Government’s proposed cash ban could hit money-stashing pensioners

Many are concerned this will give the banks and authorities too much control over how you spend your money.

man getting money out of an atm

There’s a theory that the government’s proposed ban on cash payments for purchases over $10,000 is a ploy to give banks greater control of your money, but that theory is “far-fetched” says the Reserve Bank of Australia (RBA), which claims the real motive is to fight the black economy.

The cash ban passed the Lower House last year and was to come into effect on 1 January, but will not be implemented until after a Senate inquiry that is under way.

The Senate has received thousands of submissions, with many concerned it gives the banks and authorities too much control, according to abc.net.au.

The controversial bill will ban any cash payments over $10,000 and mandates a two-year prison sentence for anyone using cash for payments above the threshold.

Many members of the public are angry about the bill, saying the government has no right to interfere in how people spend their cash. Others have expressed concern that if they have to deposit too much money in the bank, they could be affected by negative interest rates.

The government claims the measure is intended to fight the black economy, stamp out tax evasion, stop money laundering and prevent other crimes.

Those concerned believe the proposed law will leave people’s bank deposits vulnerable to negative interest rates.

But the RBA rejected the view that the proposed law was “a precursor to the imposition of negative interest rates and the government deciding to withdraw cash from circulation”, noting that RBA governor Philip Lowe had already indicated negative interest rates were extremely unlikely.

“With respect, I think some of those concerns that you’ve alluded to are a little far-fetched,” RBA head of payment policy Tony Richards told the Senate inquiry last month.

According to RBA research, “very large transactions by households are very infrequent and, when they occur, they use electronic payment methods or occasionally cheques” but that “cash is [still] a very important part of our payment system and our economy”.

Even though fewer people use cash for major purchases, many Australians still store a considerable amount of wealth in physical bank notes, says Dr Richards, who estimates that there is around $80 billion in cash circulating daily, with around 75 per cent of that being held in storage by Australians.

“If you just take the numbers literally, it would be roughly $2000 [per household], but in actual fact it’s probably the case that most households have very little and a few households have a lot, and maybe people overseas hold Australian dollars,” he said.

When asked why the government would want to stop people being able to store money “under their bed and not in the bank”, Mr Richards replied: “This was a recommendation of the Black Economy Taskforce”.

The taskforce believes the cash limit would hinder criminal activity by stopping gangs from using large cash amounts to buy cars, houses and jewellery and other money-laundering schemes.

The taskforce estimates that about $50 billion is lost to the black economy annually.

Some MPs, such as independent MP Andrew Wilkie, have said they will not support the bill, because they back public concerns the law will “push people into the clutches of the banks”.

What do you think of this new law?

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    COMMENTS

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    Jim
    13th Jan 2020
    10:53am
    The black economy is theft of taxes that should be going into the economy, this amount of money could be used to help those in need, how would you stop it, not in the way suggested, I often feel like withdrawing all my money from the bank and sticking it under the bed, let’s face it who trusts the banks! Maybe government bonds, do we trust the government any more than the banks? I think all of us might have used the black economy at sometime during our lives, no admission of guilt here, maybe a flat tax on everyone and remove tax claims on expenses, but then who will invest in new and existing companies? Is there an answer to what is basically a moral question, in an ideal world everyone would pay their taxes, everyone would be treated equally, unfortunately there is no such thing as an ideal world.
    Drewbie
    13th Jan 2020
    2:12pm
    Jim; You're correct in referring the black economy is " theft of taxes "
    & that ' this amount of money could be used to help those in need '.
    But actually that is where it ends. True: The black economy does exist, but it is far smaller than what the public is being falsely lead to believe & a recent worldwide exhaustive IMF long-term study, publicly released in 2017, has proven that countries who have gone " cashless " like Sweden, Denmark, Switzerland, Japan, to name only four; there are several others . . . actually have resulted in a ' black economy that is running rampant '.

    In truth, it is the " Big End of Town, our big four banks & other big wig international entities, including many politicians on outrageously fat paychecks " who are the true villains ". For decades they've deliberately conspired & expended great effort to deprive Australia & other countries worldwide of receiving their fair share of the tax burden.

    No offence implied Jim; but perhaps you don't know that the Head Honcho of the Taskforce who compiled this report at the behest our Federal Government, was none other than the " Global Boss " of KPMG, an Aussie named Andrew - now deceased, I forget his surname.
    This ' biggest in the world ' accounting entity, along with a few " like others " has been investigated, charged, convicted & hugely fined in International Courts in relation to their involvement in $Billions of deliberate tax evasion, money laundering for drug lords, illicit weapons dealers, etc. And is currently being investigated " in Australia " for the exact same reasons.

    And our Federal Government then charges them with investigating Australia's so -called " Black Economy " ?? In all decency, something has to be drastically, obscenely & inherently W R O N G there.

    Just like you Jim, over an honest working life I've paid my fair share of personal income tax obligations & been done with it. Even cheerfully so on the principle that generally I'm safe, secure, free to enjoy life & pursue my own happiness, as long as it doesn't cause harm to anyone else.

    Has it ever been thought that if everyone; individuals, business
    ( massive, big or small ), willingly paid their fair share of the tax pie, tax rates across the board would be significantly lower, politicians golden handshakes would be acceptably smaller & government bureaucracy wouldn't be the behemoth it is, because they wouldn't need to employ tens or hundreds of thousands of employees just to chase, catch, convict, fine & or jail tax evaders. And unfortunately, the latter rarely happens, as often as it really should!
    Jim
    13th Jan 2020
    4:28pm
    Yes I agree, with everything you have said, I was playing the devils advocate ie I don’t believe a word of the article and cashless societies have been mooted for years, I recall Singapore saying many years ago that by about 2000 they would be cashless, I was in Singapore last year, I asked the taxi driver why they hadn’t gone cashless, he just laughed and said it would never happen, too many tourists and too many tax opportunities.
    As far as the black economy goes, I have read somewhere that our black economy was about 9.8% of gdp some countries like Italy and Greece have a black economy of about 24% of gdp, I don’t know if any of those figures are correct, although they must be because I read it on the internet LOL .
    Jim
    13th Jan 2020
    5:19pm
    Just checked different sources for how much the black economy was worth re the gdp and the estimates ranged from 1.2% to 15% bit of a difference from the different sources!
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:09am
    I've thought this through - the black economy may evade income tax, but re-enters we have re-entry, Houston) the tax system the moment cash is spent... and is thus eventually re-absorbed by tax. It is only those with excess discretionary income who are, in reality, a black hole in taxation and thus the budget - since they have the opportunity to hoard money away into non-taxpaying ventures, overseas holidays, transfers out to tax havens, overseas purchases, or other ventures of the same nature.

    Governments are not innocent here - they routinely give contracts to Offshore nations/business running into the many billions - without any reciprocal arrangement for that nation/business to return the favour by investing billions in this nation.

    Yes - it is illegal to evade income tax, and when caught, offenders should be severely punished - but in reality it is small fish in the budget losses afflicting this nation.

    Put simply - all moneys kept within Australia and not subverted into local tax havens such as family and one person businesses, trust funds, super funds, and so forth - is no loss to the budget. Put simply - that means that in reality only your wage and salary earners pay their full measure of tax...
    Rae
    14th Jan 2020
    7:53am
    Just as it"s ever been TREBOR. In fact if you add up income taxes, GST, rates, regos, levies, tolls, and necessary insurances then actually having any discretionary funds left is amazing.

    The PAYG wage and salary earners are definitely paying far too much of any burden.
    Suisseoz
    14th Jan 2020
    8:03am
    Drewbie, we haven’t gone cashless in Switzerland, cash is used a lot every day here. We have a 1000 swiss franc note (worth roughly about aud$1500) that is used a lot to pay bills at the post office, naturally we have ebanking, credit cards, debit cards too, but paying bills with cash is still pretty popular.
    Mariner
    14th Jan 2020
    10:36am
    Drewbie - I am a citizen of Switzerland and I can assure you that cash is far from dead. Fact two thirds of all payments are still made by cash (yesterday's Swiss News). They have issued a new CHF1000 note just last November (CHF1000 equals $A1400). Have been to Sweden and Denmark as well as Japan last year and using cash was no problem. Paid all my hotel bills in cash as well. Some people here are engaged in kite flying to frighten us oldies.
    Mariner
    14th Jan 2020
    10:47am
    The $A100 discrepancy above is the value in the papers is higher but changing a note here you will get the lower amount. Changed a couple of them here after arriving back last November so I should know. The money changer made the $A100 profit.
    Dabbydoos
    13th Jan 2020
    11:09am
    What next. Won't affect those MPs who get given freebies and free travel etc. Why should people trust the banks after their past record. This will not stop money laundering or the black economy. Chase those companies that earn millions and pay NO tax.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    11:19am
    $50 billion is a drop in the bucket compared to the billions lost to the multinational corporations paying no tax, taking large subsidies and profit shifting off shore. The black economy may shift some funds but most of that money flows around local communities in local spending. It's not as if the government is spending taxes wisely either.

    If it's all so improbable then why did we need the Bail In Legislation passed so sneakily. Not just negative interest rates but taking off with most of the deposits being forcefully held by banks who have proved over and over to be less than honest.

    Personally I don't trust either the banks, the RBA or the government now. The days of honest and upright men doing the moral thing are long gone.
    Horace Cope
    13th Jan 2020
    12:57pm
    Rae, it would be nice if you compared like with like. Those using the black economy to evade tax are worlds apart from those who, legally, avoid tax by following the laws set down by various governments.
    ex PS
    13th Jan 2020
    1:16pm
    Rae, HC is correct, major corporations are protected by the government, the peasants are fleeced by the government, there is a big difference between the two.
    What is this country coming to when the government thinks it can interfere with an individuals right to spend and manage their own money.
    If I want to use cash instead of electronic transfers that is my business, I do not need a Commisar to decide for me. Is this Australia or the old USSR for gods sake.
    What ever happened to the Liberal dogma of not letting government have too much control over the lives of the individual?
    Rae
    14th Jan 2020
    7:57am
    Yes Horace and the big difference shows up in the current account and trading ledgers which are terrifying.

    Why foreign corporations and foreign service providers are subsidised and untaxed, often with public funds, as they shuffle billions offshore is a question Government won't go anywhere near.
    Pass the Ductape
    13th Jan 2020
    11:26am
    Frankly - it stinks! Those for whom it is said it is directed at - the shysters in our society - will always find ways to dodge any scheme designed to trap them, whereas for those like me who are trying to save up to buy a second hand car for cash - instead of paying off interest on a loan for the same, will be at the mercy of the government and sent broke! About time this big noting, do-nothing prime minister of ours gets his act together and knocks this useless scheme back into the 19th century where it belongs!
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    12:19pm
    How can you be sent broke saving up for a car? Makes no sense at all to me.
    ex PS
    13th Jan 2020
    1:24pm
    What I read was going broke financing a car. It is quite easy for someone to do this if ghey have to sign a loan with a loan shark.
    You did notvunderstand what was written, that is why it does not make sense.
    The government doesn't like cash because their .backers in tha banks will suffer from reduced profits from fees and charges if people choose not to use them.
    This government has proven that it protects banks at all costs.
    Rod63
    13th Jan 2020
    2:08pm
    @Pass the Ductape: You don't need to save money "under the bed" to pay cash for a car. You can save it in an account. Then when you have enough, buy the car.

    Buying a car 'with cash", doesn't mean it has to be with actual physical money - it just means NOT credit (a loan).

    No-one can make you take out a loan and that is not what this is about.
    Hardworker
    13th Jan 2020
    3:44pm
    Rod63 - Don't always assume you can save up for a car in your bank account. It depends on whether you are paid the Aged Pension under the Income Test or the Assets Test. If you only receive a small part Aged Pension under the Income Test Centrelink take account of your bank balances every time they do the assessment and then your part pension fluctuates. I agree with Drewbie's comments. It is fine when the big end of town cheats but not when the 'ordinary' folk try to do the best they can for themselves.
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    3:55pm
    If the big end of town did cheat on their taxes then they would be prosecuted very quickly for doing so. They just learn the rules and play the game like every one should.
    Rod63
    13th Jan 2020
    4:43pm
    Thanks for the clarification re pensions, Hardworker.
    notdeadyet
    13th Jan 2020
    5:05pm
    Re those who want to pay cash for a car - the other side of the coin is selling a second hand car. Suppose I want to sell my car for $15000 or anything above $10000. I personally have a problem with scams of money transfers etc. I would prefer to get the cash in my hand and then take it to the bank. Or better yet, go to the bank with the buyer and have him remove cash and let me deposit it without leaving the bank.
    Pass the Ductape
    13th Jan 2020
    5:18pm
    1. 'RBA governor Philip Lowe had already indicated negative interest rates were extremely unlikely'.....
    Extremely unlikely?! Pull the other one - it plays jingle bells! If negative interest rates are required, it'll happen!

    2. 'Others have expressed concern that if they have to deposit too much money in the bank, they could be affected by negative interest rates'.....
    This where YOU pay the government interest through your own bank by having it sit in an account with them.

    3. 'The controversial bill will ban any cash payments over $10,000 and mandates a two-year prison sentence for anyone using cash for payments above the threshold'.....

    FFS...I saved up for 14 years to pay cash for a replacement battery bank for my solar power system which cost over $17,000 recently. The money was in fact an estimate of the quarterly power payments accrued over that same period and I'm now in the process of doing the same again in readiness for the next battery bank - hopefully not less than in another 14 years. And by then, who knows what the cost of a new battery bank will be! I'll have to try and anticipate as I go so I'll have enough money saved when it's required.

    I thought it was called prudent budgeting, but I'm guessing if government goes ahead with it's daft scheme, I won't be able to pay for power I need, in cash - because if I do - I'll be a candidate for jail!

    And God knows what'll happen if Centrelink finds out what I'm doing - I'll probably be doing a lot more than 2 years. Well stuff 'em all - I've had a gut-full of the lot!
    Pass the Ductape
    13th Jan 2020
    5:29pm
    And I just want a car that runs well and doesn't need to me acquire a loan to get! I'm not interested in having to fall down and beg to government, a bank, or centrelink for the privilege to do so! Not much to ask is it? Or maybe these days it is!
    Eddy
    13th Jan 2020
    5:36pm
    Hardworker, if you are saving cash 'under your mattress' instead of a bank account (and I do not criticise you for doing so) then are you not part of the 'black economy' by hiding assets from Centrelink. Anyway was not one reason we were given for inflicting Mr Hewson's/Mr Howard's GST on us was to kill the 'Black Economy". It didn't kill the 'Black Economy' then and it will not kill it under this new proposal.
    We already have reporting laws about transactions in excess of $10000 (as some of the big banks allegedly chose to ignore) and they do not stop money laundering. For instance, If a criminal and an accomplice each takes $9900 (which is below the reporting threshold) of 'dirty' cash (ie the proceeds of crime etc) to the casino and buy gambling chips with it then one can then cash in all the chips and get a legitimate transaction (ie cheque or bank transfer from the casino) and the $19800 (which is a reported transaction) is now 'clean' money. So if a criminal wants a $100000 car then only have to make five tips to the casino to pay with 'clean' money, just too simple.
    The 'Black Economy' includes many 'honest' people (myself included) who aid and abet other people to circumvent their tax obligations. I refer to paying cash for work done and not requesting a receipt thereby allowing the payee to pocket the cash and not put it though their 'books'. The payee may not pay tax on the proceeds and any GST will be credited against other jobs which do go through the books.
    ex PS
    14th Jan 2020
    11:26am
    Eddy, as others have pointed out, if it not against the law it is perfectly OK to deprive the government of tax revenue. I.see hiding money under the bed as no different than moving profits off shore to avoid tax.
    The bed should be regarded as the poor mans off shore tax haven.
    Eddy
    14th Jan 2020
    12:40pm
    The point I made exPS was that having your savings 'under the bed' was in effect hiding cash assets from Centrelink, and I suspect that is against the law. I also suspect that there ae many people who do exactly that and I am not the least critical of them (I know my late mother had a sizable sum hidden in her house). If ones savings are 'under the bed' and not earning 'interest' (lol) in the bank that's okay, the tax man is only interested in the income earned not the capital secreted.
    neil
    13th Jan 2020
    11:26am
    The big banks are huge money launderers as we see time and time again but nothing is done about them, hmmm wonder why. Just like the “claytons” banking Royal commission also not much done about that, wonder why! Negative interest rates sure would be a way for the Government to really control our money, spend your money on stuff you don’t need or want or we will charge you to leave it in the bank, hmmm more control!!!
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    12:22pm
    Royal commission was a witch hunt that failed to find anything. I certainly would have gone to jail instead of answering the questions asked as it was so unlawful. There is no way those conducting it would have been able to get away with what they did in a court of law. I was absolutely disgusted by their behaviour.
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    4:45pm
    "Royal commission was a witch hunt that failed to find anything."

    Is your head permanently stuck up your arse?
    Misty
    13th Jan 2020
    10:50pm
    Or maybe has his head in the sand, obviously never saw the final report or he wouldn't be making these ridiculous comments.
    ex PS
    14th Jan 2020
    11:37am
    The government phrased the terms of the investigation in such a way as to ensure their mates were protected.
    The same will happen to any enquiry into the bush fires. Nut of course the protection wil be for themselves.
    Eddy
    14th Jan 2020
    12:53pm
    Absolutely true exPS, as a former PS and military officer I have seen this scenario played out many times. Any inquiry, be it a small local inquiry or a Royal Commission, is designed to protect those in authority who, by omission or commission, failed to fulfil their responsibilities. Having been involved in a few inquiries, when we briefed senior managers or commanders we were told what we could and could not include in our report. Now I am vey sceptical of any so called inquiries.
    ex PS
    15th Jan 2020
    7:19am
    Eddy, as an ex military person ad Public Servant I fully concur-. The government never asks a question unless they know what the answer will be. Just look at the insipid, ridiculous questions the government members ask each other in Question Time every day whilst avoiding answering any questions asked by the opposition.
    Farside
    16th Jan 2020
    1:11pm
    Big Bear observed "There is no way those conducting it would have been able to get away with what they did in a court of law", but isn't that the point? Royal commissions are not courts of law and are not bound by the same formalities. They are inquisitions with coercive powers to call and cross examine witnesses and offer indemnities to them, obtain evidence, and have rights of entry and surveillance. They are great platforms for a public display of concern but when the dust settles they are not judicial, they bring down no verdicts and there is no obligation for government to act upon recommendations.
    Viking
    13th Jan 2020
    11:31am
    I don't see any problems with this, I don't use much cash but I would hate to see its demise. Paying through the banks protects the buyer by providing a third party record of transactions that wouldnt exist with cash and I would be suspicious of any seller who demanded cash. I can't imagine too many on the pension having too much problem with this, a bit of a beat up.
    sunnyOz
    13th Jan 2020
    2:42pm
    Strongly have to disagree. Since going on the pension, I have actually noticed I spend less, but use cash more. Garage sales are nearly all cash - I find great bargains there, do them up and sell for lovely profits. I buy the freshest eggs from a lady on small 3 acre lot, many fruit and vegetables the same way, often from road side stalls. Was recently up around Tamborine Mountain and got talking to a stall holder - he can't use an eftpos machine as there is coverage!
    And just look at the trouble when the banks lines go down - cannot purchase with a card. Many people were caught out in the bush-fire disasters because they had no cash on them. Just this morning went to a local store to buy something - a sign up saying 'Cash Only - lines down'.
    I am much more budget conscious with cash, instead of a card.
    panos
    13th Jan 2020
    3:01pm
    SunnyOz by your own admission you are buying and selling in the Black economy.

    2 yrs gaol for you forthwith.

    I hope your reporting your profit to Colonel Klink (cLink) for the reduction in your pension you rogue LOL
    Rod63
    13th Jan 2020
    4:46pm
    "I hope you're reporting your profit".

    You're = you are, your = it's yours
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:15pm
    Selling a few eggs is a hobby and isn't taxed nor is doing up something to on sell if it's a hobby.
    Pass the Ductape
    13th Jan 2020
    5:40pm
    Cash is king!

    The only reason this is being brought up is to float the idea so people get used to it. Then they'll hit us right in the wallet when we're tired of arguing!

    There is only one guarantee with schemes like this and that is - government will get more and you will get less! No matter how it's spun, the outcome never alters!
    micky d.
    13th Jan 2020
    5:50pm
    Rae...
    I've heard about so-called "hobby selling" but, to the best of my knowledge, there is no such thing as "hobby profits" being, in any way, different to any other commercially derived profit.
    If applicable - profits are liable to taxation.

    Perhaps someone can advise otherwise.

    If, of course, your hobby is confined to selling a few eggs only, it is extremely unlikely that your profits ("hobby" or otherwise) would attract taxation.
    Viking
    13th Jan 2020
    5:53pm
    SunnyOz, So how many of your garage sale purchases or egg transactions were around the $10,000 mark and affected by this legislation? I have to agree with Mondo. I too would be very suss of anyone demanding payment in folding money for more than $10,000 which is the issue discussed here and is surely the context of his post. The posts here suggesting that many pensioners are rolling around in so much cash give a different picture to the calls for increased pensions. No wonder so many complaints about deeming rates when so much money seems to be stuffed into matresses earning zero.
    Triss
    13th Jan 2020
    5:53pm
    I agree with you, SunnyOz. I use cash for the same reasons. Paying cash I can keep well within my budget. Also, farmers markets would decide it was too much trouble if they couldn’t take cash. Piddling about with cards etc for customers’ $2 packs of zucchini wouldn’t be worth them having to get up at 4am on market days...and how many fewer coin donations would there be for people collecting for charity?
    ex PS
    14th Jan 2020
    11:42am
    Nothing new here, just the government making sure their backers in the banking industry continue to make profits from us.
    They get hold of our money , pay little interest, use it to make money for themselves and charge us for the privilege. Now we want to gove them even more control, just wait for the clincher, a service charge for handling amounts over $10, 000.
    Xmas19
    13th Jan 2020
    11:36am
    The biggest 'black economy' is the banks who bankroll things such as child labour industries and huge multinationals that dodge tax payments. Our politicians are exactly the same they have smart accountants who can help them avoid tax at all. The poor Australian pensioner is again in the sights of the Govt. Every day we hear of some new scheme to try and wrest the meagre savings that pensioners hold. It is enough that Centrelink requires pensioners to already tell them how they will spend their money now we will have the banks doing the same. Enough! Time to stop this continual assault on people who have worked all their lives to have options in their later life.
    thommo
    13th Jan 2020
    12:04pm
    Agree with you Xmas 19. This govt can get stuffed.
    Sceptic
    13th Jan 2020
    12:41pm
    Present the evidence to the police then.
    On the Ball
    13th Jan 2020
    11:43am
    Another Government scare. "We have to do this to stop the black economy"..
    Yeah, so now the tradies split the kitchen reno into separate amounts. $9000 for the benches etc, and $5000 for appliances. And pay one bill this year, the other next, to avoid suspicion.
    Viking
    13th Jan 2020
    6:11pm
    Yes could be but it probably won't work because most buyers (except obviously pensioners who seem from posts here to be rolling in cash) wouldnt have that much cash hanging around. I am sure that if you tried to pull $10,000 in cash out of a bank branch they wouldn't have it in stock so you'd need to fill in a form or you soon will.
    I have no idea how much effect this will have on the black economy but the government has to find some money from somewhere to pay for their poor management.
    mogo51
    13th Jan 2020
    11:48am
    Hi Rae, stole my thunder and share your views plus increase gst, flat income tax system, no deductions, increase pensions for disadvantaged plus your multi nationals tax. No more 'rorts' for pollies.
    Jim
    13th Jan 2020
    4:42pm
    Agree with the flat tax rate and no deductions, but an increase in the GST would affect the disadvantaged more than the more well off, if everyone paid a flat tax then maybe there would be enough tax collected to meet all of our needs, there might also be an opportunity to increase pensions and other payments for the most disadvantaged, I recall years ago paying as much as 60% of money I earned when working overtime, to clarify that I mean 60% of money earned over a certain amount.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:18pm
    Thanks mono. I think the banks are in trouble. They need all the deposits they can hold onto. People are hoarding cash because of no trust anymore.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:19pm
    Sorry mogo51 spell check doh
    Hasbeen
    13th Jan 2020
    11:54am
    I have bought my last Ferrari, I'm not changing houses again, so I am unlikely to ever again need to pay more than $10,000 in a lump sum, just like most people.

    Pretty much a Ho hum issue for all but a few, of mostly the criminal element. Why are others getting their knickers in a knot, unless it is politically opportune to try to use it as anti the current government.
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    12:09pm
    Anyone who has traveled outside the country knows about that $10'000. Comes in a question on the customs form for years now - although that amount was worth a lot more 10 years ago it was never changed. Still worth something here but in Europe it is now barely Eu6000 and in the US $7000. I pay the old bloke doing my yard his fee in cash, he does not want checques (have not got them anyway) and he certainly does not carry a visa receipt machine. He takes the cash down to the pub for lunch with his missus and a few drinks.
    panos
    13th Jan 2020
    3:03pm
    Where he pays 10% GST on meals and drinks......
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    3:22pm
    He cannot avoid that and so it should be and we will all be happy, and only some shit stirrers want us to do away with cash.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:15am
    Correct, panos - 'black' money starts to pay tax the first time it is spent and then steadily pays more until it is back in the Treasury...
    Tanker
    13th Jan 2020
    11:57am
    According to Peter Costello when the GST was introduced that it would see the end of the "Black Economy". Like so many politicians statements it didn't turn out that way.
    Personally I can't see the point of hoarding stacks of cash at home and this measure wouldn't affect that. Paying $10,000 in cash when buying something seems a wee bit suss to me but then that is just me.
    I am much more concerned about the possibility of it becoming a cashless society. I was in the chemist recently buying a medication not on the PBS and the chemist's electronic payment system had gone down. I went home picked up the cash, we always try to keep a bit of cash handy, got back to the chemist after a couple of hours and their system was still down. Imagine that happening on a grand scale across all such systems our economy would come to a screeching halt in about a single day.
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    12:05pm
    I'd like to see an end to people who are not registered for GST adding GST to their invoices.
    Farside
    13th Jan 2020
    1:24pm
    Unregistered suppliers would quickly stop adding GST if the ATO were to set up a system that allowed consumers to apply for refunds for GST paid to shonks by providing details of payment and copies of documents to ATO for investigation. If GST was not paid then the consumer is refunded amount paid and the supplier pays investigation fee and penalised 10x the amount avoided on first instance, 20x on second instance etc. Would not take long to change behaviours.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:23pm
    Strangely I paid cash for a recent electrical upgrade and then for aircon and still paid the GST and received an invoice and receipt. I think the younger tradies are paying the GST as it's a write off anyway for them on supplies etc.

    I've never objected to paying tax. I can't understand why business is so greedy about it. workers pay heaps of tax and can hardly deduct anything. Even travelling to work isn't deductible for labour.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    2:26pm
    You need to check if they are GST registered before you pay them any GST. Very simple to do.
    Tanker
    13th Jan 2020
    11:57am
    According to Peter Costello when the GST was introduced that it would see the end of the "Black Economy". Like so many politicians statements it didn't turn out that way.
    Personally I can't see the point of hoarding stacks of cash at home and this measure wouldn't affect that. Paying $10,000 in cash when buying something seems a wee bit suss to me but then that is just me.
    I am much more concerned about the possibility of it becoming a cashless society. I was in the chemist recently buying a medication not on the PBS and the chemist's electronic payment system had gone down. I went home picked up the cash, we always try to keep a bit of cash handy, got back to the chemist after a couple of hours and their system was still down. Imagine that happening on a grand scale across all such systems our economy would come to a screeching halt in about a single day.
    Mondo
    13th Jan 2020
    12:06pm
    Tanker, I agree, if anything the GST encouraged more cash payments to avoid the GST but politicians can't see that far when they're salivating over all that extra tax. I must say you were lucky to find anyone in a shop today who would know how much change to give you. I've had many a time when the bill has come to something like $30.98c and I give them a $50 note and a dollar coin and they look at me blankly not knowing how much change to give.

    13th Jan 2020
    12:02pm
    Good I am sick of seeing people go into travel agents with bags and bags of cash. People are either hoarding cash or operating in the black market to have that amount of cash.

    All cash should have a use by date when if it out of date it has to be exchanged so that it can be used.

    I don't think this legislation goes anywhere near far enough.
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    12:18pm
    In a way cash has a used by date, VCBB. They are making new notes every few years or haven't you noticed? The contractors who found the buried loot on the Gold Coast recently handed the stuff in as everything was in Grey Ghost notes ($100s) from the 1980s so it would have been hard to use. I do come across one or two now and then, we have lots of older people in the area. I still do most of my purchases in cash but a lot of those missing notes are in Asian countries ($100 notes are worth more than 2 $50s or 5 $20s). Cash is also much better than visa cards over there.
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    12:23pm
    They are considering putting a microchip in all notes now so they do expire.
    Herbie49
    13th Jan 2020
    12:41pm
    Fair comment, however the bags of cash I have in my mattress were earned and tax paid at the going rate. I can spend it on whatever I want, holidays, drugs or wicked women. It is highly unlikely I would spend more than 10k on anything. Black economy ok stop it, it is all a prelude to a cashless society where big brother can see everything. They can go ***k themselves
    Oldman Roo
    13th Jan 2020
    1:33pm
    VCBB , I really gain the impression that you are all in favour of this Governments move and I have never heard of people lining up with bags of Cash at Travel agents . Going cashless will make it particularly difficult for those of advanced age . Getting to the Banks can be difficult for us and keeping up with all those modern day payment options is also not only a danger of getting defrauded but also impossible to understand for me . At the moment I know exactly what I have and a lot of Australians would not have debt problems if it was still a world without Credit Cards and electronic transactions . I also have the suspicion there is another ulterior motive behind this cashless move , which is to boost the poor economy to make people spend money they do not have . As evil as it may appear to some people , when you are living off the Pension and are not a wealthy person ,if it was not for the black economy many of us could not afford Tradesmen for essential repairs or jobs in and around the house .
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    3:52pm
    I gather from that Oldman Roo you pay tradesmen cash the avoid both GST and income tax. If this is so then it is a great move by the government as that must be stopped. Why should the rest of us pay taxes so your tradesmen don't?

    One has to wonder how much cash travel agents do take as I asked if they had any US dollars once. I got told that they didn't have much and would $5,000 USD be enough. Every time I go near a travel agent I see people with bags of cash mainly $100 notes paying for their travel.

    If you are worried about Credit Cards then you we now have purely marketing payment systems like Afterpay, Zip and a dozen others that are there purely to get people to spend money they don't have.
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    4:06pm
    Big Bear you really must have a problem with travel agents taking cash for payments, most of them I know do not particularly like it unless they also have a currency exchange facility on the premises (like FlightCentre). The public does not want to pay 2% extra for card payments when the holiday costs $20'000 upwards. Used to put the cash on the card and paid with that, since I can prepay the agent in cash in drips and draps I will do it that way. No extra costs for me, extra money on holiday. We all do it our own way, as long as it is legal who cares?
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:27pm
    You take the cake here. Jealous because some can save up and take holidays I suppose.

    I use cash if there is a surcharge. Damned If I'm paying 2% more just to use visa.
    Pass the Ductape
    13th Jan 2020
    6:01pm
    I'm with you on this Rae...I saw a rather magnificent combustion stove arrangement at a popular stove supplier a while ago at a cost of $14,000.

    I was looking at it wondering who had the moolah to pay such an exorbitant price for a stove - magnificent as it was - when I noticed on the back wall of the shop a sign stating....All credit card transactions will incur a 1.5% fee.

    I asked the assistant behind the counter if the charge was still valid on the $14,000 stove. "Yes sir!" - came the reply. "Bye-bye!" - said I.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:18am
    Where are these people heading into travel agencies with bags of cash, BB? Never seen that in my life... though, on your record, I'd say it is all old age pensioners?

    **eye rolling emoticon implied**
    ex PS
    14th Jan 2020
    11:51am
    Just what sort of a trip could you possibly take that would require bags of cash. $40K fits quite comfortably in the average purse.
    If someone is seeing bags of cash all over the place I suggest they change their brand of metho.
    Their glasses need a good clean.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    2:24pm
    Those bags of cash actually annoy me as I have to wait for the person in the queue in front of me to have their cash counted I guess I could always take a good book to read whilst waiting.
    Mariner
    14th Jan 2020
    2:59pm
    VCBB should try a company with a cash counter. They are pretty accurate and also make sure there are no falsies being peddled.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    10:07pm
    Travel Agent don't have cash counters exceot the human mind.
    vincent
    13th Jan 2020
    12:22pm
    Cutting the black economy, that is a laugh. Cashless society rubbish.It will leave society exposed to the vagaries of our internet connections. Which are of dubious quality to say the least. look at the bushfires our internet and power went so everything stops there. Cash will always be the backup system otherwise we have to go back to bartering again.
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    12:26pm
    Actually that is not true as transactions under a certain amount can be processed without the internet. However no one wants to do it.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:19am
    I like to keep a small amount of cash... never really got more than $20 or so... but that's my business...
    Tis only me
    13th Jan 2020
    12:27pm
    Rae, I couldn't agree more. I'm unlikely to have sufficient funds to pay $10,000 cash for anything, but if I did that's my business. It starts at $10k, with the Govt being able to lower that threshold at will. No one else here has mentioned the bail-in laws, which you quite rightly state were passed very sneakily and I doubt many people have any idea what that really means. I'd suggest people 'google' Bank Bail-ins in Australia as a starting point to see where all this is leading.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:31pm
    Yes the banks thought they were saving money and increasing profits by closing branches, sacking staff and moving to foreign call centres but now the phone app cowboys are coming and stealing the customers who have never ever been inside a physical branch and find the new banking tech providers cheaper and more agreeable.

    The days of the big 4 in control are ending quite quickly.
    Chris B T
    13th Jan 2020
    12:28pm
    A suggested 2 year Prison Term for a Cash Spend over $10,000.
    Bank CEO's and a like just move on to schemes to fleece in the Millions of Dollars without a formal Charge.
    Spend over $10,000.00 in cash court appearance, what a LOAD of "BS" from @s.
    Farside
    13th Jan 2020
    12:30pm
    The black economy may escape direct taxation in the short term but it's not all bad. Black money is typically the purview of small business and its circulation adds to community prosperity. The black cash will be spent and and GST will eventually be paid. Another good reason for government to increase the emphasis on indirect taxation. Eliminating tax rorts and avoidance by big business is a more urgent priority.
    KSS
    13th Jan 2020
    1:16pm
    For the black economy to flourish it requires that both the service provider and the service purchaser to be complicit!
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:20am
    .. and a corrupt government at the top that nobody wants to help escape from its own failures....
    Sceptic
    13th Jan 2020
    12:40pm
    What a lot of tosh, being exposed to low-interest rates if the money is deposited in the bank. Just what interest is the cash earning when under the mattress?
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:25am
    Their biggest earner is in your cash held before it is 'cleared' - they use that to buy and sell on the international money markets... hoping for the big windfall....

    "Barings Bank was a British merchant bank based in London, and the world's second oldest merchant bank (after Berenberg Bank). It was founded in 1762 by Francis Baring, a British-born member of the German-British Baring family of merchants and bankers.[1]

    The bank collapsed in 1995 after suffering losses of £827 million (£1.6 billion today) resulting from fraudulent investments, primarily in futures contracts, conducted by its employee Nick Leeson, working at its office in Singapore. "

    Not quite - it was the 'hedges' of investing in the short term cash market - buying an individual nation's money units and then re-selling them - that brought it down.

    That's what causes your dollar fluctuations - it's all in how much the OzDoll is deemed worth on the global cash buying market..

    Banks have your money for three days to use as they wish... I used to handle security runs for bank cheque clearance and transfers - it was all done at close of business as quickly as possible.... day one.
    leek
    13th Jan 2020
    12:41pm
    I had heard stories, from real estate agents and lawyers from where i used to live in melbourne, of people paying "cash' for homes. now I am talking over $600k up to 1 million $$ in Cash. Yep these people need a "please explain" note!
    Incognito
    13th Jan 2020
    11:37pm
    Were they from China and won it at Crown?
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    1:28am
    Mostly the Rome or Athens side of Melbadishu...

    Thees block flat no mine - is belong my uncle/cousin etc - he no here - away holiday for long time - only I collect rent for him!

    The rot started when we mass imported certain groups with a keen eye for the dollar and how to get it by hook or by crook...
    Horace Cope
    13th Jan 2020
    12:55pm
    The black economy has been around as long as cash has been around and it will continue despite anything any government wants to try and legislate. It was suggested that the black economy would disappear when the GST came in but it flourished. Indeed, the government was embarrassed with the amount of GST collected because all that black money can be successfully used for is eating out and accommodation and as these fell under the umbrella of GST, the government was now collection 10% on black money.

    Those smarties who spent their black money on material things like cars, home improvements or holidays came unstuck when the ATO asked where did the money come from to pay for those material things. Naturally we wouldn't ever help people dodge the ATO by accepting a large discount if we pay in cash but we don't begrudge those who get work done expertly, but cheaper, by tradespeople who prefer to deal in cash.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    5:56pm
    Good comment.

    The Italian Tax Office stopped luxury cars and boats a few years back and investigated the owners. Apparently it netted them a heap of taxes owing.
    ozrog
    13th Jan 2020
    1:18pm
    Just more control over the average pensioner bu the government. A couple of years ago the government blamed pensioner for the missing $100 notez we all know wbo is targeted by this move.
    KSS
    13th Jan 2020
    1:35pm
    There would be very few 'normal' people paying for major purchases with large amounts of cash these days.

    What is more concerning is the major push from the banks to remove cash in the first place. For years, every week I have collected whatever small change I have and put it in a piggybank (literally). When the pig is full, I count and sort the coins, bag them up and take them to the bank to exchange for notes. The amounts involved are around the $250 - $300 a time. However, it seems that the banks have now decided this is a security issue for the bank teller. The banks have removed the coin weigh devices and replaced them with a coin sorter which sorts, counts and deposits the coins directly into your bank account! Then the bank tells you the saver/customer that you cannot withdraw that amount until 6pm that night at the earliest.

    So then you can go to the counter and make a withdrawal equal to the coins deposited and stash those notes under the matress with the rest of your savings. Problem? The coins saved have already been accounted for (from your income e.g. salary, pension whatever) and is now being counted AGAIN as a deposit when you have to put it in your account for a second time.

    No black market, no nefarious goings on. Just a simple saving scheme now removed by the bank.
    Knight Templar
    13th Jan 2020
    1:45pm
    Most would not disagree with a ban on cash payments over $10,000. It sounds reasonable and unlikely to affect most citizens. Nevertheless, it has the potential for unintended consequences.

    The legislation once enacted will give future governments the authority (through Regulations) to reduce the amount over time. Cash payments could be restricted to less than $1,000. The banks and the government will then be able to track almost every dollar spent by account holders. Their ultimate goal is for a cashless society totally dependent on credit cards and technology. Great for the banks and the Tax Office.

    The privacy implications are also of great concern.
    Circum
    13th Jan 2020
    5:29pm
    I expect my Bookie to pay my winning bets in cash,wheter its over $10,000 or not.
    Circum
    13th Jan 2020
    5:29pm
    I expect my Bookie to pay my winning bets in cash,wheter its over $10,000 or not.
    ozrog
    13th Jan 2020
    5:55pm
    And you think when the banks crash its an IT problem. Yeah right its just the banks stopping us from accessing our money. Soon they will say you can only access your money on Tuesdays and Thursdays. As soon as we are all dependant on electronic banking the banks will limit you to your own money.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    6:00pm
    Look up Cyprus, Iceland and Greece where bail ins took the money and then rationed how much you could take out of what was left in your accounts.
    Incognito
    13th Jan 2020
    11:41pm
    I was thinking the same thing Knight, they may just want to keep an eye on everyone's spending habits, then they can sell off the data.
    Nerk
    13th Jan 2020
    2:12pm
    You know you don't have to use a bank, it is your money stick it in a small safe at home, better you make it small notes cause sooner or later they'll ban $100.00 notes.
    Mondo
    13th Jan 2020
    2:50pm
    report

    reply
    You know you don't have to use a bank, it is your money stick it in a small safe at home, better you make it small notes cause sooner or later they'll ban $100.00 notes.






    Mondo
    13th Jan 2020
    2:49pm

    remove

    reply
    The Centrelink trap has been sprung! When they all these complaints from pensioners about not being able to spend more than $10,000 at a time in cash they'll have Scomo call a Royal Commission into pensioners' cash hoardings
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    3:35pm
    People who really want to hoard some dough just buy gold coins, never out of date and gold holds its value. No micro chips VCBB! listen up. You really have to have a lot to make it worthwhile.
    As far as the little tale goes about cash bags to travel agents: Some of us have accounts with them and save up by putting some money on account so when the time comes for another booking some money is in the account and not spent somewhere else. Pay before you go does not cost interest and it is also not deemed as it is spent on a future holiday - a bit like your funeral payment, LOL!. If they ban $100 notes who is banning the US$ ones?? Trump, don't make me laugh! Let's get real and just think it's another scare to frighten older people.
    Anonymous
    13th Jan 2020
    4:01pm
    These bags of cash would contain enough to pay your pension for 12 months or more and the way it comes out of those bags it has not come out of a bank account. Banks nicely sort money into nice bundles but the bundles if you can even call them that in those bags are not bundled by a bank teller.
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    4:12pm
    My last stash out of the bank had only rubber bands on them, the notes did not even all look the same way up. Makes me wonder when you last took some cash out - do not open your wallet as moths might fly out. Try to get a couple of thousand out these days - you get a rubber band and maybe an envelope to stuff the notes in if you ask nicely. You sound like an electronic payment only person.
    Horace Cope
    13th Jan 2020
    4:28pm
    Mariner, you raise a good point re travel. We are still using a cheque account and when we paid for our last holiday, the travel agent refused our cheque as there was insufficient time to clear it before the money had to be paid over. We could have used a debit card but we couldn't justify paying the additional percentage and as our financial institution was across the corridor, we cashed a cheque with them and paid for our trip in cash. All legitimate, no "hidden" funds and now the government wants to stop the convenience of cash because some people are doing the wrong thing. That's like the time the government raised the excise on RTD alcohol to stop youth binge drinking, which troubled less than 1.4% of the population, and my beloved Bundy & Cola almost doubled in price. Don't penalise us law-abiding citizens because of a few low-lifes, catch the low-lifes.
    Up front lady
    13th Jan 2020
    4:19pm
    The black economy is harmless and actually good for the economy. Cash goes round and around and after the first "black" transaction every further purchase would be subject to GST.
    Miniscule compared to the tax benefits our politicians get, big business and foreign mining companies get. Clamp down on them first.
    Rae
    13th Jan 2020
    6:05pm
    Indeed it does. That cash economy saved the USA when the banks imploded in 2008 too.

    It will be interesting to see what happens in cashless economies the next liquidity crisis when banks can't get money from each other. I wonder if our RBA will be up to the task. It's daunting to wonder if the ATMs and credit cards might be shut come morning and be totally reliant on them for buying anything at all.
    Incognito
    13th Jan 2020
    11:44pm
    So true Up Front, black economy is in the black, no debt, that is why the banks don't like it.
    Franky
    13th Jan 2020
    4:27pm
    I remember when India introduced new currency and outlawed all old bank notes. The motive supposedly was also to flush out all the illegal cash money in the economy. It turned out a total flop, as virtually all the money was legal, but it cost the economy dearly. I don't buy the Reserve Banks assertions, how can they be trusted? I do believe it leaves the door open to negative interest rates, forcing people to spend their cash rather than saving it. It's a very damaging move, and the payoff is already evident with our A$ crashing against Asian currencies in particular, which all have normal interest rates still. Negative interest rates is a recipe for destroying our economy and our wealth.

    13th Jan 2020
    4:43pm
    This is just what we could expect from an LNP government that are nothing but a bunch of fascists.
    Robbo1
    13th Jan 2020
    5:16pm
    For goodness sake! How much more can the government make the "quiet Australians" suffer?
    It's the fat cat government ministers, multi-national corporations, foreign nationals and religious groups, with the help of our big 4, dishonest banks, who are responsible for the black economy and money laundering.
    ScoMo has just, generously, donated $100,000.00 to his church. Of course, it's all tax payer money and tax exempt! Why???
    The "quiet Australians", as ScoMo calls us, would be hard pushed to save $100.00, if we're lucky, with the price of daily essentials and utitiies sky rocketing daily; but wages remaining stagnant.
    Instead of trying to help "quiet Australians" doing it tough, the pensioners, returned service personnel and those affected by the fires, the government's doing an absolutely sterling job of kicking all the "quiet Australians" to the curb!
    Shame ScoMo Shame!
    Tricky
    13th Jan 2020
    5:19pm
    With the recent State of Emergency enacted due to bush fires resulted in extensive blackouts. No ATM's, No electronic transactions. Cash rules.
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    10:33pm
    Tricky - you are sooo right, have been in places like that. (Also lived in Africa for 9 years, you DO need cash).
    Triss
    13th Jan 2020
    5:35pm
    So, it’s to stop the black economy, is it? I reckon we’re having so much wool pulled over our eyes it’s a wonder we can’t smell the sheep. Stir up the little people and they’ll forget where the real black economy is. Get the multi nationals to pay their correct taxes first, that will sort out a lot of our debts.
    Robbo1
    13th Jan 2020
    5:40pm
    Where or where does the government get off trying to destroy "the quiet Australians"?
    Most of us would be hard pressed to save $100.00, with the rate daily essentials and utitiies have escalated, while wages have remained at an all time low.
    It's the fat cat politicians, multi-national corporations, foreign nationals, sending money overseas in astronomical proportions (there really should be a limit to the amount they can send; but hey, the government's blind, deaf and dumb, when it comes to these underhanded dealings) and religious groups, with the help of our dishonest, money grabbing, avaratious, big 4 banks, who are guilty of black money and money laundering.
    Scott Morrison has just made an extremely generous donation of $100,000.00 to his church. If course, it's all taxpayer money and tax exempt; nothing but the best for our lazy, self-centred Prime Minister, who has managed to do as little as possible in the time he's been in office! It's been a case of "find the Prime Minister"!!
    Instead of ScoMo trying to assist pensioners, people on New Start (some of whom would have to go to job interviews, with a zimmer frame, only to be shown the door, for being too old), returned service personnel and "the quiet Australians" who have been affected by the horrendous bush fires, he and his cronies can think of nothing else; but ways and means to squeeze the last drop if blood out of us!
    Shame ScoMo, Shame!!
    Robbo1
    13th Jan 2020
    5:48pm
    Goodness, did I really make a boo boo and say "last drop "if" blood?
    I really meant to say " ScoMo and his cronies would make a desperate bid to squeeze the last drop of our blood; if we had any left to give"!!!
    Robbo1
    13th Jan 2020
    6:00pm
    What a bloody good excuse for ScoMo and the "Department of 'Inhuman' Services" to roll out the Cashless Debit Card for pensionsers! Next on the agenda; coming to a suburb you're in"!!
    Talk about "elder abuse" in the highest degree!!!
    SuziJ
    13th Jan 2020
    6:40pm
    Robbo1 The article is a ban on cash payments over $10,000, not the smaller stuff we use on a daily basis.
    Pass the Ductape
    14th Jan 2020
    12:31pm
    Doesn't matter what anyone says in the article says Suzi - it's what actually occurs that matters - and Robbo has it in one!

    Surely you don't believe anything a banker or politician says!?
    etc1
    13th Jan 2020
    6:12pm
    People over retirement age should not pay tax. So I don't have to burn all the fallen trees and branches, I bought a wood chipper.$55 tax. I'm only 1 person, the weekly taxes on my purchases is so much, multiply that by the millions. Where is all the money going? I know my part pension is taken back in taxes on my living expenses.
    SuziJ
    13th Jan 2020
    6:37pm
    Read the first sentence of the article people! It's a ban on cash payments OVER $10,000! Not the small stuff you & I use as cash for small items.
    ozrog
    13th Jan 2020
    6:54pm
    Why ban cash payments over $10,000 and don't say because of black economy.
    Viking
    13th Jan 2020
    8:45pm
    Yeah, It's a revelation to me after hearing so many hard luck stories that so many pensioners are sitting on tens of thousands in cash, maybe we need to revise the pension with so much cash sloshing around. We might even be able to reduce the muggings of the elderly if they have to put it into an account. So many winging about the banks, never had a problem myself, they send flowers to my wife, phone us on our birthdays, never had any bank fees, send us regular pre-paid gift cards but what's wrong with online credit union accounts?
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    10:31pm
    Viking - there is a benefit by living in or near a capital city, out here the banks would not give us the time of day!
    Viking
    14th Jan 2020
    9:35am
    Mariner, that's interesting, I would have thought the more rural bank branches (where they still exist of course) would have a closer relationship with their customers. I live several hundred km from the nearest capital city and we have had much the same positive relationship with our bank living in cities, suburbs, overseas and rural as now. In fact the capital city was the least helpful, rural regional the best. The same bank is today offering to pay a year's mortgage for fire affected victims.
    Mariner
    14th Jan 2020
    2:53pm
    @Viking - my branch closed down and I have to travel 7 km to the next one. They have one counter and a staff member sends you to a net connection desk. Do not want to do financials on the net if avoidable.
    Priscilla
    13th Jan 2020
    7:04pm
    Banks continue to rip off taxpayers by charging for the use of cards. Cards are also open to scammers and hackers. Cash is convenient and better to use. If you lose the cash in your purse/wallet that is all you lose but if you lose a card that is connected to other cards you lose soooooo much more. People have the right to chose how they plan their budgets and spending without interference.
    Anonymous
    14th Jan 2020
    2:19pm
    You get your credit card money back but not your cash.
    Harley
    13th Jan 2020
    7:56pm
    I carry no cash, not even a wallet. Even my Drivers Licence is in my phone. My wife and I drawn cash only sometimes, usually to buy a raffle ticket. I am a retyred 67 year old, all my bills are paid online and I use a credit card for the supermarket. What on earth dose one need cash for.
    Incognito
    13th Jan 2020
    11:49pm
    Buying honey from my local beekeeper, buying at garage sales, buying at markets, buying second hand goods on gumtree, and when the card payment system is down.
    Harley
    13th Jan 2020
    7:56pm
    I carry no cash, not even a wallet. Even my Drivers Licence is in my phone. My wife and I drawn cash only sometimes, usually to buy a raffle ticket. I am a retyred 67 year old, all my bills are paid online and I use a credit card for the supermarket. What on earth dose one need cash for.
    Mariner
    13th Jan 2020
    10:28pm
    You trust the net and some of us do not, simple! Hope you never lose or misplace your beloved phone, Harley. Wish you luck, I just do not have the faith in these electronics.
    hyperbole
    15th Jan 2020
    11:33am
    no way do I totally trust technology. remember seeing people dumping their trolley loads of goods at Woolworths not long ago when the system went down and only those who had cash were able to purchase.
    ray @ Bondi
    13th Jan 2020
    8:25pm
    Welcome to George Orwell 1984 foretelling the rise of dystopian governments
    MarkAdel
    13th Jan 2020
    10:29pm
    Too many conspiracy theories in the comments here. I agree with what is being proposed. How many of you have $10,000 in cash?
    ex PS
    14th Jan 2020
    11:59am
    That's right every one out there who has $10000 stashed, let know, I'll be around to visit.
    Just saving the banks the trouble.
    Incognito
    13th Jan 2020
    11:51pm
    Will not stop the black market, they will just pay off larger items in installments, use bitcoin or similar or other online payment systems. The users of the black market are not the biggest crooks we have.

    14th Jan 2020
    1:02am
    Should the government be entitled™ to tell you how to spend your money?

    NO!
    Mariner
    14th Jan 2020
    10:44am
    Talking of cash payments and tradies one should also mention that house repairs, replacing fixed items like water heaters and stoves are tax deductible in many European countries so there is no incentive to avoid GST. You have to keep the receipts and take the costs off your income tax. However, there is a capital gains tax on your own home when you sell.
    Here I pay cash for repairs, gutter cleaning, painting. For appliances and their installation I pay everything in full - I need a receipt for the warranty. Full GST included, do not know whether it is passed on.
    Zach
    14th Jan 2020
    11:51am
    I have no problem with it. I have had $50.00 in my wallet for months at a time with no use for it. Every thing is electronic now so there is little use for cash
    Pass the Ductape
    14th Jan 2020
    12:16pm
    No use for it? Chuck it this way would ya!
    ex PS
    15th Jan 2020
    7:31am
    After being in a situation where I had bought a tank full of petrol and had a card that did not work, I have developed the habit of always carrying a certain amount of cash with me. I only get caught once making the same mistake.
    The cashless society is much like the paperless workplace, a nice idea but hard to implement. Up until I retired I was still coming across offices that had everything stored off site electronically but still had filing cabinets full of duplicate paperwork, ( Just in case).
    hyperbole
    15th Jan 2020
    11:35am
    Zach, until something goes wrong .and it will..trust me!
    The recent bush fires a great example..people did not have money to fill their cars as system down
    Laura52
    21st Jan 2020
    9:52am
    I agree with the last two commentators. I work in retail and when the register goes down to computer issues or the eftpos terminals are down, for a long time...we have to ask for cash and open the cash register with a key and manually record transactions. Most people these days don't carry cash. In these circumstance we lost so many customers. It would be wise to have some on hand in emergencies. Regarding transactions and banking on the internet/phone...be most wary, unless you have installed a vpn or very good cyber security, it is so easy for hacking....has been done to me twice...even with a vpn and strict security...being tech savy myself, not always foolproof...as well.
    hyperbole
    15th Jan 2020
    11:31am
    great idea! it is time criminals who do this are caught. well remember a bank employee friend who told me when driving around a very rich area that many we were looking at were owned by "young" crims (drug dealers etc) who paid by cash.
    BillF2
    15th Jan 2020
    1:37pm
    In the biblical book of Revelation (chapter 13), there is a prophecy concerning the 'mark of the beast' - a mark of some sort in one's hand or forehead, without which one cannot engage in buying or selling. To most people this seems ridiculous and far-fetched, but the logical conclusion of our government's policies is that very scenario. One little step at a time will eventually bring us to that point. And the little step at the moment is to restrict cash purchases to $10,000. Maybe the next step will be $5000. Then $2000. Then $1000, until cash cannot be used at all.
    The excuse this time is the 'black economy'. By its very nature nobody knows how big it is, but it is easy to suggest a figure big enough to justify the action. Unfortunately, most politicians are too stupid to see what is happening, and will pass whatever legislation is put before them.
    In Western Australia, there is a government proposal to stop bikies from contacting one another. This will undoubtedly involve cash transactions as well as personal contact. This might be considered justified, if not just. But what happens when other groups of people are targeted because the government doesn't like them? Where does power and control stop?
    Why do we need such restrictions on a legal means of exchange? In reality, we don't, but they give government and their mates much greater control over the population. This is the nature of totalitarianism. One only has to look at nazi Germany, the soviet Union and China for the future of Australia. But does anyone care?
    Greg
    16th Jan 2020
    5:08pm
    A lot of people on here have a reading and/or comprehension issue - this is about CASH, you know those actual bank notes made of plasticy stuff. This is not about putting money in bank accounts, if you deposit/withdraw more then $10,000 CASH into a bank account it's reported, that's been happening for 30 years.

    There is and there will be no stopping you buying things with cash under $10,000, honestly how often does it happen that you sell/buy something in CASH for more then $10,000. Buy/sell a car privately use a Bank Cheque, if you want to be sure about the Bank Cheque go to the bank with the buyer/seller (like if it was a cash transaction) and clear the cheque instantly.

    This is purely to try and cut down on dodgy dealings that the vast majority of good citizens don't have anything to do with.
    Mariner
    17th Jan 2020
    8:03am
    Well put Greg. Thank you.
    Beemee
    17th Jan 2020
    2:41pm
    These new laws stink. The Govt is just greedy, you got it I want it attitude.
    If I buy something over $10,000 I will make arrangements with the seller, preferably not through someone privately, and pay them under $10,000 and then come back the next day and pay the balance. That way I avoid telling them anything.
    Greg
    17th Jan 2020
    2:49pm
    What the hell are you on about? How does this make the government greedy?

    All they are trying to do is stop the billions of lost tax due to cash transactions, people are not declaring income and not paying their fair share of tax. As a result other people like you and me pay more tax to cover the shortfall. Ah, hang on, sounds like you're one of the ones who doesn't declare income so that's why you're annoyed....bad luck.
    Beemee
    17th Jan 2020
    3:34pm
    I am retired so don't pay tax anymore. I suggest you dig a little deeper than just the surface reasoning behind banning cash.
    Its all about and will be about control of the people instead or running the country as they should.
    I may be of the older generation but I still have my Governmental and Forces contacts to get the right answers.
    Watch and see when this comes into effect, you will be the first to scream and by then it willbe too late. Wont be able to say you weren't warned.
    Greg
    17th Jan 2020
    3:50pm
    Time for your meds...
    Blossom
    24th Jan 2020
    1:04pm
    If you buy a late model car privately most people do not the electronic for you to pay by eftpos and will not accept a personal cheque in case it "bounces". It is a $10.00 fee for a "bank cheque" If you transfer money between banks and one is owned by an overseas bank (even partly owned) at all banks charge $30.00. All of them do that. ANZ Bank is partly overseas owned.....Even if you have Enduring Power of Attorney for a person and pay all their accounts then transfer money into your own account to be able to pay more, if you transfer $10,000.00 the Banks have to notify ATO. If you do it for even a just $1.00 less they don't have to.
    Blossom
    24th Jan 2020
    1:04pm
    If you buy a late model car privately most people do not the electronic for you to pay by eftpos and will not accept a personal cheque in case it "bounces". It is a $10.00 fee for a "bank cheque" If you transfer money between banks and one is owned by an overseas bank (even partly owned) at all banks charge $30.00. All of them do that. ANZ Bank is partly overseas owned.....Even if you have Enduring Power of Attorney for a person and pay all their accounts then transfer money into your own account to be able to pay more, if you transfer $10,000.00 the Banks have to notify ATO. If you do it for even a just $1.00 less they don't have to.
    Blossom
    24th Jan 2020
    1:12pm
    Many business also won't accept personal cheques for the same reasons.
    Many banks also have a limit of how much funds you can transfer to even a business per day. Many banks it is $5000.00
    Blossom
    24th Jan 2020
    1:12pm
    Many business also won't accept personal cheques for the same reasons.
    Many banks also have a limit of how much funds you can transfer to even a business per day. Many banks it is $5000.00
    Incognito
    24th Jan 2020
    1:47pm
    Good points, I know I cannot take out more than $1000 out off my debit card, so have to use a cheque to pay my rent to avoid third party fee's as they won't allow direct payment into their bank account now. But my bank does not charge me fee's on my cheque's.
    Greg
    24th Jan 2020
    5:50pm
    You really are just sprouting a lot of crap - all your "facts" are not for ALL banks.

    $10 fee for a bank cheque, not necessarily, depends on the bank, the business you have with them, could be free.

    What's this garbage about if the bank is overseas owned? Total rot, nothing to do with it.

    The $10,000 limit is NOT, I repeat, NOT reported to the ATO, it's reported to Austrac, nothing to do with the ATO. And if it's under $10,000 it STILL CAN BE REPORTED anyway. This reporting is nothing to do with what you are doing with YOUR money, it's about money laundering, they don't give a rats arse about you buying a car.

    The transfer limit has a default amount of $5,000 at my bank; I can login and increase that to $20,000 OR phone them and increase it to $100,000 - I was paying my progress payments online when I built a house, only one was over $100,000 so did it over two days....simple.
    Greg
    24th Jan 2020
    5:52pm
    musicveg - have you checked with your bank about the limit of $1,000, my bank allows me to increase it to $2,000 very easily.


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