The Meeting Place

School bringing back paddling as punishment

Sending home permission slips to parents last week, The Georgia School of Innovation and the Classics in the United States for children ranging between kindergarten up to ninth grade last week announced the new discipline policy.

The WRDW reported that one-third of forms had already been filled out by parents, accepting the new policy allowing teachers to strike students with a paddle as a form of punishment.

“In this school, we take discipline very seriously,” Superintendent Jody Boulineau told WRDW. “There was a time where corporal punishment was kind of the norm in school and you didn’t have the problems that you have.”

Paddling as a form of punishment is still legal in 20 states in America. Do you think Australian schools should bring back corporal punishment?

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All Children have to be taught boundaries and also have discipline at home right from the 1st day --  and kept up they will have developed a good outlook/respect/manners/and a good moral compass by the time they are of quite a young age  -- that is of course if the parents also have it and know how to instill it in their kids ---AND if they are at home and not at work leaving their kids for someone else to DRAG up -- no use letting the little kids get away with everything and then expecting it to be easy trying to get them to do the right thing at an older age -- it has to be done from the start

Well said, PlanB.

I'd add that many children and particularly girls are being raised to be self-entitled narcissists.  There are dozens of strident narcissistic celebrities as models.  

 

Hi Plan B.  That is what my late parents referred to, some people being 'dragged up'.   A smack is fine; it is important to have a warning prior to the smack, if the bad behaviour continues after the warning, then by all means give the child a smack with a hand or a wooden spoon.  This is the trouble with today society, there is hardly any discipline in the home, children are allowed to wander!    If the parents cannot discipline them that is where the problems start.

The issues today are some parents have no boundaries and limitations themselves.

I remember years ago a friend of mine went to her weekly meeting, they came out after dark to find all their cars had either been scratch or the tyres slashed.  When the Police looked into it, it had been done by children between 7 and 9 years of age!   The parents thought they were in bed!  Of you can swallow that yarn!

 

A consistent story we heard from teachers was that some of the most heartbreaking children at the kindy, preschool and on through schooling were those of 'double professionals'. - Parents who put their careers and expensive lifestyles first and expected the educators, coaches and parent volunteers to raise their children for them.  -Ask any teacher!

 

There is no way I'd support "paddling" of children anywhere..the thought of someone hitting a child is abhorrent.

However..many parents need to go back to school and learn respect themselves..if they haven't learnt to accept and observe rules themselves..then they certainly won't be able to pass it on to their children..I certainly agree with PlanB on that score...


How about striking a balance.

Could the strap be used very lightly, while still giving the impression of discipline?

No. The action of striking a child is still there so the modelling would consist of striking (violent action) without pain (hypocrisy). That would really confuse kids and I suspect would be ineffective as a disciplinary action. 

 

Right on Tedwalker, you can strike a balance as you say. My Dad used to give us a choice, the wooden spoon or a chat with the Rabbi.

If you met our Rabbi, you'd understand why we all chose to have the wooden spoon on the odd occasion.

 

Micha, I understood Ted to be saying “hit a child but in a way that doesn’t hurt” rather than “offer a child choices”.

It makes me think that rather than pain you are administering humiliation.  Is that better or worse?

Bicha - your case is proof conclusive that beating a child doesnt help. 

You olbat, are the living proof of the result of a very undisciplined childhood. You should be a warning to parents and grandparents on this forum. Ignore a child when they're at an impressionable age, and they end up like you. 

There is only so much you can take from a naughty child. I use to get out the wooden spoon and then I had to chase them, boy could they run, they were so much faster than I was and it usually ended in great laughter from all of us. I would then read out the riot act, apologies accepted and drinks all around. 

If we dont want our children to hurt others then let's not show them how to do it?

Simply, "YES."

 

Parenting should be done by parents, not teachers. Children should be well equipped with respect before they even arrive for the first day of school. I do not support physical punishment and would like to see it never return to schools or the home.

Unfortunately, we have too many parents who are greatly lacking in social skills themselves and are no role models for their children.

Agree, you can't outsource parenting.   Social responsibilities must be taught mainly by the parents, reinforced by those around or outside the family the family.

That does not mean that other forms of control can not be used by those who have to work with the children who do not have parents who love them enough to teach them respect for others.

I'm not keen on corporal punishment, but if there is to be a small amount, it should be dealt by the parents, not schools.

More imporantly, over the last twenty years, children have been brainwashed by politicians and others of influence, that they have rights and no responsibilities.   Parents have been reported by busybodies  for disciplining their children in supermarkets in true 1984 fashion.   I don't blame the parents.   I blame the do-gooders who are running our lives now.

 

What “do-gooders” are running our lives? I don’t feel do-gooders are running my life. I do feel though that no-gooders are running our Parliament.

I spanked my son once, that was enough, he immediatley got the idea that he could go so far and no further.  He has learnt to respect the rights of those around him and realize that he has not got the right to disturb their right to conduct their lawful business without interuption from others.

if ANYONE,   raised a hand to one of my children,   they would feel the full force of a hit from me,    NO ONE,   i repeat,  NO ONE has the right to hit anothers child,       send a note home to the parents,  saying whatever child has done is unacceptable,    and let the parents punish,    if it doesnt change,   remove the child from that class,   and put them in a room on there own,  with work to be done,   and keep them segregated from the rest of the class until they conform,      lots of ways to ;punish ; a child without resorting to violence,   that went out with the dickens era,   ,   

Agree 100% Cats .

adults who hit kids are sick pieces of shit and should be behind bars 

Cats thats ok when there are respectful children, but there are some real tearaways in schools.

Some teachers are even knifed in some!    I would not like to be a school teacher in this day and age.

It goes back to our children mixing with those being 'dragged up'. What I would consider good manners some other parents would laugh at, they would rather go out on the town and have a booze  not knowing what the child was up to.

the of course we came across children that were left at the school gate at 6.30am I kid you not.  No breakfast and no positive results from what they were taught, so we as the volunteers in the canteen used to give this children at 8am some food!  That is not right, no child should have to suffer like that.

Celia - what has this got to do with adults physically abusing kids under the guise of discipline ?

One child can spoil the prospects of thirty others just by acting out in the class room and taking the teachers attention away from the others. Maybe the negligent parents who do not want to take the time to educate their children in how to function in society should be bought to task for the actions of their children?

We have people argueing that they want top class teachers in the class room, why should top class people enter a proffession where they have to put up with abuse from students and parents.  If you don't want to prepare your child for real life where they will be held accountable for their behaviour, maybe you should give up your job and home school.

The neglected and spoilt children of today will provide employment for the prison officers of tommorrow.  I don't mind if they do, as it will improve the chances of the respectful children who are smart enough to realize that mindless petulance gets you nowhere in the real world.  Unless of course you want to go into politics.

Absolutely right.

exPS - the discussion is about beating a child 

You're off on a tangent unless you think that discipline should take the form of child bashing 

My point is that if parents did their job properly, the subject of disciplin administered by teachers would not come up. 

One dimensional thinking will not solve most problems.  Ask yourself, why would a teacher even think that a child should be beaten?

Talking about going off in a tangent, where in the original story was it proposed that beating a child was seen as a solution?  Bashing was not mentioned either, you may feel it is a good idea to emotionalise an arguement by introducing inflamatery  inventions, but it actually detracts from the arguement and destroys the credibility of instigator.

To me the discussion is about discipline the form of discipline is just another part of that discussion.  as I said, you are doing you are doing your child a disservice by teaching them that they can do as they wish without worrying about repurcusions, in fact, that sort of behaviour is the worst form of child abuse, you will destroy their entire future.

 

So you think corporal punishment in school, and/or beating a child at home, will solve a childs behavioural problems, just like the idiot school superintendent in the story

I think the problems that will be faced in the future will be made worse by todays children who have no idea of discipline.  Parents who do not or will not teach their children respect for others and the idea of consequences of their own actions are creating the criminals of the future.  Parenting should be done by the parents, teachers are there to teach, not to be surrogate parents, unruley children should be removed from the class and the negligent parents should be contacted and told to pick them up.  Too many so called parents see school as a cheap baby sitting service.

Behavioural problems are for the people who cause them to solve at their own expense, not for teachers to solve at the expense of other children.  In some simple cases corparal punishment will in fact solve a problem, as has been proved over many centuries, allowing children to act out with no consequences will solve nothing, and probably cause a rapid acceleration of what starts out as a minor test of authority.

Again I saw no evidence of the advocating of beating in the original story.  Take a deep breath and try not to let emotion make you irrational.

Have any of you folk ever spent time in a school classroom? I did, 45+ years.

Each year was a new adventure with students from a huge range of backgrounds ... that's just the way it is, in a classroom.

As for "It goes back to our children mixing with those being 'dragged up'." Grrrr — how arrogant.

Some of those students from horrendous backgrounds were just amazing in my experience. They turned up each day, did the school "thing" despite probably being locked out or abused in the interim. I had/have nothing but admiration for them.

Every child deserves an equal footing in school I reckon ... whatever their background.

Differences are to be explored and resolved, opined upon and smiled about, discussed openly and if problems exist ... hopefully the teacher and class can find a way through.

It was always a rocky road ... put 30 individuals in a room and expect them to be a cohesisive, productive unit who achieve high results/goals in a 12 month timeframe from an outside body e.g. ACARA ... what do you expect?

If we took YLC opinions and comments as a guide for an example?

IMO, what classrooms and teachers achieve each year is nothing short of amazing given their wide "clientele base" and would put many politicians and corporates to shame.

Hear hear RnR

I spent 12 years in a classroom, msotly annoying the crap out of my teachers. But deep down I know they all loved me , especially the ladies. I was a handsome devil even back then

....... "barf bag" time!   :-)

LOL ... of course they did Olbaid.

Always had a soft spot for those who tried to annoy the crap out of me. So funny, bit like looking in a mirror, especially when they hit a bulls-eye. Oops, time to change tack perhaps, or enlist the enemy.

 

 

" put 30 individuals in a room and expect them to be a cohesisive, productive unit who achieve high results/goals in a 12 month timeframe from an outside body e.g. ACARA ... what do you expect?"

-- and a teacher of 45 years should know that cannot be achieved without rules and boundaries. Very surprised at you RnR, You have missed the point. This child disrupted the entire school assembly, do you approve of that??? As a teacher you should know there is ample time for discussion within the classroom for such things. Disrupting the entire school is not on. By the way I am still in the education system and I have spent time in classrooms, probably many other forum members have too.

Don't get me wrong Hola, despite the hair-curling, never a dull moment ... in retrospect loved every minute of the 45+ year glorious ride.

Hopefully they all survived.

So enervating, alive, boisterous, disasters/failures and tiny-teeny wonderful triumphs with some kids and many classes. Their passionate embracing of certain causes back then e.g. saving whales and rainforests.

Kids are so discerning.

 

Wrong Topic Ray dum dum - this one is about child abuse not the national anthem

Please go be a smart arse if you must, on the other thread

Ray ... re child not standing for national anthem in assembly ... responded to that previously on the relevant topic.

What I said can equally apply to the classroom. Same deal.

RnR you do know what being 'dragged up means'?

Sounds like you were a wonderful teacher RnR :). I love what you have written about teaching. Good teachers who make each child feel valued are providing far more than education in a child’s life and I think they are lifesavers for kids who are not feeling/being valued at home.

NOT only are some advocating for a child to be hit/smacked,   call it what you will,   it is STILL a child being hit,    not content with that,   USE A PADDLE,     sadistic bastards,   TELL you what,    why dont we hog tie them and flog them?    maybe that would satisfy the evil buggers out there,    

Not spanking a child who has done something wrong, is like not jailing a man who has committed a crime.

There has to be some balance.

Absolute crap Ted. Its child abuse and shows a lack of parenting skills and self control by the adult.

I would like to see jail time for anyone caught spanking a child, and have the child removed from the abusive parent

That is the repertoire of the socially inept. Those who know a little something about behavioural psychology realise it is a negative and lazy response which does not produce the desired outcome, which is children growing into confident, caring, responsible adults who make a valuable contribution to their community. 

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