The Meeting Place

DOMESTIC VIOLENCE

Domestic violence has made headlines in the media of late sadly, 

ABC radio has been talking about this topic and how does one counter and fix these issues?

Any suggestions?

Image result for confused expression cartoonImage result for confused expression cartoon

 

It is very sad that 9 women have been killed so far this year in domestic violence, I was really surprised to read that.  

Why is this happening in our society?

Years ago in my 30s a neigbour was bashed about so much she couldn't stand and was found at the bottom of her garden, her husband had taken the daughter and left, he didn't want his daughter but he didn't want the mother his wife to have her, so he put her in an orphanage. 

The mother spent six weeks with social workers trying to find her missing daughter. That started a friendship with our family as the little girl was a year younger than my eldest.  

But the mother had to spend a whole year proving to the Family Court that she was able to care for her own child!

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-24/domestic-violence-and-issue-of-male-fragility-explored-in-art/11992600

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27 comments

Personally I think women go into relationships much too quickly, their standards over the last 50 odd years have got lower and lower and lower.   Doing that the men lose respect.   

I find I lose respect for people when they come across too familiar, I think this is half of the problem a lack of respect be it for the guy or the girl.

Also I think with todays climate in domestic violence the Federal Government needs to put some money where their mouth is.  By that they need to spend money on Safe Houses.    Plenty of money is spent on sports clubs and grounds, but not where it is really needed.

The crimes I am reading in the newspapers the last week are horrific.  Some of these poor souls should have had the safety of a Safe House.     

It is not only the lower socioeconomic homes that has domestic violence either, it comes in all homes.

The bullies in schools needs to be addressed too, perhaps bullies should not be allowed to rise through the ranks of schools but kept down a year.   Or have a special Grade.   

 

Signs of emotional abuse

The signs of emotional abuse can be difficult to identify, especially because it is non-physical. Emotional abuse includes:

blaming a partner for all the problems in a relationship

constantly comparing them with others to undermine their self-esteem and self-worth

usually being in a bad mood

intentionally embarrassing them in public

name calling

yelling, insulting or swearing at them

controlling someone’s finances (also known as financial abuse)

telling them what to wear

preventing them from seeing their friends and family

threatening suicide

making them feel guilty when they refuse sex

threatening to report their immigration status

online humiliation and intimidation.

 

Yeah, I remember thinking at the time that if he was prepared to do that in a public place, like a restaurant, one wonders what happens 'behind closed doors'.   

I agree that some women do have a lot to answer for when it comes to family disputes, but nothing excuses the atrocity that occurred in Camp Hill.   And we can't get away from the fact that statistically more than one women a week dies at the hands of a partner or ex-partner.  We don't even know the statistics for those who are beaten because anecdotally we hear that a vast majority of assaults are never reported.

We can even trot out statistics to prove that more men are killed per year than women, but the vast majority of them are killed by other men.   I totally understand this feels like we are blaming the entire male population for this, but that isn't the case, we are simply pointing out the bleeding obvious.  Domestic violence largely lies in the province of domineering men and their attitudes.  And I hasten to add that doesn't mean all men, that should also be bleeding obvious, not all men are domineering.  But if you are male and you fit the bill, you know who you are, we don't for the most part.   And I guess that's why we 'play the gender card' as so many males with delicate egos like to say.

We are highly unlikely to be killed by another woman, not unheard of I know, but highly unlikely compared to the risk some women face from those who are supposed to love and support them.  A woman and her three kids have been killed in absolutely horrific circumstances and when women start talking about it, what do 'some' men do?  Go straight on the attack.  And therein lies the problem.

Ok, end of rant.  :)

And to the men on here who didn't do that, but came in with sensible, and sensitive replies.  I dips me lid to you.  Once again you know who you are, and so do we.  ;)  

 

 

The 'he' I referred to in the first line was in reply to the post ... Another brute, Charles Saatchi 

I think partners are so wrong when they don't report a bashing, how else is the partner going to take the situation seriously if they don't learn how to behave?   That goes for both men and woman, if one hits the other as far as I personally am concern then all respect for my partner would be done and dusted and I would be out of the house with my children full stop.

..... easier said than done!  Lots of women with kids have nowhere to go - have family in another State - have NO MONEY - that is one of the main reasons- MONEY!

Plus they have to change schools - find rental accomm. in a tight and expensive rental market - plus then live in fear of every noise they hear day/night!  There is often the family pet to take into consideration.....there are a myriad of "things" that are not easy!

Be a nightmare to even contemplate leaving I would imagine when scared and being mentally/physically abused or downtrodden for years -  awful.

 

 

 

Yes I am aware Foxy I used to be membership secretary of pwp many years ago.

But if the woman/man goes to a Police Station they will help and put them into the right direction there is no need to suffer someones punches or insults.

 

PWP has a wide help network.  https://www.parentswithoutpartners.org/  Or similar organizations in the various states.

I remember the first woman I had on my books was a lady in her 60s that had just found out her best friend of 20  years had been having an affair with her spouse in all those years.

There is a lot of support out there if you can be guided in the right direction.

The saddest case I had was a 19 year old mother of twins that had just been widowed living in the country of WA.

 

 

Some very interesting and thoughtful posts. I tend to agree with KSS that some women can more than match the physical strength of males with their scheming and vindictiveness, I have seen it in the workplace from both female supervisors and peers against others. But this is only some. I would however like to raise a totally different perspective and cause of domestic violence and again I believe that females (can) play a major role here.

A generation or two back couples would go through a courting process which could take 1-2 or more years while living in their respective parents homes. During this time both sides could experience the other, their strengths, weakness, vices, interests etc did they drink, do drugs, gamble or spend excessively and how they responded to various challenges and disagreements. If one side didnt like what they saw in the other they could much more easily walk away fom the relationship. No moving out or seeking refuge was involved. In most cases they were no children over which custody was fought. 

We now live in a world of "I want it all and I want it now." By contrast young women today seem to be prepared to sleep with a man they have met down the pub or online before they know anything about them; sometimes they don't even know their names. Within two weeks they are living together. They have no idea about their respective backgrounds or weakness, who they mix with or even if they have a job. A few months later there's a pregnancy and on it goes. Both are trapped in a relationship they wouldnt have chosen if they had known more about each other. He gets drunk, maybe she's spending too much, they fight, he wins physically, her mother calls the police but the young woman still says she loves him even though he beats the hell out of her. She says she loves him because of pride and dependency. 

Some women seem to be attracted to men with more brawn than brains and then complain they use their fists before their intelligence. 

The easiest solution to avoid domestic abuse is for women (and men) to say No at the very beginning of the relationship and keep saying No until they know enough about the other person to want to move onto the next stage. You may want it all and I want it now" but if you want a relationship to last 50, 60 or 70 years it's very unlikely to be successful if the first commitment is made after just a few hours together in a noisy pub and maybe after even more glasses of alcohol. To reiterate, women (because they are the main victims) should not get into a relationship until they know what they are getting into.

Mondo hi!

The first sentence of my first post said the same;  it is a sad fact of life that many people are very lonely and a lot of people get drunk due to that lonely situation.   

I find a lot of young women want their new partner/spouse in life to produce a family home similiar to what the bride has come from.  In otherwords what their parents had worked all their lives for. 

Years ago when I was first married we were very happy to have second hand furnishings, these days the young couples want new everything and will not consider second hand hand me downs.

Great shame really because there are some really good quality furnishings that the parents could provide.

Once upon a time a Wedding Gift would be an electric Fry Pan or Toaster these days  bride wants a block of land or even a house!

Of course this means they both have to work longer hours if they can get employment and end up becoming strangers and then the problems start!

Domestic violence was just as rife several generations ago when people had long courtships and waited for marriage to have a sexual relationship. It was a hidden problem back then, not openly discussed and there was no support available for victims.

NY19 No change, situation normal nothing to worry about, what's all the fuss about then?

Hi Ny19!

 

I hear what you are saying, however, these days there is a much larger population and more people are being affected by it;  also as is today the so called 'experts' didn't know what was causing this issue.

Don't you think the world has changed in what constitutes a marriage from the 1930s 40s to today in Oz?

This is one of the reasons I started this Thread having listened to the ABC radio the other day.

Thought this was a good opportunity for some folks to spread their wings and talk about experiences that they have been subject to or have noticed what was happening in their own experiences.

I met my late husband at a dance!  No not a nightclub an old fashioned ballroom dance.

 

My husband today I met through work, we lived 1200klms apart he had come down to represent his firm in the Industrial Relations Court.

He wanted to invest in real estate and I was working in the industry at the time.  I was meant to meet him at a certain place and there was a mixup, we nearly missed eachother!  LOL

Mondo, you have completely misunderstood my post, or rather, attached your own meaning and significance to it quite separate from my meaning. Of course DV in all its forms is important and must be challenged into non existence if possible. I just wanted to make the point that it is not a "new" problem, it has always existed. The long courtships of yesteryear made no difference.

Celia - at a ballroom dance????  Wow must'a been a long time ago? No disrespect meant in any way.

I was in the rock n roll era and then transitioned onto "Disco's" haha ....loved Disco's - strobe lights -  skimpily clad go-go dancers hanging in gilded cages from the ceiling - Philip Morris and Dunhill girls turning up (also skimpily clad) with the trays of free cigs. handed out to all ......   imagine that today!   lol 

The PC peeps would be rolling in their graves!

 

Things are so darn different these days what with online dating etc -- how the hell can you know what a person is like -- you have to see and watch behavior before you start dating let alone a blooming relationship --

The days they seem to be dated and into a ssexual relationship in days --

PlanB I agree and I believe its those differences that lead to the problems we are now seeing. There is no way that a relationship stands a chance of lasting 50+years if it's effectively based on marriage (or whatever it's called today) at first sight. If you bought a house you intended to live in for your whole life based on a conversation in a pub after a few beers, chances are you would have bought a demolition job.

One thing I keep on meaning to bring up is the parents that truly believe they 'own' their offspring.

I do not believe any parent owns their children, just as I don't believe any spouse owns their partner.

I feel half the time this is the true issue of the violence where the person feels they own either the child or the spouse.

What does anyone else believe?

Some couples should just not breed if this is the case.

Celia, I dont doubt this is a contributor to the problem and it also raises the whole issue of resilence which seems to be another issue that has emerged in modern life. As a person who was raised surrounded by bombed out houses, shops and factories and the 'debris' was our playing field where few had any money and very little food, I think it instilled a degree of resilience. I married a 'refugee' from a similar background of another country and I think our combined resilience has seen us through 50 years of great marriage living and working and moving around the world with the challenges that brings. Our parents born or brought up in the first world war then lived through the depression and WW2 and were married for around sixty years. We have over 20 siblings and cousins all brought up in similar environments to us, all are still together with their original partners. 

Recent generations often treat their kids like hot house princes and princesses. They can't stand on their own feet, they are over indulged and and the first sign of a problem the parents are at their sides, even 'children' in their 30 and 40s. It takes a few grazed knees to realise that standing upright brings benefits. Deny kids those experiences and they will never learn to stand on their own feet. How often we hear, "I dont understand it, I gave them everything?" Yes thats the problem. 

Yes I agree with the overindulgence and the kids unable to stand on their own feet

... unfortunately it is going on over generations with the parents being friends instead of parents.

Cannot help but wonder whether it due to marriages being so fickle.

 

Hi Mondo.

You have a similar background to me!

I remember going down to the rear of the playground and getting into an air raid shelter!  It was off limits!

I remember the green ration books too.  Chicken was a luxury.

Lucky we were not bombed and had a comfortable house with an inside loo, that a lot of people didn't have and now take for granted. When we first came to Australia the 'dunni' was the average home owners delight!  We were aghast!  

Yes a lot of people have totally spoilt their children, our eldest now is in their 50s going on 20!

I was speaking with a person only yesterday and I suggested she wasn't in the real world!  She was explaining that she didn't believe children should walk to school but should be driven!

[I've always maintained the hardest thing for a parent to do is watch while their children fall over and have to pick themselves up, so they learn by their mistakes.  To me it is an awful parent who keeps picking their children up, that way the children never learn, especially when it comes to the value of money.]

It depends on their ages of course, but as a little one I had to walk a mile through the dense bush with mum  who then left me at a clearing to walk to a farm house and wait for the school bus. We are talking 1952.

What society has today is taken for granted and people coming from even war torn countries are demanding that they are looked after. When we came from Europe after WWII we didn't have the luxury of depanding that the Australian Government give us a life!  Our parents had to work for every penny or should I say farthing in those days.  If you didn't work for it you went hungry.

This is the sort of history that should be written into a book and given to new migrants as they come to Australia to absorb, understand and be tested on before they are allowed to be Australian Citizens.

But that is off topic now. Sorry.

 

Just taking up your thought on owning partners or children Celia. It would be pretty dismal if any dissagreed with you. The idea of 'owning' a person just doesn't swim in the generally held context.

It can look quite like responsibility and compact. I have made a compact with my wife and this involves being there. In good times or bad; in love or less, my responsibility to the agreement must be firm. She owns me to that degree. It is true that she is free to do whatever she likes, to come or to go and she will never find an enemy in me. Yet if something seems mutually important she could not expect me not to express and act upon it by the same token. 

With the children, in having them I have also taken on a responsibility. It does not matter whether I am happy with everything they do, they are in my care and the balance between protecting them and opening the world to their confident advance is one I must seek. They 'own' me to that degree. 

Somehow, this all leaves me feeling very free.

 

Roughly of a similar era Celia though different place we could go anywhere, play anywhere, use any equipment. Now, as the fortunate parent of young children I don't let them out of my sight. Expected one standard and now another. The world has not got that much more nasty, it is just that I feel fairly able to ensure that while I am around the nastiest bits should not impact them. Embarrassed about the double standard; yes, a little but I cannot see myself changing.

We started school a little older than my children did but the morning would start by milking the cows, a cold shower under a beautiful tank stand entwined in passionfruit on trellis with a lovely grainey sand base, then, run inside naked over the frosty lawn, get dressed, eat porridge (mostly,) read for a while, walk either 3/4 or 2 miles to the bus stop depending upon which way it was running and then spend an hour (through the rising dawn in winter) getting to school one way or a 1/2 hour the other.

Later it was 3 miles or so by bikes down to the bus stop until just hitting my teens when I and a brother bought an Fj Holden ute with our shearing and burr cutting money - 25 quid.

My mother thought us spoilt. She walked 5 miles to school, with her brother until he wanted to go the long way on his horse so that he would arrive the same time. She has never felt an affinity with horses. If the creek was up she would side step across a rope bridge (that is, two ropes.) There was no road crossing after a good rain. Eventually she got a bicycle (delivered to the school by the mailman no less) and that was a very great day; still remembered rosily while now, comfortably into her 90's.

The stories seem to get harder and often more charming the farther back we go so that we wonder how real some of them may have been. 

Solidly OT

 

 

 

The Thread is on domestic violence, little did I think when I started the topic that it would turn to supermarket voilence!

 

 

The women exchanged stern words and fought over the toilet paper (pictured) in a Woolworths in Australia, as the woman on the right begged for just one packet

 

 https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8084995/Toilet-paper-mayhem-three-women-FIGHT-loo-roll-aisle-Woolworths-supermarket.html?ito=email_share_article-image-share

 

This is when your true character shines through Celia.

The woman were filmed brawling in a Woolworths supermarket in Sydney as they tried to buy toilet paper (pictured)

I would have worded that differently Toot!

.... why stop there?  Road rage is everyday!   Lots of people are really angry!  Doesn't take long for one of them to "snap"!  

Image result for Road rage australia

Nice people

I remember this case!  The woman got more than she bargained for.

I agree that relationships are started far too early these days  --and in my day you did hang out and get to know people for about 2 years

However, there are some people that seem fine till they get you and think they own you and then start the jealous owning controlling ways -- which there was not a sign of before.

Perhaps if they could control the use of drugs and alcohol

... the situation would improve on all counts.

Also  mental illness should not be used as an excuse.

Just read that the slain Mum, Hannah Clarke and her 3 children who died in the car after petrol was poured over it by their deranged Father, were laid to rest in a shared coffin.? I have never heard of anyone being allowed to be buried with multiple bodies in the same coffin. When my neighbours were killed by a drunk in a pedestrian crossing near their home, Mum Dad and Baby had 3 seperate coffins.  

Comforting to know they were kept together in the same coffin. 

Hola, Think about it. Three small children incerated in a car. 

AGREE Ny19,    this was one of the most tragic cases i have heard of,      IT was only right that they be kept together,  

It will be interesting to see if there is as much violence in homosexual marriages ???

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