pm
    The bigger they are, the harder they fall, eg Hockey, Abbott, Abetz, et al.
    Luchar
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:07pm
    Aaaah, the politics of envy! How right you are, voodoolady! Here we have an ordinary family which emigrated to this country, started with nothing and worked hard to build up a healthy bank balance and become quite wealthy. Then we find that their son has the audacity to take a break from his work to enjoy a cigar where he is photographed by some photographer seeking a scoop. How smug and contemptible can one person get? Is it possible to conjure up an image worse than that?

    Oh, wait a moment. I forgot that dreadful occasion when Tony Abbott dared wink at his interviewer during a radio interview!

    Yes, voodoolady, the country is certainly better off without two people who would commit such dreadful acts!
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:36pm
    Joe's maternal grandmother was a property investor on the North Shore long before dear old Joe got into the game.

    Don't offer me crocodile tears for Joe Hockey, son of a family that owned their own shop etc and used tax avoidance to the max, and had enough to send him to private school, from whence he then went into merchant banking, using other people's money to garner large commissions, and then into politics for a continuation of the free ride, all with two brain cells warily regarding each other across his skull like two bare-knuckle prize fighters in their 30th round.....
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:01am
    I guess what you're saying TREBOR is you would be happier to have a Treasurer who lacks financial success.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:08am
    I would be happier to have a Treasurer who understood more than borrowing against property to buy property and how to use other people's money to make a profit.

    Government, despite the endless protestations of the 'right' is not and never can be a business - and the only reason they have cast it as a business is so that, in the manner of the current China mandarins and their neo-Emperor, they, as the board members, can reap mightily from it.

    We've seen that with the outright theft of public roads and sell-off of utilities, often into their own hands and those of family and mates, and the only outcome so far has been massively rising prices for the ordinary person.

    I wouldn't call any of that financial success - it is daylight robbery.

    A Treasurer needs to fully understand budgeting within the bills as due and the absolute responsibility to pay what is due, and borrowing to make up the shortfall, like any household does - not how to engineer a profit and use money flow as a weapon in a social war.

    There endeth the lesson.
    nena
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:25am
    Mr Joe Hockey is a 'joke'!!! He should stay home and do some gardening and eat vegetables, perhaps some diet would be a good start, don’t just do it past xmas. His brain must be very unhealthy as it has demonstrated for the past 10 years or so… In reference to his speech…I have never heard so much hypocrisy from all sides of politics, the theory of 'I will scratch you back if you scratch mine´ keeps going on, regrettably.
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:26pm
    nena I am disgusted at your personal attack on Mr Hockey. Whether or not you supported his politics, it is beneath contempt to make such abusive personal comments at all, never mind on a public forum.
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:53pm
    Oh please KSS. Your comment is far more offensive than Nena's.
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:25pm
    Please take note Jen, my criticism is of the action NOT the person. There is a world of difference. I would, however, be interested in your opinion of what exactly you find offensive in my comment.
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:29pm
    Um...saying Nena's views are beneath contempt? And your purporting that her comments were abusive? Many of your posts are offensive KSS. But nobody has a cry about it.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:33pm
    Hockey will be having the last laugh. Having stood up in front of the parliament and cameras and spun his fairytale he now takes up a wonderful ambassadorship. The LNP mates club in full swing!
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:34pm
    Ummm NO Jen, making abusive personal comments is beneath contempt not Nena herself or her views. Please read what I wrote NOT what you think I wrote.
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:41pm
    "nena I am disgusted at your personal attack" Sound personal enough to me KSS.
    tia-maria
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:19pm
    Jen don't worry about KSS this guy has an attitude..............and only his opinions he thinks counts.........
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:23pm
    Yes Jen - "I am disgusted" - that phrase is a statement about ME - MY reaction - MY opinion. Otherwise it would be [You are disgusting] that would be about [Nena] and not what I actually said!

    "....at your personal attack....' this is about the action and not the writer. And surely you do not disagree that what Nena wrote WAS a personal attack on Mr Hockey! So this phrase is a statement of fact not a value judgement of Nena.

    Or perhaps you would find similar comments about say; a member of your family, or indeed yourself, perfectly acceptable?
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:11pm
    Jen, there is a distinction between playing the man and playing the ball. However, KSS comments do not always smell of roses or truth. Handling the truth carelessly is an art form that KSS manages to exude from time to time. His remarks are usually full of sanctimony.
    Jen
    23rd Oct 2015
    5:06pm
    I'm well aware of the distinction but in this instance, telling a person he is disgusted with their behaviour is pretty personal and offensive.
    Mamacrystal
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:27am
    "Good riddance to bad rubbish" as the saying goes..... plenty more bad rubbish left where that came from!
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:28am
    Appeared to be a nice bloke who would have made a great Minister for Sports and Racing.
    Mamacrystal
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:56am
    And fine wining. dining and smoking expensive cigars.... is there a Portfolio for that?
    pete@nakedhydroponics
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:07am
    Following the footsteps of Russ Hinze?
    Anonymous
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:03pm
    Some people also said "appeared to be a nice guy" about Alan Bond, Peter Foster, Christopher Skase, Gordon Nuttall, etc, etc, the list goes on and on. Wake up to yourself and don't be naive. All of these people were "nice guys" - TO THEMSELVES ONLY!!
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:34pm
    Very Un-Australian to kick a guy when he is down.He has given a lot of years of service to this country and deserves a bit of respect on his departure.
    If smoking expensive cigars is the best fault anyone can put on him then he can't have been that bad.
    Anonymous
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:46pm
    Very un-Australian to treat aged/old people with disregard and dispassion, as well. Or do you disagree with that too? He got what he deserved - THE BOOT!
    Anonymous
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:50pm
    mangomick, and read voodoolady's and nena's comments above. Both of them live in the real world.
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:03pm
    i agree with him in the fact that Australia cannot afford to keep paying for a welfare system that it can't afford. In actual fact he didn't get the boot. He was offered an alternative portfolio and he rejected it.The same people who were advising Hockey on policy will be the same people advising his predecessor. Hope you aren't trying to make out that you are any different and are nice to everybody.
    Anonymous
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:56pm
    I am "nice" only to those people who are deserving of such treatment and this does not include hypocrites, sycophants, bludgers, or those collecting their pay under false pretences. Remind you of anyone?
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:15pm
    I agree Mangomick. I think he was poorly cast too. However, I don't know he would have functioned well under any LNP portfolio. They are all fraught with unresolvable problems under their present form.
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:43pm
    Well Fast Eddie, based on that list you can't even be nice to yourself.
    Paulo, i think that while Hockey wasn't suited to the Treasurers role I think having Abbott as leader made it harder for him to even try to make a decent fist of the job.
    Anonymous
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:53pm
    You know nothing about me and you last comment is as rash, unfounded, foolish, and without any substance whatsoever. Do your research before you tap your little keyboard or you will tend to show your ignorance again.
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    9:06pm
    Been on this earth long enough to know human nature. Unless you are Jesus Christ himself then at some point in time you would have been guilty of being hypocritical. The fact that you admit that you are nice to only those who are "deserving of such treatment" makes you a borderline sycophant. Otherwise you would be nice to everyone.
    Definition of sycophant: Someone who tries to get what they want, or earn someone's respect, by using flattery.i.e. Being nice to select groups.
    As for voodoolady's and nena's comments , bitter old ladies who don't live in the real world at all, they live in their own little worlds. They probably whinge about people with rental properties or have salary sacrificed to get a decent super pay out and now have more than they do.Guess you must be proud to be tarred with the same brush.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:38pm
    Is that 'knowing human nature' the same as 'common sense'? Meaning that it is your viewpoint exclusively so it must be right?

    We definitely need emoticons here....
    mangomick
    23rd Oct 2015
    1:02pm
    TREBOR are you telling me that you have never in your life been hypocritical of anyone either. Well i must inform the Vatican ,that's obviously two more Saints I've found them.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    1:30pm
    mango you are making far too many assumptions to support an assumed opinion.
    voodoolady
    23rd Oct 2015
    4:46pm
    Hey Mango Mick Wow talk about someone who has no clue. FYI I am actually quite young and prior to my accident that left me disabled I was in a very good job where I did salary sacrifice for my Super which I will thankfully receive in a few years despite wanting to claim it many time due to hardship. I am on the disability pension for now while I reeducate myself to become a teacher so I can teach disabled people/children. Hopefully after I get my new degree I will be off the pension and again adding to my super portfolio. I find your comments boorish, sanctimonious and ill-informed. You truly make yourself look quite silly when you wildly make comments about other posters you have no clue about. You have a credibility level of zero when you do that. Perhaps try to add value to the conversation rather than make assumptions you have no proof to back up
    mangomick
    23rd Oct 2015
    5:35pm
    Wow. Now we have saint Frank saint robert and saint Eddie. we are truly blessed
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    7:44pm
    You are truly blessed mango. You!
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:18am
    Aye, and he knoweth not the ways... we will continue to offer our wisdom for free to all - everyone is entitled to my opinion.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:18am
    Aye, and he knoweth not the ways... we will continue to offer our wisdom for free to all - everyone is entitled to my opinion.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:18am
    Aye, and he knoweth not the ways... we will continue to offer our wisdom for free to all - everyone is entitled to my opinion.
    mangomick
    24th Oct 2015
    9:19am
    voodoolady Thanks for your biography. I was referring to Fast Eddies statement where he stated that,...." I read voodoolady's and nena's comments above. Both of them live in the real world. ".....
    After reading Nenas and your comments I was questioning how he could assume, that yours and more so Nena's comments, that are only denigrating a person who has given a great many years of his life to public service, could be classed as being representative of someone "living in the real world. While I have never been a fan of Tony Abbott or many of his policies, I at least have the decency to respect the man for dedicating part of his life in the pursuit of public good regardless of his politics. , even if belligerently. It's poor form to insult any man/women after giving all those years to public service .
    voodoolady
    30th Oct 2015
    11:58am
    Umm no you said "As for voodoolady's and nena's comments , bitter old ladies who don't live in the real world at all, they live in their own little worlds. They probably whinge about people with rental properties or have salary sacrificed to get a decent super pay out and now have more than they do."

    You accused me of being a bitter old lady.I care not if you are replying to Frank or the Lord God. YOU were the one who made an assumption on my personality, my finances and my position within society. I made a statement regarding facts regarding Joe Hockey. He a. Never successfully passed a budget, b. he left the Nation's deficit larger than it was when he became Treasurer. In short, in his role of Treasurer he failed in my opinion (which just quietly I am allowed to have).

    It has nothing to do with the Politics or even the topic. It is about your attitude and assumptions regarding me and I have called you out on it. I will not allow ANYONE in this forum to make ANY assumptions about me. Please make note of this in future responses to my posts. You can try being a bully or you can try being a reasonable respectful human being...I choose the latter..how about you?
    btony
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:06am
    hurrah and hooroo
    pete@nakedhydroponics
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:15am
    Notice to the USA: RETURNS NOT ACCEPTED.
    leonYLC
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:47pm
    too funny
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:35pm
    I might imagine that Joe may take up residence with an American benefactor: Rupert Murdoch?
    Maybe there is a place for legislation to revoke citizenship. Who knows.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:18pm
    They'll love him. Big, cuddly, non-confrontational, just like most Aussies are with their Yanky conterparts. They'll think Kim will have had a haircut when Hocky Waltzing Matildas in.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:41pm
    Maybe the government should enact legislation (hesitate to use that word in view of my dissertation on the chasm-wide differences between Law, law, legislation and regulation - you'll get there one day, Grasshoppers).... to forbid re-entry to any politician past with a record of failure, and who is suspected of working with IS (Incredible Self-Worth).
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:16am
    I wasn't surprised at his speech at all. More of the same, lecturing without a clue. He will go down as the most useless and most disliked treasurer of all time. A pampered, supported private schoolboy, on the public teat for his entire life.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:16pm
    Evidently you have not heard of the ALP contenders in the Worthless Treasurer competition like Jim Cairns and Wayne Swan. They would be "shoo ins" for the title ahead of Hockey.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:37pm
    All might be in the same club wally. Don't know if Swan was in the 'low life' category well. He would more than likely be lumped into the 'self importance' group.
    Unlike Joe Swan did not come after the poor! Not a recommendation though.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:19pm
    Lets have a competition then. Who is the worst treasurer of all? I'd put my money on John Howard - or have you all forgotten.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:45pm
    I actually thought Howard was not too bad.
    This conversation is a bit like comparing tatoos. All ink and plenty of bravado.
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    8:00pm
    I would sat Chris Bowen. But to be fair he had a few changes in job description.
    Ladybug
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:18am
    hOO ROO sMOKEY jOE
    VicCherikoff
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:23am
    It beggars belief that anything positive could be said for a treasurer who was SO out of touch with reality of ordinary life in Australia. Funny that he didn't mention his dislike of windmills again and proclaim his love for massive open cut coal mines and coal loaders on the world's largest barrier reef. We could all appreciate his intelligence on this opinion.

    I think that he and Abbott will be recorded in the history books as the worst Treasurer and PM this country has seen - ever!
    Mamacrystal
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:25am
    I'll second that!
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:54pm
    Me too.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:22pm
    Vic, Mama and Jen, I guess you 3 would rate Kevin 07 , Julia and Wayne Swan as the Economic "Dream Team" of Australian politics. If so, why did the Labor Caucus heavies dump Rudd and Gillard when the polls indicated rough going for Labor in the run up to two elections?

    I do not know what medication you three are taking, but it sure isn't smart pills!
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:42pm
    wally: I think you may be being a bit unfair. Gillard got a huge number of Bills through and was highly regarded by international counterparts. Abbott? The clown of clowns and I'd love to know what was being said about him behind closed (diplomatic) doors.
    What you need to focus on is whether Gillard's Bills were in the national interest. I suggest that they were. Whilst the Carbon Tax will always be a bone of contention and the lie which saw this brought in was wrong I suggest that you look at how it was working and what the IMF is suggesting to put this into context rather than listen to the coal industry attacks compliments of the Murdoch Press.
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:46pm
    Wally dear, I don't know. I am not a Labor follower nor was I much interested in politics in those days. But if it annoys you, then yes, you are correct. Dream team, World's best treasurer, got us through the GFC unscathed. ;)
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:22pm
    We've just had our George Bush jnr moment and thank heavens it passed rather quickly unless of course you add Howard the coward as well.
    wally
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:54am
    Hi Paulo, I like your comment about Australia having (survived?) our George Dubya moment. I sincerely hope that Malcolm does not saddle us up with a few "Obama moments" during his time as PM!
    Grateful
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:46am
    A born "diplomat". Vigorously opposed policies that were desperately needed in this economy and then espouses in favour of them in his farewell speech. What a joke!!! He didn't fail his "politics" because he said things that he now says that he didn't believe in and yet, we want politicians to use their "conscience" to vote on serious issues such as gay marriage!! Will they then be diplomats, or politicians, or maybe honest individuals?? I bet which it will be.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:55pm
    Honest individuals/politicians/diplomats.... hang on .. I'm getting confused here... (proxy ROFL emoticon)..
    mogo51
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:48am
    How hypocritical are Politicians. They beat each others brains out by inglorious behaviour in the Parliament. They plot to fatten their own wallets during their period of Parliament. They knife their collegues with disdain and then speak glowingly as they leave screaming and choking.
    The past 7 odd years of Parliament has been the worst in Australia's history and there is no signs of this changing in the short term.
    As a Treasurer Hockey was a disaster. His attack on pensioners and the needy has been appalling. NOw he is spruking what everyone has been calling for! I rest my case
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:43pm
    And you missed the last irony: when one of the low life die their fiercest opponents get up on the podium and sing their praises. Give me a break!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:25pm
    Yeh, but the body language and the over effusiveness lets us all know what they really think. Politicians lie, but most of us can't tell the difference between when they are lying and when they aren't, so we take the view that that's all they do. We need lie detectors built into our TVs and radios.
    Young
    22nd Oct 2015
    11:59am
    Joe seemed to be a great bloke as did Tony Abbot.I bet if we met them in a pub they would be very friendly.It is all too easy today to bring a person down.
    So Joe should have looked after Craig Thompson and Kate Jackson.No way.
    Hockey failed because the people did not like losing some of their benefits and the hostile senate blocked his actions.
    His speech showed what a great person he is.
    leonYLC
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:28pm
    Young, I must admit, I never had much of an opinion of Mr Hockey, apart from the usual 'politicians are all the same' point of view. But after hearing him speak at this year's Budget lock-in, I was quite impressed by his charisma (for want of a better word) and yes, maybe he wouldn't be too bad a bloke with whom to have a beer. Can't say I'd say the same about Tony, but then I've never met him in person. At least you know with Joe that he'd bring the good cigars!
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:28pm
    Surely this is satire?

    BTW, Young, did you watch Four Corners the other night? About your mates Lawler and Jackson: https://independentaustralia.net/life/life-display/four-corners-on-lawler-and-jackson-car-crash-tv-at-its-finest,8278
    leonYLC
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:46pm
    Honestly Jen, I never thought I'd ever see myself write that either. It goes to show that (some) politicians are people too!
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:39pm
    Leon - you are probably being confused by the smugness of riches and soft living. A few hard years would show you the real man.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:48pm
    Young: in the words of the great John McEnroe "are you serious"?
    Sure there are crooks in the Labor ranks but also in the government ranks. Nobody has ever gotten the goods on the deal between the coal industry and this government. If you suggest there is no such deal then I suggest you follow the money trail: $8 billion every year now being subsidised by taxpayers so that the Carbon Tax (which was working well) could be scuttled. And then legislation passed by the Gillard government to protect ordinary citizens from predatory banks was scuttled too. And let's not forget Abbott reporting to Murdoch in the US after he won office.
    Connect the dots, not just spruik off.
    leonYLC
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:37pm
    Hard to argue with that call Trebor
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:37pm
    But then again - I could just be cynical.... I've met a few fat cats and they are nice enough on the outside - I try to judge by action and not front.

    A lot of grease does not mean that they are not royally screwing you... it just doesn't feel as bad.
    happy
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:04pm
    Oh dear. He has gone. And the nasties are out in force. About time we learned to at the very least be civilised towards each other. Be happy.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:50pm
    I don't think Joe wanted to be civilised to ordinary Australians. He didn't like wind farms either, or solar I understand. And he also talked down to the electorate.
    Now what does the word 'civilised' refer to.........
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:29pm
    Humour Happy, Humour :)
    JohnJax
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:18pm
    The job of Treasurer in the Australian Parliament was always beyond Joe Hockey. He was totally incompetent, and then lied and excused his failings as somehow being the fault of someone else (usually the previous government!). He was as ruthless as Brer Rabbott towards Julia Gillard, but couldn't summon up the courage or the grace with which she faced her political demise. Good riddance, I say!!!!
    JohnJax
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:51pm
    Agree.
    Old Fella
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:25pm
    I thought he spoke well and appreciated the content of his speech. I still had visual flashes though of his speech following each of his two budgets and the picture of his cigar smoking
    smack in the face visual, to the many negatively affected by two failed/unsuccessful National budgets. He was a 'good guy' and sadly though a 'Politician'. I do however wish him well in the great twilight he refers to , for his future years.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:31pm
    Bar ill health, I can't see him suffering too much, in every other sense. The yanks treat their lackies well.
    Young
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:35pm
    There are so many people here who seem to know all about politics.
    Why don't some of you stand.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:13pm
    We don't want to be part of the major parties, which are abject failures, and you know what happens to small parties and independents.

    I'll say it again - until we divest ourselves of this government of two parties, this country will never stand on its feet again.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:54pm
    That is correct Trebor. Voters have the wrong mindset that their vote only matters if they vote Labor or Liberal. Sadly that is exactly why nothing ever changes other than the faces.
    If I had my way there would be a whole parliament if Nick Xenophons (sic) and there would then be proper government and accountability. We increasingly have chaos and grandstanding by pollies whose egos are significantly bigger than their intelligence or abilities.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:32pm
    I have Young - only once - just to help get rid of Howard.
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:37pm
    OK I get it. Many of you didn't particularly 'like' Mr Hockey.

    But surely you are old enough to be over the name-calling and vitriolic dancing on his grave. I am appalled at the level of venom and abuse being spouted here towards not only Mr Hockey but Mr Abbott as well.

    Grow up and happy said, be civil.
    Anonymous
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:56pm
    why? we need to get real and call a spade a spade, not pussy foot around, both these men were useless and did a great deal of damage to this country
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:03pm
    Then 'get real' trood and stop behaving like spoilt children in the playground. Personal abuse is NOT 'calling-a-spade-a-spade" it is rude, insulting and offensive. Be critical by all means but use a bit of civility like an adult should.
    tia-maria
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:41pm
    Oh KSS Give it a rest............ not everyone supported............ your beloved Liberal Party ........and we are all entitle to ones opinion.............
    tia-maria
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:42pm
    trod, like your comment cheers
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:59pm
    Dead right trood. He had no consideration for the people of this country. His only goal was transferring money from the poor to the rich, subsidising the miners and hiding the tax avoidance of big business. Disgusting man, should be locked up for crimes against Australia, with several of his mates.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:18pm
    Kinda reminds me of the story of a Japanese guard at Changi, who, upon the Japanese surrender, threw open a warehouse full of Red Cross parcels that literally stunned the starving prisoners - and said ,

    "War over! We all fliend now!"

    All concentration camp guards should be forgiven after the event... it seems.

    For a long time I've associated the thinking of many of these politicians of 'left' and 'right' with that of the Hitlerites and the Stalinists - their respect and consideration for the ordinary person is zero, and their view is that the cattle in the fields are nothing more than serfs to be pushed about at the whim of the government (state) - i.e. 'vassals of the State' (and sometimes its enemies) rather than legal owners of a democratic state.

    Joe is little different in his very short-sighted thinking.

    Just calling a spade a spade.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:56pm
    LIke? Really?
    No KSS. Nothing about the personalities. Everything to do with behaviour and attacks on those who cannot defend themselves.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:36pm
    It's hard not to ridicule the rediculous. I have no personal beef with either gentleman, KSS. However, I find how they behaved and what they did offensive. Your santimony would be refreshing if it was something new.
    Tom Tank
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:44pm
    A question related to "Lifters & Leaners". If Joe become Ambassador to the U.S. does he get a salary for that as well as draw his Parliamentary Pension?
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:19pm
    Of course - and full found etc beyond your wildest dreams.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:26pm
    Ask Kim Beasley.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:57pm
    Of course. Don't they all? So who is living the era of "entitlement"?
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:38pm
    Like I said, he'll have a ball. Though eating too much is one of his weaknesses and the US is great place to put on weight. He may very well eat himself to death.
    Wstaton
    22nd Oct 2015
    8:19pm
    Yes tom tank. His definition of lifters were those who made pots of money and became rich. What an affront to all those hard working people earning a living and contributing to this great country but not manipulating the system.
    niemakawa
    23rd Oct 2015
    5:11am
    The lifters are still lifting and the leaners still leaning. That will never change, unfortunately. And now with a PM elected not by the people but by The UN, Australia is on a downward slope.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:14am
    'lifters' - on another forum someone quoth that the workers did nothing to create their own income.....

    Of course, I just had to reply that in that case they could all stay at home on full pay and allow the business to generate cash all on its own........ business to do the lifting, government to tax them mightily as a result, and the people to sit at home and be paid AWE each.

    Sounds good to me..... (ROFL)...
    Young
    22nd Oct 2015
    12:50pm
    Joe was correct in telling people they would be better off if they smoked less and gambled less.I play the pokies because I can afford to.Many of those I see there are pensioners who smoke and gamble,as well as others on handouts.People didn't take to Joe because he was too truthful.
    Oldman Roo
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:44pm
    I can not help getting the impression that you are a biased Liberal , even openly speaking out to deny the poor some pleasures in life . I am sure Hockey and Abbott would be proud of you . Hockey even indicated once that the poor really can not afford to drive anyway and maybe you forgot to back him on this one too .
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:13pm
    Sort of sounds that way.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:39pm
    I guess you are an expert in the area of truthfulness, Young.
    doclisa
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:05pm
    Selef serving bastard deterined to destroy the Australia we love by using out dated US and UK economic modeling that does not suit our country on so many levels. We do not want to be a country like the US split visciouly between the rich and the poor. Nor do we want to be a country of assumed supperiority of born to rule attitudes of the colonial britian Joe Hockey so obviously slavishly copies.
    I can think of few people who would completely stuff up being our man in Washington as completely as this self serving creepy man could. Perhaps Shorten would come very close to creating the wreckage that Hockey would.. ...but as Hockey is on the table it seems..let him go off and play with his rich toys..perhaps become a stay at home dad. Now THAT would be a great outcome!
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:12pm
    I'd love that too, doclisa. Kids and housework 7 days a week - he'd soon learn what real work is.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:34pm
    Do I detect a bit of the good old fashioned Labor Party "politics of envy" here? It would seem that you are (like the USA you describe) reflecting the split of the poor in your vicious rant against Hockey and all things that are not Labor oriented.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:44pm
    Thatcher has been out of power for years now, wally - and is ding-donged.....

    There never was 'politics of envy' other than the Conservatives thinking that the peasants had no right to a spot in the sun.... can't have the best spots crowded with the peasants.

    How is it envious for a person working fifty hours a week in a coal mine and thrust out of a job, to despise someone who sits on their asset all day and pontificates about the social good of destroying jobs, livelihoods, and retirements?

    The person claiming to be envied will never be treated like that and will retire in riches even when kicked out for failure.

    Age of entitlement?
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:00pm
    wally: why is it that you believe that the Labor Party is 'envious'? Surely it is about fairness rather than envy. The reason why so many Australians have spat the current government out is that it is intent on class warfare. Am I dreaming?
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:44pm
    Doclisa, you shouldn't confuse party politics with the man's beliefs. He ws pushing the line of IPA which advises the LNP on policy. They are the evil behind the government. Hockey was just a lackey. Poor bloke probably thinks he was doing the right thing. I don't think he was smart enough to deliberately screw us all. He's just not tht clever - hence why he came across like a wet blanket. He made the LP look good. Now he and Mr Rabbott have gone, Labour doesn't look that good any more.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:48pm
    I think they know exactly what they are doing. If not so then why is Turnbull keeping the same policies? Oh yes he relented on Family Benefits reforms...but there is an election to win. After that game on....again.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:50pm
    Correct, mick - it is the policies that count, not the way they are sold, and while ever the two parties continue down the same path with a few frills for the girls or the boys on the side, this country is headed for ruin for the majority.

    Time to take back the asylum from the lunatics.

    I note today there was another slug at single parent families - my ex and I might have had our differences over this - but what I see from the machinations involved is just more of the same Gillardist 'knock down the single parent family. guff.

    All I see is a lot of disadvantaged kids, since the extra from Family B ad childcare will vanish for them once they turn thirteen, and is not being replaced by any subsidies, unlike say Joe's 'education', for schooling etc.

    SS-DD.. from both parties.
    Young
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:15pm
    Seems there are a lot of jealous people here.Anyone can succeed in Australia if they are prepared to work.We are so lucky here.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:02pm
    Most Australians look up to those who make it because of hard work, but none I have ever met look up to those who get rich because of a highly rigged tax system or privilege which is given to a very small part of society and paid for by the poorest in the land.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:42pm
    Got it in one, mick. It's actually extremely insulting to we hard-working Australians (I did my years of eighteen hour plus days etc) to be labeled 'jealous' because we can't countenance someone getting free ride on the 'old mates network' or out of the hard-earned taxes of the many working hard in often boring jobs.

    If a work ethic had anything to do with - there's be millions of millionaires out there, and I'd be one.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:12pm
    I am in the same club. You may have seen our troll Frank have a go at me because I go skiing overseas every year. What the dear man does not acknowledge is that, like you. nobody gave me much anything and the hours I have worked are not too different to yours. People are funny in that respect.
    Not sure I'd agree that there would be millions of millionaires out there as in my old neighbourhood everybody thought I was stark ravings nuts for working all the time. Me too. But the past 5 years have been bliss and God willing maybe the next 20 could be the same. We'll see.
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:41pm
    mick, why pretend you're doing it tough. Why not be proud of your achievements and your rewards for a lifetime of effort?
    Australia has about 500,000 millionaires. It is nothing to be embarrassed about.
    Oh, I see, it doesn't line up with your political story as an "independent politician?"
    You could ask Bill Shorten how he handles that situation?
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:46pm
    Young, Malcolm put it very well, politicians do not have a monopoly on hard work. No matter how scew whiff the views in this blog, I would hesitate to call the bloggers lazy. They look pretty busy to me.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:53pm
    I notice you have been posting under other names Frank. I sort of knew you were around.
    Normal insulting crap. I do not have to be ashamed of ANYTHING as I have paid ALL of the taxes due (has Turnbull????) and I despite struggling like many others I do stand up for the oppressed. That's why I do not let YOU and/or this government off the hook. The facts are the facts are the facts and you can carry on with your TURC, Thompson and Labor propaganda as much as you like because almost everyone on this website now knows what you intent is. And it ain't transparency or honesty mate!
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    9:06pm
    I notice you have been using my name a lot mick, like we were old friends or something? What you fail to understand is that I am not the only poster with a clear and tight grip on reality.
    It doesn't matter how many times you complain about me or how many lies you conjure, nobody is believing your nonsense.
    I have your measure mate!! I can read you like a book!!!
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:00am
    Oh - regular teacher's pet! What I'd give for a day's ski-ing in the Alps! But my old Airborne knees wouldn't handle it.... they say a parachute landing is like a twelve foot jump onto concrete... I certainly feel that.... I doubt my knees would handle ski-ing...
    Adrianus
    24th Oct 2015
    8:39am
    TREBOR, my knees are good now. Doing 30 squats per day now. I will be going back to work soon I hope.
    lindy
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:35pm
    Good riddance!!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:47pm
    Trouble is Lindy, someone takes their place.
    Believer
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:36pm
    Sorry nena but this public forum is about venting your views and your comments are offensive because you make people feel they say the wrong things! If you don't like others comments then don't read them. How on earth are the open public meant to know what others really think???
    KSS
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:32pm
    There is a big difference between being critical and giving an opinion and simply being rude and abusive. Name calling is not 'airing your views'. It is pure and simple abuse. And I cannot make anyone feel anything. If they think by reading my comment - which incidentally criticises the abuse NOT the person, that they "say the wrong thing" then that is their issue to deal with.

    And I am entitled to my opinion too!
    Jen
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:37pm
    KSS Yes you're entitled to your opinion but please don't complain when others espouse theirs. Further up the forum you berated someone:

    "nena I am disgusted at your personal attack on Mr Hockey. Whether or not you supported his politics, it is beneath contempt to make such abusive personal comments at all, never mind on a public forum."

    I think it was not only personal which you've just said you don't do, but also smacked of bullying to me.
    wally
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:43pm
    Hi KSS. Unfortunately some people cannot distinguish the difference between expressing a point of view with out being abusive and vicious at the same time. This appears to be a sad reflection on their personal up bringing as reflected in their bitter and twisted outlook on life.

    It saddens me to think that so many Labor Party adherents in this forum display such unlovely and unfortunate traits that reflect more on them than on whatever point they are trying to make.

    If they are parents, one can only wonder what sort of upbringing the gave to their children.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:03pm
    As opposed to labeling people 'lifters', 'leaners' , 'welfare bludgers', ''generational criminals for wrecking the economy', 'burdens on the economy and health system', and so forth?

    I think we would all be best served by staying away from personal vitriol and labeling for point scoring, lest we fall into the same trap as Parliament does, of mistaking personal attack for policy scoring.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:48pm
    Good response Believer. Old KSS is venting his sanctimony once more.
    Believer
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:37pm
    Sorry! KSS not nena!
    Sallad
    22nd Oct 2015
    1:59pm
    JAMBALAYA ("Goodbye Joe" you gotta go me oh my oh)
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:06pm
    Elsewhere yesterday someone listed part of his speech as including schools and health care under the title of 'welfare'. I think that says it all, and sheds a searchlight on the true thinking and intentions of his party group. Apparently everything is 'welfare' and is therefore a handout controllable by the government at whim, and nowhere is there a shred of responsibility to pay the bills as they come due for social security and so forth.

    They all need to get out into the real world for a change and a couple of years of abject poverty would do them all the world of good.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:03pm
    How do you do the pic?
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:06pm
    ummm - dang - it's in My Profile somewhere, but my screen seems to be playing up or something, and my picture is so big it is cutting out other things.

    Should be a link to update profile somewhere there. You can upload a photo from your computer.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:44pm
    I'll bet Firefox wants to be updated... again...
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:06pm
    I dumped Firefox 18 months ago. Best thing I ever did. Chrome is not exactly perfect but it is a real 64 bit browser, not a 32 bit.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:51pm
    Quite right TREBOR. Most people don't realise that the IPA is the evil behind the LNP. The Institute of Public Affairs are the advisors the LNP bases all its policies on. If the public tuned into that mob, the LNP would be decimated overnight.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:03pm
    Not sure about the IPA. We need to start at the top where political decisions translate into money streams. After that it filters down to the various groups. The IPA is obviously one of them.
    And ultimately there is money changing hands for policies. Election funding for LNP governments always comes from BIG BUSINESS and big business does not provide funding because they are Santa Claus. Never.
    So look at what the current government has done since coming to office:

    1. repealed the Carbon and Mining Taxes. So taxpayers now kick in $8 billion a year to the fossil fuel industry and the big miners pay zilch tax.
    2. refused to address multinationals refusing to pay tax in Australia.
    3. refused to close Tax Shelters used by the rich, including the superannuation tax shelter which helps the rich squirrel away money into superannuation.
    4. repeatedly come after average and poor Australians whilst lowering company tax rates (for the wealthy).

    As I keep saying if you follow the money trail you will find the culprits.
    Culgoa
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:15pm
    This is the Treasurer who told us "the age of entitlement is over" but continued to claim the daily allowance while living in his wife's home in Canberra... and this snout in the trough is now potentially to be rewarded with the Ambassador's job in the USA. I also find this most offensive.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:23pm
    I think solid review of who we appoint our representatives to foreign countries should be undertaken, and on what basis.

    Jobs for the mates is simply not good enough, and there should be a ban on any past politician continuing to work for government in any way due to obvious bias.

    Unless this country is to make some progress back to where it was when the rot started in 1982, we can no longer afford to be paying flunkies mighty amounts plus all found to handle our affairs.

    This joint is more and more like some petty Third World Banana Republic Diktatorship of a self-appointed elite, with all the cream going to the cronies.
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:31pm
    Agree Culgoa. Quite offensive!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:54pm
    What he meant was "The age of entitlement is over for the poor." He just didn't have time to put into context. He'll be in his element in the US where the poor have little entitlement.
    Tomaso
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:27pm
    I say good riddance to the twot.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:55pm
    Did you mean "twat or twit"?
    Chris B T
    22nd Oct 2015
    2:52pm
    Why cann't Joe and others complete their term elected for.
    Just more wastefull spending of public money for byelection.
    The back bench or side lined menbers still pickup a large income, just not enough for some, next big slice of pie please cann't wait.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:59pm
    Agreed, they should pay back the wages they would have earned when they cop out and pick up the tab for the byelection. I bet they'd hang around till they finished their job then.
    downunder
    22nd Oct 2015
    3:39pm
    What a jerk and complete loser. Now he'll waddle off to a plum job as US ambassador (most likely), it only tells job for the boys, regardless of their capacity. His performance a treasurer were just deplorable
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:45pm
    Now that's what I've been talking about - robbo - that is now a used gun... can't get the same value for it!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:00pm
    Ha! ha! ha! Nice one
    Wstaton
    22nd Oct 2015
    8:40pm
    Seems to me the. Same as CEO's who fail at their job yet get a big bonus when they are kicked out.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:20am
    Sentenced to penal servitude as an ambassador for five to ten years....

    22nd Oct 2015
    4:08pm
    Of course we had a great treasurer in Wayne Swan renamed Mr deficit and now we have that idiot Bowen whats his Qualifications for the job apart from being an arrogant pig or perhaps Kathy Jackson now theres person who knows about money she pinched millions from the union or what about Craig Thomsen a great union man who paid for his daliances from the union and have we all forgot about Julia Gillard who paid for her house from union money and got away with it or what about her man a labour freeloader like all of them and pinched the money from the mens shed.
    There is also a probably prime minister named Shorten who has stitched up the workers for his own financial benefit.
    Labour is a great party to vote for if you are a scumbag
    MICK
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:00pm
    And your last paragraph tells us all what you are......
    Get real and find some perspective. Instead of the political propaganda how about an HONEST discussion. I thought so. Troll!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:03pm
    No mick, robbo is no troll. He's not smart enough for the job. You've got to sound half credible or at least santimonious like KSS
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:21am
    robbo a crook will often share some of the proceeds of crime with those who are an immediate threat or likely to become a threat. They usually surround themselves with likeminded people of questionable character.
    wally
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:18am
    I would accuse the "True Believer" Labor voters of being scumbags. Misled by their own beliefs and prejudices, perhaps, by I have found most of them to be sincere in their beliefs to an extent that was once the monopoly of religion.

    Unfortunately the Labor Party has morphed from being a "working Man's" party led by the likes of Curtin and Chifley in the 1940's to become dominated by Spivs like Shorten and Thomson who have wormed their way into positions of leadership in the Unions where they have put their own selfish interests ahead of the best interests of the union members they claim to represent.

    No, I would not call the True Believers in the Labor Party scumbags, but they are blinded by their traditional way of thinking. Believing that the old Labor ideals still exist and that they have not been betrayed by a leadership desperate to cling to power through lies, deception and betrayal of the rights of the people whose interests the leaders are sworn to protect.
    wally
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:33am
    *****
    Correction to my last , above post. It should read "I would NOT accuse the "True Believer" Labor voters of being scumbags.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:57am
    wally that makes a lot of sense. I agree with your summation. I note that not much is mentioned here on their past president. Is that because he is in gaol and serving his penalty. Out of respect? Usually the "true believers" turn on their own for leaving the party.
    Bellcurve
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:17pm
    Joe overshot his target in public life and now we all have to pay for one of the biggest leaners/bludgers we've ever seen. Joe "the windbag" Hockey would have made an acceptable North Sydney alderman but was out of his depth in federal parliament. His hypocrisy knew no bounds. Good riddance....
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:05pm
    Go easy on him. He was just poorly cast for the job. Mind you, noone would be able to sell what he had to offer.
    Young Simmo
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:21pm
    He has probably retired because his wife's house is now paid off by us tax payers paying his wife's house payments of $250 a week..
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    4:48pm
    $250 a day, Simmo.. $250 a day.... enough to keep a leaner unemployed bludger alive for a week, they say.

    Lest we forget.... they shall not grow poor, as we that are left grow poor... age shall not weary their pensions, nor the years their entitlements.. at the going down of their tenure, and in our mourning their existence - we shall remember them.
    Young Simmo
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:12pm
    WOW TREBOR, we not only paid the house off , but the farm and the million dollar boat as well.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:23pm
    Yeah - but no need for a private jet while ever the taxpayer flies you for free as well....... why waste money when it's there for the taking?
    Young Simmo
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:48am
    Yeah TREBOR, I have completed my reincarnation application form and requested to come back as a KPHIP.


    I can here you now saying, what the FFFF is a KPHIP?



    Well, it is a Keep Politicians Honest If Possible, animal that doesn't exist today.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    2:48am
    Perhaps you should come back as a PPPP - a Privileged Politician Party Ponce - that way you'd be set for life!
    Steff
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:22pm
    Hockey wasnt the one who shafted pensioners with the taper rate changes that was all Scott
    Morrisons doing
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:06pm
    Nothing's changed except the man. The clothes are the same.
    Rae
    23rd Oct 2015
    8:34am
    Those taper rate changes have yet to flow into changes in the economy.At least lump sums can be drawn down to limit the effects.

    The disturbing change is the classing of non concessional superannuation drawdowns as income for social security purposes.
    This effects defined benefit pensions from 2016.
    Some will lose substantial income and there is nothing they can do to change that.

    Anyone putting money after paying tax into superannuation is now at risk. If taxes are reintroduced for pension payments it will mean double taxation applying to non concessional superannuation.

    It is also a step away from classing deposit savings in the bank as income when they are withdrawn.

    Yet not a single economic reporter has picked up on it.

    The effect of the newspeak Fair and Sustainable Pensions Act will no doubt start to appear but in my opinion Superannuation is now broken and far to much at risk to sovereign interference.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:25am
    It's also double tax for aged etc pensions - since those are made up out of the Social Security Contribution in Income Tax and some others being drawn on. Changing the revenue/expenditure strand into something coming from consolidated revenue in no way alters the fact that the money comes from taxed incomes, and thus any taxation on pensions is double taxation.

    Since GST replaced some income tax, GST for pensioners is not acceptable since it is double taxation.

    I will also re-iterate that since pensions are an already paid for right, and unlike superannuation have accrued no tax benefits along the way - reducing pension of working pensions because of income is also unacceptable. Unless and until all retirement strands are treated equally, there is gross injustice in the entire system.

    I will be placing this in detail to my current member.
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:48pm
    I think this is the future of politics.
    We will see a cabinet reshuffle following the first two budgets of a new government. The Treasurer and PM will be the first to go. The sugar can then be put back on the table in good time for an election. I'm still thinking around the 10th Sept for our next election.
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:07pm
    Are you taking bets, Frank?
    Adrianus
    22nd Oct 2015
    7:49pm
    OK I'll bite. What's your best guess?
    Paulodapotter
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:08am
    I'll get back to on that one.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    9:20am
    I'm just saying, it was kind of like ...Hockey one, Hockey two, let's get the puck out of here!
    mangomick
    23rd Oct 2015
    9:53am
    Interesting analogy when you consider Abbott was (in the opinion of many) always skating on thin ice.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:28am
    Yes, you could say the government has now gone on the front foot. Turned bullish you could say.
    Gee Whiz
    22nd Oct 2015
    5:48pm
    As treasurer Joe hockey was a failure. And for the 20 years he has been in parliament he was nothing more than a seat warmer and achieved nothing.

    He will go to the USA as an ambassador on a couple of hundred thousand a year ,plus, plus then come back and have the gall to write his memoirs in the hope that someone in Australia will buy a copy.

    Why is it all politicians believe the are the messiah returned to earth to save us all but are in reality totally useless ?

    Don't they understand they are regarded by the public as something you have to scrape off you shoes after walking through a dog exercise park?
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    6:12pm
    They do have a cock-eyed idea of how much they are loved. They seem to not understand that the reason we put them there is to get rid of the last lot. Rarely are they loved and even when they are, it is short-lived. Hubris is usually their undoing. The LNP has an abundance of that as they have a large contingent of members who stongly believe they are born to rule. The public love to tear them down. Part of our convict heritage, I'd suggest. Watch out Malcolm.

    22nd Oct 2015
    7:03pm
    great to see labor mick and his labor drones back in force dancing on the grave of a honest politician who had the guts to attempt to bring australia back of the edge of extinction after the former labor government, read the comments of mick's lackeys, the likes of trebor, jen, oblivious given the free rein by labor mick, culgoa, never heard of before and another creation of labor mick, there is tomasco, great on your spaghetti, have not heard of for a while, newcomers the likes of downunder, the name says enough, bellcurve, a cricketer? and of course the great young simmo, still believe he is the incarnation of ZORRO, another new face lena, read her comments, enough said, then in comes tia-maria, alcoholic anonymous is his only hope, mamacrystal, cross dresser, labor admirer, hey here comes fast eddy, bypassing himself in his comments, as for voodoolady, labor mick knows how to pick his clones.
    As for me, how lucky are we to have thrown out the former labor government under rudd and gillard and as for swan, our worst australian treasurer ever, he only sit on the backbench to get his years up for his federal pension after which he will never be mentioned or heard of again, labor mick and his drones, keep on spouting your thoughts, it only will make it easier to see where it comes from, when will we see some intelligent comments come from their labor mouths!!!!!!!!
    Paulodapotter
    22nd Oct 2015
    7:35pm
    Looks like we're doomed heemskerk99. If only your forebears had discovered Australian instead of the poms, we might be in better shape. However. with the loss of Joe, extinction it is. Lets have a bet. I bet you Howard was the worst treasurer we ever had (if deficits are the measure).
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    9:18pm
    " If only your forebears had discovered Australia"...... Hell Paulo. You wouldn't wish that on us would you...........
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:05pm
    You need to stay off the sauce, handsome....

    Heeeey! How come I don't rate a mention?
    Paulodapotter
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:10am
    No Mango, it would have been a better place if Cook had made a navigational error.
    mangomick
    23rd Oct 2015
    8:18am
    Think the Dutch had a fair sort of a hand in South Africa and look how that turned out.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    2:52pm
    .. the Batavia made it to dry land.. but then they ate up all the prophets.....
    mareela
    22nd Oct 2015
    8:11pm
    Robbo and heemskerk99 it seems you and like minded followers of the now x treasurer are incapable of putting your views forward without abusing anyone who disagrees with you. I happen to believe Julia Gillard will go down in Australia's history as one of its better PM's. Of course you will have to read said history from a totally unbiased impartial author and believe me there will be plenty. You will have to stop reading the Australian and the Daily Telegraph though. As you can see I have managed to comment without abusing you for your misguided beliefs. I hope I will be afforded the same courtesy.
    mangomick
    22nd Oct 2015
    9:32pm
    Labor have only got themselves to blame for Gillards demise......... But yes, history will paint her in a much better light than she is given credit for today. And a much better light than Abbott will be shown in.
    It wouldn't really matter how good a job a Prime Minister or Treasurer does, they will never get accolades or even a kind word from the great percentage of people on this forum who have dyed in the wool, hard left or hard right political view. And we wonder why our politicians can't come to some consensus.
    Paulodapotter
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:14am
    It's a pity we seem to remember the worst of our politicians rather than the best. Gillard oversaw some very good reforms. I'm struggling to find any by Abbott. Oh yeah - we stopped the boats and we got rid of the carbon tax. Simply wonderful achievements. Refugees and the renewable energy industry are simply over the moon with gratitude.
    Anonymous
    23rd Oct 2015
    8:09am
    Of course no need for abuse but Gillard had no clue and was sacked by her own party because she was down right stupid only had one job before Prime minister and that was at Slater& Gordons the ambulance chasers and she also got the sack from that for setting up sham agreements with her boyfriend to rip off the union
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:32am
    robbo, That was in her early days when she was young and naïve. She was only 40.
    SGW
    22nd Oct 2015
    8:51pm
    it doesn't matter what party their from, there all self serving pricks. vote independent were you can

    22nd Oct 2015
    9:22pm
    hey paulodapotter, I thought you had more brains, obliviously I was wrong, as to accuse howard of being a worst treasurerer than swan, was you in a coma during the rudd, gillard regime, or did you have your labor blinkers on, if I have billions in the bank and six years later you have a 400 billion debt and in your own words you then be a great treasurer, god help australia when the next labor government, hopefully never, takes over. swan only stays in parliament to make sure he get his pension, he be better off swimming on the pond around parliament house.
    TREBOR
    22nd Oct 2015
    10:08pm
    Your prose is laboured, you capitalisation at sentence beginning is bereft of capital, and your intent vague and inappropriate, as well as being nigh impossible of interpretation.

    F.

    Joe's the one with the 400 billion deficit..... that's why he's leaving for a plum job - before it all collapses.
    Paulodapotter
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:05am
    No Heemskirk99, I've just got a long memory. No one should forget the black hole left by Howard in the Fraser government that led to the Keating led government.I guess you hadn't migrated to Australia that far back. The only good treasurers were those that were fortunate enough to arrive when things were on the up as the mining boom did for Costello. It's very arguable that Keating was the best treasurer because he brought in reforms at a time when things were going to look bad for any treasurer. He showed real guts, more than Costello, Hockey and a whole range of hubris filled treasurers. I don't support any political party. However, I do like to see things with both my eyes. I think you should keep up with your observations so those of us with some integrity can feel better about ourselves.
    Rae
    23rd Oct 2015
    8:46am
    It isn't the 400 billion that is a problem in our trillion dollar economy.

    The real problem is the private debt, the one Mr Hockey encouraged us to all join in.

    The trillion dollars of private debt at 180% of average earnings.
    Earnings that are falling by the way due to the wonderful policy of the Libertarians.

    Yes get them up to the neck in debt and then slowly withdraw income. Really clever politics from our brilliant Treasury I don't think.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:49am
    "Joe's the one with the 400 billion deficit"
    You will need to explain that for those of us who are not used to talking in big numbers?
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:45am
    Simple enough - Labor's residual debt of around $260 bn constituted a 'budget emergency', and Joe and Co immediately abolished the debt ceiling and now that government debt is around $400bn... but that's due to a 'hostile' senate not permitting the slitting of pensioner's guts etc and due to purchasing F-35s and continuing to feather the nests of mates and cronies via appointments and sell-offs to benefit them.... only the unemployed and single parent families are fair game.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:52am
    Anyway - a little research for you - an no comments on the 'left bias' of the ABC - it doesn't exist other than in the minds of the paranoid:-

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-03-18/fact-check--australia27s-economic-inheritance/6162670

    I only offer rough figures - unlike Joe I don't have all day to sit down and work these out to my own satisfaction..... and how to spin it to my party's best advantage...

    Hard work that politicking....
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    4:33pm
    TREBOR, I see you're talking about the Commonwealth Debt, not the Deficit. The Commonwealth gross debt has gone from just $59 billion in June 2008 (or 5 per cent of GDP) to about $430 billion in June 2015 (26.3 per cent of GDP).
    The main reason is the Commonwealth's inability to properly match spending to revenues or vice versa, which has been a feature of the Budget since 2008.

    The States also carry another $275 billion of government debt by the way.

    To be fair Australia's nett Debt level would be around $430 billion less $127 billion (Future Fund) = $303 billion.

    Australia's gross Commonwealth government debt-to-GDP ratio is now at the highest level since the ABS's quarterly records began 27 years ago and exceeds the 22.9 per cent record set in December 1995 after the 1991 contraction.
    It is impossible to cover all the reasons for the high level of debt but it did start climbing rapidly soon after the 2007 election.
    What concerns me is the level of Household Debt and the Household debt to income ratio.
    I didn't bother looking at your ABC report.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    3:02am
    Yes - I don't get paid $7000 a week to sit around and work out the figures and the titles of all the debts etc, and spin the results so it sounds good for my party and not the other one.

    I can only deal with the fact that government debt has increased under Joe's tutelage to the approximate $400bn quoted as somehow being Labor's legacy.

    I have a problem with cheats....

    You should read the ABC thing, if only in the interests of fairness.

    Perhaps someone needs to explain why the States carry $275Bn in debt.... then they sell off everything that recoups revenue for a short-term fix.....

    $127Bn in a Future Fund - and they can't afford pensions for those who've paid into it for all their working lives?

    "$59 billion in June 2008 (or 5 per cent of GDP) to about $430 billion in June 2015 (26.3 per cent of GDP)."

    And it was around $270Bn (from memory) until Tony and Joe got in...

    Now we have - not $400Bn - but $430Bn...

    If you'd read the ABC 'leftie' blurb - you'd note the difference between Gross Debt and Net Debt.....

    http://www.aph.gov.au/About_Parliament/Parliamentary_Departments/Parliamentary_Library/FlagPost/2015/April/~/media/05%20About%20Parliament/54%20Parliamentary%20Depts/544%20Parliamentary%20Library/Flagpost/Charts/DebtPositionChart02.gif

    This is from the parliamentary library - which the ABC accesses for its information - perhaps you'd prefer that.

    I love these arguments - shooting fish in a barrel. Maybe I don't know all the jargon - bu I sure can find the facts.

    Case rests......
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    3:10am
    The Futures Fund pays for public servants and politicians payouts and perks once they are booted out.

    Why is this so, when they have contributed nowhere near as much in proportion into the Social Security Contribution as the ordinary working stiff has?

    This money, held in a tax haven, needs to be returned to a National Retirement Fund and its benefits paid to all equally - not just some elite who have off-shored it like some petty Third World dictatorship to benefit its cronies, and to be a fund available for the ruling elite once they are kicked out.

    What is it about you people that you cannot see you are being robbed - with billions placed in offshore accounts and available only to a few? You would condemn such a thing heartily if it were some Cocaine Republic in Central America.... yet you swallow it whole.

    Some time ago I suggested that it would not surprise me if our politicians and their ilk were spiriting money away into some Caymans account for their personal benefit and in the event they are deposed and forced to flee our shores.

    It seems I was right.

    In some future 'Flight of the Wild Geese' - they have $127Bn to access.. of OUR money!
    Adrianus
    24th Oct 2015
    9:24am
    Labor did have their beady eyes on the $127b and wanted to spend it also. Swan also gained access to my bank account and emptied it. It took me 6 months to get my money back.
    TREBOR, look at it this way, If Labor had tipped the future fund down the drain as well we would all be paying more tax to cover PS pensions. Labor will not rest until workers are paying out more in tax than they take home.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:03pm
    Yes - that's why I have come to the advocacy of a Sovereign fund out of their grasping hands - politicians of both sides are like drunken pokie addicts - the moment they see a chance to rob the kid's piggy banks to feed the endless lust for spending, they can't resist it.

    I'm not sure how we could go about setting up a retirement fund for all without some party getting its mitts on it somehow. Even that $127Bn in the Caymans isn't safe - in any 'Flight of The Mild Geese' from a popular revolt here, I'm certain some of those Geese have the keys to it, just in case.

    Can't be caught short.... really makes me wonder at times.....
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:06pm
    If a Cocaine President from San Snortador did this - salted away $127Bn in public funds in a safe tax haven - RICO would be on his ass like a jockey in the final run of the Malbun cup.

    Yes somehow we of Oz presume that any such move by our government is totally above board. I wonder about us sometimes in our naivety.

    What's so different about an Ore President from El Ovanole?
    Adrianus
    24th Oct 2015
    12:36pm
    Don't know where you get your information? Check out the asset allocation of the fund. It is well diversified and cleverly spread across asset classes in my opinion. Around 20% is liquid. I'm beginning to appreciate your ramblings more TREBOR. Send me some of that good stuff to keep me going. HA HA HA
    mareela
    22nd Oct 2015
    9:51pm
    Heemskerk99, unfortunately it's true about Howard and he has already gone down in history as the worst spendthrift PM in Australia's history. The only reason he had a surplus was he sold everything that wasn't tied down. As for Costello maybe you should read up on what he sold Australia's gold reserves for. They got a third term because they blatantly bought votes with their middle class tax cuts. Maybe you should also read what John Hewson said about Howard and Costello or should I say Abbott and Costello. Remember a bloke called Campbell Newman? He paid Costello a fortune to advise him about what he should do in QLD. Look what happened after following that advice. Queenslanders had enough of Joe BP without getting another dose of like minded corruption. The people spoke loud and clear.
    Paulodapotter
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:27am
    It's interesting to note that despite Howard's record breaking reign as PM, his legacy will not be historically flattering. Iraq will be his undoing. He's technically (but not as yet legally) our first war criminal and the ramifications of his actions domestically (with all his dog whistling capabilities) and internationally has been disastrous. His legacy will be felt for generations. It's no surprise he was in the government that decided helping the yanks to slaughter millions of Vietnamese was a good and just decision, decision he still declares was right and moral.

    However, I was not referring to Howard and Costello as our worst financial managers. They were saved that distinction due to Chinese economic growth. I was referring to his time as treasurer in the Fraser government which was simply disastrous and required major surgery when Keating was treasurer.
    Paulodapotter
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:29am
    As for poor ol' Joe. He simply drew the short straw with an off-sider in the form of the mad monk.
    mangomick
    23rd Oct 2015
    8:12am
    Many forget that Howard really only got in for that last term because of the blatant "children overboard" lie that he perpetuated.
    wally
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:29am
    Yes Mango, if john Howard hadn't gone on the Aussie Customs boat and started throwing refugee children overboard into the ocean, he would not have been re elected. Of course the voters' revulsion at Mark Latham's thuggish behaviour in the election campaign in 2004 had nothing to do with Howard's re-election.

    You still have to wonder about the "What Might Have Been" moments had Mark Latham become Prime Minister and went to represent Australia overseas on the international level. We will never know.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:35am
    It was often said that Mark Latham was the most intelligent Labor leader for some time, and he still holds that title.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:55am
    I recall that the officer in command advised the operations centre that there was no such incident - and he did so at the time.

    Gulf of Tonkin anyone?

    No wonder nobody trusts government any more.
    mangomick
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:58pm
    Wally ...Howard used the Tampa incident and the lie of children overboard to bolster his flagging popularity to give him the 2001 election win. Up until then his polls were miserable, his popularity low and his performance dismal.
    It's rather funny how staunch ultra conservatives like yourself, will not recognise the truth that history has already written.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    2:50pm
    .. and the people caught up with him next election around and turfed him from his own seat for lying to them......

    Power To The People!
    wally
    24th Oct 2015
    4:22pm
    Hi Frank. I am reading the Latham Diaries at the moment. So far I am only up to the 1998 "chapter". As a front bencher at that time Latham would propose changes and reforms to policy only to see them rejected or reversed by the powers that be in the Labor Party hierarchy at that time. Frustrated, he left the education portfolio and returned to the back bench. He blames Labor's failures against the Howard government on Labor's unwillingness to adopt new methods (and approaches) on the Union control of the Labor Caucus He points out how the Labor Party adopted the policy of appeasing minority groups financially, such as migrants, greenies and middle class lefties, while ignoring the concerns of tradional Labor voters who felt that Labor had abandoned them in favour of the "new" Labor constituents.

    I wonder if anything has changed in the Labor way of doing things regarding policy since 1998? Or, as Latham might say, have they learned anything since 1998, and do they have the will to change their ways?
    Adrianus
    25th Oct 2015
    10:40am
    Good morning wally,
    It seems the union faction of Labor was powerful enough back then to get rid of Latham. The union movement is hanging on to "protectionism" and "the welfare state" in an effort to remain relevant. I feel they have become more powerful within the Labor ranks during the last 15 years. I believe Bill Shorten's public opinions are those of the unions. His non verbals are giving it away now because he is not allowed to be a true leader and put forward strong opinions of his own. He cannot possibly continue this charade. I don't know if Labor voters can see this but the majority of Labor voters now want him gone, but do the unions have another yes man to replace him ??
    wally
    25th Oct 2015
    3:10pm
    Labor's True Believers are a sentimental lot. Remember how all Aussies loved QANTAS because it was Australia's own big time international airline? QANTAS was a great source of pride. Then a lot of QANTAS came under the control of overseas companies. QANTAS changed and stopped being a 100% Aussie airline.

    Like QANTAS, the ALP has changed from what it once was because those in ALP leadership positions have changed. They are not men of the calibre of Whitlam and Keating, let alone Curtin and Chifley. The ALP, like QANTAS is not what it once was.

    Yet the True Believers do not appreciate or seem to understand the fact that the ALP has changed. The ALP's leadership is more concerned about staying on the gravy train than it is about fixing Australia's problems, That is why they jettisoned Rudd and Gillard when the polls showed that Tony Abbott was becoming more of a threat t them in 23010 and 2013. That is also why they have made one of their own,ex Union boss Bill Shorten as party leader instead of the rank and file's choice of Anthony Albanese. Like Rudd and Gillard, the ALP party bosses have hung the true believers out to dry.
    niemakawa
    23rd Oct 2015
    3:49am
    Two of our finest politicians who could have saved Australia from impending "bankruptcy" have left us. Mr Hockey and the elected PM Mr Abbott. Never mind life goes on and thankfully we have a new party Australian Liberty Party which will when elected sere Australia well.
    HOLA
    23rd Oct 2015
    7:25am
    Just one last note to the ex-Treasurer Joe Hockey.
    Haters are Losers pretending to be Winners. Now put that in your Cuban cigar and smoke it!!!
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    10:31am
    Is that your final note HOLA?
    wally
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:21am
    Haters and Losers are terms that would apply to those who post hateful comments about the departing Mr Hockey.
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    11:56am
    So slitting the guts of pensioners and the unemployed and stomping on jobs are not hate actions?

    Hmm...
    Anonymous
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:01pm
    Trebor these people don"t contribute to society anyway so who cares
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    2:46pm
    Really? Everyone does in some way, Robbo... the only ones who think differently are the form of Neo-Fascists we are allowing into our homes and into our governments. In reality, a society is a holistic thing and not just a bunch of numbers, and an economy without reference to its people has no foundation whatsoever - since it is intended to be the servant of those people.

    Even the unemployed - in a time of job drought - contribute to society overall by being stood aside to allow others to prosper - perhaps they need to be compensated adequately for their sacrifice....
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    2:47pm
    You'll notice I don't even mention pensioners in your absurd definition of 'leaners'.
    Fred
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:14pm
    It does not matter what party they come from they should NOT be allowed to break their contract with the Australian People. HOCKEY would have signed that he would serve the Australian People for the next 3 years and then if he did not want to go any further he good has just said he would not stand at the next election. Now we have another Politician on the Public Purse and we now have to pay for a by election which will cost us the tax payer a heap of money. Solution if you get elected then you are there for 3 years Front or Back Bench what ever unless for some medical reasons you cannot carry on.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    12:14pm
    Dear oh dear!! So much hate for the Australian Government.
    Fred
    23rd Oct 2015
    1:30pm
    Frank I don't hate the Australian Government I hate they way the treat the people of Australia idiots. My main point was the act of Politicians of all sides being getting voted in but actually losing the election after a short time they spit the dummy and say they are quitting. If they want to quit before their signed contract with the people of Australia then let them pay for the bye election.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    1:41pm
    He He He, sorry Fred, I was not referring to your post. My remark was a response to the overall tone of this thread. I just feel that many Labor supporters are still yet to come to terms with the election loss and are blinded by a deep seated denial. So much so that I ask the rhetorical question. At what point does this vial language become unpatriotic?
    In regard to your statement, I don't think it's a good idea to force people to stay in a job from which they need to leave, for whatever reason. Don't you think it promotes dumb obedience and poor performance?
    TREBOR
    23rd Oct 2015
    2:48pm
    A government in which the people fear government is a tyranny - a government in which the government fears its people is a democracy.

    Many confuse that simple issue.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    4:41pm
    Many more would ask why is it necessary that you hold fear over anyone? Why must people fear you TREBOR?
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:30am
    Nobody fears me, Frank.. unless it is politicians whose bluff I call. I am regarded as one of the most gentle and caring souls by those who know me - perhaps it is some form of inner hippy struggling to get out, though I doubt it.

    Only those of criminal bent in politics need fear the people - that's pretty simple. If any such fear me - they need to take a long hard look at themselves.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    11:52am
    Actually it's a near-quote from one of the US Founding Fathers, and the word fear is perhaps more a reflection of that time than a reliable word to encompass the concept in this day and age.

    What people should fear is being found out for their own wrongdoings, and the just response that comes after.
    Adrianus
    24th Oct 2015
    12:24pm
    TREBOR, I don't know how accurate these 100 year old quotes are, or if the person attributed to is actually totally responsible? Sometimes I think journos may have misquoted to improve the story.
    What happens to a society when fear ceases to be a motivation? Fear of losing ones job for example? Sometimes I wish I would have had less fear growing up, but then I don't think I would have been as successful? I will never know.
    Here's one for you.
    "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the outcome of the vote." Benjamin Franklin
    I believe we live in a country which has managed to provide a reasonable level of liberty for it's citizens, and continues to do so.
    Pisces
    23rd Oct 2015
    3:57pm
    Why he was ever made treasurer is beyond me he watched over the HIH collapse so nothing in his skill set to qualify him for handling funds
    Anonymous
    23rd Oct 2015
    4:16pm
    No skill set for Wayne Swan either his qualification was an arts degree that is a degree for uni students who don"t quite make it and boy he didn't quite make it either.
    mareela
    23rd Oct 2015
    6:31pm
    Robbo don't know how you live with yourself. Do you have any friends? You seem to live in a right wing bubble and are absolutely incapable of admitting that anyone other than a fascist party can help get Australia out of the mess this government has got us into. I can see faults on both sides if our major party's but have to say that the people of Australia have always prospered under a Labor government. Note I said PEOPLE of Australia.......not just business, corporations and politicians. This country needs to be governed for ALL AUSTRALIANS which the Lib/National party are incapable of doing. They owe too much to their masters the INP. Labor might get help from the unions but at the end of the day most Australians benefit. Hope you can admit that a Labor government is an alternative to the Libs.
    Adrianus
    23rd Oct 2015
    7:49pm
    mareela you may be capable of many things, I don't know? But one thing is for sure you are not capable of is... " see faults on both sides if our major party's.
    I don't think robbo is any of those names you called him.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:34am
    I think Robbo caught one or two photon torpedoes from the monitors on the board... his posts seem to have vanished.

    I've been at work as every good pensioner should be, so it wasn't me.

    Unfortunately, I long ago asserted that perhaps only a totalitarian government could set right what has been set wrong in this country..... a dreadful outcome from 35 or more years of social engineering, but predictable to any student of history. Once enough applecarts have been upset and enough people injured and even killed in this 'bloodless revolution' of social engineering - the people inevitably retaliate, as the Dalai Lama would testify.
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    12:35am
    Bit deep for some - that's all right - I'm used to it.
    Anonymous
    24th Oct 2015
    10:49am
    Give me a break mareela I have posted all the details of labour crooks previously one being a prime minister named Gillard and her boyfriend who recently pinched all the money from the mens shed in his area and of course one did escape me the daddy of them all Al Grasby we all benefitted from him that is if we took drugs.

    I also think a so called labour prime minister named Shorten has been accused of an horrendous crime apart from ripping of the workers for
    his own benefit.
    Adrianus
    24th Oct 2015
    11:20am
    Careful robbo, we all know these things such as the union bosses running around the country paying a certain person's debts, some of which were more than a year old. But to put it in print is a different matter. This is no longer a free country. It's not worth your retirement savings.
    wally
    24th Oct 2015
    4:47pm
    So Mareela thinks Australia has always prospered under a Labor Government. Really? How did the Labor Prime Minister Scullin add the Australia's prosperity during the 1930's Great Depression? Fifty Years later Paul Keating told us Australia was undergoing the "Recession we had to have". Were you rolling around in money then, Mareela

    So you think that the Labor Party looks after all the Australian people and the Libs don't? Mark Latham complains in his diary entries that the Labor Party lost in 1996 because so many of Labor's traditional supporters lost faith in the Labor Party. Labor was promoting programs that favoured minority groups in areas like the provision of government housing, education grants at the expense of the traditional, Anglo Celtic Labor voters. Chasing greenie votes in the inner suburbs of Sydney and Melbourne lost the votes of the Tasmanian timber workers faced with the loss of their jobs in 2004.

    So who (or what) does the Labor Party stand for and represent? Is it the Aborigines, migrants, greenies. hospitals and education? Is it the traditional working class people watching the jobs they once worked at disappear? Or is it all about keeping Labor Party Caucus members more time to keep their snouts in the taxpayer funded trough?
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    2:39am
    A final word (I hope) - the reality that we've had such a changeover in prime ministers and of treasurers (small letters intended) shows us two thing:-

    1. The people have lost faith in their political leaders and the political process and in the parties that predominate.

    2. Something is very rotten in the state of Denmark...

    Who will rid us of these troublesome parties?
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    2:53am
    "There is a new World coming this one's coming to an end...."
    The UN will be ruling us soon enough. Hence the change in PM, Mr Turnbull is the one they wanted, which coincides with The UN meeting of all members in Paris in December 2015. Same situation happened recently with the election in Canada. Agenda 21
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    2:53am
    "There is a new World coming this one's coming to an end...."
    The UN will be ruling us soon enough. Hence the change in PM, Mr Turnbull is the one they wanted, which coincides with The UN meeting of all members in Paris in December 2015. Same situation happened recently with the election in Canada. Agenda 21
    TREBOR
    24th Oct 2015
    3:17am
    I need more information here, niem... I'm not up on all this, though I see part of the picture.

    Post me some links - but I can't guarantee I have the time to review them all and draw some conclusions.

    I doubt we want the UN to be ruling us....
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    3:40am
    TREBOR google Agenda21 the information is all there. Take your time
    and have a look. This is not fiction but fact. And Mr Turnbull will be at the meeting in Paris and will on behalf of all Australians, without our consent, mind you, give away our rights.
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    3:43am
    TREBOR this maybe of interest.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG0WcjGHkEw&authuser=0
    Anonymous
    24th Oct 2015
    2:04pm
    Look at the time can"t you lot sleep
    wally
    24th Oct 2015
    4:52pm
    Sharia Law will see and end to the Libs and the Labor Party.
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    6:36pm
    Trebor Wally:

    Quote
    Islam is not a religion. "Islam" means submission. It is based on "Umma" or a world view that sees the entire planet as Islamic and countries that are not yet under the Sharia are waiting to be set free. The universal brotherhood, or Umma, is more about politics and conquest that religion which is only a small part of the ideology.
    Unquote

    This is all covered in Agenda21.
    mangomick
    24th Oct 2015
    7:36pm
    Really??? Christopher Monckton , Contrary to Monckton's claims, he is not a member of the House of Lords in the Parliament of Britain.
    Monckton is not a scientist. He is a climate change skeptic who has a degree in classics and a diploma in journalism.
    He claimed to have received the Nobel Peace Laureate in 2007 for his work on climate change but that was proven to be false .
    Agenda 21... maybe it is about New world order but you don't need to be a rocket scientist to work out that we can't have infinite growth, eventually the music is going to stop and there just isn't going to be enough chairs.
    World Leaders need to get together now and have a plan in place because finally when resources run out there is going to be an end to Growth and life as we now know it. When that happens things aren't going to be very pretty.Too much emphasis on increasing populations to to increase growth and using more and more of scarce resources. Now all the low hanging fruit is gone and we are digging deeper and deeper for oil,coal and iron ore.
    wally
    26th Oct 2015
    10:24am
    Hi mango. Despite your hatchet job on Monckton, where are the cold hard facts to prove that he is wrong? All we seem to get is wild and wooly "Chicken Little" scare stories from the likes of Tim Flannery and Al Gore. The real inconvenient truth about Gore's scarey movie An Inconvenient Truth is that it was/is a hotchpotch of half truths and misinterpreted (thus misleading) film clips that for lies and propaganda value would have made Josef Goebbels jealous of its impact on a gullible, non scientific world audience.
    mangomick
    27th Oct 2015
    10:33pm
    wally wally wally. You mentioned Tim Flannery and Al Gore but you forgot to mention the 95% to 99% of the world scientists from all fields that have been researching climate change and have had their results peer reviewed for many years , and they all concur that the effects of mankind have been responsible for large variances of our climate and the oceans rising acidity.
    And fresh off the press Wally,
    Royal Dutch Shell , BHP Billiton and GE are teaming up with the McKinsey consultancy and other large companies to advise governments on how to combat global warming without weakening their economies, Financial Times reports.
    The companies also are backing a $6M “energy transitions commission” to create a blueprint for a greener global economy in the next 15 years.
    Guess these big companies are only doing this to appease Tim Flannery, eh Wally
    Pollyanna
    24th Oct 2015
    9:07am
    I, personally am glad he is gone. Abbott tried hard but with Hockey at his side he did not stand a chance. He could not count to ten let alone balance the books. Of course he will get another cushy job. They all do. The biggest trouble they are still being paid by us (the tax payers) for their so called service. They still get all their perks. Who needs two offices and two secretaries and so on and on. All payments and perks should stop when they leave office the same as us humans do. Think of the billions we could save.
    mangomick
    24th Oct 2015
    9:23am
    Thought it was the other way round. Abbott and Credlin would knock back many proposals that Joe was in favour of like reviewing Super tax breaks for the very wealthy.
    Rose
    24th Oct 2015
    1:27pm
    In my opinion Joe Hockey is a decent man who is able to perform well in whatever position he will cover : because he is a decent man and refuse to stoop down to some politician level.
    maxchugg
    24th Oct 2015
    3:39pm
    We must be lifters, not leaners says Joe, before grabbing the usual massive golden handshake and accepting a plum job with huge salary and massive perks. Lifting or leaning?
    the retirement age has to be lifted to 70, Joe can go on full benefits any time he wants, as he has demonstrated.
    If there's a prize for hypocricy, I nominate Joe!
    Scrivener
    24th Oct 2015
    4:48pm
    Reminds me of the story:
    An old station hand named Billy was overseeing his herd in a remote pasture in the outback when suddenly a brand-new BMW advanced toward him out of a cloud of dust.

    The driver, a large round man smoking a cigar and wearing a Brioni® suit, Gucci® shoes, RayBan® sunglasses and YSL® tie, leaned out the window and asked the old man, "If I tell you exactly how many cows and calves you have in your herd, will you give me a calf?"

    Billy looks at the man, who obviously is a yuppie, then looks at his peacefully grazing herd and calmly answers, "Sure, why not?"

    The yuppie parks his car, whips out his Dell® notebook computer, connects it to his Cingular RAZR V3® cell phone, and surfs to a NASA page on the Internet, where he calls up a GPS satellite to get an exact fix on his location which he then feeds to another NASA satellite that scans the area in an ultra-high-resolution photo.

    The yuppie then opens the digital photo in Adobe Photoshop® and exports it to an image processing facility in Hamburg, Germany ......

    Within seconds, he receives an email on his Palm Pilot® that the image has been processed and the data stored. He then accesses an MS-SQL® database through an ODBC connected Excel® spreadsheet with email on his Blackberry® and, after a few minutes, receives a response.

    Finally, he prints out a full-color, 150-page report on his hi-tech, miniaturized HP LaserJet® printer, turns to Billy and says, "You have exactly 1,586 cows and calves."

    "That's right. Well, you'll be helpin yourself to one of me calves, then, since you won it fair en square." says Billy.

    He watches the smartly dressed yuppie select one of the animals and looks on with amusement as the man gingerly picks it up & stuffs it into the boot of his car.

    As the yuppie is carefully brushing the dust & hair off his suit, Billy says, "Hey, if I can tell you exactly what work you do & where you come from, will you give me back my calf?"

    The yuppie thinks about it for a second, wonderingwhat this wrinkled up dirt encrusted uneducated old man could possibly know? He grins and then says, "Okay, old fella, why not? I'm a believer in fair play."

    "You're a politician & you work in Canberra." says the old timer.

    "Wow! That's correct," says the yuppie, "but, tell me how on earth did you guess that?"

    "No guessing required." answered Billy "You showed up here even though nobody called you; you want to get paid for an answer I already knew, to a question I never asked. You used millions of dollars worth of equipment trying to show me how much smarter than me you are; and you don't know a thing about how working people make a living - or about cows, for that matter. This is a herd of sheep.

    Now give me back my dog."
    Anonymous
    25th Oct 2015
    11:02am
    Good one its a good laugh.
    wally
    25th Oct 2015
    3:12pm
    Thanks Scrivener. After all the bile and vitriol that has been splashed around in the preceding postings, yours is comes as a welcome relief.

    24th Oct 2015
    7:14pm
    like to thank hockey for the great service he has given to australia, please don't take any notice of our redbags and the me me brigade, as nothing will satisfy their demands unless you fill their pockets without them having to do anything for the good of this great country, AUSTRALIA wake up, do you want your children, grandchildren and great grandchildren pay of labor debt this generation will leave you ?
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    7:39pm
    I agree, well said.
    niemakawa
    24th Oct 2015
    7:40pm
    I agree, well said.
    Adrianus
    25th Oct 2015
    7:25pm
    Yes, well said Heemsy!!
    mareela
    24th Oct 2015
    8:44pm
    Heemskerk99 who has the greatest debt? I think the LNP/Nationals beat Labor by a country mile. The new PM is now talking about borrowing more money for infrastructure to provide more jobs for Australians and I have to say I agree with his strategy. Considering unemployment is at a 13 year high under this government it is refreshing to see the PM talk some sense.
    Jen
    25th Oct 2015
    6:52am
    Totally agree, mareela. This government's austerity ideology was doomed to fail and did, spectacularly. You can't cut your way to prosperity. It's laughable that the LNP call themselves "the adults" and "the best money-managers."
    wally
    26th Oct 2015
    10:16am
    Only because Hockey was stuck with the debt run up by the 3 stooges Rudd, Gillard and Swan. In the dying moments of the Labor government before they got booted in 2913, they passed laws making it impossible fo get out of the debts they had created. Sort of like an "iron clad" contract.

    I would like to see Jen explain he claim sneering at the LNP claim of being "the best money managers" if the Costello budget of 2007 is compared with the amount of indebtedness run up by the 3 stooges by the time they left office in 2913.

    From the timing of your post, Jen, I can only surmise that you were still asleep and dreaming when you came up with that comment.
    Adrianus
    26th Oct 2015
    10:53am
    mareela, the government HAS been borrowing more money to pay for infrastructure as well as borrowing more money to pay for Labor's debt. Every time the budget does not produce a surplus that difference or deficit is borrowed. Also for some unknown reason the NBN costs don't appear in the budget reconciliation.
    You and Jen would make fine Labor treasurers. It's ironic that the last two Labor Treasurers to receive the magazines award for Finance Minister of the year both presided over Australia's worst periods of Commonwealth debt. Makes one wonder how much did Australia pay for those awards?
    Jen
    26th Oct 2015
    1:22pm
    Oh, that old chestnut Wally? When are the rusted on righties going to take responsibility for the massive blow out of debt, deficit and unemployment WITHOUT a global financial crisis? When will it no longer be the fault of Labor, Wally? Never? I see.

    Your middle paragraph is gobbledy gook so no idea what you're trying to say. But you mention Costello, the goose who was paid a king's ransom to sort out Queensland's finances for the LNP! Look where that got them! You have some very strange heroes, Wally!
    Torchbearer
    25th Oct 2015
    1:14pm
    Joe was a disaster his party should have taken a hint as to how he performed when overseeing the insurance industry. A pity we are paying him a parliamentary pension AND giving him a plum job in US.
    geomac
    25th Oct 2015
    3:51pm
    Senator Xenophon, a long time critic of the system of political entitlements, said MPs should not be able to access to their parliamentary superannuation if they were appointed to a diplomatic post.
    "This looks a lot like a double dip by ex-politicians. It is beyond community standards. It is not reasonable," Senator Xenophon said.


    Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/federal-politics/political-news/nick-xenophon-wants-politicans-to-stop-doubledipping-20151025-gkhwmz.html#ixzz3pYIKeYyg

    25th Oct 2015
    5:38pm
    my question to you all, if you was in joe hockey's position, would you refuse his pension or refuse the offer to become ambassador to america, my bet, you would be killing each other to be first in line. jealousy is a curse and the me me brigade urgently need to start looking at themselves, as the saying goes a rort is only called a rort by those who can't participate in it themselves.
    wish joe and his family all the best and good luck joe, you deserve it.
    .
    mareela
    25th Oct 2015
    9:43pm
    Heemskerk99 you have to be a relative of Joe's by the sound of your comments. That's fine if you love the man and his family. I have nothing personal against Mr. Hockey but you have to be honest and admit the poor man had no idea what he was doing. His budgets were pure ideology. Australians need jobs not austerity.
    You also sound like someone with no social conscience that cares little for anyone in this country but yourself. So sad. Guess this country has given you all that you want and you have decided that everyone bar you is a leaner. I've got news for you.... You seem to be indoctrinated in LNP ideology and can't see the wood for the trees. Hope you continue to enjoy the fruits of this fine country.
    worker
    26th Oct 2015
    11:03am
    Thank good the Australian citizens have got rid of this employee Hockey. However we the Australian still pay him the perks and so called pension arranged by members of parliament.
    Like other members of parliament he was paid good wagers and perks whiles employed and will continue to be payed whiles he is not a employee hence he can have and drive a car unlike as he stated the poor can.
    its time thoses no longer employed by Australian citizens members of parliament did not get perks and so called pensions.
    Kato
    26th Oct 2015
    12:55pm
    Gone one trick one term Tony. Gone Joe one trick one term phoney.

    26th Oct 2015
    2:07pm
    as stated before, jealousy is a curse and some of you are total blinded by it , just read the comments of the likes of jen, mareela, worker, kato etc. I say, GOOD LUCK, JOE AND ENJOY YOUR LIFE WITH YOUR FAMILY, thanks for saving us from another disastrous labor government, the likes of rudd, gillard, rudd, was getting giddy with them in government, which set australia back 10 years and more!
    niemakawa
    26th Oct 2015
    4:54pm
    Absolutely.
    niemakawa
    26th Oct 2015
    4:54pm
    Absolutely.
    Paulodapotter
    26th Oct 2015
    9:03pm
    History won't support you Heemskerk99. History will give Howard and Abbott an absolute thrashing, economically, socially and morally. I don't need to support that statement. It's already a fact.
    Fred
    26th Oct 2015
    9:33pm
    That comment about Lord or Not Lord Mongatan as the Case may be does he have a steady job that I know of but travels the world Debunking Global Warriming some of the mistake he makes are very small end cab be talkedthouougtThe figures keep coming trusting a Global Change (mostely Governmeant backed) There have new group I ave heard is saying a mini ice age. C certainly a mini Ice Age but we don't have to listens to what they yet they have no government backing but just you wait we will hear soon. A lot of they ones we don't hear about are the self funded(noticed I said not government tax payers money) With the about of money that the people said the the world was flat I am sure a lot would now if AL CORE said the world was was whilst running in his 4 engine just with his party of hangers on burning petrol in their hire cars. Would would be working out how to push mountains over the edge to make to world evermore flatter bit bigger
    mareela
    29th Oct 2015
    5:07pm
    To the likes of Heemskerk99, robbo, niemakawa, frank and all the fervid right wing posters Your jealousy of the Rudd, Gillard years and all the good they did for our nation as well as them saving us from recession in the GFC is showing. The current government's diabolical mismanagement of our economy is typical of a right wing conservative government that continues to show they have no idea of what they're doing. Getting us further and further into debt is all they seem to be able to manage thanks to Poor old Joe who was way out of his depth. Wake up Australia! Do you want your children, grandchildren to pay back the LNP/National debt for years to come? This government has already put us back 10 years. Make your vote count at the next election and vote out this disasterous right wing government.
    Anonymous
    29th Oct 2015
    7:16pm
    mareela,as for me, to be accused by you of being jealous of the rudd and gillard labor government, by it self is an insult, as for you telling us they saved us of the recession caused by the gfc, we now are paying of those debts incurred by the stupidity of thinking that the insulation of our homes, without the expertise of those involved in this industry for years, would save this country of a recession, just think, if that is possible in your case, how many people lost their lives, how many houses burnt down, how many houses had to be re-done, there is still a waiting list at this moment to replace that insullation, due to the absolute stupidity of rudd and gillard's labor government,
    mareela, just for your information, the iron ore and the money left by the howard/costello saved us from that recession, there was no debt when labor took over, guess what, what was the debt left by the rudd/gillard/rudd labor government, 400 to 500 billion,
    then, thanks christ, the australian people woke up to their mistake of electing those simpletons, may it be many years before the australian people elect absolute labor stupidity over reasonable government, just look back at whitlam and keating and now an other fool, shorty, waiting in the background to put australia further in the mess labor left us.
    please mareela give us one thing what improved this country under the rudd/gillard/rudd government, is it the hundreds of kids who drowned when rudd gave the green light to open our borders, which gave the green light to the merchants of death, may be you was taken in by gillard's speech of misogyny, after all it was only to cover up her incredible shortfall of how to govern this great country of us,
    mareela, nothing against you, just get your facts right, read the comments of the royal commission, it is as plain as the nose on your face, labor stinks!!!!!!!
    Adrianus
    29th Oct 2015
    7:52pm
    If a "fervid right wing poster " is someone who thinks that people should accept responsibility for their standard of living and pays taxes knowing that those who have fallen on hard times don't get left behind then I am guilty. You got me.
    Joe was twice as good as Swan. Swan had no idea and was continually bashing the banks and business.
    mareela I think you must be one of the slow learning 17% who think Shorten would make a great PM?
    mareela you are part of the problem!
    mareela
    29th Oct 2015
    7:48pm
    Heemskerk99 we will have to agree to disagree. This government stinks. They have proved themselves hopeless at managing the economy and so much for their blackout on what is going on at sea with refugees. You must be very naive or just plain indoctrinated with right wing ideology. You yourself have obviously emigrated to Australia and for all I know we're once a refugee asking to come to this great country. Because Australians are being treated with disdain we don't know what is going on but we do know this government is actually paying people smugglers to turn back their unsafe leaky boats and most likely lives have been lost. Fact. You will one day read how well Labor managed the economy during the GFC. Afraid history will not be kind to Tony/Malcolm/Joe. I note you are unable to come to terms with the fact this government has spent and spent like a drunken sailor and doubled the deficit in just 1 year. Never mind the truth will always prevail. You need to take your blinkers off and give credit where it is due. Malcolm has stuffed up the NBN too. Such disasters this government is responsible for. Now Amnesty International wants a RC into the treatment of refugees in Australia. Hope you weren't treated in such a fashion when you came to this country. Anyway have a nice day and try and expand your reading from the Murdoch press. You might just learn some home truths. Using offensive language is also unbecoming. You should be able to make your points without name calling of the opposition. Hope you've had a good life in Australia.
    Adrianus
    29th Oct 2015
    8:25pm
    There are still people who think Shorten will be PM and Labor will send cheques in the mail.
    They don't realise that we don't have any more money. We are borrowing money to pay the interest on Labor's reckless waste!!!
    mareela
    29th Oct 2015
    8:32pm
    Frank we are up the creek without a paddle thanks to Joe's reckless economy management or rather mismanagement.
    Adrianus
    29th Oct 2015
    8:36pm
    Yeah? How so? What did he do wrong in your opinion?
    mareela
    29th Oct 2015
    8:44pm
    Some light reading for you Frank but from my observation on this site being a Right winger you only believe what Murdoch press tells you to think:
    https://www.thesaturdaypaper.com.au/news/politics/2014/12/20/how-john-howards-tax-cuts-undid-his-protege-tony-abbott/14189940001389
    Adrianus
    30th Oct 2015
    12:19pm
    There would be 12 million taxpayers who would disagree. But it's the Labor way to spend big and tax more to cover the cost. Anyway I thought I asked for your opinion on what Joe did wrong not what some journo thinks of Howards tax policy.
    mareela
    29th Oct 2015
    8:49pm
    More facts Frank:
    https://independentaustralia.net/politics/politics-display/shocking-joe-hockey-admits-the-budget-emergency-was-a-lie,6711
    Adrianus
    30th Oct 2015
    12:21pm
    mareela, I fail to see what facts you are eluding to in this interview? It makes Joe look good in my opinion. Give me some real dirt?
    mareela
    30th Oct 2015
    2:48pm
    Frank unlike yourself and the right wingers I deal in facts and not dirt associated with politicians. In my humble opinion there is no Australian on the horizon that I think even half way cares for Australia and Australians. No one that can lift this country out of the quagmire that this government has got us into with help from the opposition. They all seem to want to remain in power at any cost and Australians are paying the price for their greed. We'd are no longer assured of a job, a roof over our heads and an affordable education. All the right wingers want to do is privatise everything which is supposedly good for competition but we know that's not true-just look at all the RTO's that are gouging young students since the government privatised TAFE. I despair of young people ever owning a home and please don't insult my intelligence by saying like your hero Joe "get a better paying job". Jobs are few and far between in some areas of Australia. Unemployment has risen in the last 2 years also. Why isn't this government doing something positive to get people into jobs. All Turnbull wants to do is nothing till the next election in the hope his charm will get him re-elected. Following some of TA's policies will be disasterous for this country. They have to do something about revenue apart from robbing the poor. The gap between the have's and have not's is just getting wider.
    Adrianus
    30th Oct 2015
    4:15pm
    mareela, you said Joe put us up the creek without a paddle, I'm just wondering how? What are those poor Fiscal policies you attribute to his authority?
    mareela the gap may be getting wider but mathematically there are more haves than have nots than there were during the nineties and the early noughties. This is expected from a top 10 wealth nation. I can see you are a hard wired lefty, and as such if I were to offer any sound logic which occasionally I do, then it wouldn't resonate with you.
    Anyway here goes. :)
    Governments don't create jobs, but they can assist by;
    1. getting out of the way.
    2. speeding up the process for start ups to actually get going.
    3. rewarding businesses for collecting taxes.
    4. reduce red, green tape.
    5. Have Fiscal policy settings which work with the RBA monetary policy to lower the $AUS.
    I think this government would be more than happy to compare the rate of jobs growth with the previous government.
    But that's not important in the big picture.

    30th Oct 2015
    7:42pm
    mareela, using your own words, this government stinks, I can assure you, the 2000 people who drowned under the labor government of rudd, gillard, rudd were more on the nose, excuse my language, but the truth has to be told, as for your great admiration for amnesty international, just read how many people, babies and children are drowning in the mediterranean sea believing in that association!
    as for stuffing up the nbn, guess who thought this scheme up, while on a plane, getting drunk and putting it on the back of a beer coaster, I was told as was everybody else it was rudd, he also abused a stewardess for not getting a banquet, he would not have been able to finish for the one hour flight and as for to-days so called refugees, when I came to this country within 6 months I learned the language, I started work the very next day I arrived, never been on social services, yet, now those refugees let in under the labor government of rudd, gillard and rudd again, it shows 95% are still on the dole after 5 years and 1% speaks our language,
    nareela, what does it take for you to start living in the real world, take your red blinkers off, if that is the world you want to live in, good luck and find that country, I hope it will never happen to me or my children's future to live in such a country.
    as for joe, hope you enjoy your retirement with your family, forget about all those losers who will never get to your heights.
    mareela
    4th Nov 2015
    3:46pm
    Oh Heems you really are deluded. Where do you get your stats from? The Australian or the SMH or did you actually get them straight from the horse mouth ie Murdoch. Poor old Joe didn't really reach great heights so he's set the bar very low for Morrison to follow. Your ideology has blinded you to actual facts and unfortunately you are part of Australia's problem. However you are entitled to your opinion so good luck with your dreams! ????

    4th Nov 2015
    6:49pm
    mareela, just for your information, I get my stats from the australian bureau of statistics and centrelink, easy just check it out for yourself, has nothing to do with your hated enemy, the murdoch press, how dare they publish the truth, only a right wing roque could do this to australia, instead read the faifax press, ouch they agreed on this matter.
    reading your own words "don't insult my intelligence", reading your comments to these forums or replying to other people's comments, sorry you lost me,
    accusing those who oppose your thought as living in a right wing bubble,
    stating we always prospered under a labor government, debt left under keating 250 billion and 18% interest, won't mention the Whitlam labor government the less said about that government the better!
    accusing me of being jealous of the rudd, gillard, rudd government, they started with about 50 billion in the kitty and left with more than 350 billion dollars in debt, yet mareela still think the sun shines out of labor's a... and to top it up mareela blames the libs of stuffing up the nbn, thought up by rudd and a mate on a plane on the back of a beer coaster, as the saying goes, "when the beer is in the man, his wisdom is in the can" an old saying but how true, these statements will give everybody a change to make up their own mind about mareela's intelligence.